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Piniella: I'm retiring at the end of the season


Ballgame64
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Ryne Sandberg, come onnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn down!

Clearly Ryno was groomed for the role by Hendry and if he goes then there is no guaranty that Ryno is the next manager.

I think Sandberg was offered the Class A manager job because Hendry didn't think there was anyway Ryne would take it but at least Hendry could look fans in the eyes and say the Cubs offered him a chance. When Soto was on rehab in AA last year, Hendry visited the Smokies and commented on the job Ryno and the other coaches were doing. I think Sandberg has surprised Cubs management by his willingness to do whatever it takes to get experience and be a viable candidate, not to mention the results.

 

He has had success at each level. There are a lot of people here who will not give him much credit for what he has done and think he will be a horrible manager because he doesn't spew stats constantly, talks about playing the game the right way or they simply say the teams have been successful inspite of Sandberg. But at the end of the day, the team is judged on Wins/Losses and ultimately on championships, not how many times a manager calls fo sacrifice bunt during the seaon.

 

I am not saying he should be the next manager. My only hope is the next manager gets more out of the talent that is on the roster than Lou has the last couple of years. This team seems to lack focus or does not seem prepared on a daily basis. Is that the manager/coaching staff, the players or a combination of both? The baseball season is a long season but managers like Tony LaRussa find a reason to make every game more important than yesterday. Maybe that is why his teams are better year in and year out even when they don't have the same talent level on paper, that other teams appear to have.

Edited by Ballgame64
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Ryne Sandberg, come onnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn down!

Clearly Ryno was groomed for the role by Hendry and if he goes then there is no guaranty that Ryno is the next manager.

 

Is Sandberg as terrible as everyone seems to think? He could be. I just know he has said things about sacrifice bunts in the past and everyone subsequently hated him, but does anyone have actual insights on his managerial style? Just wondering.

 

if you want to like sandberg, you can, you're just going to have to ignore everything he's written and everything he's done as a minor league manager.

 

i'm not being sarcastic. if you're fine doing that, then, sure, there's nothing in his past to dislike. of course, if you do that, there's also just nothing in his past.

 

That's fine. I'm already inclined to dislike him, but just wanted to detail on what he's actually done as a manager. Do his teams sacrifice bunt way more than other minor league teams? Does he overwork pitchers? Do his teams run into a lot of outs?

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Ryne Sandberg, come onnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn down!

Clearly Ryno was groomed for the role by Hendry and if he goes then there is no guaranty that Ryno is the next manager.

 

Is Sandberg as terrible as everyone seems to think? He could be. I just know he has said things about sacrifice bunts in the past and everyone subsequently hated him, but does anyone have actual insights on his managerial style? Just wondering.

 

if you want to like sandberg, you can, you're just going to have to ignore everything he's written and everything he's done as a minor league manager.

 

i'm not being sarcastic. if you're fine doing that, then, sure, there's nothing in his past to dislike. of course, if you do that, there's also just nothing in his past.

 

That's fine. I'm already inclined to dislike him, but just wanted to detail on what he's actually done as a manager. Do his teams sacrifice bunt way more than other minor league teams? Does he overwork pitchers? Do his teams run into a lot of outs?

 

After the opposing starting pitcher threw 8 straight balls to start a game a few seasons ago, Sandberg had his #3 and #4 hitter try to sacrifice bunt.

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Earl Weaver must be a managing god around here.

1,480 - 1,060 for a .583 winning percentage. #20 all time in wins and #9 all time in winning percentage. One World Series title and three World Series losses.

 

I hope the Cubs next manager can be that bad with the Cubs. Although, I'd rather see 3 WS wins and 1 loss.

 

So what makes a good manager?

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Ryne Sandberg, come onnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn down!

Clearly Ryno was groomed for the role by Hendry and if he goes then there is no guaranty that Ryno is the next manager.

 

Is Sandberg as terrible as everyone seems to think? He could be. I just know he has said things about sacrifice bunts in the past and everyone subsequently hated him, but does anyone have actual insights on his managerial style? Just wondering.

 

He's backed up his hit-and-run and excessive bunting talk while managing in the minors.

 

...because that is how the game was played when Ryno was in his prime. The "daily double" of Dernier and Ryno made a killing doing this in '84. That is how the game was played back then and that is how Ryno knows the game. What scares me about him is that he doesn't seem flexible enough to change with the game. Some of what he says I completely agree with (respect the game, appreciate the fans, it is a privilege to play) but a lot of what he has done in the minors I disagree with as the game has simply evolved without him (or so it would seem). Giving up outs is no longer a consistently good game strategy IMO. I fear that Ryno will try to implement the '84 style of play in 2011 and fail miserably. He is easily my favorite player and seeing him fail isn't something that I want to watch.

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I can definitely see how Ryne is on the manager path considering the success he has had in the minors. Not to sound all meatball, but I just don't want one of my favorite players of all time in any sport thrown into a managers job when he has no experience and very little chance for success.

 

If the Cubs were really serious about grooming him as a manager in waiting, he's up here next year as a Bench/3rd base coach and observes the MLB game from a coaches perspective. I'd bet (hope) he would adjust some of his opinions about Saber and Small ball.

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He has had success at each level. There are a lot of people here who will not give him much credit for what he has done and think he will be a horrible manager because he doesn't spew stats constantly, talks about playing the game the right way or they simply say the teams have been successful inspite of Sandberg. But at the end of the day, the team is judged on Wins/Losses and ultimately on championships, not how many times a manager calls fo sacrifice bunt during the seaon.

 

Ok let's judge Sandberg on his win-loss records

 

71-68

60-78 (QUICK!! PROMOTE HIM!!)

71-69 (OVER 500?? PROMOTE HIM AGAIN!!)

51-44

 

That is a stellar 6 games under 500 for his managerial career. Surely, no other minor league managers are out there with that kind of track record.

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He has had success at each level. There are a lot of people here who will not give him much credit for what he has done and think he will be a horrible manager because he doesn't spew stats constantly, talks about playing the game the right way or they simply say the teams have been successful inspite of Sandberg. But at the end of the day, the team is judged on Wins/Losses and ultimately on championships, not how many times a manager calls fo sacrifice bunt during the seaon.

 

Ok let's judge Sandberg on his win-loss records

 

71-68

60-78 (QUICK!! PROMOTE HIM!!)

71-69 (OVER 500?? PROMOTE HIM AGAIN!!)

51-44

 

That is a stellar 6 games under 500 for his managerial career. Surely, no other minor league managers are out there with that kind of track record.

And I was just assuming his teams actually did enjoy a lot of success.

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So what makes a good manager?

Championships

 

Earl Weaver must be a managing god around here.

1,480 - 1,060 for a .583 winning percentage. #20 all time in wins and #9 all time in winning percentage. One World Series title and three World Series losses.

Lou Piniella

1,826-1,691 for a .519 winning percentage with 1 World Series Title and 3 Manager of the Year awards. Sure his winning % is not as good as Weaver's, but he managed the frigging Rays for 3 years. He has more wins than Weaver and as many titles. Look around here to see how he is thought of as a manager.

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"...because that is how the game was played when Ryno was in his prime. The "daily double" of Dernier and Ryno made a killing doing this in '84. That is how the game was played back then and that is how Ryno knows the game. What scares me about him is that he doesn't seem flexible enough to change with the game. Some of what he says I completely agree with (respect the game, appreciate the fans, it is a privilege to play) but a lot of what he has done in the minors I disagree with as the game has simply evolved without him (or so it would seem). Giving up outs is no longer a consistently good game strategy IMO. I fear that Ryno will try to implement the '84 style of play in 2011 and fail miserably. He is easily my favorite player and seeing him fail isn't something that I want to watch."

 

I like your take on this subject. When I hear "playing the game right" I think about playing smart. Throwing to the correct base, not running into outs, being patient at the plate and looking for a pitch to drive not just hit with less than two strikes, cutting down on your swing with two strikes because making the defense make a play is better than striking out (unless of course you hit into a double play). I don't equate those things to constantly calling for a sacrifice bunt or always trying to hit and run.

 

My memories of Ryno as a player will not be tarnished by a managing career with the Cubs or any other team.

Edited by Ballgame64
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So what makes a good manager?

Championships

 

Earl Weaver must be a managing god around here.

1,480 - 1,060 for a .583 winning percentage. #20 all time in wins and #9 all time in winning percentage. One World Series title and three World Series losses.

Lou Piniella

1,826-1,691 for a .519 winning percentage with 1 World Series Title and 3 Manager of the Year awards. Sure his winning % is not as good as Weaver's, but he managed the frigging Rays for 3 years. He has more wins than Weaver and as many titles. Look around here to see how he is thought of as a manager.

 

More wins is meaningless. Winning percentage matters, and Lou's pales in comparison.

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When I hear "playing the game right" I think about playing smart.

 

When I hear it, I think about all those poor morons who walk up to the plate with scuba gear on, hit the ball with their kayak paddles and then run into center field before collapsing to the ground. I wish they'd stop playing the game wrong.

Edited by Tyrant
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So what makes a good manager?

Championships

 

Earl Weaver must be a managing god around here.

1,480 - 1,060 for a .583 winning percentage. #20 all time in wins and #9 all time in winning percentage. One World Series title and three World Series losses.

Lou Piniella

1,826-1,691 for a .519 winning percentage with 1 World Series Title and 3 Manager of the Year awards. Sure his winning % is not as good as Weaver's, but he managed the frigging Rays for 3 years. He has more wins than Weaver and as many titles. Look around here to see how he is thought of as a manager.

 

More wins is meaningless. Winning percentage matters, and Lou's pales in comparison.

So take out his 3 years with the Rays (where NO ONE would have won at that time) and then give me his winning % if that's what makes such a huge difference.

 

It's .536. Still a far cry from Weaver.

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