Corey Patterson: time to call it quits?

[Gingerballs Lives]

I post this in just about every cpat thread, but he WAS GOOD. Before his knee blew up he was good. I don't see him as a failed "five tool" prospect as much as the victim of a career ending (altering?) injury.

 

I don't think the knee injury had anything to do with his falling off a cliff. His 2004 was an above average season. He just lost it, and I don't think we had the coaching at the big league level that was capable of bringing him out of it. From there he got hackier and hackier and nobody seemed to care to try and fix him or it was too late at that point to teach the old dog new tricks.

 

 

Yeah, 24 home runs and 32 stolen bases is pretty solid. He was no leadoff man but a useful player (that season) nonetheless.

[Tarver]

BULL [expletive] SH*T

 

Jacque Jones put up much, much better numbers than Patterson could ever aspire too, and everybody hated him, even while he played an acceptable CF in '07.

 

Ryan and TT were always Patterson fans, and that's cool. But let's keep a little objectivity. The guy's a fantastic defensive CF. And that's it. He's never had sustained success at the plate.

[chopsx9]

4 hits and a grand slam in the 9th to tie the game. ( and a BB)

 

Jake Fox HR in extras to win it. Pie and Moore also played in the game.

 

http://scores.espn.go.com/mlb/boxscore?gameId=300709113

 

A little surreal, but good for them

[SouthSideRyan]

BULL [expletive] SH*T

 

Jacque Jones put up much, much better numbers than Patterson could ever aspire too, and everybody hated him, even while he played an acceptable CF in '07.

 

Ryan and TT were always Patterson fans, and that's cool. But let's keep a little objectivity. The guy's a fantastic defensive CF. And that's it. He's never had sustained success at the plate.

 

Might want to compare Jones's #s in '07 to Corey's #s in '04. This was while Corey played better defense. And I liked Jones.

[NCCubFan]

4 hits and a grand slam in the 9th to tie the game. ( and a BB)

 

Jake Fox HR in extras to win it. Pie and Moore also played in the game.

 

http://scores.espn.go.com/mlb/boxscore?gameId=300709113

 

A little surreal, but good for them

Pie left the game with a strained quad (less than a week after returning from a lengthy stay on the DL). Wieters also left the game with an injury. The field was reportedly quite slick.

[Little Slide Rooter]

4 hits and a grand slam in the 9th to tie the game. ( and a BB)

 

Jake Fox HR in extras to win it. Pie and Moore also played in the game.

 

http://scores.espn.go.com/mlb/boxscore?gameId=300709113

 

A little surreal, but good for them

 

Maybe McPhails dumpster diving is finally paying off. Im all for all of these guys sucess, especially when their on a team as irellevant as the Orioles. No matter what happens, I wont kick myself about Patterson as Washington and Milwaukee both quickly tried and gave up on him, and Fox was never of much use to us, but giving up on Pie when they did for nothing, essentially to make room for Aaron [expletive] Miles and Joey [expletive] Gathright is nothing short of perplexing.

[NewUserName]

4 hits and a grand slam in the 9th to tie the game. ( and a BB)

 

Jake Fox HR in extras to win it. Pie and Moore also played in the game.

 

http://scores.espn.go.com/mlb/boxscore?gameId=300709113

 

A little surreal, but good for them

 

Maybe McPhails dumpster diving is finally paying off. Im all for all of these guys sucess, especially when their on a team as irellevant as the Orioles. No matter what happens, I wont kick myself about Patterson as Washington and Milwaukee both quickly tried and gave up on him, and Fox was never of much use to us, but giving up on Pie when they did for nothing, essentially to make room for Aaron [expletive] Miles and Joey [expletive] Gathright is nothing short of perplexing.

 

what really bothers me about Pie is the idea that he was given a chance with the Cubs and didnt perform.

[CincyCubsFan]

4 hits and a grand slam in the 9th to tie the game. ( and a BB)

 

Jake Fox HR in extras to win it. Pie and Moore also played in the game.

 

http://scores.espn.go.com/mlb/boxscore?gameId=300709113

 

A little surreal, but good for them

 

Don't forget Cesas Izturis and Will Ohman...

[Little Slide Rooter]

4 hits and a grand slam in the 9th to tie the game. ( and a BB)

 

Jake Fox HR in extras to win it. Pie and Moore also played in the game.

 

http://scores.espn.go.com/mlb/boxscore?gameId=300709113

 

A little surreal, but good for them

 

Maybe McPhails dumpster diving is finally paying off. Im all for all of these guys sucess, especially when their on a team as irellevant as the Orioles. No matter what happens, I wont kick myself about Patterson as Washington and Milwaukee both quickly tried and gave up on him, and Fox was never of much use to us, but giving up on Pie when they did for nothing, essentially to make room for Aaron [expletive] Miles and Joey [expletive] Gathright is nothing short of perplexing.

 

what really bothers me about Pie is the idea that he was given a chance with the Cubs and didnt perform.

 

You mean after playing half of 2007 and a fourth of 2008 and we shipped him off when he was 24? Yeah, Ill say he got a fair shot.

[Tryptamine]

4 hits and a grand slam in the 9th to tie the game. ( and a BB)

 

Jake Fox HR in extras to win it. Pie and Moore also played in the game.

 

http://scores.espn.go.com/mlb/boxscore?gameId=300709113

 

A little surreal, but good for them

 

Maybe McPhails dumpster diving is finally paying off. Im all for all of these guys sucess, especially when their on a team as irellevant as the Orioles. No matter what happens, I wont kick myself about Patterson as Washington and Milwaukee both quickly tried and gave up on him, and Fox was never of much use to us, but giving up on Pie when they did for nothing, essentially to make room for Aaron [expletive] Miles and Joey [expletive] Gathright is nothing short of perplexing.

 

what really bothers me about Pie is the idea that he was given a chance with the Cubs and didnt perform.

 

You mean after playing half of 2007 and a fourth of 2008 and we shipped him off when he was 24? Yeah, Ill say he got a fair shot.

 

I'm hoping this is sarcasm but, 260 AB over a year and a half is not a fair shot. Getting 1 start a week is a horrible thing to do to a prospect.

[champaignchris]

I recently read Moneyball for the first time and I was struck by the early chapters' description of Billy Beane as a "5-tool" prospect who simply didn't have the mental makeup to hit major league pitching with any consistency. I immediately thought of Corey Patterson.

 

That might not be fair to Corey, though. He's had a much better career than Beane did.

[NewUserName]

4 hits and a grand slam in the 9th to tie the game. ( and a BB)

 

Jake Fox HR in extras to win it. Pie and Moore also played in the game.

 

http://scores.espn.go.com/mlb/boxscore?gameId=300709113

 

A little surreal, but good for them

 

Maybe McPhails dumpster diving is finally paying off. Im all for all of these guys sucess, especially when their on a team as irellevant as the Orioles. No matter what happens, I wont kick myself about Patterson as Washington and Milwaukee both quickly tried and gave up on him, and Fox was never of much use to us, but giving up on Pie when they did for nothing, essentially to make room for Aaron [expletive] Miles and Joey [expletive] Gathright is nothing short of perplexing.

 

what really bothers me about Pie is the idea that he was given a chance with the Cubs and didnt perform.

 

You mean after playing half of 2007 and a fourth of 2008 and we shipped him off when he was 24? Yeah, Ill say he got a fair shot.

 

I'm hoping this is sarcasm but, 260 AB over a year and a half is not a fair shot. Getting 1 start a week is a horrible thing to do to a prospect.

 

not sure it was sarcasm but maybe not written well. I was trying to say that there are people who say that Pie was given a chance and failed and thats why the Cubs traded him. I agree that he was never given a chance.

[Little Slide Rooter]

4 hits and a grand slam in the 9th to tie the game. ( and a BB)

 

Jake Fox HR in extras to win it. Pie and Moore also played in the game.

 

http://scores.espn.go.com/mlb/boxscore?gameId=300709113

 

A little surreal, but good for them

 

Maybe McPhails dumpster diving is finally paying off. Im all for all of these guys sucess, especially when their on a team as irellevant as the Orioles. No matter what happens, I wont kick myself about Patterson as Washington and Milwaukee both quickly tried and gave up on him, and Fox was never of much use to us, but giving up on Pie when they did for nothing, essentially to make room for Aaron [expletive] Miles and Joey [expletive] Gathright is nothing short of perplexing.

 

what really bothers me about Pie is the idea that he was given a chance with the Cubs and didnt perform.

 

You mean after playing half of 2007 and a fourth of 2008 and we shipped him off when he was 24? Yeah, Ill say he got a fair shot.

 

I'm hoping this is sarcasm but, 260 AB over a year and a half is not a fair shot. Getting 1 start a week is a horrible thing to do to a prospect.

 

My part was clearly sarcasm. I dont know about the guy before me. Hopefully it was, but you never know.

[shnsajax]

4 hits and a grand slam in the 9th to tie the game. ( and a BB)

 

Jake Fox HR in extras to win it. Pie and Moore also played in the game.

 

http://scores.espn.go.com/mlb/boxscore?gameId=300709113

 

A little surreal, but good for them

 

Don't forget Cesas Izturis and Will Ohman...

 

My god, no wonder the O's suck so bad. How many Cubs cast offs do they need.

[Little Slide Rooter]

4 hits and a grand slam in the 9th to tie the game. ( and a BB)

 

Jake Fox HR in extras to win it. Pie and Moore also played in the game.

 

http://scores.espn.go.com/mlb/boxscore?gameId=300709113

 

A little surreal, but good for them

 

Don't forget Cesas Izturis and Will Ohman...

 

My god, no wonder the O's suck so bad. How many Cubs cast offs do they need.

 

They can have the whole damn team except for Castro, Soto, and Cashner as far as Im concerned.

[Tarver]

BULL [expletive] SH*T

 

Jacque Jones put up much, much better numbers than Patterson could ever aspire too, and everybody hated him, even while he played an acceptable CF in '07.

 

Ryan and TT were always Patterson fans, and that's cool. But let's keep a little objectivity. The guy's a fantastic defensive CF. And that's it. He's never had sustained success at the plate.

 

Might want to compare Jones's #s in '07 to Corey's #s in '04. This was while Corey played better defense. And I liked Jones.

 

That post is so old I can't even remember why I was so upset, and we've both usually agreed on Patterson's value.

 

I'd still rather have Jones in 06 and 07, though. This is the 1st season in 4 years that Corey's had anything close to an acceptable WAR, and at the time Jones' offensive production was easier to project.

[BigSlick]

I miss Felix Pie

[StarlinOnYou]

4 hits and a grand slam in the 9th to tie the game. ( and a BB)

 

Jake Fox HR in extras to win it. Pie and Moore also played in the game.

 

http://scores.espn.go.com/mlb/boxscore?gameId=300709113

 

A little surreal, but good for them

 

Don't forget Cesas Izturis and Will Ohman...

 

My god, no wonder the O's suck so bad. How many Cubs cast offs do they need.

 

Wouldn't Ohman be like our 3rd best reliever?

[hardcorecubfan]

The wunderkind so many wanted up here with his "five tools." I just hope one of them is a framing hammer or a college degree

From most all reports, Corey is a genuinely nice guy. But feel free to be bitter and trash him for a joke.

 

No, I wish him the best and only hope he has a skill beyond baseball. The trashing comes from many who put him on a pedestal before he could ever prove himself. I am sure early on the label of wunderkind, and savior of an organization weighed heavy on him, a lot of pressure for a kid.

[dew1679666265]

Wouldn't Ohman be like our 3rd best reliever?

 

Yeah, but not by a ton. Marmol and Marshall both have an xFIP of 2.60 and 2.57, respectively. Ohman's xFIP is 4.37 and then Russell's is 4.64 and Cashner's is 4.97.

[TruffleShuffle]

Wouldn't Ohman be like our 3rd best reliever?

 

Yeah, but not by a ton. Marmol and Marshall both have an xFIP of 2.60 and 2.57, respectively. Ohman's xFIP is 4.37 and then Russell's is 4.64 and Cashner's is 4.97.

 

in other words, our bullpen is terrible.

[dew1679666265]

Wouldn't Ohman be like our 3rd best reliever?

 

Yeah, but not by a ton. Marmol and Marshall both have an xFIP of 2.60 and 2.57, respectively. Ohman's xFIP is 4.37 and then Russell's is 4.64 and Cashner's is 4.97.

 

in other words, our bullpen is terrible.

 

Yep, though Cashner was pitching better until he got slapped around a few days ago. Russell was also doing much better earlier in the year (when, I believe, Tim was promoting him).

[KaiserCesar]

Wouldn't Ohman be like our 3rd best reliever?

 

Yeah, but not by a ton. Marmol and Marshall both have an xFIP of 2.60 and 2.57, respectively. Ohman's xFIP is 4.37 and then Russell's is 4.64 and Cashner's is 4.97.

 

in other words, our bullpen is terrible.

 

Yep, though Cashner was pitching better until he got slapped around a few days ago. Russell was also doing much better earlier in the year (when, I believe, Tim was promoting him).

 

I want to say Cashner's xFIP was still in the 4's even when his ERA was in the 2.25 range. His k/bb ratio was never really that great this year but was getting a lot of outs in play.

[dew1679666265]

I want to say Cashner's xFIP was still in the 4's even when his ERA was in the 2.25 range. His k/bb ratio was never really that great this year but was getting a lot of outs in play.

 

Yeah, I think it was in the very low 4s and would have been below Ohman's. The poor outing launched it almost to 5.0. He hasn't been great this year no doubt, but hopefully this will be a good experience.

[Guest]

I want to say Cashner's xFIP was still in the 4's even when his ERA was in the 2.25 range. His k/bb ratio was never really that great this year but was getting a lot of outs in play.

 

Yeah, I think it was in the very low 4s and would have been below Ohman's. The poor outing launched it almost to 5.0. He hasn't been great this year no doubt, but hopefully this will be a good experience.

Versus lefties this year, Russell has 16 K vs 2 BB in 19.3 IP. He's been horribly unlucky on HR/FB ratio, though. Could be a small sample thing, but that's what has hurt him lately.