Derosa to Indians for Jeff Stevens, Chris Archer, John Gaub

[dew1679666265]

But you shouldn't go with younger players just for the crap of it, which is what Hendry did.

 

There was not a need to trade Mark DeRosa. Trading him raises significant questions, which is not what a GM or manager should want.

 

Why do you think he's doing it for the heck of it? How do you know he doesn't think Fontenot is ready to play at least against RH pitching? It's not like what he's done in the minors and off the bench the last two years doesn't show that. Hendry probably wanted to start Fontenot at 2b, and decided he would rather have Bradley over DeRosa. Stuff like this only raises questions with the fans, but plenty of times last season the fans questioned him and he was right. Probably the only time they didn't was when they signed Fukudome, and as of right now thats really is only major mistake. His job is to make the team better, he believes Fontenot/Miles can do what DeRosa was gonna do and Bradley will give them a quality bat in RF.

 

And I think he's making a poor decision because he wants another left handed bat in the lineup. I could be proven wrong, but if you have a sure thing to produce well (DeRosa) you don't then trade that away for three big question marks.

 

It's just not that logical.

 

If Peavy is brought in, that's a clear improvement. Otherwise, all Hendry did was raise questions that didn't need to be raised.

 

I will agree with you that right now this team isn't better then the one that finshed the season. But I think their only a little worse, and still a 90 plus win team. Of course getting Peavy, Sheets or Lowe would put them past last year IMO. I still think were not done, and once we get a little payroll boost from the new owner we will add another pitcher.

 

Then how are the moves Hendry made good moves? If we are a worse team now than before the moves and those moves (assumingly) were not forced on him, then they were bad moves.

 

If Peavy comes in (or perhaps one of the others), I will understand the moves better. But not until then.

[cubsfan26]

Then how are the moves Hendry made good moves? If we are a worse team now than before the moves and those moves (assumingly) were not forced on him, then they were bad moves.

 

He's replaced guys with slight downgrades at some postions, to improve at other postions. IMO Bradley is a nice upgrade compared to what we had in the outfield, and when he's in the line-up it will be lethal. He did downgrade at 2b a little and in the bullpen a little(could be though) but the rotation will be about the same. So right now we upgraded one spot, and slighty downgraded two spots. So the team is a little worse, but not much worse then when the season ended. Upgrading the rotation, will put us at a overall good offseason and make us better. Plus I think having more LH hitters in the line-up will help more then people think.

 

 

 

This might sound dumb but I think we could win less games but be in a better postion to win in the playoffs. I do think the playoffs are a crapshoot, and do think this team choked. But I think that was just part of the reason. When the exact samething happen in 08 that happen in 07, with a very simliar line-up. There's a problem, and if u look at the numbers of how this team has hit in the postseason against RH pitching. I really do think getting more LH is a important thing. I know some will disagree, but I did research and almost every World Series winning team since the wild card has had good or productive LH bats in their line-up. Again lets wait and see how the roster looks on opening day and what Hendry does with this roster throught out the season.

[dew1679666265]

Then how are the moves Hendry made good moves? If we are a worse team now than before the moves and those moves (assumingly) were not forced on him, then they were bad moves.

 

He's replaced guys with slight downgrades at some postions, to improve at other postions. IMO Bradley is a nice upgrade compared to what we had in the outfield, and when he's in the line-up it will be lethal. He did downgrade at 2b a little and in the bullpen a little(could be though) but the rotation will be about the same. So right now we upgraded one spot, and slighty downgraded two spots. So the team is a little worse, but not much worse then when the season ended. Upgrading the rotation, will put us at a overall good offseason and make us better. Plus I think having more LH hitters in the line-up will help more then people think.

 

The upgrade in right is slight, at best, because we'll have almost 80 games (most likely) with a mixture of Hoff/Reed/Gathright out there.

 

But, again, if we add a top of the line starter (Peavy) I'll think differently about this move. It hinges on that, though.

 

This might sound dumb but I think we could win less games but be in a better postion to win in the playoffs. I do think the playoffs are a crapshoot, and do think this team choked. But I think that was just part of the reason. When the exact samething happen in 08 that happen in 07, with a very simliar line-up. There's a problem, and if u look at the numbers of how this team has hit in the postseason against RH pitching. I really do think getting more LH is a important thing. I know some will disagree, but I did research and almost every World Series winning team since the wild card has had good or productive LH bats in their line-up. Again lets wait and see how the roster looks on opening day and what Hendry does with this roster throught out the season.

 

Left handed hitting is good, but only when it's good left handed hitting. Bradley meets that requirement, but Aaron Miles does not. Miles will be getting quite a few ABs now that DeRosa is gone. No matter what hand he hits with, that's a bad thing.

[anabiono]

i heard aaron miles has dreamy eyes

[mikeyt34]

The bottom line here is what have the Cubs accomplished in the post season? They have flaws in a short series against tough right handed pitchers, it's been proven two years in a row. Trust me, I hate losing DeRosa, but loading a lineup of lefties against these tough right handers in the post season seems like a practical way to forge ahead. Would DeRosa be better in the regular season than Miles? Most definitely. But at least Lou will have more flexibility with Miles and Bradley together than with DeRosa alone, as far as a post season short series is concerned. This is what Hendry and Lou are looking for in my opinion. I know I have the Cubs in the playoffs already, but seriously, I would be shocked if they didn't win the division going away.

 

For example, say the Cubs have to play the Dbacks in round one against Brandon Webb and Dan Haren...Playoff line up

 

Miles SS

Fontenot 2B

Lee 1B

Ramirez 3B

Bradley CF/RB

Soriano LF

Soto C

Fukudome RF/CF

Zambrano P

 

Right there you have 5 lefties if you include Z in the mix. You've got stir the pot a little, whatever the Cubs have done the last two years in the post season, obviously didn't work.

Also, look for Bradley to get a bit of the Harden treatment late in the season to keep him fresh for the post season.

[dew1679666265]

i heard aaron miles has dreamy eyes

 

I've heard all of DeRosa is sexy, though. He's better even in that, apparently.

[anabiono]

i heard aaron miles has dreamy eyes

 

I've heard all of DeRosa is sexy, though. He's better even in that, apparently.

 

the tribe has stole my heart, i can't even bear to read or hear his name anymore

 

must. force. self. to. love. miles. and. dreamy. eyes. of. golden. splendor.

[dew1679666265]

The bottom line here is what have the Cubs accomplished in the post season? They have flaws in a short series against tough right handed pitchers, it's been proven two years in a row. Trust me, I hate losing DeRosa, but loading a lineup of lefties against these tough right handers in the post season seems like a practical way to forge ahead. Would DeRosa be better in the regular season than Miles? Most definitely. But at least Lou will have more flexibility with Miles and Bradley together than with DeRosa alone, as far as a post season short series is concerned. This is what Hendry and Lou are looking for in my opinion. I know I have the Cubs in the playoffs already, but seriously, I would be shocked if they didn't win the division going away.

 

For example, say the Cubs have to play the Dbacks in round one against Brandon Webb and Dan Haren...Playoff line up

 

Miles SS

Fontenot 2B

Lee 1B

Ramirez 3B

Bradley CF/RB

Soriano LF

Soto C

Fukudome RF/CF

Zambrano P

 

Right there you have 5 lefties if you include Z in the mix. You've got stir the pot a little, whatever the Cubs have done the last two years in the post season, obviously didn't work.

Also, look for Bradley to get a bit of the Harden treatment late in the season to keep him fresh for the post season.

 

Aaron Miles is not good, though. He can't hit righties or lefties very well so I don't understand how starting him - much less in the leadoff spot - is a better idea than DeRosa.

 

And Jeremy Hermida is a left, as is Luke Scott. Trade for one of them instead of signing Bradley. There's your left handed bat and you keep DeRosa, a far, far superior player to Aaron Miles - no matter the hand that either hits the ball with.

[dew1679666265]

i heard aaron miles has dreamy eyes

 

I've heard all of DeRosa is sexy, though. He's better even in that, apparently.

 

the tribe has stole my heart, i can't even bear to read or hear his name anymore

 

must. force. self. to. love. miles. and. dreamy. eyes. of. golden. splendor.

 

Maybe the opposing pitchers will fall for his dreamy eyes and walk him every time.

[mikeyt34]

Aaron Miles is not good, though. He can't hit righties or lefties very well so I don't understand how starting him - much less in the leadoff spot - is a better idea than DeRosa.

 

And Jeremy Hermida is a left, as is Luke Scott. Trade for one of them instead of signing Bradley. There's your left handed bat and you keep DeRosa, a far, far superior player to Aaron Miles - no matter the hand that either hits the ball with.

 

To say Miles can't hit is quite a stretch. The reason he was signed is because he is a capable hitter. The guy hit .290 and .319 with an OBP of .342 the last two years with the Cardinals, granted not in a full time role, but I think Miles can duplicate these numbers and hit around .300. A lead off guy hitting around .300 with an OBP of .330 is respectable.

[Monco]

The bottom line here is what have the Cubs accomplished in the post season? They have flaws in a short series against tough right handed pitchers, it's been proven two years in a row. Trust me, I hate losing DeRosa, but loading a lineup of lefties against these tough right handers in the post season seems like a practical way to forge ahead. Would DeRosa be better in the regular season than Miles? Most definitely. But at least Lou will have more flexibility with Miles and Bradley together than with DeRosa alone, as far as a post season short series is concerned. This is what Hendry and Lou are looking for in my opinion. I know I have the Cubs in the playoffs already, but seriously, I would be shocked if they didn't win the division going away.

 

For example, say the Cubs have to play the Dbacks in round one against Brandon Webb and Dan Haren...Playoff line up

 

Miles SS

Fontenot 2B

Lee 1B

Ramirez 3B

Bradley CF/RB

Soriano LF

Soto C

Fukudome RF/CF

Zambrano P

 

Right there you have 5 lefties if you include Z in the mix. You've got stir the pot a little, whatever the Cubs have done the last two years in the post season, obviously didn't work.

Also, look for Bradley to get a bit of the Harden treatment late in the season to keep him fresh for the post season.

Miles hitting lefty ave/obp/ops:

2005 292/317/682

2006 256/310/654

2007 292/311/664

2008 317/345/752

 

Theriot vs. rightys:

2007 260/318/634

2008 308/379/734

 

Factor in Miles below average fielding at short also.

[cubsfan26]

Left handed hitting is good, but only when it's good left handed hitting. Bradley meets that requirement, but Aaron Miles does not. Miles will be getting quite a few ABs now that DeRosa is gone. No matter what hand he hits with, that's a bad thing.

 

 

Fontenot is a LH though, and now will get to play everyday which will help against LH pitching. Miles is a fine hitter against LH pitching, yes he has very little power. But he can hit for average and get on base well against lefties. IMO every hitter doesn't have to have good power, hitting for average and talking walks also help make the line-up go, if you have other power hitters around them.

[cubsfan26]

Miles hitting lefty ave/obp/ops:

2005 292/317/682

2006 256/310/654

2007 292/311/664

2008 317/345/752

 

Miles will be getting most of his starts as a RH in platoon with Fontenot. The rest of the time he will just be playing off the bench.

[dew1679666265]

Aaron Miles is not good, though. He can't hit righties or lefties very well so I don't understand how starting him - much less in the leadoff spot - is a better idea than DeRosa.

 

And Jeremy Hermida is a left, as is Luke Scott. Trade for one of them instead of signing Bradley. There's your left handed bat and you keep DeRosa, a far, far superior player to Aaron Miles - no matter the hand that either hits the ball with.

 

To say Miles can't hit is quite a stretch. The reason he was signed is because he is a capable hitter. The guy hit .290 and .319 with an OBP of .342 the last two years with the Cardinals, granted not in a full time role, but I think Miles can duplicate these numbers and hit around .300. A lead off guy hitting around .300 with an OBP of .330 is respectable.

 

It's an extremely low goal to shoot for and a lot worse than what DeRosa is likely to produce. I'm not happy at all with a player who might get a single 30% of the time. He doesn't slug, and gets on base much less than the extreme lowest I'd want out of a top of the order slap hitter.

 

I'd want no less than a .350 OBP out of the leadoff spot - something Miles has barely done once in his career. And for a guy who will not slug at all ( career .364 SLG) I want much better than the very low end. He's actually a slightly worse version of Ryan Theriot. The fact that he's left handed will not save him.

 

Add to that, all I've heard is that he's a poor defensive second baseman - which would mean a terrible defensive shortstop - and he's no better than a bench player at best.

[mikeyt34]

I'm not arguing the fact that DeRosa won't be missed, and Miles is a downgrade, but this trade was also to free up the cash to acquire Milton Bradley, so don't lose sight of that. Look at it as Marquis and DeRosa, for Milton Bradley, Arron Miles, and 3 pithcing prospects, maybe that will take away some of the sting for some of you.

 

My point is, the Cubs can't go into the post season again the way they were constructed the past two years. Does anyone want to take a crack again at Derek Lowe or Brandon Webb with Fukudome and Jim Edmonds as our sole LH hitters in the lineup? Lou and Jim don't either.

[17 Seconds]

The bottom line here is what have the Cubs accomplished in the post season? They have flaws in a short series against tough right handed pitchers, it's been proven two years in a row. Trust me, I hate losing DeRosa, but loading a lineup of lefties against these tough right handers in the post season seems like a practical way to forge ahead. Would DeRosa be better in the regular season than Miles? Most definitely. But at least Lou will have more flexibility with Miles and Bradley together than with DeRosa alone, as far as a post season short series is concerned. This is what Hendry and Lou are looking for in my opinion. I know I have the Cubs in the playoffs already, but seriously, I would be shocked if they didn't win the division going away.

 

For example, say the Cubs have to play the Dbacks in round one against Brandon Webb and Dan Haren...Playoff line up

 

Miles SS

Fontenot 2B

Lee 1B

Ramirez 3B

Bradley CF/RB

Soriano LF

Soto C

Fukudome RF/CF

Zambrano P

 

Right there you have 5 lefties if you include Z in the mix. You've got stir the pot a little, whatever the Cubs have done the last two years in the post season, obviously didn't work.

Also, look for Bradley to get a bit of the Harden treatment late in the season to keep him fresh for the post season.

 

First of all, it has not been "proven" that the offense was flawed in that they couldn;t hit RHP and that's why they lost in the playoffs. They lost because they didn't hit. It's as simple as that. What WAS proven was that the Cubs hit RHP well last season. I thought we were done with the false " the Cubs lost because theycouldn't hit RHP" stuff. They just didn't hit. If they batted from the other side they still wouldn't have hit.

 

Second, you seriously would bat Aaron Miles leadoff? Aaron ".329 career" OBP Miles? People complain about Soriano leading off because he doesn't take many walks, well Miles is much much worse than Soriano at that. The last 2 seasons he's drawn 25 and 23 walks. That guy doesn;t belong anywhere near the top of the lineup.

[17 Seconds]

Look at it as Marquis and DeRosa, for Milton Bradley, Arron Miles, and 3 pithcing prospects

 

More like Marquis, DeRosa, and a lot of money for Bradley/Miles/3 prospects

[Monco]

Miles hitting lefty ave/obp/ops:

2005 292/317/682

2006 256/310/654

2007 292/311/664

2008 317/345/752

 

Miles will be getting most of his starts as a RH in platoon with Fontenot. The rest of the time he will just be playing off the bench.

I put his stats hitting as a lefty because it was suggested he could start at short in place of Theriot vs. the D-backs facing Haren and Webb

[17 Seconds]

To say Miles can't hit is quite a stretch. The reason he was signed is because he is a capable hitter. The guy hit .290 and .319 with an OBP of .342 the last two years with the Cardinals,.

 

You talk as though that means he's a good hitter, and that a .342 OBP is good for a singles hitter. He's not a good offensive player. Not at all

 

A lead off guy hitting around .300 with an OBP of .330 is respectable

 

A .330 OBP in the leadoff spot isn't even remotely acceptable. That's seriously like the worst case scenario. You're basically giving the most ABs of the team to the guy who makes out at the highest rate. If you have a .330 OBP and you don't hit for power, you belong in the 8 hole, if that.

 

We really need to stop acting like Miles is a good hitter. He's pretty much Juan Pierre but without the stolen bases. That's bad. Really bad.

[dew1679666265]

Left handed hitting is good, but only when it's good left handed hitting. Bradley meets that requirement, but Aaron Miles does not. Miles will be getting quite a few ABs now that DeRosa is gone. No matter what hand he hits with, that's a bad thing.

 

 

Fontenot is a LH though, and now will get to play everyday which will help against LH pitching. Miles is a fine hitter against LH pitching, yes he has very little power. But he can hit for average and get on base well against lefties. IMO every hitter doesn't have to have good power, hitting for average and talking walks also help make the line-up go, if you have other power hitters around them.

 

I agree that OBP is important, but Miles just doesn't provide enough of it. He'll get on base at a mediocre rate and has no power whatsoever to balance that out. He's an older, slightly worse version of Ryan Theriot.

 

If a guy can provide what Theriot did last year (a .380+ OBP) with no power, I can live with that. Miles is unlikely to come close to that.

[dew1679666265]

I'm not arguing the fact that DeRosa won't be missed, and Miles is a downgrade, but this trade was also to free up the cash to acquire Milton Bradley, so don't lose sight of that. Look at it as Marquis and DeRosa, for Milton Bradley, Arron Miles, and 3 pithcing prospects, maybe that will take away some of the sting for some of you.

 

It was a trade to free up cash to acquire Milton Bradley, and that's a bad thing. We downgrade a decent amount at one position to slightly upgrade at another - and we spend a whole heck of a lot of money to do it. Keep in mind that Bradley is very unlikely to play 100 games for us. Meaning that Hoffpauir/Reed/Gathright will get lots of at bats this year. That delivers a huge sting.

 

Plus, we also downgraded in the pitching depth.

 

My point is, the Cubs can't go into the post season again the way they were constructed the past two years. Does anyone want to take a crack again at Derek Lowe or Brandon Webb with Fukudome and Jim Edmonds as our sole LH hitters in the lineup? Lou and Jim don't either.

 

I'd be fine with it if the alternative is to make the lineup worse by acquiring bad left handed hitters (Aaron Miles). But, keep in mind those aren't the only two options. Jeremy Hermida and Luke Scott are available - both are lefties and both are much better than Aaron Miles and would not force us to play the trio of Hoff/Reed/Gathright.

[mikeyt34]

Dexter you said, "the Cubs lost because they couldn't hit RHP" is false and is a myth? What more evidence do you need to see in the POST SEASON. I don't give a hoot about the regular season and how well they did against some of the3, 4 and 5 RH starters in league during the REGULAR SEASON. In the POST SEASON, you are going against 1's and 2's RH Pitchers on most teams, this is where the Cubs have failed. I guess Jim and Lou disagree with you then about the need for left handed hitting. Meh, what do they know, they have only about 80 years of baseball knowledge to fall back on...

[17 Seconds]

Dexter you said, "the Cubs lost because they couldn't hit RHP" is false and is a myth? What more evidence do you need to see in the POST SEASON. I don't give a hoot about the regular season and how well they did against some of the3, 4 and 5 RH starters in league during the REGULAR SEASON. In the POST SEASON, you are going against 1's and 2's RH Pitchers on most teams, this is where the Cubs have failed. I guess Jim and Lou disagree with you then about the need for left handed hitting. Meh, what do they know, they have only about 80 years of baseball knowledge to fall back on...

 

Search through the board, this has been discussed thoroughly. The Cubs hit good RHP well in the regular season too.

 

And of course you use the biggest copout, which is that Lou and Hendry agree with it. What about when Dusty was batting Patterson Neifi in the 1-2 spots and doing all sorts of other dumb things? We can't question him, because he has years of baseball knowledge, right? Basically you're saying we can never question anybody in charge of running a baseball team, which is really dumb considering that they make huge mistake all the time. Really weak.

[mikeyt34]

Some of you are too caught up in my saying that Miles should lead off. I just threw that lineup out there as an example. Ok, move Miles down to the 8th spot move Soriano back up to lead off, whatever. I'm just saying another LH bat in the line up come post season is a good thing.

[17 Seconds]

Some of you are too caught up in my saying that Miles should lead off. I just threw that lineup out there as an example. Ok, move Miles down to the 8th spot move Soriano back up to lead off, whatever. I'm just saying another LH bat in the line up come post season is a good thing.

 

Not if

 

A) he's not good

 

B) we're facing a lefty

 

anyways it's moot since the only way he's get at-bats in the postseason is if somebody it hurt. fontenot will be the primary 2B against rhp.