hill to be skipped; injured in 5/16 AAA start

[jersey cubs fan]

cubs were 16-9 prior to marquis' start against the brewers (when hill was skipped), and they're 3-6 since.

 

way to get your hands all over stuff, lou!

 

That's pretty poor reasoning.

 

really? why?

 

they've lost every tinkered-with game. if i remember correctly, they shuffled the rotation to allow marquis (and not hill) to start against the brewers. they lost. hill was then nine days removed from his last start when he threw against the cardinals. they lost that game. and lieber, who took hill's spot in the rotation, got battered today. they lost.

 

you really don't see how this rotation shuffle hurt the cubs?

 

I don't think it's the reason they're 3-6.

 

There's never one reason. But it certainly appears to be a significant factor. Lou had to go get his paws on things to justify his standing as the wise ole' manager. Things were going fine, and he freaked out.

[abuck1220]

cubs were 16-9 prior to marquis' start against the brewers (when hill was skipped), and they're 3-6 since.

 

way to get your hands all over stuff, lou!

 

That's pretty poor reasoning.

 

really? why?

 

they've lost every tinkered-with game. if i remember correctly, they shuffled the rotation to allow marquis (and not hill) to start against the brewers. they lost. hill was then nine days removed from his last start when he threw against the cardinals. they lost that game. and lieber, who took hill's spot in the rotation, got battered today. they lost.

 

you really don't see how this rotation shuffle hurt the cubs?

 

I don't think it's the reason they're 3-6.

 

and i didn't say it was the reason.

[RynoRules]

cubs were 16-9 prior to marquis' start against the brewers (when hill was skipped), and they're 3-6 since.

 

way to get your hands all over stuff, lou!

 

That's pretty poor reasoning.

 

really? why?

 

they've lost every tinkered-with game. if i remember correctly, they shuffled the rotation to allow marquis (and not hill) to start against the brewers. they lost. hill was then nine days removed from his last start when he threw against the cardinals. they lost that game. and lieber, who took hill's spot in the rotation, got battered today. they lost.

 

you really don't see how this rotation shuffle hurt the cubs?

 

I don't think it's the reason they're 3-6.

 

and i didn't say it was the reason.

 

But your argument certainly implied it.

[Brett]

cubs were 16-9 prior to marquis' start against the brewers (when hill was skipped), and they're 3-6 since.

 

way to get your hands all over stuff, lou!

 

That's pretty poor reasoning.

 

really? why?

 

they've lost every tinkered-with game. if i remember correctly, they shuffled the rotation to allow marquis (and not hill) to start against the brewers. they lost. hill was then nine days removed from his last start when he threw against the cardinals. they lost that game. and lieber, who took hill's spot in the rotation, got battered today. they lost.

 

you really don't see how this rotation shuffle hurt the cubs?

 

I don't think it's the reason they're 3-6.

 

and i didn't say it was the reason.

 

But your argument certainly implied it.

Maybe if Hill took the mound every day...

[abuck1220]

cubs were 16-9 prior to marquis' start against the brewers (when hill was skipped), and they're 3-6 since.

 

way to get your hands all over stuff, lou!

 

That's pretty poor reasoning.

 

really? why?

 

they've lost every tinkered-with game. if i remember correctly, they shuffled the rotation to allow marquis (and not hill) to start against the brewers. they lost. hill was then nine days removed from his last start when he threw against the cardinals. they lost that game. and lieber, who took hill's spot in the rotation, got battered today. they lost.

 

you really don't see how this rotation shuffle hurt the cubs?

 

I don't think it's the reason they're 3-6.

 

and i didn't say it was the reason.

 

But your argument certainly implied it.

 

no it didn't.

[brinoch]

cubs were 16-9 prior to marquis' start against the brewers (when hill was skipped), and they're 3-6 since.

 

way to get your hands all over stuff, lou!

 

That's pretty poor reasoning.

 

really? why?

 

they've lost every tinkered-with game. if i remember correctly, they shuffled the rotation to allow marquis (and not hill) to start against the brewers. they lost. hill was then nine days removed from his last start when he threw against the cardinals. they lost that game. and lieber, who took hill's spot in the rotation, got battered today. they lost.

 

you really don't see how this rotation shuffle hurt the cubs?

 

I don't think it's the reason they're 3-6.

 

and i didn't say it was the reason.

 

But your argument certainly implied it.

Maybe if Hill took the mound every day...

 

Nope, just every fifth game when Rothschild ignores him as is proper.

[Banghart]

cubs were 16-9 prior to marquis' start against the brewers (when hill was skipped), and they're 3-6 since.

 

way to get your hands all over stuff, lou!

 

That's pretty poor reasoning.

 

really? why?

 

they've lost every tinkered-with game. if i remember correctly, they shuffled the rotation to allow marquis (and not hill) to start against the brewers. they lost. hill was then nine days removed from his last start when he threw against the cardinals. they lost that game. and lieber, who took hill's spot in the rotation, got battered today. they lost.

 

you really don't see how this rotation shuffle hurt the cubs?

 

I don't think it's the reason they're 3-6.

I agree. I think the fact that the Cubs averaged over 6 and a half runs a game in April versus 3 runs a game in May is a bigger reason for the difference.

[Tracer Bullet]

cubs were 16-9 prior to marquis' start against the brewers (when hill was skipped), and they're 3-6 since.

 

way to get your hands all over stuff, lou!

 

That's pretty poor reasoning.

 

really? why?

 

they've lost every tinkered-with game. if i remember correctly, they shuffled the rotation to allow marquis (and not hill) to start against the brewers. they lost. hill was then nine days removed from his last start when he threw against the cardinals. they lost that game. and lieber, who took hill's spot in the rotation, got battered today. they lost.

 

you really don't see how this rotation shuffle hurt the cubs?

 

I don't think it's the reason they're 3-6.

 

and i didn't say it was the reason.

 

But your argument certainly implied it.

 

It implied that one of the reasons for the downturn was screwing with the rotation. To get that the shuffling was the only reason, you'd have to make quite a leap.

[dew1679666265]

Besides... you know darn well that athletes and coaches/managers give a lot of stock responses that are full of crap.

 

Agreed. Which is why, going back to the original point, I don't particularly believe him when he talks about needing Hill.

 

I don't know why Lou would specifically mention that to the Reds radio guys in a casual conversation that's not on the air (people he certainly doesn't need to impress) that the Cubs "absolutely need Hill to be himself in order for the team to win this year". The Reds radio guys talked about it as that Lou thought it was one of the biggest keys to the whole season.

 

I'm inclined to give the benefit of the doubt. There's just no real reason why he would feel the need to volunteer that to the opposing team's radio guys if he didn't believe it.

 

I think this is a very good point that hasn't been mentioned much. Lou didn't say this after prompting from Bruce Levine or a Chicago media guy, he said it off camera to the Reds radio man.

 

Seems odd he'd volunteer something he didn't mean.

[dew1679666265]

cubs were 16-9 prior to marquis' start against the brewers (when hill was skipped), and they're 3-6 since.

 

way to get your hands all over stuff, lou!

 

That's pretty poor reasoning.

 

really? why?

 

they've lost every tinkered-with game. if i remember correctly, they shuffled the rotation to allow marquis (and not hill) to start against the brewers. they lost. hill was then nine days removed from his last start when he threw against the cardinals. they lost that game. and lieber, who took hill's spot in the rotation, got battered today. they lost.

 

you really don't see how this rotation shuffle hurt the cubs?

 

I could be wrong on this, but I seem to remember that Marquis was going to start anyway in that series and Lou pushing back Hill moved Dempster or Z up a day.

 

Not 100% on that, but I think I remember seeing that.

[CubColtPacer]

cubs were 16-9 prior to marquis' start against the brewers (when hill was skipped), and they're 3-6 since.

 

way to get your hands all over stuff, lou!

 

That's pretty poor reasoning.

 

really? why?

 

they've lost every tinkered-with game. if i remember correctly, they shuffled the rotation to allow marquis (and not hill) to start against the brewers. they lost. hill was then nine days removed from his last start when he threw against the cardinals. they lost that game. and lieber, who took hill's spot in the rotation, got battered today. they lost.

 

you really don't see how this rotation shuffle hurt the cubs?

 

I could be wrong on this, but I seem to remember that Marquis was going to start anyway in that series and Lou pushing back Hill moved Dempster or Z up a day.

 

Not 100% on that, but I think I remember seeing that.

 

It moved Z into the Brewers series. Some were arguing that Marquis should have been the one skipped, but that would be a different argument than the one proposed above. That is suggesting that the tinkering itself was a big problem, regardless of who got switched.

[dew1679666265]

cubs were 16-9 prior to marquis' start against the brewers (when hill was skipped), and they're 3-6 since.

 

way to get your hands all over stuff, lou!

 

That's pretty poor reasoning.

 

really? why?

 

they've lost every tinkered-with game. if i remember correctly, they shuffled the rotation to allow marquis (and not hill) to start against the brewers. they lost. hill was then nine days removed from his last start when he threw against the cardinals. they lost that game. and lieber, who took hill's spot in the rotation, got battered today. they lost.

 

you really don't see how this rotation shuffle hurt the cubs?

 

I could be wrong on this, but I seem to remember that Marquis was going to start anyway in that series and Lou pushing back Hill moved Dempster or Z up a day.

 

Not 100% on that, but I think I remember seeing that.

 

It moved Z into the Brewers series. Some were arguing that Marquis should have been the one skipped, but that would be a different argument than the one proposed above. That is suggesting that the tinkering itself was a big problem, regardless of who got switched.

 

So the tinkering then caused us to lose a game started by our best starting pitcher? Interesting logic.

 

Whether or not skipping Hill was a good idea, I see no way Lou's tinkering hurt Z or Wood's ability to pitch on that day.

[17 Seconds]

So when is Hill making his second start?

[Keener98]

So when is Hill making his second start?

 

 

Well if Lou or Larry have any say, probably 9 days or so after his 1st start.

[rawaction]

So when is Hill making his second start?

 

in 1 hour.

[abuck1220]

5 2/3 ip, 3 h, 4 bb, 0 r, 8 k's. 92 pitches, 52 strikes.

 

yeah, he walked more than you'd like, but it's cancelled out by his ability to strike guys out and not give up hits. bring him back up.

[Keener98]

5 2/3 ip, 3 h, 4 bb, 0 r, 8 k's. 92 pitches, 52 strikes.

 

yeah, he walked more than you'd like, but it's cancelled out by his ability to strike guys out and not give up hits. bring him back up.

 

 

I agree he should be back up but I doubt the Cubs like the 52 strikes and 40 balls. I bet he makes at least 1 more down there.

[abuck1220]

“It’s a few pitches here and there where my arm will drop down,” Hill said after the Iowa Cubs’ 3-0 win over Portland. “I’ll kind of come around pitches, instead of stand through them.”

 

Hill, who owns an 18-15 record at the major-league level since 2006, balked at the notion of being demoted.

 

“It’s not a demotion, at least in the sense they put it,” Hill said Sunday. “You go down there to get more work, more pitches in.”

 

“I’m (working on) getting more consistent with my arm slot and getting my arm where it should be,” Hill said. “It’s kind of dropping down, more three-quarters. I’m more of an over-the-top guy.”

 

Hill worked out of trouble with three strikeouts in the third inning, but again walked the leadoff batter in the fourth.

 

“You try to forget about the last pitch,” Hill said. “Mechanically, you want to make that adjustment within the next pitch and not have it happen two or three pitches in a row.”

 

“He’s come down (to triple-A) with a vengeance and said, ‘Hey, you guys made the wrong decision and I’m going to fight my way to get back to Chicago,’” Iowa manager Pat Listach explained. “That’s the way he’s taken it, and that’s the way he approaches everything.”

 

Hill, who started last Tuesday against Tacoma, has pitched 102/3 innings for the Iowa Cubs, allowing 10 hits, five walks, two earned runs and striking out 13.

 

“It’s a process,” he said. “That’s what’s so great about this game. It’ll build you up, bring you down and teach you how to get back up again.”

[Laura]

Cubs.com Pie story.

 

The Cubs have shown they'll make a move if necessary. Rich Hill was reassigned to Iowa after posting a 1-0 record and 4.12 ERA in five starts. He'll need some more time. In his last outing with Iowa, he threw 55 fastballs, and 28 were strikes, 27 were balls. That's not a good ratio.

 

"We could've kept him here and put him in the bullpen, and get work whenever he could," Piniella said. "We chose to do what's good for Rich, and that's to send him out there and pitch. That's another perfect example. We couldn't start him the way he was throwing here. It wasn't fair to him or fair to us."

[abuck1220]

you know what else isn't a good ratio? the ten baserunners marquis allowed in 5 2/3 last night to the worst offensive team in baseball. or the 1.73 baserunners he has allowed per inning on the season. but i guess as long as those baserunners are getting on via line drives all over the field, it's ok.

 

from the suntimes...

 

Left-hander Rich Hill has a 1.69 ERA in two starts at Class AAA Iowa, but the results are mixed enough that it looks like he'll be there for at least another few starts, manager Lou Piniella said.

 

''I would think so,'' said Piniella, who pointed out reports that of the 55 fastballs Hill threw in his last start, barely half (28) were strikes. ''That's not a real good mix. So you've got to do better with that.''

 

Although he struck out eight, Hill walked four in 5 2/3 innings Sunday. He has walked five in 10 2/3 innings over the two starts.

[treebird]

it's awfully hard to root for a team that says yes to jim edmonds and no to rich hill

[VanceJergins]

you know what else isn't a good ratio? the ten baserunners marquis allowed in 5 2/3 last night to the worst offensive team in baseball. or the 1.73 baserunners he has allowed per inning on the season. but i guess as long as those baserunners are getting on via line drives all over the field, it's ok.

 

from the suntimes...

 

Left-hander Rich Hill has a 1.69 ERA in two starts at Class AAA Iowa, but the results are mixed enough that it looks like he'll be there for at least another few starts, manager Lou Piniella said.

 

''I would think so,'' said Piniella, who pointed out reports that of the 55 fastballs Hill threw in his last start, barely half (28) were strikes. ''That's not a real good mix. So you've got to do better with that.''

 

Although he struck out eight, Hill walked four in 5 2/3 innings Sunday. He has walked five in 10 2/3 innings over the two starts.

 

A FEW more? He really is clueless.

[Tyrant]

He's not throwing strikes.

[imb]

If the problem really is mechanical, and it sounds like it is, I think it's a good idea to have Hill work on it in AAA where the results dont matter as much as the fact that he's working in game conditions.

 

It's a bummer that Marquis is allowed to suck at the major league level, but two wrongs dont make a right. If Hill throws 50% strikes at the major league level, he's going to get rocked. Let him work that out in Iowa and in the meantime someone throw Marquis off a bridge.

[Jon]

He's not throwing strikes.

He didn't have a good strike to total pitch ratio last time out, but the choice is between leaving Hill at Iowa and let Marquis start or remove Marquis from the rotation and let Hill work on his mechanics in the majors. He has still been effective and has struck out more batters as of late.

 

It's not that tough of a decision when compared to leaving him down there for the rest of the month.