College Basketball 2007-2008

[SouthSideRyan]

 

And, by the way, by your example, Pruitt gained an advantage for Illinois tonight (albeit a very slight one) when he prevented White from shooting. So, then, the foul should have been called. Because, after all, there's no way for the ref to know if that ball is going to go in -- despite the distance. Right?

 

Snipped the context discussion cause I already said I'd be fine with calling things to the letter of the law, but it's not how it's done.

 

And yes, Pruitt gained a tiny advantage in doing such, just as every time a player fouls, there is some tiny advantage to them. I already admitted that Pruitt made a ridiculous decision in coming within 20 feet of White, I already told you why it wasn't called, unless your argument is that White was going to make his 3/4 court shot, I'm not really understanding the argument.

 

I'm feeling querulous so I'm picking a useless argument.

 

I'd laugh, but I don't know what querulous means, so you may have just insulted me. I'll go with a slight giggle.

[NCCubFan]

I don't know what that means. I'm not worried about anything physical happening to dear ol dad. I doubt anything is said any worse than IU fans chanting f*** you refs at their last game.

 

That was absolutely unacceptable and reprehensible. Times like those I wish IU still had Coach Knight.

I remember a game in the 70s or 80s where some IU fans chanted "BS" (they didn't actually abbreviate it as I did) after a questionable call. Knight immediately got on the PA and said something like "This is Indiana University. We don't do that here." He got a huge cheer from the crowd.

[NCCubFan]

IDKWTI = I don't know who that is. Deron Williams's response when asked about the guy who scored 1 point in the first half tonight.

Basically the equivalent of referring to Lord Voldemort as "You-Know-Who" or "He-Who-Must-Not-Be-Named" in the Harry Potter series.

[WindyCity]

Apparently, it really is completely and totally impossible to coach free throw shooting.

 

](*,)

[circlechange]

I seem to recall a technical called against Webber a while back for calling a time out when Michigan didn't have one... in a rather important game, too.

 

And it was a different situation. Whistles are blown based on context, it's just the way it's done. Webber was trapped in a corner by UNC defenders and stopped to motion for the time out. In doing so, he could've gained an advantage and gotten out of the trap. The Arizona player called it as time was clearly about to expire, and gained no advantage in doing so.

 

Context shouldn't matter. The rules are black and white. It's all the contextual interpretations and application hat give us the awful reffing we see in every single Big Ten game. If you applied the rules without regard to context, you would cut down significantly on overly physical play, there would be more turnovers, and much higher scoring games.

 

And, by the way, by your example, Pruitt gained an advantage for Illinois tonight (albeit a very slight one) when he prevented White from shooting. So, then, the foul should have been called. Because, after all, there's no way for the ref to know if that ball is going to go in -- despite the distance. Right?

I can't believe you're arguing that the foul on Pruitt should have been called, to decide a hard fought tie game going into double overtime. I'm an Illini fan, and if the situation were reversed I'd be embarrassed to win a game that way. Sorry to butt in on the argument but unless a guy gets physically decked to the ground in that situation that should never be called.

[illiniguy]

Good lord, can Shaun Pruitt just get his diploma now? Oh and to the poster saying that what Eric does was stupid and we should just beat them on the court. Are you really that dense? You really believe poor Eric was a victim who didn't know how to react? Anyone with half a brain knows they railroaded our program. He is a hell of a player. I wish he was on our team. But, I am very glad his old man isn't associated with our university. That guy is a clown.

[brinoch]

I seem to recall a technical called against Webber a while back for calling a time out when Michigan didn't have one... in a rather important game, too.

 

And it was a different situation. Whistles are blown based on context, it's just the way it's done. Webber was trapped in a corner by UNC defenders and stopped to motion for the time out. In doing so, he could've gained an advantage and gotten out of the trap. The Arizona player called it as time was clearly about to expire, and gained no advantage in doing so.

 

Context shouldn't matter. The rules are black and white. It's all the contextual interpretations and application hat give us the awful reffing we see in every single Big Ten game. If you applied the rules without regard to context, you would cut down significantly on overly physical play, there would be more turnovers, and much higher scoring games.

 

And, by the way, by your example, Pruitt gained an advantage for Illinois tonight (albeit a very slight one) when he prevented White from shooting. So, then, the foul should have been called. Because, after all, there's no way for the ref to know if that ball is going to go in -- despite the distance. Right?

I can't believe you're arguing that the foul on Pruitt should have been called, to decide a hard fought tie game going into double overtime. I'm an Illini fan, and if the situation were reversed I'd be embarrassed to win a game that way. Sorry to butt in on the argument but unless a guy gets physically decked to the ground in that situation that should never be called.

 

I really think you need to see my post re: being querulous.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Eric Gordon : Illinois Basketball Fans :: Ty Willingham : Notre Dame Football Fans

[rawaction]

I didn't have a problem with Frazier's chest bump in the intros. It would have been stupid if he didn't. I thought it was funny and a great job by him to get in his head right away. As for Gordon getting away with travelling calls, yeah he does travel pretty much every time he catches the ball on the move. But I suggest Illini fans watch Brian Randle too. He does the same. And Gordon has been called for at least 2 traveling violations in every game this year.

 

Big Ten officiating is what it is. It's consistently inconsistent. It's horrible. That's what you expect out of a BigTen game unfortunately. Neither team was helped nor hurt by officiating overall.

 

Lastly, Sampson really sucks at coaching. IU is a horrible zone team. U of I was able to hit outside shots and get it inside whenever they wanted to (luckily for us, they never seemed to want to go inside). Yet Sampson stayed in the zone. He went to the man late and the D was great. Offensively, he's shown he that he can draw up a shot for Gordon out of halftime and that's about it.

[hawkeyecub]

I have no horse in this race at all, the only thing I find funny is how IU is 19-3 (8-1) while Illinois is 10-14 (2-9) but most Illinois fans seem certain that they will dominate Indiana immediately once this season is over and IU will go nowhere this year.

 

Indiana is a flawed team without a PF or true PG. But they also have one of the five best guards in the country and maybe one of the five best big men in the country this year. They'll be a 4 seed at the lowest and will get to the Sweet 16.

 

I don't think Sampson is proving a lot as a coach this year and I don't like him at all, but they have some decent talent coming in and aren't completely going away.

With Illinois, I know you have Legion and Smith coming in next year and with McCamey that can be a really nice backcourt. I just think you're getting a little ahead of yourselves especially when I don't think Weber still has that "great coach" tag that he always got when people criticized his recruiting.

[rawaction]

Yeah, I don't understand the comments about IU not being that good next year. Lose DJ and probably lose Gordon, but do bring back every other contributor on the team. The 3 top guys they will bring back, put up 41 points last night. And they bring in antoher top 5-10 recruit in the nation.

[gflore34]

I have no horse in this race at all, the only thing I find funny is how IU is 19-3 (8-1) while Illinois is 10-14 (2-9) but most Illinois fans seem certain that they will dominate Indiana immediately once this season is over and IU will go nowhere this year.

 

Indiana is a flawed team without a PF or true PG. But they also have one of the five best guards in the country and maybe one of the five best big men in the country this year. They'll be a 4 seed at the lowest and will get to the Sweet 16.

 

I don't think Sampson is proving a lot as a coach this year and I don't like him at all, but they have some decent talent coming in and aren't completely going away.

With Illinois, I know you have Legion and Smith coming in next year and with McCamey that can be a really nice backcourt. I just think you're getting a little ahead of yourselves especially when I don't think Weber still has that "great coach" tag that he always got when people criticized his recruiting.

 

Illinois by the way, has some more than decent talent coming in, Weber has really stepped up his recruiting and has commitments from arguably the state' top two players (2010) and boatload of talent coming in 2009. At this point far superior to what Indiana has for 2009 and 2010, as for 2008, I believe you'll see a vastly improved Illini team - Legion and Smith can do something most of the current Illini can't do - shoot.

[soapy]

i didn't see the big deal about Frazier's "bump" before the game. it annoyed the hell out of me that they kept showing it and making a big deal about it. so what? he wasn't trying to hurt him. i can see beeing a little bothered if I'm Gordon and wanting to take it to Frazier, but other than that, who cares?

 

IU is still struggling. I never expect a highly effecient, high-scoring offense from a Sampson team, but I do expect good defense and that zone was a joke. On the offensive side, they once again went away from DJ when the game was on the line. I will never understand this.

 

I agree all the "IU sucks" stuff from the UI fans is a bit much. I don't see any IU fans hear claiming IU is a final four team or a national contender right now or anything. They have flaws, we get it. Who is saying otherwise?

 

Anyway, I'm glad IU came out with a (ugly) win. I hate UI and Weber so I'm glad to see a sweep (so far).

[Derwood]

IU will be "nothing" next year?

 

didn't you say that about Ohio State after losing Oden/Conley Jr.? Aren't they, um, 16-7 (7-3) this year?

 

and didnt' McCamey give a verbal commit to IU but back out to go to UofI? did he "screw Indiana's program"? do they have some childish acronym for him in Bloomington?

[illiniguy]

IU will be "nothing" next year?

 

didn't you say that about Ohio State after losing Oden/Conley Jr.? Aren't they, um, 16-7 (7-3) this year?

 

and didnt' McCamey give a verbal commit to IU but back out to go to UofI? did he "screw Indiana's program"? do they have some childish acronym for him in Bloomington?

No McCamey did not. Just another false truth told by ESPN last night. Goes along with Gordon opening up his recruting. By opening up they mean we found out when he showed up at IU's MM. McCamey was waiting for us to offer the whole time. He has said in interviews we are his dream school.

[Derwood]

IU will be "nothing" next year?

 

didn't you say that about Ohio State after losing Oden/Conley Jr.? Aren't they, um, 16-7 (7-3) this year?

 

and didnt' McCamey give a verbal commit to IU but back out to go to UofI? did he "screw Indiana's program"? do they have some childish acronym for him in Bloomington?

No McCamey did not. Just another false truth told by ESPN last night. Goes along with Gordon opening up his recruting. By opening up they mean we found out when he showed up at IU's MM. McCamey was waiting for us to offer the whole time. He has said in interviews we are his dream school.

 

 

so he never had interest in IU at all?

[illiniguy]

I have no horse in this race at all, the only thing I find funny is how IU is 19-3 (8-1) while Illinois is 10-14 (2-9) but most Illinois fans seem certain that they will dominate Indiana immediately once this season is over and IU will go nowhere this year.

 

Indiana is a flawed team without a PF or true PG. But they also have one of the five best guards in the country and maybe one of the five best big men in the country this year. They'll be a 4 seed at the lowest and will get to the Sweet 16.

 

I don't think Sampson is proving a lot as a coach this year and I don't like him at all, but they have some decent talent coming in and aren't completely going away.

With Illinois, I know you have Legion and Smith coming in next year and with McCamey that can be a really nice backcourt. I just think you're getting a little ahead of yourselves especially when I don't think Weber still has that "great coach" tag that he always got when people criticized his recruiting.

Well we know we are a terrible team and that they are supposed to be a good team. Yet everytime we have played them they have barely beaten us. We also played Duke, they had no such problem taking us to the woodshed. They lose Gordon and White next year. In the next three years we add the most talent we have ever had, IU could be on probabtion. Are you still failing to see why we think we will be better going forward?

[illiniguy]

IU will be "nothing" next year?

 

didn't you say that about Ohio State after losing Oden/Conley Jr.? Aren't they, um, 16-7 (7-3) this year?

 

and didnt' McCamey give a verbal commit to IU but back out to go to UofI? did he "screw Indiana's program"? do they have some childish acronym for him in Bloomington?

No McCamey did not. Just another false truth told by ESPN last night. Goes along with Gordon opening up his recruting. By opening up they mean we found out when he showed up at IU's MM. McCamey was waiting for us to offer the whole time. He has said in interviews we are his dream school.

 

 

so he never had interest in IU at all?

He listed them, but he sure as hell didn't ever commit to them. It was more of Jay Bilas telling his side of the story. His side just happened to be way innacurate.

[wekse]

IU will be "nothing" next year?

 

didn't you say that about Ohio State after losing Oden/Conley Jr.? Aren't they, um, 16-7 (7-3) this year?

 

and didnt' McCamey give a verbal commit to IU but back out to go to UofI? did he "screw Indiana's program"? do they have some childish acronym for him in Bloomington?

No McCamey did not. Just another false truth told by ESPN last night. Goes along with Gordon opening up his recruting. By opening up they mean we found out when he showed up at IU's MM. McCamey was waiting for us to offer the whole time. He has said in interviews we are his dream school.

 

 

so he never had interest in IU at all?

 

haha, that's not exactly the same thing now is it?

[Derwood]

I have no horse in this race at all, the only thing I find funny is how IU is 19-3 (8-1) while Illinois is 10-14 (2-9) but most Illinois fans seem certain that they will dominate Indiana immediately once this season is over and IU will go nowhere this year.

 

Indiana is a flawed team without a PF or true PG. But they also have one of the five best guards in the country and maybe one of the five best big men in the country this year. They'll be a 4 seed at the lowest and will get to the Sweet 16.

 

I don't think Sampson is proving a lot as a coach this year and I don't like him at all, but they have some decent talent coming in and aren't completely going away.

With Illinois, I know you have Legion and Smith coming in next year and with McCamey that can be a really nice backcourt. I just think you're getting a little ahead of yourselves especially when I don't think Weber still has that "great coach" tag that he always got when people criticized his recruiting.

Well we know we are a terrible team and that they are supposed to be a good team. Yet everytime we have played them they have barely beaten us. We also played Duke, they had no such problem taking us to the woodshed. They lose Gordon and White next year. In the next three years we add the most talent we have ever had, IU could be on probabtion. Are you still failing to see why we think we will be better going forward?

 

and who's to say that your great recruits don't all bolt after THEIR freshmen year?

[illiniguy]

I have no horse in this race at all, the only thing I find funny is how IU is 19-3 (8-1) while Illinois is 10-14 (2-9) but most Illinois fans seem certain that they will dominate Indiana immediately once this season is over and IU will go nowhere this year.

 

Indiana is a flawed team without a PF or true PG. But they also have one of the five best guards in the country and maybe one of the five best big men in the country this year. They'll be a 4 seed at the lowest and will get to the Sweet 16.

 

I don't think Sampson is proving a lot as a coach this year and I don't like him at all, but they have some decent talent coming in and aren't completely going away.

With Illinois, I know you have Legion and Smith coming in next year and with McCamey that can be a really nice backcourt. I just think you're getting a little ahead of yourselves especially when I don't think Weber still has that "great coach" tag that he always got when people criticized his recruiting.

Well we know we are a terrible team and that they are supposed to be a good team. Yet everytime we have played them they have barely beaten us. We also played Duke, they had no such problem taking us to the woodshed. They lose Gordon and White next year. In the next three years we add the most talent we have ever had, IU could be on probabtion. Are you still failing to see why we think we will be better going forward?

 

and who's to say that your great recruits don't all bolt after THEIR freshmen year?

At what point did I say any of them were that good? Maybe Jereme Richmond can do that, but even then I doubt that as we will be pretty good and he won't get to run loose like Gordon does.

[Derwood]

I have no horse in this race at all, the only thing I find funny is how IU is 19-3 (8-1) while Illinois is 10-14 (2-9) but most Illinois fans seem certain that they will dominate Indiana immediately once this season is over and IU will go nowhere this year.

 

Indiana is a flawed team without a PF or true PG. But they also have one of the five best guards in the country and maybe one of the five best big men in the country this year. They'll be a 4 seed at the lowest and will get to the Sweet 16.

 

I don't think Sampson is proving a lot as a coach this year and I don't like him at all, but they have some decent talent coming in and aren't completely going away.

With Illinois, I know you have Legion and Smith coming in next year and with McCamey that can be a really nice backcourt. I just think you're getting a little ahead of yourselves especially when I don't think Weber still has that "great coach" tag that he always got when people criticized his recruiting.

Well we know we are a terrible team and that they are supposed to be a good team. Yet everytime we have played them they have barely beaten us. We also played Duke, they had no such problem taking us to the woodshed. They lose Gordon and White next year. In the next three years we add the most talent we have ever had, IU could be on probabtion. Are you still failing to see why we think we will be better going forward?

 

and who's to say that your great recruits don't all bolt after THEIR freshmen year?

At what point did I say any of them were that good? Maybe Jereme Richmond can do that, but even then I doubt that as we will be pretty good and he won't get to run loose like Gordon does.

 

i honestly don't know anything about your recruits, which is why i'm asking. from what i can gather, you have good recruits, but not so good they'll leave early, but good enough to be better than Indiana for years to come? how are IU's recruits?

 

ETA: you also never addressed my point about OSU

[illiniguy]

I have no horse in this race at all, the only thing I find funny is how IU is 19-3 (8-1) while Illinois is 10-14 (2-9) but most Illinois fans seem certain that they will dominate Indiana immediately once this season is over and IU will go nowhere this year.

 

Indiana is a flawed team without a PF or true PG. But they also have one of the five best guards in the country and maybe one of the five best big men in the country this year. They'll be a 4 seed at the lowest and will get to the Sweet 16.

 

I don't think Sampson is proving a lot as a coach this year and I don't like him at all, but they have some decent talent coming in and aren't completely going away.

With Illinois, I know you have Legion and Smith coming in next year and with McCamey that can be a really nice backcourt. I just think you're getting a little ahead of yourselves especially when I don't think Weber still has that "great coach" tag that he always got when people criticized his recruiting.

Well we know we are a terrible team and that they are supposed to be a good team. Yet everytime we have played them they have barely beaten us. We also played Duke, they had no such problem taking us to the woodshed. They lose Gordon and White next year. In the next three years we add the most talent we have ever had, IU could be on probabtion. Are you still failing to see why we think we will be better going forward?

 

and who's to say that your great recruits don't all bolt after THEIR freshmen year?

At what point did I say any of them were that good? Maybe Jereme Richmond can do that, but even then I doubt that as we will be pretty good and he won't get to run loose like Gordon does.

 

i honestly don't know anything about your recruits, which is why i'm asking. from what i can gather, you have good recruits, but not so good they'll leave early, but good enough to be better than Indiana for years to come? how are IU's recruits?

They have a very good one for '08 whose name eludes me. After that they have struggled because of the impending NCAA investigation. Trust me, people better kick us now while we are down.

[Derwood]

I have no horse in this race at all, the only thing I find funny is how IU is 19-3 (8-1) while Illinois is 10-14 (2-9) but most Illinois fans seem certain that they will dominate Indiana immediately once this season is over and IU will go nowhere this year.

 

Indiana is a flawed team without a PF or true PG. But they also have one of the five best guards in the country and maybe one of the five best big men in the country this year. They'll be a 4 seed at the lowest and will get to the Sweet 16.

 

I don't think Sampson is proving a lot as a coach this year and I don't like him at all, but they have some decent talent coming in and aren't completely going away.

With Illinois, I know you have Legion and Smith coming in next year and with McCamey that can be a really nice backcourt. I just think you're getting a little ahead of yourselves especially when I don't think Weber still has that "great coach" tag that he always got when people criticized his recruiting.

Well we know we are a terrible team and that they are supposed to be a good team. Yet everytime we have played them they have barely beaten us. We also played Duke, they had no such problem taking us to the woodshed. They lose Gordon and White next year. In the next three years we add the most talent we have ever had, IU could be on probabtion. Are you still failing to see why we think we will be better going forward?

 

and who's to say that your great recruits don't all bolt after THEIR freshmen year?

At what point did I say any of them were that good? Maybe Jereme Richmond can do that, but even then I doubt that as we will be pretty good and he won't get to run loose like Gordon does.

 

i honestly don't know anything about your recruits, which is why i'm asking. from what i can gather, you have good recruits, but not so good they'll leave early, but good enough to be better than Indiana for years to come? how are IU's recruits?

They have a very good one for '08 whose name eludes me. After that they have struggled because of the impending NCAA investigation. Trust me, people better kick us now while we are down.

 

so does this mean that Bruce Weber is NOT the worst recruiter in history?

[illiniguy]

I have no horse in this race at all, the only thing I find funny is how IU is 19-3 (8-1) while Illinois is 10-14 (2-9) but most Illinois fans seem certain that they will dominate Indiana immediately once this season is over and IU will go nowhere this year.

 

Indiana is a flawed team without a PF or true PG. But they also have one of the five best guards in the country and maybe one of the five best big men in the country this year. They'll be a 4 seed at the lowest and will get to the Sweet 16.

 

I don't think Sampson is proving a lot as a coach this year and I don't like him at all, but they have some decent talent coming in and aren't completely going away.

With Illinois, I know you have Legion and Smith coming in next year and with McCamey that can be a really nice backcourt. I just think you're getting a little ahead of yourselves especially when I don't think Weber still has that "great coach" tag that he always got when people criticized his recruiting.

Well we know we are a terrible team and that they are supposed to be a good team. Yet everytime we have played them they have barely beaten us. We also played Duke, they had no such problem taking us to the woodshed. They lose Gordon and White next year. In the next three years we add the most talent we have ever had, IU could be on probabtion. Are you still failing to see why we think we will be better going forward?

 

and who's to say that your great recruits don't all bolt after THEIR freshmen year?

At what point did I say any of them were that good? Maybe Jereme Richmond can do that, but even then I doubt that as we will be pretty good and he won't get to run loose like Gordon does.

 

i honestly don't know anything about your recruits, which is why i'm asking. from what i can gather, you have good recruits, but not so good they'll leave early, but good enough to be better than Indiana for years to come? how are IU's recruits?

They have a very good one for '08 whose name eludes me. After that they have struggled because of the impending NCAA investigation. Trust me, people better kick us now while we are down.

 

so does this mean that Bruce Weber is NOT the worst recruiter in history?

Until they sign on the dotted line, I stand by my topic. I also would like to point out that these kids all gained interest after jerence Howard was signed. Maybe Howard's the guy getting this all done.