ESPN Cubs Rumblings...

[tkenm356]

If it's been posted, lock...

 

People in Chicago would be amazed how many scouts following the NL Central report that they either think (a) the Cubs are a better, more talented team than the Brewers, or (b) the Cubs will end up winning the division. "I know they've played spotty, to say the least," one scout said of the Cubs. "But I think they have a chance to rip off about 14 [wins] out of 15 one of these days." The scout's theory is that the Cubs have played tight, in great part because they haven't adjusted to Lou Piniella's personality and he hasn't adjusted to them. "I think they're at a real turning point," the scout said. "If Lou can use that [suspension] time to watch from afar for a few days and then come back and make some adjustments, I think that team could take off. And knowing Lou, I think he can and he will."

 

• In that vein, we've heard from a variety of sources that a number of Cubs players told their friends they were much more relaxed on the bench this week during the four games Piniella was serving his suspension. But one baseball man who has seen a lot of the Cubs flatly rejects the suggestion that Piniella's demeanor has somehow affected the way this team has played, saying: "The one thing I've never seen is negative body language. These guys have played hard. They've come back. They've gotten key hits late. If they're pressing, there's one cure for that: win."

 

Carlos Zambrano

 

Zambrano

 

• If there's a Cub who's a topic of even greater fascination than Piniella around the sport, it's Carlos Zambrano. "There's a guy," one front-office man said, "who's costing himself a lot of money right now. And beating the crap out of one of his teammates doesn't help." Zambrano still has plenty of time to restore his free-agent value. But clubs have watched his ground ball/fly ball rate shrink from a high of 2.28 in 2003 to just 1.26 this year. He also had never allowed an opponent slugging percentage over .351 in any season of his career -- but this year it's nearly .500. And left-handed hitters have an ominous .355 AVG/.430 OBP/.579 SLG line against him -- compared to .231/.337/.355 over the previous three years. "I don't know why," one scout said. "But his stuff is very, very flat early in games. Then he gets into his last inning or two, and he gets back in his normal arm slot, and he blows guys away. He's a real mystery."

 

• The Cubs had lots of reasons to recall Felix Pie last weekend. But one of them was the effect Pie seems to have had on his buddy, Alfonso Soriano. With Pie on the roster, Soriano was hitting .413, with five homers, and slugging .755 going into Wednesday. With Pie in the minor leagues, Soriano was batting .259 and slugging .396.

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/columns/story?columnist=stark_jayson&id=2896288

[SaorsaDaonnan]

Interesting that scouts think that; hadn't heard their opinion either way. As other posters have mentioned before, our third order winning percentage still looks good enough for first place, albeit not as decisively as in recent weeks:

 

 

http://www.baseballprospectus.com/statistics/standings.php

 

 

It's a frustrating team, no doubt, but not one to be given up on in early June, particularly in a division like ours. It's interesting to think that our difference between W1 and W3, which at a glance is the third largest difference (in absolute value) in the majors and second only to the Yanks among negative differences, includes the horrible performances of certain players who shall go unnamed.

 

Even if we kept these nameless players, if the team played to its pythag-projected win % of .539* over the remaining 104 games, the team would end at 82 games. So, even a mild upswing in luck might move us into serious contention, particularly if combined with a deadline acquisition or the dfa-ing of nameless pieces of dead weight.

 

 

*before Thursday's game

[Amazing_Grace]

I don't buy that Lou's demeanor is causing the team to play badly. I think the fact that he's willing to sit veteran players in favor of younger guys when it's best for the team has upset a couple guys (Izturis, Floyd, and especially Jones). I think it's causing some of those guys to press because they're afraid they won't get another multimillions contract if they aren't playing (they're right, they won't, and they shouldn't have gotten the one they have anyway).

 

I've long suspected that Soriano was pushing behind the scenes to get Pie on the team ever since the stories about them being buddies in ST. Since we presumably will have Soriano and Pie on the team a long while, this is not a bad thing. If Soriano can get Jones out of the lineup that way, he'll have accomplished by accident something (benching a veteran) that really no Cubs manager or GM has been willing to do since well... I can't remember.

 

If Z rebounds and starts pitching well, rattling off 3-4 very good starts before the deadline, he absolutely should be traded. If he doesn't, it's a tough call. You still have to see what you can get, but you have to at least entertain the possibility that he'll continue to pitch badly enough down the stretch that his contract demands will get into a comfortable area.

[Amazing_Grace]

So, even a mild upswing in luck might move us into serious contention, particularly if combined with a deadline acquisition or the dfa-ing of nameless pieces of dead weight.

 

 

*before Thursday's game

 

So you think we should trade Jones at any cost as well?

[NCCubFan]

The Cubs had lots of reasons to recall Felix Pie last weekend. But one of them was the effect Pie seems to have had on his buddy, Alfonso Soriano. With Pie on the roster, Soriano was hitting .413, with five homers, and slugging .755 going into Wednesday. With Pie in the minor leagues, Soriano was batting .259 and slugging .396.

Interesting. I thought the idea was for Soriano to be a good influence on Pie, but it looks like just the opposite.

[Cubbies4Life]

I don't buy that Lou's demeanor is causing the team to play badly. I think the fact that he's willing to sit veteran players in favor of younger guys when it's best for the team has upset a couple guys (Izturis, Floyd, and especially Jones). I think it's causing some of those guys to press because they're afraid they won't get another multimillions contract if they aren't playing (they're right, they won't, and they shouldn't have gotten the one they have anyway).

 

I've long suspected that Soriano was pushing behind the scenes to get Pie on the team ever since the stories about them being buddies in ST. Since we presumably will have Soriano and Pie on the team a long while, this is not a bad thing. If Soriano can get Jones out of the lineup that way, he'll have accomplished by accident something (benching a veteran) that really no Cubs manager or GM has been willing to do since well... I can't remember.

 

If Z rebounds and starts pitching well, rattling off 3-4 very good starts before the deadline, he absolutely should be traded. If he doesn't, it's a tough call. You still have to see what you can get, but you have to at least entertain the possibility that he'll continue to pitch badly enough down the stretch that his contract demands will get into a comfortable area.

 

If the Cubs are going to make the playoffs they need Zambrano to start pitching well...I don't see any reason to trade Zambrano until the Cubs fall out of contention

[SaorsaDaonnan]

So, even a mild upswing in luck might move us into serious contention, particularly if combined with a deadline acquisition or the dfa-ing of nameless pieces of dead weight.

 

 

*before Thursday's game

 

So you think we should trade Jones at any cost as well?

 

 

Depends on what you mean...

 

I don't like Jones at all, but I wouldn't take on a bigger albatross contract to get rid of him. Nor would I send along a good prospect just to dump his salary. On the other hand, I'd trade him for about anything I could get my hands on, and I'd be willing to eat his salary this year.

 

I'm not sure how this question is connected to the broader issue of the Cubs' chances. Is it the following?

 

In contention----> Maximize on-field quality------>dump Jones immediately

 

Not in contention----> trade guys for highest possible value----> play Jones in hopes he improves and then can be dealt from stronger position

 

If those are my options, I'd pick the former. We're close enough to contention that I'd be willing to forego the pair of B prospects that Jones might fetch in the rosiest possible scenario, However, I think I'd play an outfield of Murton/Pie/Soriano almost regardless of whether the Cubs remain in contention, on the basis that consistent PT for Murt and Pie is more valuable than the marginal prospects that a streaking Jones might bring.

[XZero771679666304]

I for one think Jones needs to be dealt. His playing is adversely affecting both Murton and Floyd, who are both better players than Jones. Now that Pie is up, this will only get worse since there is no reason for him to play CF anymore. If he was hitting even as well as he did last year, I might think differently, and he would certainly be easier to move.

 

If I am the GM, I trade Jones, even if I have to eat 50-60% of the remaining contract.

[Omar]

The Cubs had lots of reasons to recall Felix Pie last weekend. But one of them was the effect Pie seems to have had on his buddy, Alfonso Soriano. With Pie on the roster, Soriano was hitting .413, with five homers, and slugging .755 going into Wednesday. With Pie in the minor leagues, Soriano was batting .259 and slugging .396.

Interesting. I thought the idea was for Soriano to be a good influence on Pie, but it looks like just the opposite.

 

Like I've said before, with Pie in CF, Soriano has less ground to cover in LF and that allows Fonz to focus about his bat and not worry about his glove.

[don_kessinger_was_good]

The Cubs had lots of reasons to recall Felix Pie last weekend. But one of them was the effect Pie seems to have had on his buddy, Alfonso Soriano. With Pie on the roster, Soriano was hitting .413, with five homers, and slugging .755 going into Wednesday. With Pie in the minor leagues, Soriano was batting .259 and slugging .396.

Interesting. I thought the idea was for Soriano to be a good influence on Pie, but it looks like just the opposite.

 

Actually, no, not a surprise at all. Felix is a winner and a very special kid. I've yet to hear from anyone that has played with Pie that didn't absolutely LOVE the kid as a teammate. And of course, you know that Felix has played in the league championship for every team at every level he's ever played for, right? World Series, here we come!!

[Soul]

The Cubs had lots of reasons to recall Felix Pie last weekend. But one of them was the effect Pie seems to have had on his buddy, Alfonso Soriano. With Pie on the roster, Soriano was hitting .413, with five homers, and slugging .755 going into Wednesday. With Pie in the minor leagues, Soriano was batting .259 and slugging .396.

Interesting. I thought the idea was for Soriano to be a good influence on Pie, but it looks like just the opposite.

 

Actually, no, not a surprise at all. Felix is a winner and a very special kid. I've yet to hear from anyone that has played with Pie that didn't absolutely LOVE the kid as a teammate. And of course, you know that Felix has played in the league championship for every team at every level he's ever played for, right? World Series, here we come!!

 

Hehe, to think all these years we only needed Felix to break that damn curse :wink:

[10man]

The Cubs had lots of reasons to recall Felix Pie last weekend. But one of them was the effect Pie seems to have had on his buddy, Alfonso Soriano. With Pie on the roster, Soriano was hitting .413, with five homers, and slugging .755 going into Wednesday. With Pie in the minor leagues, Soriano was batting .259 and slugging .396.

Interesting. I thought the idea was for Soriano to be a good influence on Pie, but it looks like just the opposite.

 

Actually, no, not a surprise at all. Felix is a winner and a very special kid. I've yet to hear from anyone that has played with Pie that didn't absolutely LOVE the kid as a teammate. And of course, you know that Felix has played in the league championship for every team at every level he's ever played for, right? World Series, here we come!!

 

Hehe, to think all these years we only needed Felix to break that damn curse :wink:

Felix is a baseball Leprechaun. He eats goats for breakfast.

[Soul]

The Cubs had lots of reasons to recall Felix Pie last weekend. But one of them was the effect Pie seems to have had on his buddy, Alfonso Soriano. With Pie on the roster, Soriano was hitting .413, with five homers, and slugging .755 going into Wednesday. With Pie in the minor leagues, Soriano was batting .259 and slugging .396.

Interesting. I thought the idea was for Soriano to be a good influence on Pie, but it looks like just the opposite.

 

Actually, no, not a surprise at all. Felix is a winner and a very special kid. I've yet to hear from anyone that has played with Pie that didn't absolutely LOVE the kid as a teammate. And of course, you know that Felix has played in the league championship for every team at every level he's ever played for, right? World Series, here we come!!

 

Hehe, to think all these years we only needed Felix to break that damn curse :wink:

Felix is a baseball Leprechaun. He eats goats for breakfast.

 

The anti-curse, lucky Felix!

[Danny82]

The Cubs had lots of reasons to recall Felix Pie last weekend. But one of them was the effect Pie seems to have had on his buddy, Alfonso Soriano. With Pie on the roster, Soriano was hitting .413, with five homers, and slugging .755 going into Wednesday. With Pie in the minor leagues, Soriano was batting .259 and slugging .396.

Interesting. I thought the idea was for Soriano to be a good influence on Pie, but it looks like just the opposite.

 

Like I've said before, with Pie in CF, Soriano has less ground to cover in LF and that allows Fonz to focus about his bat and not worry about his glove.

Do you really think that matters?

 

I certainly don't.

[Have a seat, Neifi]

Felix is 7 feet tall and blows lightning bolts out of his arse.

[Exile on Waveland]

The Cubs had lots of reasons to recall Felix Pie last weekend. But one of them was the effect Pie seems to have had on his buddy, Alfonso Soriano. With Pie on the roster, Soriano was hitting .413, with five homers, and slugging .755 going into Wednesday. With Pie in the minor leagues, Soriano was batting .259 and slugging .396.

Interesting. I thought the idea was for Soriano to be a good influence on Pie, but it looks like just the opposite.

 

Like I've said before, with Pie in CF, Soriano has less ground to cover in LF and that allows Fonz to focus about his bat and not worry about his glove.

Do you really think that matters?

 

I certainly don't.

 

Maybe it doesn't normally, but Soriano has proved to be very sensitive to various factors. He's hit better at leadoff than other spots, hit better while playing LF than CF, etc. Maybe the sample sizes are too small to draw a definitive conclusion, but it's certainly possible. Oh, I'll end with the omnipresent "players aren't robots" and different things may affect them differently

[gflore34]

I for one think Jones needs to be dealt. His playing is adversely affecting both Murton and Floyd, who are both better players than Jones. Now that Pie is up, this will only get worse since there is no reason for him to play CF anymore. If he was hitting even as well as he did last year, I might think differently, and he would certainly be easier to move.

 

If I am the GM, I trade Jones, even if I have to eat 50-60% of the remaining contract.

 

Bottom line Jones needs to go, if there ever was a player who's play reflects his dislike with playing for the Cubs it's Jacque Jones. He's a California native, Hendry should look trading him to the Angels, Dodgers, Giants or Padres - take anything Jim - lower level prospect, bucket of balls, six pack of Anchor Porter or Sierra Nevada Pale Ale or Stone Arrogant Bastard Ale - just get him out of town.

[RynoRules]

If Lou's personality is really having that great an effect, then these guys need to freaking grow a pair.

[third eye]

I for one think Jones needs to be dealt. His playing is adversely affecting both Murton and Floyd, who are both better players than Jones. Now that Pie is up, this will only get worse since there is no reason for him to play CF anymore. If he was hitting even as well as he did last year, I might think differently, and he would certainly be easier to move.

 

If I am the GM, I trade Jones, even if I have to eat 50-60% of the remaining contract.

 

Bottom line Jones needs to go, if there ever was a player who's play reflects his dislike with playing for the Cubs it's Jacque Jones. He's a California native, Hendry should look trading him to the Angels, Dodgers, Giants or Padres - take anything Jim - lower level prospect, bucket of balls, six pack of Anchor Porter or Sierra Nevada Pale Ale or Stone Arrogant Bastard Ale - just get him out of town.

 

I didnt see this posted elsewhere, but in the trib they had an article today about some of the players on both Chicago teams that might be traded plus the views of various scouts on each of the players. Here is what they said about Jacque:

 

Jones: "Pass," one scout said bluntly. "I would have very little interest [in recommending him], although scouts aren't in the money business. He has put up some decent numbers, although his defense is nothing great."

 

"[The Cubs] would love to trade him," another said, "but they would have almost no left-handed hitting. To me, he would have more value in the American League because he still has some offensive value. But we're talking about [the Cubs] eating a sizable portion of his contract."

 

I thought it was a bit surprising given his numbers last year. I figured teams would view him as a low cost option for decent production assuming he gets to play every day. Apparently not.

[gflore34]

I for one think Jones needs to be dealt. His playing is adversely affecting both Murton and Floyd, who are both better players than Jones. Now that Pie is up, this will only get worse since there is no reason for him to play CF anymore. If he was hitting even as well as he did last year, I might think differently, and he would certainly be easier to move.

 

If I am the GM, I trade Jones, even if I have to eat 50-60% of the remaining contract.

 

Bottom line Jones needs to go, if there ever was a player who's play reflects his dislike with playing for the Cubs it's Jacque Jones. He's a California native, Hendry should look trading him to the Angels, Dodgers, Giants or Padres - take anything Jim - lower level prospect, bucket of balls, six pack of Anchor Porter or Sierra Nevada Pale Ale or Stone Arrogant Bastard Ale - just get him out of town.

 

I didnt see this posted elsewhere, but in the trib they had an article today about some of the players on both Chicago teams that might be traded plus the views of various scouts on each of the players. Here is what they said about Jacque:

 

Jones: "Pass," one scout said bluntly. "I would have very little interest [in recommending him], although scouts aren't in the money business. He has put up some decent numbers, although his defense is nothing great."

 

"[The Cubs] would love to trade him," another said, "but they would have almost no left-handed hitting. To me, he would have more value in the American League because he still has some offensive value. But we're talking about [the Cubs] eating a sizable portion of his contract."

 

I thought it was a bit surprising given his numbers last year. I figured teams would view him as a low cost option for decent production assuming he gets to play every day. Apparently not.

 

I guess the fact that he's a terrible hitter doesn't matter, just the fact that he bats from the left side is somehow an asset. What a load of nonsense...

[jersey cubs fan]

I guess the fact that he's a terrible hitter doesn't matter, just the fact that he bats from the left side is somehow an asset. What a load of nonsense...

 

I just don't understand why so many people have perpetuated the myth that the Cubs would have no LH bats if they dealt Jones. First, Floyd would end up getting the majority of his time. Also, Pie would be the everyday CF with Jones gone. You have the switch hitting Izturis playing in at least half the games. Ward is on the bench, Pagan is a switch hitter and so is the temporary backup catcher.

[NCCubFan]

And of course, you know that Felix has played in the league championship for every team at every level he's ever played for, right? World Series, here we come!!

That's true except for Iowa. Also, I don't think he actually played in the championship for West Tenn; I think that was the year he missed most of the second half due to injury. [/nitpick]

[Pushfrog98]

Felix is 7 feet tall and blows lightning bolts out of his arse.

His poop is used as currency in Argentina!

[Abe Frohman]

I guess the fact that he's a terrible hitter doesn't matter, just the fact that he bats from the left side is somehow an asset. What a load of nonsense...

 

I just don't understand why so many people have perpetuated the myth that the Cubs would have no LH bats if they dealt Jones. First, Floyd would end up getting the majority of his time. Also, Pie would be the everyday CF with Jones gone. You have the switch hitting Izturis playing in at least half the games. Ward is on the bench, Pagan is a switch hitter and so is the temporary backup catcher.

 

More importantly - what exactly has Jones DONE with his left-handed swing?

[jersey cubs fan]

About veterans grumbling, I definitely think Jones is in this group, the reports of him asking for a trade last year and hating being a Cub have been too prevalent. Floyd has spoken up in the media a little, but I don't think he's a real big complainer. But with the structure of his contract, it wouldn't surprise me.

 

I find it hard to believe that Izturis is in this group though. He's young and hasn't been an established everyday player in 3 years.

 

I don't think Barrett is complaining about playing time, although I do think he's clashing with Lou.

 

Some of the relievers are probably a little annoyed. Dempster because of the whole rotation/closer debacle (and the fact that his one bad game caused such a stir), Howry and Eyre because of anger at their own performance and probably a bit about their usage. And I think Ohman is always in a foul mood. But it's not out of the ordinary for pitchers, especially relievers, to have a testy relationship with their manager, especially one that was a position player.