Jason Marquis Facts

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

If it's any consolation, I think Marquis can hit better than Izturis. :D

 

16.5m better? Not really.

 

That's true-and there was an article lately that had the difference between a good hitting pitcher and a poor hitting pitcher as something like .4 ERA, right? I think that was about the difference-it was somewhere in between .3 and .6 extra value that a good hitting pitcher brought to a team over a really poor hitting one.

 

I'm interested and would like a link.

 

Here it is-thanks to IMB for helping me remember where to look:

 

http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/article/hitting-pitchers/

 

They have the difference between the best hitting pitchers and the worst at about half a run of ERA.

 

That was an interesting article. Thanks.

[Roast]

Those aren't facts.

Then what are they?

[wolf stansson]

Marquis has a wonderful effect on people.

Remember this blast from the past?

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y274/krkhinrich/200px-Mussolini_hitler.jpg

 

You just gotta love a pitcher who is supposedly a sinker baller yet leads the league in HR's allowed. He allowed 35 HR last year (last three seasons has brought an increase from 26 to 29 to 35). Just in case you think the homerun increase is fluky I would point out the decrease from 138 to 100 to 96 k's.

 

Jason has no second pitch, he overthrows his sinker and he has a reputation of being hard to work with.

[Monco]

Marquis has a wonderful effect on people.

Remember this blast from the past?

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y274/krkhinrich/200px-Mussolini_hitler.jpg

 

You just gotta love a pitcher who is supposedly a sinker baller yet leads the league in HR's allowed. He allowed 35 HR last year (last three seasons has brought an increase from 26 to 29 to 35). Just in case you think the homerun increase is fluky I would point out the decrease from 138 to 100 to 96 k's.

 

Jason has no second pitch, he overthrows his sinker and he has a reputation of being hard to work with.

 

Well,Rothschild is gonna fix that (so they say)

[CardsFanInChiTown]

Well,Rothschild is gonna fix that (so they say)

 

 

It looks like Rothschild put him on the Glendon Rusch diet.

[USSoccer]

I guess Marquis is this year's Jacque Jones.

 

Yeah I agree. He could go out an perform well and shut some of these critics up. But right NOW, none of them will say it is in ANY WAY possible. Just like they did for Jones. They had him not batting above .250 with an OBP not at .300.

 

Yeah, that bet that somebody made to give everybody something if Jones accomplished certain marks came a little closer than he wanted, although by the last week he was safe. :D

 

That was me. I stand by that bet. It took a career season to make it close.

 

And for the record, I fully expect Jason Marquis to be Shawn Estes level bad.

[mg420]

perhaps you marquis bashers should look at what carpenter did in 5+ seasons with the jays before he became a card. jason certainly has the stuff to turn his career around too. quoting stats on why he has been a bad pitcher doesnt mean he wont be a good one in the future.

 

http://www.baseball-reference.com/c/carpech01.shtml

 

While there's a likely chance that Marquis will improve over his '06 numbers, it makes no sense to include Carpenter as a point of reference. Marquis has been healthy his entire career unlike Carpenter and Marquis doesn't have the FB, curve, control, or command of Carpenter.

 

check out cc's walk totals with toronto.

 

And look where he's at now. Carpenter gets healthy and goes to one of the best pitching coaches in the game and finally gets to the point where his production matches his stuff and excels.

 

Marquis doesn't have the stuff and has already been through 2 of the better pitching coaches over the last 20 years while healthy and producing flucuating results.

 

Different styles of pitchers with different talent levels under different circumstances of trying to rebound. I don't see any similarity that has value.

 

hindsight is a wonderful thing.

[sethuel1]

perhaps you marquis bashers should look at what carpenter did in 5+ seasons with the jays before he became a card. jason certainly has the stuff to turn his career around too. quoting stats on why he has been a bad pitcher doesnt mean he wont be a good one in the future.

 

http://www.baseball-reference.com/c/carpech01.shtml

 

While there's a likely chance that Marquis will improve over his '06 numbers, it makes no sense to include Carpenter as a point of reference. Marquis has been healthy his entire career unlike Carpenter and Marquis doesn't have the FB, curve, control, or command of Carpenter.

 

check out cc's walk totals with toronto.

 

And look where he's at now. Carpenter gets healthy and goes to one of the best pitching coaches in the game and finally gets to the point where his production matches his stuff and excels.

 

Marquis doesn't have the stuff and has already been through 2 of the better pitching coaches over the last 20 years while healthy and producing flucuating results.

 

Different styles of pitchers with different talent levels under different circumstances of trying to rebound. I don't see any similarity that has value.

 

hindsight is a wonderful thing.

 

Well that statement didn't make any sense

[mg420]

Marquis has a wonderful effect on people.

Remember this blast from the past?

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y274/krkhinrich/200px-Mussolini_hitler.jpg

 

You just gotta love a pitcher who is supposedly a sinker baller yet leads the league in HR's allowed. He allowed 35 HR last year (last three seasons has brought an increase from 26 to 29 to 35). Just in case you think the homerun increase is fluky I would point out the decrease from 138 to 100 to 96 k's.

 

Jason has no second pitch, he overthrows his sinker and he has a reputation of being hard to work with.

 

actually he throws a good slider too.

[Rob]

Here's a phrase I bet we don't hear this year.

 

"It looks like they're going to intentionally walk Izturis to get to the pitcher."

 

Of course we wont. The pitcher wont be batting 3rd.

[Mephistopheles]

Those aren't facts.

Then what are they?

 

The people ahead of me replied too fast. I was responding to this:

 

Jason Marquis had a great first full year for braves and cardinals. Jason Marquis had "good" 2nd full seaons for braves and cardinals. .

 

Anyways since his bat has been brought into the discussion. Sure I and others probably short-change his overall impact because he's a Zambrano with the bat (and Z's bat made him as good as Carp in Carp's Cy Young season). It's not hard to analyze his bats impact. The average pitcher in the league has an equivalent average of about .128 give or take a bit. Jason's career is .194 and he's averaged about .220 the last three seasons. He's good for 60 outs of production and that's all of five runs with the difference in EqA. He's good for 200 innings so those five runs come out to about .25 on his ERA/RA give or take relative to an average hitting pitcher. So subtract from whatever ERA total you're looking at...hello 5.26 PECOTA ERA. He's almost under five!

[A New Era]

I guess Marquis is this year's Jacque Jones.

 

Yeah I agree. He could go out an perform well and shut some of these critics up. But right NOW, none of them will say it is in ANY WAY possible. Just like they did for Jones. They had him not batting above .250 with an OBP not at .300.

 

Yeah, that bet that somebody made to give everybody something if Jones accomplished certain marks came a little closer than he wanted, although by the last week he was safe. :D

 

That was me. I stand by that bet. It took a career season to make it close.

 

And for the record, I fully expect Jason Marquis to be Shawn Estes level bad.

 

Wanna. . . . . BET!? What is Shawn Estes bad anyway? :lol:

[Ding Dong Johnson]

perhaps you marquis bashers should look at what carpenter did in 5+ seasons with the jays before he became a card. jason certainly has the stuff to turn his career around too. quoting stats on why he has been a bad pitcher doesnt mean he wont be a good one in the future.

 

http://www.baseball-reference.com/c/carpech01.shtml

 

While there's a likely chance that Marquis will improve over his '06 numbers, it makes no sense to include Carpenter as a point of reference. Marquis has been healthy his entire career unlike Carpenter and Marquis doesn't have the FB, curve, control, or command of Carpenter.

 

check out cc's walk totals with toronto.

 

And look where he's at now. Carpenter gets healthy and goes to one of the best pitching coaches in the game and finally gets to the point where his production matches his stuff and excels.

 

Marquis doesn't have the stuff and has already been through 2 of the better pitching coaches over the last 20 years while healthy and producing flucuating results.

 

Different styles of pitchers with different talent levels under different circumstances of trying to rebound. I don't see any similarity that has value.

 

hindsight is a wonderful thing.

 

When in Rome...

[sethuel1]

perhaps you marquis bashers should look at what carpenter did in 5+ seasons with the jays before he became a card. jason certainly has the stuff to turn his career around too. quoting stats on why he has been a bad pitcher doesnt mean he wont be a good one in the future.

 

http://www.baseball-reference.com/c/carpech01.shtml

 

While there's a likely chance that Marquis will improve over his '06 numbers, it makes no sense to include Carpenter as a point of reference. Marquis has been healthy his entire career unlike Carpenter and Marquis doesn't have the FB, curve, control, or command of Carpenter.

 

check out cc's walk totals with toronto.

 

And look where he's at now. Carpenter gets healthy and goes to one of the best pitching coaches in the game and finally gets to the point where his production matches his stuff and excels.

 

Marquis doesn't have the stuff and has already been through 2 of the better pitching coaches over the last 20 years while healthy and producing flucuating results.

 

Different styles of pitchers with different talent levels under different circumstances of trying to rebound. I don't see any similarity that has value.

 

hindsight is a wonderful thing.

 

When in Rome...

catch-22

[Ding Dong Johnson]

perhaps you marquis bashers should look at what carpenter did in 5+ seasons with the jays before he became a card. jason certainly has the stuff to turn his career around too. quoting stats on why he has been a bad pitcher doesnt mean he wont be a good one in the future.

 

http://www.baseball-reference.com/c/carpech01.shtml

 

While there's a likely chance that Marquis will improve over his '06 numbers, it makes no sense to include Carpenter as a point of reference. Marquis has been healthy his entire career unlike Carpenter and Marquis doesn't have the FB, curve, control, or command of Carpenter.

 

check out cc's walk totals with toronto.

 

And look where he's at now. Carpenter gets healthy and goes to one of the best pitching coaches in the game and finally gets to the point where his production matches his stuff and excels.

 

Marquis doesn't have the stuff and has already been through 2 of the better pitching coaches over the last 20 years while healthy and producing flucuating results.

 

Different styles of pitchers with different talent levels under different circumstances of trying to rebound. I don't see any similarity that has value.

 

hindsight is a wonderful thing.

 

When in Rome...

catch-22

 

When the cat's away, the mice will play.

[Amazing_Grace]

Here's a phrase I bet we don't hear this year.

 

"It looks like they're going to intentionally walk Izturis to get to the pitcher."

 

Of course we wont. The pitcher wont be batting 3rd.

 

Now that's just mean. I'm disappointed enough as it is.

[nilodnayr]

perhaps you marquis bashers should look at what carpenter did in 5+ seasons with the jays before he became a card. jason certainly has the stuff to turn his career around too. quoting stats on why he has been a bad pitcher doesnt mean he wont be a good one in the future.

 

http://www.baseball-reference.com/c/carpech01.shtml

 

And where do you find Carp on Marquis' comparables list? Two words for you...Josh freakin Fogg.

[Laura]

 

Let's just say this-not anytime soon. Although I freely admit that I will not be surprsied if Marquis has an ERA below 4 or an ERA above 6, and there's not many pitchers I can say that about.

 

What does this mean? Will you be shocked if he has an era between 4 and 6?

 

 

Marquis' ERA will definitely be a predictions contest category. Be sure to enter.

[Magnetic Curses]

perhaps you marquis bashers should look at what carpenter did in 5+ seasons with the jays before he became a card. jason certainly has the stuff to turn his career around too. quoting stats on why he has been a bad pitcher doesnt mean he wont be a good one in the future.

 

http://www.baseball-reference.com/c/carpech01.shtml

 

that has absolutely no pertinence to marquis's case. can he turn his career around? sure, but the comparison to carpenter is irrelevant.

 

stats are the best predictors of future performance that we have, and there's no evidence that suggests that marquis is going to be more than just a guy this season.

[wolf stansson]

actually he throws a good slider too.

No he doesn't. He throws a terrible slider that flattens out, stays over the plate because he can't place it to save his life and then watches 35 of them sail over the fence.

[Magnetic Curses]

actually he throws a good slider too.

No he doesn't. He throws a terrible slider that flattens out, stays over the plate because he can't place it to save his life and then watches 35 of them sail over the fence.

 

he never said who's perspective he was speaking from.

[soccer10k]

I guess Marquis is this year's Jacque Jones.

 

Yeah I agree. He could go out an perform well and shut some of these critics up. But right NOW, none of them will say it is in ANY WAY possible. Just like they did for Jones. They had him not batting above .250 with an OBP not at .300.

 

Yeah, that bet that somebody made to give everybody something if Jones accomplished certain marks came a little closer than he wanted, although by the last week he was safe. :D

 

That was me. I stand by that bet. It took a career season to make it close.

 

And for the record, I fully expect Jason Marquis to be Shawn Estes level bad.

 

Hey, if Marquis pitches a complete game shutout in the last week of the year to help the Cubs clinch the division, I won't complain.

[CuseCubFan69]

 

Let's just say this-not anytime soon. Although I freely admit that I will not be surprsied if Marquis has an ERA below 4 or an ERA above 6, and there's not many pitchers I can say that about.

 

What does this mean? Will you be shocked if he has an era between 4 and 6?

 

 

Marquis' ERA will definitely be a predictions contest category. Be sure to enter.

 

How can I can put down what I think it is when my keyboard doesn't have the infinity symbol?

[CubColtPacer]

 

Let's just say this-not anytime soon. Although I freely admit that I will not be surprsied if Marquis has an ERA below 4 or an ERA above 6, and there's not many pitchers I can say that about.

 

What does this mean? Will you be shocked if he has an era between 4 and 6?

 

 

Marquis' ERA will definitely be a predictions contest category. Be sure to enter.

 

I meant that the range of possibilities for Marquis is much bigger than most pitchers because he has no consistent year-his ERA is either good to great or terrible, with nothing in between.

[CuseCubFan69]

 

Let's just say this-not anytime soon. Although I freely admit that I will not be surprsied if Marquis has an ERA below 4 or an ERA above 6, and there's not many pitchers I can say that about.

 

What does this mean? Will you be shocked if he has an era between 4 and 6?

 

 

Marquis' ERA will definitely be a predictions contest category. Be sure to enter.

 

I meant that the range of possibilities for Marquis is much bigger than most pitchers because he has no consistent year-his ERA is either good to great or terrible, with nothing in between.

 

He's a dow joneser baby!