Rogers: Cubs, Red Sox showing most interest in Drew

[KingCubsFan]

I know I'll catch nine kinds of hell from some of you, but it's cool. I'm just saying that as long as Hendry is making an honest run at these guys, that is all we can ask. He can't force anyone to sign on the dotted line.

 

See, I expect more from a major league GM. Anyone given the title of GM can make an honest run at a player. I want an agressive GM that goes out and gets these deals done.(see Dave Dombrowsi)

I guess hindsight is 20/20. You spend an awful lot of energy ripping on Hendry for giving Mark DeRosa a 3/13 million contract to be a second baseman, so I can only imagine what would happen if he:

a)gave an old catcher who draws about 10 walk a year a 4 year/40 million dollar contract

b)proceeds to sign an outfielder with a chronic knee condition by outbidding the competition by about 4 years and 50 million dollars

c)signs a 35 year-old injury-prone closer to a long term deal so he can throw 25 innings at 6 million a year.

Is that the kind of agressiveness you want?

Edited November 17, 2006 by KingCubsFan

[ShawonOmeter12]

Nothing can overcome the fact that Hendry had a WS contender in '03 and by '05 it was trash.

 

fair enough i agree with that point, wood and prior were healthy in 03 great things happened. ever since they have been injured and look where we are. finally hendry is stock piling pitchers and not counting on prior, what ever we get is a bonus. to summarize my stance, it really bothers me when all people do is pick apart every move made and have 5 ways that would have been better. let the man do his job and wait for the completed product before you try and have his head on a pike. if in the end the product is garbage(last year) fire away at him but atleast let him complete his squad before you jump to conclusions.

[Soriano12]

let the man do his job and wait for the completed product before you try and have his head on a pike.

 

Why? If people have gribes with Hendry's moves they have every right to voice thier displeasures.

[CubsWin]

This is the same guy that traded Ricky Nolasco for slappy.

 

This is the same guy that traded Choi for Lee.

 

This is the same guy that traded ... whoever for Ramirez.

 

Really, this is a tired argument. Lee and Aramis where pure salary dumps that fell into Hendry's lap.

 

Lee was actually traded to Baltimore, but a long term deal couldn't be worked out.

 

Aramis was getting too expensive for the Pirates.

 

I have to ask you, who wouldn't have made those trade? That is the question.

No, the more important question is why didn't anyone else make those trades?

 

This anti-argument doesn't hold water, CubinNY. Here's why...

 

If it is true and Ramirez and Lee were true salary dumps, then every GM in need of a top 3 1B and 3B and a little bit of salary room would have been in line to get them since they were practically being given away, right? So why is it that the failure of a GM, Jim Hendry, was the one that got them? Why didn't they wind up on some other team? Were the Cubs the only team that could afford them? Why didn't the Yankees get Ramirez? They needed a 3B. Why didn't the Red Sox get Lee, they needed a 1B. If it is as you say and these players just "fell into Hendry's lap" and he deserves no credit for getting them as they went into what looks to be their very productive primes, then why didn't some other, better, more proactive, non-failure of a GM come in and steal them away from our dunce of a GM? After all, he was just sitting there doing nothing when they just fell into his lap?

 

If the Ramirez, Hundley and Lee trades don't count as evidence of Hendry's worth, neither do his missing out on Beltran, or not signing enough pitching to cover when Wood got injured, or not having an adequate back-up for when Nomar went down, or his not improving the team's OBP enough.

[Soriano12]

I know I'll catch nine kinds of hell from some of you, but it's cool. I'm just saying that as long as Hendry is making an honest run at these guys, that is all we can ask. He can't force anyone to sign on the dotted line.

 

See, I expect more from a major league GM. Anyone given the title of GM can make an honest run at a player. I want an agressive GM that goes out and gets these deals done.(see Dave Dombrowsi)

I guess hindsight is 20/20. You spend an awful lot of energy ripping on Hendry for giving Mark DeRosa a 3/13 million contract to be a second baseman, so I can only imagine what would happen if he:

a)gave an old catcher who draws about 10 walk a year a 4 year/40 million dollar contract

b)proceeds to sign an outfielder with a chronic knee condition by outbidding the competition by about 4 years and 50 million dollars

c)signs a 35 year-old injury-prone closer to a long term deal so he can throw 25 innings at 6 million a year.

Is that the kind of agressiveness you want?

 

I'll take a Dave Dombrowsi running my team any day over Hendry.

[Guest]

et the man do his job

 

how is he preventing him from doing his job?

[Transmogrified Tiger]

The Cubs got Lee because Baltimore couldn't sign him to an extension.

[ShawonOmeter12]

This is the same guy that traded Ricky Nolasco for slappy.

 

This is the same guy that traded Choi for Lee.

 

This is the same guy that traded ... whoever for Ramirez.

 

Really, this is a tired argument. Lee and Aramis where pure salary dumps that fell into Hendry's lap.

 

Lee was actually traded to Baltimore, but a long term deal couldn't be worked out.

 

Aramis was getting too expensive for the Pirates.

 

I have to ask you, who wouldn't have made those trade? That is the question.

No, the more important question is why didn't anyone else make those trades?

 

This anti-argument doesn't hold water, CubinNY. Here's why...

 

If it is true and Ramirez and Lee were true salary dumps, then every GM in need of a top 3 1B and 3B and a little bit of salary room would have been in line to get them since they were practically being given away, right? So why is it that the failure of a GM, Jim Hendry, was the one that got them? Why didn't they wind up on some other team? Were the Cubs the only team that could afford them? Why didn't the Yankees get Ramirez? They needed a 3B. Why didn't the Red Sox get Lee, they needed a 1B. If it is as you say and these players just "fell into Hendry's lap" and he deserves no credit for getting them as they went into what looks to be their very productive primes, then why didn't some other, better, more proactive, non-failure of a GM come in and steal them away from our dunce of a GM? After all, he was just sitting there doing nothing when they just fell into his lap?

 

If the Ramirez, Hundley and Lee trades don't count as evidence of Hendry's worth, neither do his missing out on Beltran, or not signing enough pitching to cover when Wood got injured, or not having an adequate back-up for when Nomar went down, or his not improving the team's OBP enough.

 

i agree, this has been my point all along. pretty much hendry is a sore subject, those who hate him would be upset if he traded augie ojeda for babe ruth. never going to please all, just get us back to the playoffs and you will please me jim!

[Soriano12]

i agree, this has been my point all along. pretty much hendry is a sore subject, those who hate him would be upset if he traded augie ojeda for babe ruth. never going to please all, just get us back to the playoffs and you will please me jim!

 

Dude, you offer no argument to defend Hendry other than "Just leave him alone". At least Cubswin makes a valid argument to deflect the Hendry criticism.

[ShawonOmeter12]

et the man do his job

 

how is he preventing him from doing his job?

 

i think you know what i mean but if we have to play these games i will spell it out for you, he is not physically stopping him from doing his job, i am saying to let him complete his body of work before you judge it. for a lame example: a painting looks like a bunch of crap slopped together before it is completed and becomes a master piece. i am in no way calling hendry's work a master piece though just an analogy.

[BigbadB]

I don't buy the rumor at all. Meanwhile, I get excited everytime I hear that Hendry is looking at one of the top FA.

 

I'd be shocked if Drew signed that deal. If he did, it likely means he really wanted to play in Boston.

 

In this money crazy market, he's worth more than that.

 

As far as signing DeRosa and other role player moves, I hate to say it, but these guys typically get signed much earlier than the top tier guys. the semi-decent one's anyway. There's not nearly the market for these guys and if a good deal comes along, they are wise to take it.

 

Plus, if Hendry sat on his hands waiting to spend all the dough on top free agents and not fixing the rest of the team, the top FA's might not see the team as a place to sign if they aren't serious about being competitive.

 

I'm certainly not a Hendry apologist by any means. But, I'm not about to let this rumor get me all worked up.

 

Hendry should be talking to all the agents of the top tier FA's. He needs to make them well aware how interested he is in each player, and to make sure they don't forget. Hopefully, he gets 1 or 2 of them.

[Danny82]

let the man do his job and wait for the completed product before you try and have his head on a pike.

 

Why? If people have gribes with Hendry's moves they have every right to voice thier displeasures.

 

Completely true. Not only do they have the right to say those things, but they also take with that right the possibility of looking like a complete fool down the road when the finished product is much different and improved from the point in time when he was being chastised.

Edited November 17, 2006 by Danny82

[jjgman21]

The Cubs got Lee because Baltimore couldn't sign him to an extension.

 

that cuts both ways. you can use it to discredit Hendry, but you also have to use the fact that he was able to get the deal done and hence consummate the trade as something that he should be credited for.

[Guest]

et the man do his job

 

how is he preventing him from doing his job?

 

i think you know what i mean but if we have to play these games i will spell it out for you, he is not physically stopping him from doing his job, i am saying to let him complete his body of work before you judge it. for a lame example: a painting looks like a bunch of crap slopped together before it is completed and becomes a master piece. i am in no way calling hendry's work a master piece though just an analogy.

 

I am pretty sure most managers don't agree with that. I certainly don't let my staff "complete their body of work" before I review it. and how are the results of 2005 not hendry's body of work? When you see him following the same pattern that led to disaster, what is wrong with criticizing it? I really don't see your point whatsoever. When Jim makes a bad move, he deserves criticism.

[JeffH]

Well, we've seen two completely dreadful bodies of work.

 

How many chances does he get before we conclude that he's incapable of assembling a worthwhile baseball team?

[ShawonOmeter12]

i would prefer drew but if he gets soriano you will not here one complaint from me. do you think 6 years and 100 million would get soriano to the midwest?

[Soul]

et the man do his job

 

how is he preventing him from doing his job?

 

i think you know what i mean but if we have to play these games i will spell it out for you, he is not physically stopping him from doing his job, i am saying to let him complete his body of work before you judge it. for a lame example: a painting looks like a bunch of crap slopped together before it is completed and becomes a master piece. i am in no way calling hendry's work a master piece though just an analogy.

 

I don't understand why someone should wait........longer.

 

In '05 I felt the way you do. We were coming off a disappointing season, but hey there was still a chance to bounce back. Let Hendry do his job, right? Of course.

 

But then '05

 

Then '06.

 

How much more waiting should someone do before concluding he's been doing a poor job with the club? Obviously if he manages to turn it around opinions will change. But you know what? That still doesn't erase these past few years of pain (some of the most painful I ever remember as a Cub fan...and that's saying something).

[Transmogrified Tiger]

The Cubs got Lee because Baltimore couldn't sign him to an extension.

 

that cuts both ways. you can use it to discredit Hendry, but you also have to use the fact that he was able to get the deal done and hence consummate the trade as something that he should be credited for.

 

Not trying to use it for either purpose, it's relevant to what was being discussed though.

[Guest]

Plus, if Hendry sat on his hands waiting to spend all the dough on top free agents and not fixing the rest of the team, the top FA's might not see the team as a place to sign if they aren't serious about being competitive.

 

So a top free agent is going to sign because the cubs signed DeRosa? doubtful.

 

I don't know if Hendry has a plan in place and is fitting the pieces together. I sure hope so. Hard to give him the benefit of the doubt after the last two offseasons though. I have said all along that the DeRosa move has to be put in context. Hendry definitely overpaid and I'm just praying he isn't the starting 2b.

[jjgman21]

I don't buy the rumor at all. Meanwhile, I get excited everytime I hear that Hendry is looking at one of the top FA.

 

I'd be shocked if Drew signed that deal. If he did, it likely means he really wanted to play in Boston.

 

 

I agree that this rumor should be dismissed. JD Drew in Boston makes no sense at all. We are talking about a guy who felt he was treated harshly by the St. Louis fans and media, and who feld he was treated harshly by the Los Angeles fans and media. So he goes to Boston?

 

This is a quiet Christian southern boy. So he chooses the liberal, gay marriage haven of Massachusettes?

 

Drew to Boston for less money than he is worth makes no damn sense. This has Boras false rumor written all over it.

[ShawonOmeter12]

et the man do his job

 

how is he preventing him from doing his job?

 

i think you know what i mean but if we have to play these games i will spell it out for you, he is not physically stopping him from doing his job, i am saying to let him complete his body of work before you judge it. for a lame example: a painting looks like a bunch of crap slopped together before it is completed and becomes a master piece. i am in no way calling hendry's work a master piece though just an analogy.

 

I am pretty sure most managers don't agree with that. I certainly don't let my staff "complete their body of work" before I review it. and how are the results of 2005 not hendry's body of work? When you see him following the same pattern that led to disaster, what is wrong with criticizing it? I really don't see your point whatsoever. When Jim makes a bad move, he deserves criticism.

 

do you stand over their shoulder and watch/complain about their every move? that is what you are doing right now with hendry. the funny part is that i really don't like him as a GM either but to me the sum is worth more than the parts is how i like to view/judge things.

[Guest]

no. nor do I make judgements on jim's conversations, meetings, proposals, etc.

[Soul]

Plus, if Hendry sat on his hands waiting to spend all the dough on top free agents and not fixing the rest of the team, the top FA's might not see the team as a place to sign if they aren't serious about being competitive.

 

So a top free agent is going to sign because the cubs signed DeRosa? doubtful.

 

I don't know if Hendry has a plan in place and is fitting the pieces together. I sure hope so. Hard to give him the benefit of the doubt after the last two offseasons though. I have said all along that the DeRosa move has to be put in context. Hendry definitely overpaid and I'm just praying he isn't the starting 2b.

 

An argument could probably be made that if DeRosa doesn't start, then he's even more overpaid and it's an even worse deal.......from a financial perspective.

[Soriano12]

do you stand over their shoulder and watch/complain about their every move? that is what you are doing right now with hendry

 

Last I checked this is a Cub's fan forum, not a discussion board for internal Cubs managment.

[CubsWin]

let the man do his job and wait for the completed product before you try and have his head on a pike.

 

Why? If people have gribes with Hendry's moves they have every right to voice thier displeasures.

Right, and I have absolutely no problem with that, but shouldn't we at least wait until the bad thing we are complaining about has actually happened before we start complaining about it?

 

I mean, the last time we did this it was because Hendry just lost Ramirez. Shouldn't we at least wait until Drew actually signs with somebody else and we learn more about what he was offered?