Marty York: Cubs Planning Trade for Vernon?

[Laura]

Then we got hosed.

 

I want to see Pie playing for the Cubs. But I'm not saving a spot for him if good alternatives are available.

 

I've seen that movie too many times before.

[Guest]

Why are we trying to upgrade CF with Pie in the wings? Anyone?

 

I remember the Cubs passing on Jim Thome because Hee Seop Choi was waiting in the wings. Perhaps they remember that as well.

 

In that case, it was a good idea. Thome was aging. In hindsight, it might look like a bad move, but the Cubs had one of the top 20 prospects in the game, and Thome was a 32-year old, seeking a 5-6 year deal in the double digit millions.

 

in hindsight, lee does look good at 1b.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Then we got hosed.

 

I want to see Pie playing for the Cubs. But I'm not saving a spot for him if good alternatives are available.

 

I've seen that movie too many times before.

 

It's not Pie, it's Wells, and trading something as valuable as Pie for Wells.

[CubsWin]

Then we got hosed.

 

I want to see Pie playing for the Cubs. But I'm not saving a spot for him if good alternatives are available.

 

I've seen that movie too many times before.

 

It's not Pie, it's Wells, and trading something as valuable as Pie for Wells.

I agree with not holding CF open for Pie, but I don't agree with trading away Pie to get a CFer the caliber of Vernon Wells.

 

I'm all for acquiring Wells...without giving up Pie. I don't know if the Cubs would have anything the Jays would want after that though.

 

There is nothing wrong with having two CFers on the roster in '08 so long as one of them has the bat and arm to play RF.

[NCCubFan]

Vernon Wells and BJ Ryan for Felix Pie and Ryan Dempster.

 

Who's with me? :P

Where do I sign up? :D

[Outshined_One]

It depends on what the Cubs would have to give up. I personally think Wells is overrated, but he's better than most other options the Cubs have for CF. Depending on his salary, they could still acquire Soriano to play a mediocre 2B while pounding the heck out of the ball.

 

Given the Blue Jays' inclinations, I'm guessing the Cubs don't have much in the way of position prospects that would interest them. Looks like pitching would probably be the way to go.

[Neuby]

Why are we trying to upgrade CF with Pie in the wings? Anyone?

 

I remember the Cubs passing on Jim Thome because Hee Seop Choi was waiting in the wings. Perhaps they remember that as well.

 

 

Stole the words right of my mouth.

Anyone have any updates on Hee Seop Choi?

 

I think a lot of posters forget the Cubs like all major league teams are allowed three outfielders, it might not seem that way because two of are outfielders last year threw like girls but really they do let us have three outfielders. Crazy and wild stuff.

[A New Era]

 

Do people want an OF of Murton / Pie / Someone Else next year?

 

Oh, deffinatly. If that someone else is another 25-30 HR hitter with solid OBP, and Soriano playing at second? You can count me in, I want to see Pie playing with us next year. Build a good enough offense that his production is "bonus". .

[Laura]

 

Do people want an OF of Murton / Pie / Someone Else next year?

 

Oh, deffinatly. If that someone else is another 25-30 HR hitter with solid OBP, and Soriano playing at second? You can count me in, I want to see Pie playing with us next year. Build a good enough offense that his production is "bonus". .

 

That's always the hope.

 

Getting the pitching to support it and hoping that whoever plays SS + Murton + Pie + new RFer (who would be an upgrade on JJones -- not guaranteed -- or a platoon guy) is a good enough offense is another matter, even with a huge payroll increase.

 

It might be easier to do if it didn't have to be done by next season. But that's the deadline for Hendry.

 

ETA: Sorry, I forgot to add that 2B is also up in the air and we aren't certain yet what's happening at 3B.

 

ETA a 2nd time: sorry again, I obviously missed the Soriano playing 2B in the first edit. d'oh

Edited November 3, 2006 by Laura

[Guest]

Why are we trying to upgrade CF with Pie in the wings? Anyone?

 

I remember the Cubs passing on Jim Thome because Hee Seop Choi was waiting in the wings. Perhaps they remember that as well.

 

 

Stole the words right of my mouth.

Anyone have any updates on Hee Seop Choi?

 

 

update on Choi - later traded for Derrek Lee. Need any further updates?

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Do people want an OF of Murton / Pie / Someone Else next year?

 

Yep. 4 players to contention. 2B/Leadoff(Durham, Iwamura), Corner OF/power bat(Drew, Burrell), very good SP(Daisuke, Schmidt, Zito), less good SP(Kuroda, Padilla, Lilly). Keep the pen as is with Dempster and Wuertz changing roles, although if we can get rid of Eyre or Dempster's contract then we do it.

 

Durham/Iwamura

Murton

Lee

Ramirez

Drew/Burrell

Pie

Izturis

 

Zambrano, Daisuke/Schmidt/Zito, Hill, Kuroda/Padilla/Lilly, Prior/Marshall/Guzman/Mateo/Marmol/Ryu/Gallagher

 

Ryu/Mateo/Guzman, Novoa/Aardsma, Ohman, Dempster, Eyre, Howry, Wuertz

[CuseCubFan69]

IMO Toronto is going to want pitching and it'll be Hill plus an everyday player prospect or Guzman and Marshall and an everyday prospect at the very least.

[mg420]

IMO Toronto is going to want pitching and it'll be Hill plus an everyday player prospect or Guzman and Marshall and an everyday prospect at the very least.

 

if they cubs trade hill they deserve to lose.

[Wheelimus]

Ok. The Blue Jays, just looking at their stats (don't follow that team closely) doesn't have a ton of talent at shortstop. So lets start the offer with Cesar Izturis and remind them he's an All-Star. :lol:

 

Next, lets add Ryan Dempster to the mix. To us he's the shaky closer with the 4.80 ERA. To them he'd be their 4th or 5th best starting pitcher, maybe better. Sell them on the fact that his style is better suited for starting anyway. Better to give up 2 or 3 runs over seven innings than over one.

 

Now, what if you could add Pie to the deal, and the Blue Jays would take on the extra payroll? We upgrade insanely in center field. I'd probably request a period to negotiate an extension first, though.

 

The jays fill three positions by trading one guy. It maybe bites us in the ass when Pie becomes the player we hope he can be. At least he'll be in the AL and it won't be rubbed in our face everyday.

 

If they'd do it, I'd consider it, we go bigtime in center and actually wind up saving a little cash. Cash we could pile onto something else. :D

 

Dunno if I'd do it, but it's tempting.

[CuseCubFan69]

Ok. The Blue Jays, just looking at their stats (don't follow that team closely) doesn't have a ton of talent at shortstop. So lets start the offer with Cesar Izturis and remind them he's an All-Star. :lol:

 

Next, lets add Ryan Dempster to the mix. To us he's the shaky closer with the 4.80 ERA. To them he'd be their 4th or 5th best starting pitcher, maybe better. Sell them on the fact that his style is better suited for starting anyway. Better to give up 2 or 3 runs over seven innings than over one.

 

Now, what if you could add Pie to the deal, and the Blue Jays would take on the extra payroll? We upgrade insanely in center field. I'd probably request a period to negotiate an extension first, though.

 

The jays fill three positions by trading one guy. It maybe bites us in the ass when Pie becomes the player we hope he can be. At least he'll be in the AL and it won't be rubbed in our face everyday.

 

If they'd do it, I'd consider it, we go bigtime in center and actually wind up saving a little cash. Cash we could pile onto something else. :D

 

Dunno if I'd do it, but it's tempting.

 

Izturis came up through the Toronto organization so they know all about him unfortuately. I think they just started using Aaron Hill back at SS at the end of the year and if he works out there they will have no interest in a SS other than for a backup SS.

 

I think Pie could have a Wells like career without as much power so I'd like to keep him.

[BigbadB]

I think Pie could have a Wells like career without as much power so I'd like to keep him.

 

How can one really predict how much power Pie will have? He won't be 22 until February. If he puts on 20-30 pounds of mass over the next 3 or 4 years, he may end up with even more power than Wells.

 

If I'm Hendry, Pie isn't in any trade discussions, period.

[Banedon]

My point in the Thome-Choi comment wasn't to say that I want Thome instead of Lee or any such nonsense. My point was that we've had young players with a lot of hype that haven't panned out like we thought they would, and getting a proven player has instead been the right move. I should have used Lee-Choi instead.

[CuseCubFan69]

I think Pie could have a Wells like career without as much power so I'd like to keep him.

 

How can one really predict how much power Pie will have? He won't be 22 until February. If he puts on 20-30 pounds of mass over the next 3 or 4 years, he may end up with even more power than Wells.

 

If I'm Hendry, Pie isn't in any trade discussions, period.

 

Just a guess I suppose BbB. I could see him as a 15-30 HR guy.

 

I put on 20-30 pounds and it didn't help my power. :D

 

I assume you meant muscle, right?

[Tedward]

Izturis came up through the Toronto organization so they know all about him unfortuately. I think they just started using Aaron Hill back at SS at the end of the year and if he works out there they will have no interest in a SS other than for a backup SS.

 

Didn't Wilken draft Wells when he was with TOR? It wouldn't surprise me if he was someone the Cubs were targeting this offseason.

[BigbadB]

I think Pie could have a Wells like career without as much power so I'd like to keep him.

 

How can one really predict how much power Pie will have? He won't be 22 until February. If he puts on 20-30 pounds of mass over the next 3 or 4 years, he may end up with even more power than Wells.

 

If I'm Hendry, Pie isn't in any trade discussions, period.

 

Just a guess I suppose BbB. I could see him as a 15-30 HR guy.

 

I put on 20-30 pounds and it didn't help my power. :D

 

I assume you meant muscle, right?

 

Is there any other kind of weight a guy, who sees dollar signs not all that far down the road, could put on?

[cubweiser03]

Gammons this morning on the radio talked about the Jays potentially dealing Wells at this years winter meetings. The Jays are anticipating that Vernon will be asking for $15M per season after next year and they wouldnt be able to afford him, so they might try and deal him this winter. He didnt mention suitors. Edited November 3, 2006 by cubweiser03

[CuseCubFan69]

Izturis came up through the Toronto organization so they know all about him unfortuately. I think they just started using Aaron Hill back at SS at the end of the year and if he works out there they will have no interest in a SS other than for a backup SS.

 

Didn't Wilken draft Wells when he was with TOR? It wouldn't surprise me if he was someone the Cubs were targeting this offseason.

 

Yep, and Izzy too.

[CuseCubFan69]

Gammons this morning on the radio talked about the Jays potentially dealing Wells at this years winter meetings. The Jays are anticipating that Vernon will be asking for $15M per season after next year and they wouldnt be able to afford him, so they might try and deal him this winter. He didnt mention suitors.

 

Yeah, they said Beltran type money. I think Hendry has a lot of options to make this team better and depending on what Toronto wants this should be explored.

[goonys evil twin]

Gammons this morning on the radio talked about the Jays potentially dealing Wells at this years winter meetings. The Jays are anticipating that Vernon will be asking for $15M per season after next year and they wouldnt be able to afford him, so they might try and deal him this winter. He didnt mention suitors.

 

Yeah, they said Beltran type money. I think Hendry has a lot of options to make this team better and depending on what Toronto wants this should be explored.

 

Wells is good, but far from great. He'd be a substantial improvement over Pierre though.

 

He's exactly the type of player Hendry would go gaga over though. Toolsy, with glossy traditional numbers. He'd call him a .300 hitter even though he typically doesn't hit .300. He doesn't strike out much. All-in-all, a very Hendry guy. Now, if you end up giving him $15m per year, you aren't getting a bunch of bang for your buck, but seeing as how he's a CF, and significantly better than most CF, he's not going to kill you either.

 

If Hendry keeps doing things the Hendry way, Vernon is one of the better options.

[CuseCubFan69]

Gammons this morning on the radio talked about the Jays potentially dealing Wells at this years winter meetings. The Jays are anticipating that Vernon will be asking for $15M per season after next year and they wouldnt be able to afford him, so they might try and deal him this winter. He didnt mention suitors.

 

Yeah, they said Beltran type money. I think Hendry has a lot of options to make this team better and depending on what Toronto wants this should be explored.

 

Wells is good, but far from great. He'd be a substantial improvement over Pierre though.

 

He's exactly the type of player Hendry would go gaga over though. Toolsy, with glossy traditional numbers. He'd call him a .300 hitter even though he typically doesn't hit .300. He doesn't strike out much. All-in-all, a very Hendry guy. Now, if you end up giving him $15m per year, you aren't getting a bunch of bang for your buck, but seeing as how he's a CF, and significantly better than most CF, he's not going to kill you either.

 

If Hendry keeps doing things the Hendry way, Vernon is one of the better options.

 

What you wrote reminds me of Homer....well that's our Hendry!

 

I wouldn't mind the combo of Matthews and Durham, one of the Japanese guys and a big trade/or sign an impact pitcher. I think an ARod trade would rob the team of it's depth and recources.

 

Durham

Murton

Lee

Ramirez

Barrett

Jones

Matthews

Theriot/Cedeno/Izturis