Week 4: Seahawks @ BEARS - Sunday Oct. 1, 7:15 cst NBC

[UMFan83]

I am a bit worried that the secondary is going to be exposed. The CBs I think are very overrated. Vasher and Tillman have done absolutely nothing this year (except tackle players after they've burned them on routes). Brown is still Brown and Manning is fast for a safety, but overall, if there was a game for the secondary to prove themselves, this is it.

[Chocolate Milk]

I really don't understand the hate for the Bears secondary. I'm not really sure what people expect. Other teams ARE going to complete passes. This is going to happen.

 

People remember the last playoff game but forget that the Bears secondary was the best in the NFL last year and has only been improved. Manning Jr. is better than a washed up Azumah and Wesley is better than Chris Thompson. I think Manning is at least equal to Harris and probably a better pass defender. I'm not really seeing the beef here.

 

Last year they gave up a passer rating of 61.2 (#1 in the NFL and 7 points lower than #2). They also only gave up 10 TD's (#1 in the NFL and 5 less touchdowns than the #2 team) while making 24 INT's. What more do you want? The Bears secondary is arguably the best in the NFL.

 

If there was anything I'd be worried about on defense, it's the rush defense. We've been susceptible to delays and misdirection in the running game. We're giving up 4ypc good for 20th in the league.

[UMFan83]

Tillman was downright average last year even before the playoff game. Vasher was opportunistic which got him a pro bowl bid. Maybe your right, but if the secondary was so good last year, why did the Bears use the draft and FA to add to the secondary and not other areas of need.

[bukie]

Tillman was downright average last year even before the playoff game. Vasher was opportunistic which got him a pro bowl bid. Maybe your right, but if the secondary was so good last year, why did the Bears use the draft and FA to add to the secondary and not other areas of need.

 

Starters were good, depth in nickle packages was bad.

[Chocolate Milk]

Tillman was downright average last year even before the playoff game. Vasher was opportunistic which got him a pro bowl bid. Maybe your right, but if the secondary was so good last year, why did the Bears use the draft and FA to add to the secondary and not other areas of need.

 

There is no if's about it. The Bears secondary was by far the best secondary in the NFL last year. Calling Tillman average is silly. The guy is good, but not elite. He's the #1 CB for a reason.

 

The reason the Bears bulked up the secondary is pretty obvious. Chris Harris was adaquate but not good. They were losing Jerry Azumah and Mike Brown had been injured the majority of the last two seasons. Also, if there was anything the playoff game showed us, it's that our secondary depth was a big weakness.

 

I don't know. Maybe the Bears secondary get's torched this weekend. I don't see it happening though. The first 2 games the Bears were way up, forcing the other team to pass and they still haven't given up a touchdown.

[goonys evil twin]

Tillman was downright average last year even before the playoff game. Vasher was opportunistic which got him a pro bowl bid. Maybe your right, but if the secondary was so good last year, why did the Bears use the draft and FA to add to the secondary and not other areas of need.

 

The defense was great, and the offense stunk, yet they concentrated on defense throughout, getting line and linebacker depth and "ignored other areas of need". I don't think you're reasoning holds up. Part of it was needing to replace Azumah, part of it was probably anticipating further troubles with Brown.

 

 

I'm a little concerned with all the 4-receiver talk that the running game is going to be what Seattle tries to exploit. The Bears seem to run-up an awful lot of tackles for no gain, but the right running game gets way too many 5-15 yard runs against these guys.

[Magnetic Curses]

Tillman was downright average last year even before the playoff game. Vasher was opportunistic which got him a pro bowl bid. Maybe your right, but if the secondary was so good last year, why did the Bears use the draft and FA to add to the secondary and not other areas of need.

 

The defense was great, and the offense stunk, yet they concentrated on defense throughout, getting line and linebacker depth and "ignored other areas of need". I don't think you're reasoning holds up. Part of it was needing to replace Azumah, part of it was probably anticipating further troubles with Brown.

 

 

I'm a little concerned with all the 4-receiver talk that the running game is going to be what Seattle tries to exploit. The Bears seem to run-up an awful lot of tackles for no gain, but the right running game gets way too many 5-15 yard runs against these guys.

 

i think you're right. the 2 or 3-gap defensive front is designed to get pressure in the backfield and the linebackers and safeties are just there to stick receivers between the sticks, with run-stopping duties as well.

 

i'd just run draw after draw on the bears.

[rawaction]

I really don't understand the hate for the Bears secondary. I'm not really sure what people expect. Other teams ARE going to complete passes. This is going to happen.

 

People remember the last playoff game but forget that the Bears secondary was the best in the NFL last year and has only been improved. Manning Jr. is better than a washed up Azumah and Wesley is better than Chris Thompson. I think Manning is at least equal to Harris and probably a better pass defender. I'm not really seeing the beef here.

 

Last year they gave up a passer rating of 61.2 (#1 in the NFL and 7 points lower than #2). They also only gave up 10 TD's (#1 in the NFL and 5 less touchdowns than the #2 team) while making 24 INT's. What more do you want? The Bears secondary is arguably the best in the NFL.

 

If there was anything I'd be worried about on defense, it's the rush defense. We've been susceptible to delays and misdirection in the running game. We're giving up 4ypc good for 20th in the league.

 

And missed tackles. But yeah, this will be a battle of the best 2 secondaries in football. I like Seattle's maybe a little better, but not much. Like you pointed out, the Bears CBs are very good. Tillman is a good CB. Sure people caught passes on him, but people have to realize that he was on everyone's #1 WR. You know the Redskins, Bucs, and Panthers were gonna get the ball to Moss, Galloway, and Smith repspectively. That's their gameplan. Fact is, he gave up very few TDs. He gave up very few big plays. With the offensive schemes out there and the fact he was on an island for all 16 games last year, he was bound to have some passes caught on him.

 

Those stats from above don't happen unless you have good CBs.

[Chocolate Milk]

Those stats from above don't happen unless you have good CBs.

 

Giving up only 10 passing touchdowns in one year is astonishing.

[Chocolate Milk]

Bad news guys.

 

Per ESPN Radio A. Curry has been put on IR (foot).

 

:cry:

 

So much for me pimping him over Gage. :roll:

[Banedon]

Bad news guys.

 

Per ESPN Radio A. Curry has been put on IR (foot).

 

:cry:

 

So much for me pimping him over Gage. :roll:

 

Is it time to cut bait with him? Seems like he's always injured.

[UMFan83]

He's on the #1 receiver, and lets look at how those #1 receivers did against Tillman last year. Note that I am just picking who in my judgement the #1 receiver is. I am not 100% sure that Tillman was covering each of these guys:

 

Washington - Santana Moss 4 catches 96 yards

Detroit - Probably Roy Williams 5 catches 96 yards 1 TD

Cincinnati - Chad Johnson 3 catches 77 yards 2 TD

Cleveland - Antonio Bryant 6 catches 83 yards 2 TD

Minnesota - Koren Robinson 1 catch 4 yards, Marcus Robinson 4 catches 41 yards (not sure who he covered there..could have even been Williamson)

Baltimore - Derrick Mason 2 catches 38 yards

Detroit - Was probably on Mike Williams 3 catches 27 yards

New Orleans - Joe Horn 2 catches 27 yards

San Francisco - Brandon Lloyd 1 catch 13 yards (only completed pass all game, no one was catching anything that day)

Carolina - Steve Smith 14 catches 169 yards

Tampa Bay - Joey Galloway 7 catches 138 yards

Green Bay - Donald Driver 8 catches 64 yards

Pittsburgh - Hines Ward 3 catches 27 yards 1 TD

Atlanta - Brian Finneran 6 catches 75 yards

Green Bay - Donald Driver 6 catches 107 yards

Minnesota - Did not or barely played

Carolina - 12 catches 218 yards 2 TD

 

Obviously, he was not responsible for all of that, there are different coverages, bend but don't break, etc. But the fact of the matter is, this is how his target receivers did against him. A few good games, a few bad games, a few terrible games. I will average these out, but remember that there was 1 game where he did not play (which I'll throw out), 1 game where it was nearly impossible to throw, and 2 other games where conditions were pretty bad (also a few games where conditions were great to throw)

 

Totals:

16 games

86 catches

1296 yards

8 TD

 

Average:

1 game

5.4 catches

81 yards

0.5 TD

Edited September 29, 2006 by UMFan83

[rawaction]

Isn't this just his 2nd year?

[Banedon]

Isn't this just his 2nd year?

 

This is Tillman's 4th season.

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/players/stats?playerId=4493

 

EDIT: Sportsline.com has Tillman ranked 44th in DB's. He's the highest ranked Bear DB.

 

http://www.sportsline.com/nfl/playerrankings/regularseason/DB

 

I'm wondering if these are skewed though because the Bears help on coverage so much. They swarm.

[UMFan83]

I think he was talking about Curry. He just happened to post that seconds after my post

[sweetpeteman]

Holy Cow, Schlereth actually picked the Bears!

[Banedon]

I think he was talking about Curry. He just happened to post that seconds after my post

 

:oops:

[da bears]

Holy Cow, Schlereth actually picked the Bears!

 

Oh geez. Interesting that he thinks they can beat the Seahawks but not the Lions.

[Chocolate Milk]

He's on the #1 receiver, and lets look at how those #1 receivers did against Tillman last year. Note that I am just picking who in my judgement the #1 receiver is. I am not 100% sure that Tillman was covering each of these guys:

 

Washington - Santana Moss 4 catches 96 yards

Detroit - Probably Roy Williams 5 catches 96 yards 1 TD

Cincinnati - Chad Johnson 3 catches 77 yards 2 TD

Cleveland - Antonio Bryant 6 catches 83 yards 2 TD

Minnesota - Koren Robinson 1 catch 4 yards, Marcus Robinson 4 catches 41 yards (not sure who he covered there..could have even been Williamson)

Baltimore - Derrick Mason 2 catches 38 yards

Detroit - Was probably on Mike Williams 3 catches 27 yards

New Orleans - Joe Horn 2 catches 27 yards

San Francisco - Brandon Lloyd 1 catch 13 yards (only completed pass all game, no one was catching anything that day)

Carolina - Steve Smith 14 catches 169 yards

Tampa Bay - Joey Galloway 7 catches 138 yards

Green Bay - Donald Driver 8 catches 64 yards

Pittsburgh - Hines Ward 3 catches 27 yards 1 TD

Atlanta - Brian Finneran 6 catches 75 yards

Green Bay - Donald Driver 6 catches 107 yards

Minnesota - Did not or barely played

Carolina - 12 catches 218 yards 2 TD

 

Obviously, he was not responsible for all of that, there are different coverages, bend but don't break, etc. But the fact of the matter is, this is how his target receivers did against him. A few good games, a few bad games, a few terrible games. I will average these out, but remember that there was 1 game where he did not play (which I'll throw out), 1 game where it was nearly impossible to throw, and 2 other games where conditions were pretty bad (also a few games where conditions were great to throw)

 

Totals:

16 games

86 catches

1296 yards

8 TD

 

Average:

1 game

5.4 catches

81 yards

0.5 TD

 

Good effort. I'm not sure it's going to tell us much about Tillman though as the Bears do not rotate corner backs from one side of the field to the other. For example, the Cinci game, C. Johnson burned Vasher for a long touchdown when Vasher whiffed on his jam at the line of scrimmage. Steve Smith burned Thompson for one of those long TD's in the playoff game, etc.

 

Tillman is at his best when covering big receivers and not as good when covering small speedy types. I still say Tillman is good, though. Maybe we can agree to disagree.

[UMFan83]

He's on the #1 receiver, and lets look at how those #1 receivers did against Tillman last year. Note that I am just picking who in my judgement the #1 receiver is. I am not 100% sure that Tillman was covering each of these guys:

 

Washington - Santana Moss 4 catches 96 yards

Detroit - Probably Roy Williams 5 catches 96 yards 1 TD

Cincinnati - Chad Johnson 3 catches 77 yards 2 TD

Cleveland - Antonio Bryant 6 catches 83 yards 2 TD

Minnesota - Koren Robinson 1 catch 4 yards, Marcus Robinson 4 catches 41 yards (not sure who he covered there..could have even been Williamson)

Baltimore - Derrick Mason 2 catches 38 yards

Detroit - Was probably on Mike Williams 3 catches 27 yards

New Orleans - Joe Horn 2 catches 27 yards

San Francisco - Brandon Lloyd 1 catch 13 yards (only completed pass all game, no one was catching anything that day)

Carolina - Steve Smith 14 catches 169 yards

Tampa Bay - Joey Galloway 7 catches 138 yards

Green Bay - Donald Driver 8 catches 64 yards

Pittsburgh - Hines Ward 3 catches 27 yards 1 TD

Atlanta - Brian Finneran 6 catches 75 yards

Green Bay - Donald Driver 6 catches 107 yards

Minnesota - Did not or barely played

Carolina - 12 catches 218 yards 2 TD

 

Obviously, he was not responsible for all of that, there are different coverages, bend but don't break, etc. But the fact of the matter is, this is how his target receivers did against him. A few good games, a few bad games, a few terrible games. I will average these out, but remember that there was 1 game where he did not play (which I'll throw out), 1 game where it was nearly impossible to throw, and 2 other games where conditions were pretty bad (also a few games where conditions were great to throw)

 

Totals:

16 games

86 catches

1296 yards

8 TD

 

Average:

1 game

5.4 catches

81 yards

0.5 TD

 

Good effort. I'm not sure it's going to tell us much about Tillman though as the Bears do not rotate corner backs from one side of the field to the other. For example, the Cinci game, C. Johnson burned Vasher for a long touchdown when Vasher whiffed on his jam at the line of scrimmage. Steve Smith burned Thompson for one of those long TD's in the playoff game, etc.

 

Tillman is at his best when covering big receivers and not as good when covering small speedy types. I still say Tillman is good, though. Maybe we can agree to disagree.

 

Yeah I know there are inaccuracies there. I wasn't going to go back and recall each game (but now that you mention it I remember it being Vasher that was burned on that play). I just wanted to throw some numbers out there. I am not saying Peanut is bad...and to be honest, I think he had a very good year in 2003 and a decent year when he played in 2004. Anyways, we'll have a better idea of how good the Bears secondary is after this game. I just wonder what kinda schemes they are going to use with the Linebackers and Safeties. Lovie says that they are going to use their normal schemes, but I am not sure I believe that.

[Brian]

Clark missed practice again today, not looking good for sunday for him.

[UMFan83]

Clark missed practice again today, not looking good for sunday for him.

 

Meh, Brian Westbrook misses Friday practices all the time and ends up playing on Sunday

[cubweiser03]

If the Bears win sunday night are we going to have to dust off that old album collection and play that damn song? 8)

 

This sunday night is going to be so crazy. The sunday night game last year with Atlanta was awesome. This is going be off the charts. IF the Bears win sunday the town is going to turn upside down monday.

[YearofDaCubs]

Bad news guys.

 

Per ESPN Radio A. Curry has been put on IR (foot).

 

:cry:

 

So much for me pimping him over Gage. :roll:

I wanted to see what this guy can do but this is just pathetic. This guy is ALWAYS injured.

[CP_414]

I think the Seattle 4 receiver set plays right into the Bears defense. The front four are good at getting pressure on the Qb and with the 4 receivers there is one less blocker for Seattle. I think the Bears will get Hasselback at least 3 times on sacks. Hasselback should have to release the ball very quickly. Since he will be throwing quick passes the Bears linebackers will come into play quite a bit on the passing game. With the ability of Urlacher and Briggs to get sideline-to-sideline I predict an interception by one of those two guys. That said, Seattle will probably get a couple of big plays by the nature of their offense.