Neifi and Sabermetrics

[RynoRules]

According to Rob Neyer's sabermetric catagories (FRAR, WS, and UZR), Nefi Perez was the best defensive shortstop in the NL this year, and deserved the goild glove.

 

Source: Neyer's article on ESPN.com Insider addressing the "willful ignorance" of GG voters.

 

As Tree has aptly put it: "I'm not sayin', I'm just sayin'."

[SouthSideRyan]

And the Cubs intend to make him even less valuable by moving him to 2nd base. I don't think anybody debates that Neifi is a great glove, but in a lineup with so much uncertainty in the OF you can't afford to have a black hole like Neifi in the lineup. Especially with Dusty's propensity to bat him in the 1 or 2 spots.

[MeatampPotatoesMan]

Neifi, not "Nefi."

 

...and CPat was also a good fielder who sucked it up at the dish. I don't hear anyone singing his praises.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Good for Neifi. I hope he never puts on a Cubs uniform again.

[Outshined_One]

In the hands of a competent manager, Neifi is a decent bench guy to have around. He's always had solid defense. When he has been used in a limited capacity, his bat is also decent (I read that on Desipio, but I can't remember which article).

 

However, we know what Dusty likes to do with Neifi. I want Hendry to Dusty-proof this team, so that means I don't want Neifi anywhere near this team next season.

[USSoccer]

In the hands of a competent manager, Neifi is a decent bench guy to have around. He's always had solid defense. When he has been used in a limited capacity, his bat is also decent (I read that on Desipio, but I can't remember which article).

 

However, we know what Dusty likes to do with Neifi. I want Hendry to Dusty-proof this team, so that means I don't want Neifi anywhere near this team next season.

 

Hear Hear. Neifi, used properly, isn't as bad. When with Dusty, it's like mixing gasoline and fire and gunpowder.

[RockTheIvy]

Neifi, not "Nefi."

 

...and CPat was also a good fielder who sucked it up at the dish. I don't hear anyone singing his praises.

 

At least Neifi! had a good empty batting average, not a terrible empty one.

[Omar]

The quantity of quality shortstops and their defense in the NL arent that great. Im not surprised people think he should've got it.

[cjbucks]

And the Cubs intend to make him even less valuable by moving him to 2nd base. I don't think anybody debates that Neifi is a great glove, but in a lineup with so much uncertainty in the OF you can't afford to have a black hole like Neifi in the lineup. Especially with Dusty's propensity to bat him in the 1 or 2 spots.

 

I would disagree with that - I think a lot of people debate that on this board.

[KatJ]

According to Rob Neyer's sabermetric catagories (FRAR, WS, and UZR), Nefi Perez was the best defensive shortstop in the NL this year, and deserved the goild glove.

 

I thought Sabermetrics was more about the offense. Under sabermetrics, a player is more trouble than he's worth if dazzling defense is outweighed by lack of execution at the plate.

[burnt out cubbie fan]

According to Rob Neyer's sabermetric catagories (FRAR, WS, and UZR), Nefi Perez was the best defensive shortstop in the NL this year, and deserved the goild glove.

 

Source: Neyer's article on ESPN.com Insider addressing the "willful ignorance" of GG voters.

 

As Tree has aptly put it: "I'm not sayin', I'm just sayin'."

If you look at the other saber catagories, Neifi is a pretty bad offensive player. I'm just sayin'.

[Joe_Cub]

...and CPat was also a good fielder who sucked it up at the dish. I don't hear anyone singing his praises.

 

Maybe last season. Was he that good this season?

 

He made that awesome catch in Cincinnati and that was one of the best catches I ever saw. But that seemed to be his peak. He just didn't look very good in the field to me last season but I don't know what his stats say he did as far as defense goes.

[Balsa]

Yeah, his defense actually declined last year. Not as much as his average...but...

[Big Z]

Corey sucked in CF this year.

[RynoRules]

Neifi, not "Nefi."

 

...and CPat was also a good fielder who sucked it up at the dish. I don't hear anyone singing his praises.

 

Wow. Sorry, my Cubbie spell check must be broken. :roll:

[RynoRules]

The point of this thread is that objective stats show that, if used correctly, Neifi can be an effective ML player.

[UK1679666180]

Have to get rid of Baker 1st, Baker would play him over Cedeno as he did last year and he would hit Perez at the top of the order, like he did last year.

 

History isn't on Baker's side, as far as utilizing Perez properly.

 

He's an ideal 25th man, which is currently occupied by a player who was used too often last year and should not be on the roster this year.

[MeatampPotatoesMan]

The point of this thread is that objective stats show that, if used correctly, Neifi can be an effective ML player.

 

But he isn't used correctly and is therefore a detriment to this team. It's not his fault. It's Baker's.

 

Burnitz was rock solid in RF and also GG caliber this year. Too bad his offense was lacking. He was shown the door and Neifi should be too.

[RynoRules]

I think its crazy to exclude a guy who could be effective simply b/c the manager misuses him. The better option, IMO, is for Dusty's boss to tell him how he is to be used.

[UK1679666180]

I think its crazy to exclude a guy who could be effective simply b/c the manager misuses him. The better option, IMO, is for Dusty's boss to tell him how he is to be used.

 

A GM doesn't tell a manager who to play or who not to play, a GM fires a manager who isn't on the same page as him. Hendry would be overstepping his boundaries if he wanted to become an arm-chair manager, that's our job.

[RynoRules]

I think its crazy to exclude a guy who could be effective simply b/c the manager misuses him. The better option, IMO, is for Dusty's boss to tell him how he is to be used.

 

A GM doesn't tell a manager who to play or who not to play, a GM fires a manager who isn't on the same page as him. Hendry would be overstepping his boundaries if he wanted to become an arm-chair manager, that's our job.

 

That doesn't stop Billy Beane (source: "Moneyball"), and many on this bd. hold him up as one who runs his club the right way. He and Howe had many fallings-out re who should be used, in-game strategy, etc. Beane and his mentor, Sandy Alderson, disagree with the common baseball conception that the manager is the "face" of the team, and instead believe that the front office (specifically the GM) should set the tone.

[KingKongvs.Godzilla]

There was a point in this guys career where he was the worst offensive player in baseball period. That was a several year streak, at a time when he played in Coors.

 

As good as his glove may be, I don't think he's worth the risk of having Dusty start him everyday...

[UK1679666180]

They disagreed on who should play and who shouldn't and Howe was canned. Beane offered opinions on who should play, but Howe had the final say.

 

Can you actually see Hendry telling Baker; Cedeno should play and why Perez shouldn't?

 

I can't, it'll never happen.

[MeatampPotatoesMan]

I think its crazy to exclude a guy who could be effective simply b/c the manager misuses him. The better option, IMO, is for Dusty's boss to tell him how he is to be used.

 

A GM doesn't tell a manager who to play or who not to play, a GM fires a manager who isn't on the same page as him. Hendry would be overstepping his boundaries if he wanted to become an arm-chair manager, that's our job.

 

That doesn't stop Billy Beane (source: "Moneyball"), and many on this bd. hold him up as one who runs his club the right way. He and Howe had many fallings-out re who should be used, in-game strategy, etc. Beane and his mentor, Sandy Alderson, disagree with the common baseball conception that the manager is the "face" of the team, and instead believe that the front office (specifically the GM) should set the tone.

 

Beane is the exeption to the rule. Name one other team in MLB that uses the manager that way.

[rawaction]

I posted about a month ago that Neifi played the best SS in the NL last season.

 

The quantity of quality shortstops and their defense in the NL arent that great. Im not surprised people think he should've got it.

 

I completely disagree with this. Could have made an argument for Furcal, Jack Wilson, and Vizquel (who did win it). And that doesn't even include Khalil Greene and Alex Gonzalez who are absolute wizards over there. NL SS are much better than their AL counterparts as a whole.