Cubs add Chapman for Torres, et al. imb wishes we paid more

[minnesotacubsfan]

The court of public opinion is guilty until proven innocent and there is never going to be anything he can do to satisfy it, which is inherently unfair to Chapman.

 

It's also extremely unfair to his girlfriend, as there's no fair restitution for what he did to her, and she's still with him so it's not over yet. She's (and he) the only one that truly knows what happened, and hopefully the violence towards her is over.

 

Can domestic abusers ever stop? Honest question

[Vinestal]

The court of public opinion is guilty until proven innocent and there is never going to be anything he can do to satisfy it, which is inherently unfair to Chapman.

 

Pooooooooooor Chapman!!! Won't anyone think of the man that just served a domestic violence suspension and at a minimum fired a gun eight times in his garage scaring his girlfriend into hiding in the bushes?! And, according to her initial story, choked her and pushed her against a wall? So mistreated!

 

You were there for the whole thing and know exactly what happened? that's fascinating please continue to tell us all about it. I hate that people assume whatever a woman says to the police is 100% accurate. What he said happened and what she said happened were very different stories. I'm not saying he didn't do anything wrong but Jesus you weren't there how the hell do you know what went down? Reporters weren't there either. There's a reason why the police didn't pursue the case. I don't feel sorry for either one of them, they had issues, they worked them out apparently. I don't care what happened in their personal life. Frankly I don't think anyone needs to be judging the guy. He went through the legal and baseball judgement and served a suspension. Nothing is going to change what happened. He's here now, probably only for a few months. Enjoy his pitching dominance and move on.

[jersey cubs fan]

I hate that people assume whatever a woman says to the police is 100% accurate.

 

What she says doesn't have to be anywhere close to 100% accurate for the truth to be that Chapman did very bad things and is a very bad person.

[BigSlick]

I love the accusations of our ~nefarious agenda~ you know, the agenda of not liking domestic violence

[Tracer Bullet]

The court of public opinion is guilty until proven innocent and there is never going to be anything he can do to satisfy it, which is inherently unfair to Chapman.

 

Pooooooooooor Chapman!!! Won't anyone think of the man that just served a domestic violence suspension and at a minimum fired a gun eight times in his garage scaring his girlfriend into hiding in the bushes?! And, according to her initial story, choked her and pushed her against a wall? So mistreated!

 

You were there for the whole thing and know exactly what happened? that's fascinating please continue to tell us all about it. I hate that people assume whatever a woman says to the police is 100% accurate. What he said happened and what she said happened were very different stories. I'm not saying he didn't do anything wrong but Jesus you weren't there how the hell do you know what went down? Reporters weren't there either. There's a reason why the police didn't pursue the case. I don't feel sorry for either one of them, they had issues, they worked them out apparently. I don't care what happened in their personal life. Frankly I don't think anyone needs to be judging the guy. He went through the legal and baseball judgement and served a suspension. Nothing is going to change what happened. He's here now, probably only for a few months. Enjoy his pitching dominance and move on.

 

um, no he didn't. a few cops deciding not to arrest you is not "going through the legal system." and the reason he didn't is b/c his girlfriend was scared of him and also felt dependent upon him so she wouldn't cooperate. If you cared at all about domestic abuse victims, you wouldn't have this attitude that the victim deserves no support.

[Banedon]

The court of public opinion is guilty until proven innocent and there is never going to be anything he can do to satisfy it, which is inherently unfair to Chapman.

 

Pooooooooooor Chapman!!! Won't anyone think of the man that just served a domestic violence suspension and at a minimum fired a gun eight times in his garage scaring his girlfriend into hiding in the bushes?! And, according to her initial story, choked her and pushed her against a wall? So mistreated!

 

You were there for the whole thing and know exactly what happened? that's fascinating please continue to tell us all about it. I hate that people assume whatever a woman says to the police is 100% accurate. What he said happened and what she said happened were very different stories. I'm not saying he didn't do anything wrong but Jesus you weren't there how the hell do you know what went down? Reporters weren't there either. There's a reason why the police didn't pursue the case. I don't feel sorry for either one of them, they had issues, they worked them out apparently. I don't care what happened in their personal life. Frankly I don't think anyone needs to be judging the guy. He went through the legal and baseball judgement and served a suspension. Nothing is going to change what happened. He's here now, probably only for a few months. Enjoy his pitching dominance and move on.

 

I'm too busy at work today to tear into this appropriately, but I'll just say that you need to read more about domestic violence, why victims don't report or retract their reports, and why they stay with abusers.

 

It's far more important than baseball.

[davell]

This is a post I horsefeathering hate writing. It will come off HOT TAKEY and will likely piss off some of the most valued opinions on this site to me. But its not been said yet(I don't think) and needs to be, in my opinion.

 

First off, I can't stand Chapman. I HATE that we traded for him. But, at the end of the day, he's going to be pitching for someone. It very likely could have been the Giants or Nats. Our two chief competitors, both who needed pen help as much or more than us. They were certainly trying to get him.

 

Chapman appears to be the best pen arm that's getting dealt. The price on Miller seems astronomical and it doesn't sound like he's moving. If he does move, it really appears we had to part with Schwarber for him, which I'd have been less OK with, than even trading for this POS. If the Nat's give up Giolito for him, great job by the Yanks. I don't even think the Giants CAN trade for him.

 

Were Theo's comments lip service? Absolutely. But he made the team better and kept him off other teams looking for the same thing, thus weakening them a bit. Set the market high as horsefeathers in the process, making it harder for them to regain their standing.

 

To me, it comes down to whether the players were OK with this move. They're more important than we are. I'll guess they WERE OK with it, or he wouldn't be here. They likely look at it as "Hey, we got better". May help the morale, if anything. That is more important to Theo than catching some blowback from disappointed fans. His chief job is to win. Sometimes, you've got to be ruthless in business to succeed at the highest levels and this is the epitomy of that. He traded for a guy that's unfortunately eligible TO play. And if he didn't, someone else was going to and it could have came back to haunt us eventually.

 

How much does this effect my viewing? No idea, the horsefeathers hasn't pitched yet. I feel confident if we win it all, I'll be happy as horsefeathers though. I sincerely hope everyone here winds up in that boat as well. I don't think we'll even truly know that until it happens.

 

Theo is here to win. He gulped and made the move that made sense from a baseball perspective. His number one job is to bring a championship here. Cold blooded Theo? Hes here now. Rightly or wrongly, this idiot is going to play for someone and help them. In the end, we're secondary and I get that end of it. I hate it, but I get it. The business end trumps us. And I figure that quite a few that are pissed off now will not be, if this works out. I figure I'm in that boat and I hate it. But my want for a championship is high enough that I'll eventually rationalize damn near anything evidently. In the end, I truly wish everyone here winds up in that boat too. Happy as horsefeathers we won, trumping anything else that has gone on.

 

Apologies again, I can't speak loudly enough in saying I'm not trying to offend anyone.

[Banedon]

To me, it comes down to whether the players were OK with this move. They're more important than we are. I'll guess they WERE OK with it, or he wouldn't be here. They likely look at it as "Hey, we got better". May help the morale, if anything. That is more important to Theo than catching some blowback from disappointed fans. His chief job is to win. Sometimes, you've got to be ruthless in business to succeed at the highest levels and this is the epitomy of that. He traded for a guy that's unfortunately eligible TO play. And if he didn't, someone else was going to and it could have came back to haunt us eventually.

 

Players being ok with it doesn't mean much to me. Sports culture is ok with a lot things that society at large isn't, or shouldn't, be ok with.

[Sammy Sofa]

Theo IS pretty bro-y. He's probably more Vinestal-like than we want to admit.

[davell]

To me, it comes down to whether the players were OK with this move. They're more important than we are. I'll guess they WERE OK with it, or he wouldn't be here. They likely look at it as "Hey, we got better". May help the morale, if anything. That is more important to Theo than catching some blowback from disappointed fans. His chief job is to win. Sometimes, you've got to be ruthless in business to succeed at the highest levels and this is the epitomy of that. He traded for a guy that's unfortunately eligible TO play. And if he didn't, someone else was going to and it could have came back to haunt us eventually.

 

Players being ok with it doesn't mean much to me. Sports culture is ok with a lot things that society at large isn't, or shouldn't, be ok with.

 

The players and the business are more important than we are. If a guy is eligible to play and is good enough to play, my guess is any team would employ him if it helps them win.

[Banedon]

To me, it comes down to whether the players were OK with this move. They're more important than we are. I'll guess they WERE OK with it, or he wouldn't be here. They likely look at it as "Hey, we got better". May help the morale, if anything. That is more important to Theo than catching some blowback from disappointed fans. His chief job is to win. Sometimes, you've got to be ruthless in business to succeed at the highest levels and this is the epitomy of that. He traded for a guy that's unfortunately eligible TO play. And if he didn't, someone else was going to and it could have came back to haunt us eventually.

 

Players being ok with it doesn't mean much to me. Sports culture is ok with a lot things that society at large isn't, or shouldn't, be ok with.

 

The players and the business are more important than we are. If a guy is eligible to play and is good enough to play, my guess is any team would employ him if it helps them win.

 

This isn't a "would" conversation though. It's a "should" conversation.

 

The only baseball discussion to be had here is whether the price was too high or not. The team is most assuredly better with Chapman on the team.

 

But saying "well if we didn't, some other team would have" doesn't absolve the moral dilemma that comes with this acquisition.

[Tracer Bullet]

Theo IS pretty bro-y. He's probably more Vinestal-like than we want to admit.

 

that's not my read. I don't think he would have traded for someone who had been convicted or plead guilty to domestic violence. But he's clearly willing to play according to the rules, even if that means standing firmly on the line and leaning over as far as he can. He knows what his reputation will be if he orchestrates the teams that end the droughts for the Red Sox and Cubs. So if he can add an elite RP and dance around a little media and fan blowback, I think he's willing to do that.

[ConstableRabbit]

To me, it comes down to whether the players were OK with this move. They're more important than we are. I'll guess they WERE OK with it, or he wouldn't be here. They likely look at it as "Hey, we got better". May help the morale, if anything. That is more important to Theo than catching some blowback from disappointed fans. His chief job is to win. Sometimes, you've got to be ruthless in business to succeed at the highest levels and this is the epitomy of that. He traded for a guy that's unfortunately eligible TO play. And if he didn't, someone else was going to and it could have came back to haunt us eventually.

 

Players being ok with it doesn't mean much to me. Sports culture is ok with a lot things that society at large isn't, or shouldn't, be ok with.

A man who's been accused of rape, sexual assault, and quid pro-quo sexual favors by multiple women was elected as POTUS for two consecutive terms and remains one of the most admired politicians of the last 50 years. I don't think it's limited to sports culture. People choose to ignore bad behavior when it suits their own needs.

[Freyr]

I hate that people assume whatever a woman says to the police is 100% accurate.

 

What she says doesn't have to be anywhere close to 100% accurate for the truth to be that Chapman did very bad things and is a very bad person.

You continually give awful comebacks on why we all should dislike Chapman. This statement right here is awful

[Tracer Bullet]

To me, it comes down to whether the players were OK with this move. They're more important than we are. I'll guess they WERE OK with it, or he wouldn't be here. They likely look at it as "Hey, we got better". May help the morale, if anything. That is more important to Theo than catching some blowback from disappointed fans. His chief job is to win. Sometimes, you've got to be ruthless in business to succeed at the highest levels and this is the epitomy of that. He traded for a guy that's unfortunately eligible TO play. And if he didn't, someone else was going to and it could have came back to haunt us eventually.

 

Players being ok with it doesn't mean much to me. Sports culture is ok with a lot things that society at large isn't, or shouldn't, be ok with.

 

The players and the business are more important than we are. If a guy is eligible to play and is good enough to play, my guess is any team would employ him if it helps them win.

 

The players' opinions about moral issues are not more important than anyone else's. In fact, they're probably the least important given how biased they are (as a group). I would expect the vast majority of players will be more concerned about winning than anything. They see a guy who is an awesome RP who was going to be on their team or someone else's in the playoffs, so they want him on their team. That shouldn't surprise anyone nor change anyone's perspective on whether the Cubs made the right move.

 

If the only thing you care about is winning at all costs, then that's up to you. I don't want to win by having to employ a guy everyone knows abused his girlfriend (even what he admits, shooting a gun in his garage during or shortly after a dispute with your wife, is domestic abuse - the clear intent is intimidation and fear).

 

I appreciate that you're at least willing to own that and talk reasonably about it, rather than try to dance around this issue.

[imb]

Quotes like Rizzo's are why these leagues taking tough stances on DV cases are important. Chapman was never arrested or charged, but he was still suspended. Some would call that unfair, but then Rizzo makes a tone deaf quote like that and reminds you that people, in general, do not take this stuff seriously.

[Banedon]

To me, it comes down to whether the players were OK with this move. They're more important than we are. I'll guess they WERE OK with it, or he wouldn't be here. They likely look at it as "Hey, we got better". May help the morale, if anything. That is more important to Theo than catching some blowback from disappointed fans. His chief job is to win. Sometimes, you've got to be ruthless in business to succeed at the highest levels and this is the epitomy of that. He traded for a guy that's unfortunately eligible TO play. And if he didn't, someone else was going to and it could have came back to haunt us eventually.

 

Players being ok with it doesn't mean much to me. Sports culture is ok with a lot things that society at large isn't, or shouldn't, be ok with.

A man who's been accused of rape, sexual assault, and quid pro-quo sexual favors by multiple women was elected as POTUS for two consecutive terms and remains one of the most admired politicians of the last 50 years. I don't think it's limited to sports culture. People choose to ignore bad behavior when it suits their own needs.

 

I wasn't absolving any other aspect of our culture by any means. I was simply saying that locker room culture is hardly a place to look and say "well if they're ok with it, we should be too".

[Freyr]

 

Pooooooooooor Chapman!!! Won't anyone think of the man that just served a domestic violence suspension and at a minimum fired a gun eight times in his garage scaring his girlfriend into hiding in the bushes?! And, according to her initial story, choked her and pushed her against a wall? So mistreated!

 

You were there for the whole thing and know exactly what happened? that's fascinating please continue to tell us all about it. I hate that people assume whatever a woman says to the police is 100% accurate. What he said happened and what she said happened were very different stories. I'm not saying he didn't do anything wrong but Jesus you weren't there how the hell do you know what went down? Reporters weren't there either. There's a reason why the police didn't pursue the case. I don't feel sorry for either one of them, they had issues, they worked them out apparently. I don't care what happened in their personal life. Frankly I don't think anyone needs to be judging the guy. He went through the legal and baseball judgement and served a suspension. Nothing is going to change what happened. He's here now, probably only for a few months. Enjoy his pitching dominance and move on.

 

I'm too busy at work today to tear into this appropriately, but I'll just say that you need to read more about domestic violence, why victims don't report or retract their reports, and why they stay with abusers.

 

It's far more important than baseball.

 

Or his girlfriend is crazy and was reacting to possibly finding out he was texting another girl (seems childish I know). No one knows anything other than the people at the scene. It's day 3 of Chapman trade being done, move on with your lives and don't cheer him on when he's saving this team. And yea they do need saving, they really have played awful since June

[davell]

 

Players being ok with it doesn't mean much to me. Sports culture is ok with a lot things that society at large isn't, or shouldn't, be ok with.

 

The players and the business are more important than we are. If a guy is eligible to play and is good enough to play, my guess is any team would employ him if it helps them win.

 

This isn't a "would" conversation though. It's a "should" conversation.

 

The only baseball discussion to be had here is whether the price was too high or not. The team is most assuredly better with Chapman on the team.

 

But saying "well if we didn't, some other team would have" doesn't absolve the moral dilemma that comes with this acquisition.

 

That's a great point. I guess I just don't think its reasonable to expect my teams to behave differently than others. That may very well be a fault of mine.

[Sammy Sofa]

They've struggled only in part due to relief pitching; how is a reliever going to "save the team?"

[Sammy Sofa]

Or his girlfriend is crazy and was reacting to possibly finding out he was texting another girl (seems childish I know). No one knows anything other than the people at the scene.

 

So what you're positing is that Chapman is actually so noble because he was so terrified by his crazed girlfriend he had no choice but to start blasting off a gun to protect himself?

[Freyr]

They've struggled only in part due to relief pitching; how is a reliever going to "save the team?"

 

Have you seen how many games the bullpen has either blown a lead between innings 6-7, or when Rondon chokes? I know the stats say Rondon has been great, but my goodness he is awful in major spots. Chapman is nearly unhittable, I could see him coming in and getting those 2 inning saves Rondon could never nail down.

[jersey cubs fan]

They've struggled only in part due to relief pitching; how is a reliever going to "save the team?"

 

Have you seen how many games the bullpen has either blown a lead between innings 6-7, or when Rondon chokes? I know the stats say Rondon has been great, but my goodness he is awful in major spots. Chapman is nearly unhittable, I could see him coming in and getting those 2 inning saves Rondon could never nail down.

you don't understand things

[Banedon]

Or his girlfriend is crazy and was reacting to possibly finding out he was texting another girl (seems childish I know). No one knows anything other than the people at the scene.

 

So what you're positing is that Chapman is actually so noble because he was so terrified by his crazed girlfriend he had no choice but to start blasting off a gun to protect himself?

 

Gotta scare off the wolves somehow.

[Freyr]

Or his girlfriend is crazy and was reacting to possibly finding out he was texting another girl (seems childish I know). No one knows anything other than the people at the scene.

 

So what you're positing is that Chapman is actually so noble because he was so terrified by his crazed girlfriend he had no choice but to start blasting off a gun to protect himself?

No not at all, I'm throwing out another scenario in what could have went down, since I provided a link yesterday with details of what happened. He didn't choke her, that's clear enough. He also fired a gun in the garage after the girlfriend had ran off already. Stop making it out to be he was firing a gun at her. That's absolutely absurd