Cubs add Chapman for Torres, et al. imb wishes we paid more

[SRQCub]

The playoffs might be a crapshoot, but I have a hard time believing that having a guy like Aroldis Chapman in your bullpen doesn't move the needle. Just one inning, or even one batter, could make all the difference in a playoff series.

 

Going into a series and not having to worry about facing Chapman and Ken Janssen at the end of the Dodgers pen, for example, is something you'd have a hard time putting a value on, though that value would be HIGH.

[Thrilho]

Would making one trade that included Archer and Colome count as one move?

 

i guess it comes down to that either A.) wasn't an option or B.) the front office determined those two werent worth the asking price. im ok with either

 

Yeah, at the end of the day, Theo is incredibly good at his job, and that's basically the trump card in any argument on this. But I think everyone here realizes the answer to Tim's original question is that it doesn't move the needle much at all, nor would any realistic trade, for this year's World Series. And assuming this trade doesn't come with an extension, there's no way it makes us better from 2017 on, so it just strikes me as contradictory to Theo's stated goal of 'making the playoffs as many times as possible'. Obviously he thought the slight uptick this year was worth any potential sacrifice down the road. We'll see how it goes. And, as others have said, this is before all the personal [expletive].

If everyone here believed this trade doesn't move the needle much at all for 2016 then there would be no debate. Without an extension, we'd all be coming down hard on the "against" side.

 

Right now I'm not buying the 2%, similar to how I don't buy that the Cubs chances of winning the division are 95%. These aggregate stats are a nice guy but I think the actual value is way more nuanced than some people are making it out to be.

 

A true shutdown back end to a bullpen can change a series in a lot of ways. And having a lefty to go in to own Harper and Murphy would be real nice.

[JennieGarthAlgar]

I like that Chapman is only 28. Let's get him locked up...

 

...in jail!

 

-half of the posters here

 

Hahaha, it's funny when people have a moral objection to a guy being on their favorite baseball team that is a domestic violence incident in his recent history.

 

Good one.

 

It was more commentary on the horse being beaten to death in this thread. Someone made a suggestion to have a Chapman: Good Baseball Player and a Chapman: Awful Human Being thread, which I thought was a good idea.

[squally1313]

I hope the World Series clinching game is such a full on dong assault that David Ross pitches the last inning so I don't have to see Chapman's stupid d-bag face be the one everyone converges on.

[Cubbie Swagger]

BTW, if the forum hadn't crashed, I could pull up my post from the off-season (before the domestic violence thing) where I said the Cubs needed a proven dominant closer like Aroldis Chapman to shut folks down in the playoffs. I said that I didn't feel confident in our bullpen. The general consensus seemed to be that our bullpen was very good and that it didn't make sense to spend big money on a closer when we already have Rondon.

 

http://img.pandawhale.com/133519-billy-madison-I-am-the-smartes-3NB4.gif

Either that, or I'm just not always wrong, which seems to be the popular opinion here.

[Agony and Ivy]

BTW, if the forum hadn't crashed, I could pull up my post from the off-season (before the domestic violence thing) where I said the Cubs needed a proven dominant closer like Aroldis Chapman to shut folks down in the playoffs. I said that I didn't feel confident in our bullpen. The general consensus seemed to be that our bullpen was very good and that it didn't make sense to spend big money on a closer when we already have Rondon.

 

This is still incorrect thinking.

[David]

I hope the World Series clinching game is such a full on dong assault that David Ross pitches the last inning so I don't have to see Chapman's stupid d-bag face be the one everyone converges on.

 

arrieta cgso, 5-0.

[Banedon]

 

...in jail!

 

-half of the posters here

 

Hahaha, it's funny when people have a moral objection to a guy being on their favorite baseball team that is a domestic violence incident in his recent history.

 

Good one.

 

It was more commentary on the horse being beaten to death in this thread. Someone made a suggestion to have a Chapman: Good Baseball Player and a Chapman: Awful Human Being thread, which I thought was a good idea.

 

It's a terrible idea. That just make it easier to ignore the things that make him a terrible human, and those things shouldn't be ignored.

[squally1313]

BTW, if the forum hadn't crashed, I could pull up my post from the off-season (before the domestic violence thing) where I said the Cubs needed a proven dominant closer like Aroldis Chapman to shut folks down in the playoffs. I said that I didn't feel confident in our bullpen. The general consensus seemed to be that our bullpen was very good and that it didn't make sense to spend big money on a closer when we already have Rondon.

 

Very true, but large gif

Either that, or I'm just not always wrong, which seems to be the popular opinion here.

 

I'm probably doing this wrong, but based on this link I'm not sure you said what you thought you said.

 

http://www.northsidebaseball.com/archive/search.php?keywords=chapman&terms=all&author=cubbie+swagger&sc=1&sf=all&sr=posts&sk=t&sd=d&st=0&ch=300&t=0&submit=Search

 

Edit: Alright the most damning post looks like it was actually a quote from Sofa, but the maybe one post you could point to came in September before two rounds of playoff series in which Chapman would have made absolutely zero difference one way or another.

Edited July 25, 2016 by squally1313

[Banedon]

Either that, or I'm just not always wrong, which seems to be the popular opinion here.

 

Whatever rep you have, you've earned.

[BigSlick]

BTW, if the forum hadn't crashed, I could pull up my post from the off-season (before the domestic violence thing) where I said the Cubs needed a proven dominant closer like Aroldis Chapman to shut folks down in the playoffs. I said that I didn't feel confident in our bullpen. The general consensus seemed to be that our bullpen was very good and that it didn't make sense to spend big money on a closer when we already have Rondon.

I like Duke's post about how if we had Chapman last year it would have made exactly zero difference in the series against the Mets

 

There are tons of situations where having another shutdown reliever doesn't move the needled at all - like if you're blowing out your opponent, or you're being blown out.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

I hope the World Series clinching game is such a full on dong assault that David Ross pitches the last inning so I don't have to see Chapman's stupid d-bag face be the one everyone converges on.

 

arrieta cgso, 5-0.

it'd be more of a FU to baseball if it was Hendricks and game 4

[JennieGarthAlgar]

 

Hahaha, it's funny when people have a moral objection to a guy being on their favorite baseball team that is a domestic violence incident in his recent history.

 

Good one.

 

It was more commentary on the horse being beaten to death in this thread. Someone made a suggestion to have a Chapman: Good Baseball Player and a Chapman: Awful Human Being thread, which I thought was a good idea.

 

It's a terrible idea. That just make it easier to ignore the things that make him a terrible human, and those things shouldn't be ignored.

 

I just think its weird how much some of you guys despise this guy when our ownership, front office, management, players, MLB and even his girlfriend can seem to forgive him and give him a second chance. I want world peace too, but I won't hold my breath.

 

And honestly, look at the pictures. This wasn't a Chris Brown/Rihanna situation. Doesn't excuse it, but some of you guys act like he should be castrated or something.

Edited July 25, 2016 by JennieGarthAlgar

[minnesotacubsfan]

Those of you slitting your wrists over losing Torres....you realize the Yankees will be ecstatic if he ends up being as good as Javy Baez...OUR SECOND BEST SHORTSTOP.

 

:flythew: :flythew: :flythew:

 

 

This effects 3 innings, 7-8-9

[Brian]

those that peruse the Cardinals forums, what are their reactions?

[BrockLanders]

I am excited to watch him pitch

 

[Ding Dong Johnson]

those that peruse the Cardinals forums, what are their reactions?

[UMFan83]

those that peruse the Cardinals forums, what are their reactions?

 

Similar to the discussions we're having:

 

-Did the Cubs overpay for a rental

-I wouldn't want the Cardinals to acquire a guy with his background

-Wish he wasn't coming back to the NL

-Guess the Cubs are completely going for it

[treebird]

TWO MAIN TAKEAWAYS

 

ONE

i understand "well this is the market," but if this is the market for two months of a reliever, years of a starter is going to be even more nightmarish. we are most likely going to have to make one of those trades eventually (and could have right now). not having torres will make that harder. i agree that he's overrated and blocked, but if other teams value him highly, i wish we would have used him to get someone at a more important position who will be around for longer.

 

TWO

i'm also honestly just really disappointed that our big deadline acquisition is a piece of horsefeathers who abuses women. this is supposed to be fun and i was all excited to see what cool new player got added to the team. now it's a guy who i wish was in prison. this absolutely makes this team and this season less fun for me. i'm not going to stop watching, but i'm already dreading the conversations with my mom and my girlfriend about the new cub everyone is so excited about.

[Post Count Padder]

those that peruse the Cardinals forums, what are their reactions?

 

Similar to the discussions we're having:

 

-Did the Cubs overpay for a rental

-I wouldn't want the Cardinals to acquire a guy with his background

-Wish he wasn't coming back to the NL

-Guess the Cubs are completely going for it

 

:lol:

[Schwarber Fan]

those that peruse the Cardinals forums, what are their reactions?

 

Similar to the discussions we're having:

 

-Did the Cubs overpay for a rental

-I wouldn't want the Cardinals to acquire a guy with his background

-Wish he wasn't coming back to the NL

-Guess the Cubs are completely going for it

 

:lol:

 

This. Lmao.

[UMFan83]

those that peruse the Cardinals forums, what are their reactions?

 

Similar to the discussions we're having:

 

-Did the Cubs overpay for a rental

-I wouldn't want the Cardinals to acquire a guy with his background

-Wish he wasn't coming back to the NL

-Guess the Cubs are completely going for it

 

:lol:

 

haha I knew someone would pounce on that line.

[Gmoney08]

So around twitter and on the radio today everyone is saying Cubs land their new closer Aroldis Chapman.

 

I think the Cubs should be using Chapman as the ultimate fireman in the highest leverage situations & against stud lefties. Inning be damned. If its the 9th then well its the 9th.

 

The Cubs blowout so many teams it would be pretty meh to only use him as a closer, look at that stretch where Rondon was barely ever pitching except to get some reps in a game up by 5 runs.

 

I want to use our shiny toy when the games are on the line, whether its the 6th with bases loaded no outs, 8th inning in a 1 run game, etc.

[Bryants Disco Ball]

 

Very true, but large gif

Either that, or I'm just not always wrong, which seems to be the popular opinion here.

 

I'm probably doing this wrong, but based on this link I'm not sure you said what you thought you said.

 

http://www.northsidebaseball.com/archive/search.php?keywords=chapman&terms=all&author=cubbie+swagger&sc=1&sf=all&sr=posts&sk=t&sd=d&st=0&ch=300&t=0&submit=Search

 

Edit: Alright the most damning post looks like it was actually a quote from Sofa, but the maybe one post you could point to came in September before two rounds of playoff series in which Chapman would have made absolutely zero difference one way or another.

 

Just read the thread and came away curious about something: who was Tom before he was Tom? Sounds like he was infamous at one point.

[SCCubbieFAN]

IMO, not having to FACE Chapman in the playoffs or the WS is the part of this deal that can't be measured but could very well be the most valuable part of it.