Cardinals Not Pursuing Major Position FA?

[David]

Fully copping to stealing this post from GRB's Fat Strat, quotes and all...

 

 

http://www.stltoday.com/sports/baseball/professional/mozeliak-says-cards-no-longer-looking-for-dynamic-signing/article_0fc30cae-22ef-594a-9561-a911b7019a9e.html

 

Cardinals general manager John Mozeliak, two days removed from Jason Heyward’s decision to sign with the rival Chicago Cubs, said Sunday that his front office does not intend to speed after another a free-agent outfielder or the next available slugger. The club prefers at this point to turn right field over to rookie Stephen Piscotty and lean on other young or returning players. The Cardinals remain involved in the market for pitching, either a starter or a bullpen arm.

 

“We still feel like from what we’ve been trying to do and been through this winter allows us ways to improve,” Mozeliak said. “It’s clear now this offseason is not going to have that dynamic signing that we tried to do with (David) Price and Heyward. There isn’t anything now that we’re chasing with a nine-figure contract. We can take the time to see what we have in the players we control. Obviously, we’re always open to adjusting.”

 

Gordon -- not an option

The Cardinals, for example, don’t see free-agent Alex Gordon as an alternative for Heyward just as they didn’t rush into the sweepstakes for Zack Greinke when Price chose Boston.

 

Upton -- might be an option if his market falls significantly

Other free agents in the market, such as power options Chris Davis and Justin Upton, are seeking deals at this point that would also take long-term commitments, the types of which the Cardinals have avoided. The market could bend back toward the Cardinals, but it would take time and the club intends to use its depth for leverage. Upton, at 28, is arguably a fit, but any interest the Cardinals have is tempered by how they view the outfielders already on the roster: specifically Piscotty, Randal Grichuk, and Brandon Moss.

[minnesotacubsfan]

Is Piscotty going to be good? Or, expected to be?

[Guest]

Is Piscotty going to be good? Or, expected to be?

 

so far he's following the usual course of pretty decent prospect who comes up to the big leagues and rakes even more than in the minors, but that was with a .372 babip

[minnesotacubsfan]

Cardinal dust?

[XZero771679666304]

I have to think that a lot of this is just posturing on Mozeliak's part. There's no doubt that the phone started ringing off of the hook after they lost out on Price, and even more after Heyward. They've talked about their new resources, and agents are no doubt eager to get in on it now, hoping the Cards will act out of desperation.

 

I have a hard time imagining that they won't sign at least one of the remaining upper tier FAs. If they don't, that's fine by me; that would be a huge gamble.

[Guest]

I have to think that a lot of this is just posturing on Mozeliak's part. There's no doubt that the phone started ringing off of the hook after they lost out on Price, and even more after Heyward. They've talked about their new resources, and agents are no doubt eager to get in on it now, hoping the Cards will act out of desperation.

 

I have a hard time imagining that they won't sign at least one of the remaining upper tier FAs. If they don't, that's fine by me; that would be a huge gamble.

I agree.I think Chris Davis will play for them next year. They have to find some power from somewhere.

[XZero771679666304]

I don't think it'll be Davis, the cost is high, and his performance has been volatile.

 

I think it'll be Alex Gordon. He has Cardinal written all over him. As for power, I think they're banking on a healthy Adams and Holliday, as well as a potential rebound from Gyorko. Plus Carpenter ad a breakout power season last year. I think Alex Gordon and a farewell season from Mark Buehrle would be a likely scenario.

[Cubswin11]

Is Piscotty going to be good? Or, expected to be?

If you ask Cardinals fans he should've finished #2 in ROY behind the winner, Grichuck

[Guest]

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[mul21]

I kind of believe that they won't chase any of the remaining FAs. I especially don't buy into the Davis hype and would be surprised if they took a chance on Gordon, unless his asking price comes down to 4 years max. I'd bet on a trade for a bat that can play RF or CF (there are CarGo and Blackmon rumors floating around) that would shift Grichuk to RF and Piscotty to mainly 1B and either Adams or Moss being there part time as well. Likely a 4 man rotation for CF, RF, and 1B at that point with built in Holliday insurance since he's been so brittle. I just can't possibly imagine them going into the season with as little offense as they've got right now and expecting to win enough to get into the playoffs.

[hawkeyecub]

I saw something Friday night that linked them to Fowler after losing on Heyward so this makes me happy.

[Aaron_Kennelly]

How, exactly, do they plan on catching back up with us? All of the remaining pitching options kinda suck. If they are standing pat with their position players and add a Mike Leake, we probably enter the season as the favorite by about ten games.

[Guest]

I kind of believe that they won't chase any of the remaining FAs. I especially don't buy into the Davis hype and would be surprised if they took a chance on Gordon, unless his asking price comes down to 4 years max. I'd bet on a trade for a bat that can play RF or CF (there are CarGo and Blackmon rumors floating around) that would shift Grichuk to RF and Piscotty to mainly 1B and either Adams or Moss being there part time as well. Likely a 4 man rotation for CF, RF, and 1B at that point with built in Holliday insurance since he's been so brittle. I just can't possibly imagine them going into the season with as little offense as they've got right now and expecting to win enough to get into the playoffs.

 

yeah. i could believe it. they've been stubborn enough about not crossing their self-imposed line of what is reasonable with FAs before and it has worked out for them, so i could see them trying to keep that going.

 

trade for one of those guys seems likely, though.

[Gilby]

Nightengale is going to get off writing about how the Cardinals "stick to their guns" and are so disciplined when it comes to free agency this spring when everyone else is writing about how awesome the Cubs are.

[minnesotacubsfan]

Let them stick to their guns, they can be our AAAA team

[Guest]

Nightengale is going to get off writing about how the Cardinals "stick to their guns" and are so disciplined when it comes to free agency this spring when everyone else is writing about how awesome the Cubs are.

That Narrative rings hollow.

[Guest]

The Cardinals are in a weird spot. They have position players who project to be average at every position(there isn't a hole like CF was for the Cubs until last week), but it's mostly divided into players who are in a decline phase(Molina, Peralta, Holliday) or those who haven't played enough to be certain that they can provide above average production(Piscotty, Grichuk, possibly Wong). As a result there's not a slam dunk move they can make on offense to add value like the Cubs just did with Heyward. They can add Chris Davis but if he's replacing a quasi-platoon made of Moss/Adams/Gyorko/Piscotty/Pham then the upgrade isn't as large, and that goes even more so for any outfield acquisitions.

 

The starting pitching is more of the same, there's not a single pitcher that they can feel great about being able to get 30+ starts from, but they have an abundance of decent or better options in Wainwright, Martinez, Wacha, Garcia, Gonzales, etc. They'll probably add a SP instead of a position player because Gonzales/Cooney/Lyons is weaker as a 5 starter than the position player alternatives. In the end though, that's not going to be what bridges the gap, they need to make sure that all of Wong, Grichuk, and Piscotty all pan out like Carpenter, Craig, and Freese did, otherwise that offense could get ugly in a hurry with the over 30 guys continuing to trend down.

[toonsterwu]

To piggyback off the above, their system is also in a decline right now (granted the entirety of the minors is weaker than in years past, partly due to the changes in how organizations manage their young talent, and also because, well, there were massive graduations last year - very few systems look strong compared to the recent past). There are still some intriguing arms, but few arms with good ceilings that are above "lottery ticket" status (really, if we're being honest, it's only Reyes, as Flaherty/Gonzalez/Weaver have modest ceilings, best case, mid-rotation type arm ceilings but even then, that's debatable). There are few positional assets of note, and most are too far away (Tilson seems like he could step in sooner than later). The lack of close to ready positional assets is why I thought they might go all-out on a short-term deal for Heyward, to bridge the gap for when their positional assets are ready.

 

Realistically, they should take the first half of the season to assess where they are. The combination of aging core and unknown youth (as TT noted), plus that they are coming off a 100 win season), affords them that opportunity. That said, if things go sideways, they really should sell at the deadline. The Cardinals being the Cardinals, they probably aren't going to massively tank and rebuild, but the thing about having an all-around decent roster is that you can likely garner good returns for your solid assets, still field a solid team, and look to build from there. The margin of error is slimmer, but they can probably try that route and hope some current prospects develop. I mean, it's not hard to imagine Trevor Rosenthal netting them a huge return at the deadline, and they can go with Tuivailala as the closer and see if he works. It's not hard to see one of their solid and steady SP arms perhaps being an intriguing asset at the deadline. With the money influx they supposedly have, they can start saving towards making aggressive moves in the next two off-seasons.

 

All in all, I agree with Mozeliak's direction here, if that is the case. I think it would, instead, by a mistake if they aggressively pursue FA's on the board. Now ... if they can pry away some young asset for a team (I see Cardinals fans dreaming about Machado) that might be a different story, but I think it's going to be tough for that to occur).

[SouthSideRyan]

I mean, I'd love for the Cardinals to sell off and focus on 2018 for some reason, but I just don't see it as remotely realistic.

[UK1679666180]

To piggyback off the above, their system is also in a decline right now (granted the entirety of the minors is weaker than in years past, partly due to the changes in how organizations manage their young talent, and also because, well, there were massive graduations last year - very few systems look strong compared to the recent past). There are still some intriguing arms, but few arms with good ceilings that are above "lottery ticket" status (really, if we're being honest, it's only Reyes, as Flaherty/Gonzalez/Weaver have modest ceilings, best case, mid-rotation type arm ceilings but even then, that's debatable). There are few positional assets of note, and most are too far away (Tilson seems like he could step in sooner than later). The lack of close to ready positional assets is why I thought they might go all-out on a short-term deal for Heyward, to bridge the gap for when their positional assets are ready.

 

Realistically, they should take the first half of the season to assess where they are. The combination of aging core and unknown youth (as TT noted), plus that they are coming off a 100 win season), affords them that opportunity. That said, if things go sideways, they really should sell at the deadline. The Cardinals being the Cardinals, they probably aren't going to massively tank and rebuild, but the thing about having an all-around decent roster is that you can likely garner good returns for your solid assets, still field a solid team, and look to build from there. The margin of error is slimmer, but they can probably try that route and hope some current prospects develop. I mean, it's not hard to imagine Trevor Rosenthal netting them a huge return at the deadline, and they can go with Tuivailala as the closer and see if he works. It's not hard to see one of their solid and steady SP arms perhaps being an intriguing asset at the deadline. With the money influx they supposedly have, they can start saving towards making aggressive moves in the next two off-seasons.

 

All in all, I agree with Mozeliak's direction here, if that is the case. I think it would, instead, by a mistake if they aggressively pursue FA's on the board. Now ... if they can pry away some young asset for a team (I see Cardinals fans dreaming about Machado) that might be a different story, but I think it's going to be tough for that to occur).

 

Don't count on Tilson, I have been watching him since his Soph season in HS. I told my boss, he's more Sam Fuld than Jacoby Ellsbury. If he's anything above a 4th OF'er, Id be shocked.

[toonsterwu]

I don't really think Tilson's best case is anymore than a 4th OF, but he's really one of their few upper level young-ish positional assets that seem to have any sort of hope.

[Guest]

Looks like if/when this Iwakuma deal falls though over the failed physical, the Dodgers are going to ramp up their pursuit of Mike Leake, who the Cardinals were hoping to get.

[Gingerballs Lives]

Looks like there are going to be some unmanned clouds in baseball heaven this year :hello:

[StylesClash]

Have the Cardinals been linked to Chris Davis since Baltimore apparently pulled their offer? If Davis were added to their lineup, it still wouldn't be as deep as ours, their middle of the order would certainly stack up well.

 

Also who will be competing for their fifth starters job besides Lyons?

[UMFan83]