Samardzija trade rumors

[Guest]

I think I saw a quote yesterday from someone within their org saying they're excited about the youngsters and won't be dealing them for help now.

Yeah - I think they are realistic enough to know they can't really hang with the big boys given their current roster.

[Clem Fandango]

I think I saw a quote yesterday from someone within their org saying they're excited about the youngsters and won't be dealing them for help now.

 

[muntjack]

Something something Jason Heyward.

[toonsterwu]

So...

 

Of all the contending teams, Baltimore has had the worst starting pitching. By Far. They clearly haven't trusted Gausman to be a solution to their problem, either, as they've been shuttling him back and forth to AAA all year long. Bundy is coming back off surgery and won't be someone they can rely upon for big innings this year.

 

They might get desperate enough to deal two of Bundy/Gausman/Harvey. I get a feeling they'll target more of a Feldman-type upgrade where they don't have to give those guys up, though.

 

Baltimore's starting pitching has been ... more productive over the past month (ERA is down, but the advanced metrics are still bad). They aren't about to move Bundy, from everything that's been speculated upon here. Speculation seems to be that Gausman is close to untouchable as well, as they are just biding time to give him a full-time slot. I think in the right deal, they might move Gausman, but I doubt it would be Gausman and more for Samardzija (personally, I'm actually not that against a Gausman for Samardzija type deal ... dunno if either side would do it, though ... but I think Gausman has mysteriously dropped off the radar of young pitching excitement for some reason (I guess his struggles last year?), but nothing seems to suggest a need to be grossly worried yet).

 

I think they would easily listen on Rodriguez and Harvey, and honestly, if they offered those two in a package, I think I would be open to it. Right now, last word out was that they aren't going to trade 2 of their Big 4, but they have a great shot at the east this year, so my guess is push come to shove, they might consider it. Honestly, I like the idea of Rodriguez and Harvey for more than Sanchez (who I was big on once upon a time) and Norris.

 

Thing is, Tillman's velocity creeped back up last time out. If he is back in the low-mid 90's with the breaking ball, he might turn his season around enough that, combined with Chen, and along with Gonzalez/Norris being decent, they might not feel an urge to go over-board. Granted, the last time they had a big 4 in pitching, 3 of them never became starters, so maybe that changes the calculus a bit. I really don't expect them to make a move until late, though, as I think they are going to bide their time to see if Ubaldo can turn it around, see if Miguel can find his form, and see what Tillman's velocity is at. That's probably at least going to take us to mid-late July.

[Guest]

Would Theo trade Shark to the Cardinals?

[Tangled Up in Plaid]

Would Theo trade Shark to the Cardinals?

If we got back all their best prospects.

[Guest]

So...

 

Of all the contending teams, Baltimore has had the worst starting pitching. By Far. They clearly haven't trusted Gausman to be a solution to their problem, either, as they've been shuttling him back and forth to AAA all year long. Bundy is coming back off surgery and won't be someone they can rely upon for big innings this year.

 

They might get desperate enough to deal two of Bundy/Gausman/Harvey. I get a feeling they'll target more of a Feldman-type upgrade where they don't have to give those guys up, though.

 

Baltimore's starting pitching has been ... more productive over the past month (ERA is down, but the advanced metrics are still bad). They aren't about to move Bundy, from everything that's been speculated upon here. Speculation seems to be that Gausman is close to untouchable as well, as they are just biding time to give him a full-time slot. I think in the right deal, they might move Gausman, but I doubt it would be Gausman and more for Samardzija (personally, I'm actually not that against a Gausman for Samardzija type deal ... dunno if either side would do it, though ... but I think Gausman has mysteriously dropped off the radar of young pitching excitement for some reason (I guess his struggles last year?), but nothing seems to suggest a need to be grossly worried yet).

 

I think they would easily listen on Rodriguez and Harvey, and honestly, if they offered those two in a package, I think I would be open to it. Right now, last word out was that they aren't going to trade 2 of their Big 4, but they have a great shot at the east this year, so my guess is push come to shove, they might consider it. Honestly, I like the idea of Rodriguez and Harvey for more than Sanchez (who I was big on once upon a time) and Norris.

 

Thing is, Tillman's velocity creeped back up last time out. If he is back in the low-mid 90's with the breaking ball, he might turn his season around enough that, combined with Chen, and along with Gonzalez/Norris being decent, they might not feel an urge to go over-board. Granted, the last time they had a big 4 in pitching, 3 of them never became starters, so maybe that changes the calculus a bit. I really don't expect them to make a move until late, though, as I think they are going to bide their time to see if Ubaldo can turn it around, see if Miguel can find his form, and see what Tillman's velocity is at. That's probably at least going to take us to mid-late July.

Thanks for the more detailed breakdown. It wouldn't be outlandish to see them make a big move and spend a couple of their big three (I'm not a big fan of Rodriguez). I just don't expect them to make that big of a splash.

 

I guess if:

- the team as a whole is playing well

- Tillman, in particular, falls on his face and

- Gausman is erratic

they may consider it. It just isn't very likely.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

Would Theo trade Shark to the Cardinals?

 

If he would, that's a huge "don't care about 2015" sign.

[Guest]

Would Theo trade Shark to the Cardinals?

Sure. Taveras and Wacha makes it a done deal.

[Guest]

Would Theo trade Shark to the Cardinals?

 

If he would, that's a huge "don't care about 2015" sign.

Sure. Taveras and Wacha makes it a done deal. And makes us much better in 2015.

 

But the Cards would never do it.

[Guest]

Would Theo trade Shark to the Cardinals?

If we got back all their best prospects.

I they're going to need pitching. I can imagine the heat though.

[sneakypower]

i'd be fine with Gonzales/Martinez, Alex Reyes, Kelly/Grichuk/Ramsey

 

give 'em Wright, if they need to back-fill C-Mart

[Guest]

i'd be fine with Gonzales/Martinez, Alex Reyes, Kelly/Grichuk/Ramsey

 

Miller, Martinez, and one of their OF glut at AAA/MLB.

[sneakypower]

Shelby Miller feels like Jeremy Hellickson from a couple years ago, where you know they'd like to move on, but they'll always command way too much to actually make it happen

 

(and he might really be kind of bad)

Edited June 24, 2014 by sneakypower

[Guest]

Shelby Miller feels like Jeremy Hellickson from a couple years ago, where you know they'd like to move on, but they'll always command way too much to actually make it happen

 

Probably, which is too bad because they have the right combo of talent, MLB readiness, and doubt about that talent(Miller's 2014, Martinez as SP or RP) to make something happen. For one data point, the folks at GRB were not enthused about such a package being needed, some insisting that Miller was better and/or more valuable than Shark alone.

[Guest]

Shelby Miller feels like Jeremy Hellickson from a couple years ago, where you know they'd like to move on, but they'll always command way too much to actually make it happen

 

(and he might really be kind of bad)

What has happened to him this year? He's changed his pitch mix a fair amount but hasn't lost appreciable velocity.

[sneakypower]

fwiw, Dave Cameron thinks he's broken

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/shelby-miller-looks-broken/

 

(from April, but he's stuck to it when asked more recently)

[Guest]

fwiw, Dave Cameron thinks he's broken

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/shelby-miller-looks-broken/

 

(from April, but he's stuck to it when asked more recently)

Interesting.

[imb]

could we have more than two games of early april data for this year please

[Deeg]

So...

 

Of all the contending teams, Baltimore has had the worst starting pitching. By Far. They clearly haven't trusted Gausman to be a solution to their problem, either, as they've been shuttling him back and forth to AAA all year long. Bundy is coming back off surgery and won't be someone they can rely upon for big innings this year.

 

They might get desperate enough to deal two of Bundy/Gausman/Harvey. I get a feeling they'll target more of a Feldman-type upgrade where they don't have to give those guys up, though.

 

They've only been shuttling Gausman because they can do so with no downside - he's a part of their short-term plans.

 

If folks think Sanchez, Norris and Pompey is short, it really does seem as if expectations are unrealistic because of the Garza overpay. Sanchez has warts, but his stuff is truly elite - and you're getting another TORP prospect and a multi-tool switch-hitting CF who draws walks. That's a good deal. Would I rather have Bundy, Harvey and extras? Yeah - but I very much doubt that happens.

[Guest]

Even leaving aside Sanchez's control issues(which alone are a big big problem that may put reliever ceiling on him), he can't strike people out. Couldn't strike out A-ball hitters in the FSL, or AA hitters in the EL, or AAA hitters in the IL. He's the prototype for the over-rated prospect. A pitcher, one without any semblance of control, and one who can't even get swings and misses, AND who's already had hints of injury(shoulder, blister) problems. He's a lottery ticket, and not even a particularly good one. We got a better one last year in Black, because while he can't throw strikes he'll at least generate Ks.

 

If thinking that we're settling for dreck like Sanchez as a big chunk of the return for Samardzija makes me unrealistic, then we should be riding out his contract next year and taking the pick. Samardzija's been one of the 15 best pitchers in MLB this year, has frontline stuff, a 'young' arm, is injury free, and is 1.5 years from free agency(meaning you get Shark + a first rounder when you trade for him). It's bad enough that our curse is that we have to target the most overrated commodity in the game in return, even in the face of pitcher's dying in the streets multiple times a week people don't seem to get how much less value unproven pitchers have compared to hitters. Especially in this run environment.

 

/rant off

[Andy]

Couldn't have put it any better TT. Totally agreed.

[Guest]

Even leaving aside Sanchez's control issues(which alone are a big big problem that may put reliever ceiling on him), he can't strike people out. Couldn't strike out A-ball hitters in the FSL, or AA hitters in the EL, or AAA hitters in the IL. He's the prototype for the over-rated prospect. A pitcher, one without any semblance of control, and one who can't even get swings and misses, AND who's already had hints of injury(shoulder, blister) problems. He's a lottery ticket, and not even a particularly good one. We got a better one last year in Black, because while he can't throw strikes he'll at least generate Ks.

 

If thinking that settling for dreck like Sanchez as a big chunk of the return for Samardzija makes me unrealistic, then we should be riding out his contract next year and taking the pick. Samardzija's been one of the 15 best pitchers in MLB this year, has frontline stuff, a 'young' arm, is injury free, and is 1.5 years from free agency(meaning you get Shark + a first rounder when you trade for him). It's bad enough that our curse is that we have to target the most overrated commodity in the game in return, even in the face of pitcher's dying in the streets multiple times a week people don't seem to get how much less value unproven pitchers have compared to hitters. Especially in this run environment.

 

/rant off

Hey, my favorite package is one that includes Betts.

[davell]

Taijuan Walker is 94-96 in the 7th inning in his first start back.

[Guest]

Taijuan Walker is 94-96 in the 7th inning in his first start back.

ok...that's not bad