Castro

[Guest]

Also mostly irrelevant because, as has been said, established players just don't get moved off their position for rookies unless there is a vast difference in defensive abilities.

 

Which there clearly is between Russell and Castro. Baez is a better SS too, but Russell is clearly the best of the three. A few errors made playing out of position don't change that - it's like saying Mirotic sucks based on what he did when Thibs had him playing SF.

 

There clearly is a vast difference? Those are strong words you're using.

[Sammy Sofa]

It's flat-out bizarre how many Cubs fans seem to buy the "Castro is a terrible SS" narrative. The only way he gets moved off of SS is if he's traded or if Baez or Russell are drastically better...and they're not. Established players are not moved for rookies because of negligible defensive differences.

[Sammy Sofa]

Also mostly irrelevant because, as has been said, established players just don't get moved off their position for rookies unless there is a vast difference in defensive abilities.

 

Which there clearly is between Russell and Castro. Baez is a better SS too, but Russell is clearly the best of the three. A few errors made playing out of position don't change that - it's like saying Mirotic sucks based on what he did when Thibs had him playing SF.

 

There clearly is a vast difference? Those are strong words you're using.

 

And he dismisses Russell's errors as just being because he's out of position...so does he think Russell's SS defense is so much better that it would offset all of the errors Castro would then be making since he's apparently so much worse AND would be playing out of position?

[Guest]

Basically if you have like Andrelton or even Lindor, you make that switch. Baez and Russell are not that. They've both had questions about sticking at SS themselves from time to time. Neither is some crazy good impact SS in the field.

 

I'm not saying Russell doesn't end up supplanting Castro at SS by one way or another, but that's not a move you make right now.

[Gilby]

even with the small sample size Russells UZR is way better than Castros

 

Russell's had TWO chances at shortstop at the major league level.

 

And Deeg - you have no idea if Baez AND Russell are better shortstops. Baez may be more "athletic" but he's much less sure-handed than Castro. Russell, I don't know enough about.

[SouthSideRyan]

even with the small sample size Russells UZR is way better than Castros

 

lolol

[treebird]

even with the small sample size Russells UZR is way better than Castros

 

excluding things like when people (mr) post the n word or claim evolution isn't real, this might legitimately be the worst post anyone has ever made here.

[Deeg]

even with the small sample size Russells UZR is way better than Castros

 

Russell's had TWO chances at shortstop at the major league level.

 

And Deeg - you have no idea if Baez AND Russell are better shortstops. Baez may be more "athletic" but he's much less sure-handed than Castro. Russell, I don't know enough about.

 

If you don't trust the virtually unanimous opinion of scouts, trust your eyes. We've seen plenty enough of both Russell and Baez at SS to see that they're substantially better than Castro. Russell has much better range and hands, Baez slightly better range and a much stronger arm. If Castro were a star, I could see the case for not wanting to rock the boat - but this is a guy with a lifetime .730 OPS. He's not a star and never will be, and two of the last three years he's been abysmal offensively. He may recover and get his season numbers back to his career norms - or he may not - but there's no development curve. There's no sign of sustained improvement.

 

Absent any overwhelming reason to the contrary, a pretty simple approach should be applied - play the best defender at the more important position. SS is pretty darn important. Bryant may have an overwhelming reason to stay at 3B although he's clearly not the best defensive option - he's the best of the prospects and a near-lock to be a plus-plus player, and his value is higher at 3B than LF. Castro has no such mitigating circumstances. It may not happen mid-season, but the Cubs would be crazy to play Russell and Baez out of position to keep a mediocre defender with Castro's offense at SS.

[Guest]

If you don't trust the virtually unanimous opinion of scouts, trust your eyes. We've seen plenty enough of both Russell and Baez at SS to see that they're substantially better than Castro. Russell has much better range and hands, Baez slightly better range and a much stronger arm. If Castro were a star, I could see the case for not wanting to rock the boat - but this is a guy with a lifetime .730 OPS. He's not a star and never will be, and two of the last three years he's been abysmal offensively. He may recover and get his season numbers back to his career norms - or he may not - but there's no development curve. There's no sign of sustained improvement.

 

Both the actual opinions of scouts/evaluators and my eyes do not see an appreciable difference between Russell and Castro defensively. You're the only person I've ever seen suggest there is a chasm between them defensively.

[Gilby]

even with the small sample size Russells UZR is way better than Castros

 

Russell's had TWO chances at shortstop at the major league level.

 

And Deeg - you have no idea if Baez AND Russell are better shortstops. Baez may be more "athletic" but he's much less sure-handed than Castro. Russell, I don't know enough about.

 

If you don't trust the virtually unanimous opinion of scouts, trust your eyes. We've seen plenty enough of both Russell and Baez at SS to see that they're substantially better than Castro. Russell has much better range and hands, Baez slightly better range and a much stronger arm. If Castro were a star, I could see the case for not wanting to rock the boat - but this is a guy with a lifetime .730 OPS. He's not a star and never will be, and two of the last three years he's been abysmal offensively. He may recover and get his season numbers back to his career norms - or he may not - but there's no development curve. There's no sign of sustained improvement.

 

Absent any overwhelming reason to the contrary, a pretty simple approach should be applied - play the best defender at the more important position. SS is pretty darn important. Bryant may have an overwhelming reason to stay at 3B although he's clearly not the best defensive option - he's the best of the prospects and a near-lock to be a plus-plus player, and his value is higher at 3B than LF. Castro has no such mitigating circumstances. It may not happen mid-season, but the Cubs would be crazy to play Russell and Baez out of position to keep a mediocre defender with Castro's offense at SS.

 

We've seen very little of Baez and Russell at shortstop.

 

I don't particularly care if they move Russell to SS in 2016, but feeling comfortable to move Castro off SS for Baez, owner of a career 41% K rate and .551 OPS, because he has a better arm (Castro's arm is perfectly fine) seems really silly to me.

[sontensei]

I wonder what some folks thought about Rizzo after seeing he had a terrible debut his first time up in San Diego.

 

I think Baez is one of those types, his next shot up he will impress im sure. castro could have the game winning walkoff hit game 7 of the world series and i still wouldnt like him. --- but i'd prolly cry for the cubs lol

[Guest]

even with the small sample size Russells UZR is way better than Castros

 

Russell's had TWO chances at shortstop at the major league level.

 

And Deeg - you have no idea if Baez AND Russell are better shortstops. Baez may be more "athletic" but he's much less sure-handed than Castro. Russell, I don't know enough about.

 

If you don't trust the virtually unanimous opinion of scouts, trust your eyes. We've seen plenty enough of both Russell and Baez at SS to see that they're substantially better than Castro. Russell has much better range and hands, Baez slightly better range and a much stronger arm. If Castro were a star, I could see the case for not wanting to rock the boat - but this is a guy with a lifetime .730 OPS. He's not a star and never will be, and two of the last three years he's been abysmal offensively. He may recover and get his season numbers back to his career norms - or he may not - but there's no development curve. There's no sign of sustained improvement.

 

Absent any overwhelming reason to the contrary, a pretty simple approach should be applied - play the best defender at the more important position. SS is pretty darn important. Bryant may have an overwhelming reason to stay at 3B although he's clearly not the best defensive option - he's the best of the prospects and a near-lock to be a plus-plus player, and his value is higher at 3B than LF. Castro has no such mitigating circumstances. It may not happen mid-season, but the Cubs would be crazy to play Russell and Baez out of position to keep a mediocre defender with Castro's offense at SS.

 

We've seen very little of Baez and Russell at shortstop.

 

I don't particularly care if they move Russell to SS in 2016, but feeling comfortable to move Castro off SS for Baez, owner of a career 41% K rate and .551 OPS, because he has a better arm (Castro's arm is perfectly fine) seems really silly to me.

 

 

More or less silly than looking at 52 games and calling it a career?

 

 

Despite the fact that the Rizzo/Baez comparison is very flawed, how silly of us was it to trade a guy like Andrew Cashner for a dude with a .523 career OPS?

[Sammy Sofa]

two of the last three years he's been abysmal offensively

 

Whut.

[Banedon]

two of the last three years he's been abysmal offensively

 

Whut.

 

http://imoviequotes.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/102-Animal-House-quotes.gif

[Sammy Sofa]

Man, I was trying to find a gif of that the other day and none of my searches were working. Well done.

[Gilby]

even with the small sample size Russells UZR is way better than Castros

 

Russell's had TWO chances at shortstop at the major league level.

 

And Deeg - you have no idea if Baez AND Russell are better shortstops. Baez may be more "athletic" but he's much less sure-handed than Castro. Russell, I don't know enough about.

 

If you don't trust the virtually unanimous opinion of scouts, trust your eyes. We've seen plenty enough of both Russell and Baez at SS to see that they're substantially better than Castro. Russell has much better range and hands, Baez slightly better range and a much stronger arm. If Castro were a star, I could see the case for not wanting to rock the boat - but this is a guy with a lifetime .730 OPS. He's not a star and never will be, and two of the last three years he's been abysmal offensively. He may recover and get his season numbers back to his career norms - or he may not - but there's no development curve. There's no sign of sustained improvement.

 

Absent any overwhelming reason to the contrary, a pretty simple approach should be applied - play the best defender at the more important position. SS is pretty darn important. Bryant may have an overwhelming reason to stay at 3B although he's clearly not the best defensive option - he's the best of the prospects and a near-lock to be a plus-plus player, and his value is higher at 3B than LF. Castro has no such mitigating circumstances. It may not happen mid-season, but the Cubs would be crazy to play Russell and Baez out of position to keep a mediocre defender with Castro's offense at SS.

 

We've seen very little of Baez and Russell at shortstop.

 

I don't particularly care if they move Russell to SS in 2016, but feeling comfortable to move Castro off SS for Baez, owner of a career 41% K rate and .551 OPS, because he has a better arm (Castro's arm is perfectly fine) seems really silly to me.

 

 

More or less silly than looking at 52 games and calling it a career?

 

 

Despite the fact that the Rizzo/Baez comparison is very flawed, how silly of us was it to trade a guy like Andrew Cashner for a dude with a .523 career OPS?

 

I'm not saying Baez definitely won't be good; I have some hope that he can be. However, with the huge red flags he showed, I think it's madness to move someone of similar defensive abilities for him, until he actually hits at the major league level.

 

You said yourself the Rizzo/Baez comparison is flawed, and Cashner was coming off shoulder issues, so it wasn't silly at all.

[Cubbie Swagger]

I think Russell is certainly a better shortstop than Castro, but he is also a better second baseman. I would rather have Russell playing out of position than Castro. I'm okay with leaving them where they are and waiting to see what becomes of Baez.

[Lenny]

dont you want your best athlete / defender at SS? if you put those 3 guys next to each other, you cant say Castro has better D/quickness/athleticism than either Russell or Baez

 

The difference between them is likely negligible enough that it's nowhere near the problem you desperately want it to be. Castro isn't playing even remotely close to being bad enough that he needs to be moved off of SS. And, again, if someone has to go to 3B, wouldn't you want it to be the guy who probably has the better arm?

You need a stronger arm for SS than 3B

 

Yep.

 

Remember when we tried Hairston at SS? Macias? "Past a diving Theriot"?

 

Starlin has spoiled people.

[bukie]

Castro is the most criminally underappreciated Cub since Aramis Ramirez.

[Guest]

Castro is the most criminally underappreciated Cub since Aramis Ramirez.

 

Eh, maybe, but he's not really close to Aramis in that regard.

[sontensei]

Castro is the most criminally underappreciated Cub since Aramis Ramirez.

 

Eh, maybe, but he's not really close to Aramis in that regard.

 

Aramis was the man

[sontensei]

http://m.cubs.mlb.com/news/article/125634202/joe-maddon-on-javier-baez-the-biggest-thing-he-has-to-do-is-stay-ready

[toonsterwu]

Since I don't know what's going on ...

 

Deeg - I have a hard time buying the idea that viewing Addison Russell at 2nd base in the bigs is enough to make an assessment that he has better range and hands. I'm also a bit confused about the unanimous opinion thing - in fact, there were plenty of folks that questioned/wondered if Russell is better moving to 3rd (I believe Kiley McDaniel noted this in his thing this year, noting, as many others have, the arm action that could potentially be a problem, particularly as he gets older.) Personally, I think Castro, Russell, and Baez are all "through their prime" shortstops, guys who can stick there but as they age have to get shifted off of short (granted, one could argue that there are very few post-prime year shortstops that you would want there in an ideal situation). The reality is all three have warts about their defense. I'd be stunned if any were multiple, legitimate Gold Glove winners through their careers, particularly at short. None of them are Machado ... and Machado had to move to 3rd for Hardy and Machado coming up might've had better defense tools than all three of them for shortstop. If I had to say one was better long run, I'd say Russell, but I don't think it's by enough to justify moving Castro to another position anytime soon. Personally, I'm not convinced that Castro's range is worse than Russell's ... and he has a better arm.

 

That isn't to say that I think the current configuration is the long term configuration. I just don't see them making that move this year, unless they come up with a Castro deal. I could be wrong.

[CubColtPacer]

two of the last three years he's been abysmal offensively

 

Whut.

 

I think he's referring to 2013 and this year. Obviously this year is not even quite 1/4 over so it's a little unfair including it. On the other hand, he has the worst peripherals of his career this year basically across the board, so there's no imminent sign that his season is going to turn around.

[TheDude]

If Castro were a star, I could see the case for not wanting to rock the boat - but this is a guy with a lifetime .730 OPS. He's not a star and never will be, and two of the last three years he's been abysmal offensively. He may recover and get his season numbers back to his career norms - or he may not - but there's no development curve. There's no sign of sustained improvement.

 

.730 OPS from a short stop each year is good enough to place in top 10 SS offensively, top 5 in last two years with the dip in offense across the sport. I'll take a top 5 or top 10 offensive SS to compliment a line-up that has elite 1B and 3B every day of the week.