Cubs exploring Giancarlo Stanton's availability

[Sammy Sofa]

I tend to shrug off nearly any prospect in a trade for an established player,

 

Well, you shouldn't. Prospects have a wide range of value and the guys listed on this are pretty valuable.

 

Two quality major leaguers plus two quality prospects is a very steep price to pay.

 

Well, yeah, and the return is pretty damn valuable. And while I like Rizzo and Shark a lot, they've both managed close to one successful season each in their ideal roles. I'm not saying that this is the ideal package I'd want the Cubs to give up, but I don't think it's all that far off from being fair/what it takes.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

Besides, as good as he is now, imagine what he'll look like when we fix his swing and add another 100 points of OPS. Because that's what we do.

[jersey cubs fan]

2002

Guys, we can't trade Kerry Wood, Hee Seop Choi, Corey Patterson and Juan Cruz. That Pujols kid is a great hitter, but let's not go nuts.

/2002

 

We can stop with the stupidity of calling Stanton Pujols.

[Guest]

Which ones?

There's no way trading Rizzo, Baez, Vizcaino and Samardzija for one player makes sense.

 

Agreed. Not trying to sabotage the thread, but if we're going to trade the farm, wouldn't it make a bit more sense to trade for David Price (assuming Tampa makes him available after this season)? I think I'd rather have arguably the best pitcher in the game than Stanton.

 

I'd be wary of trading the farm for an arm but I agree with Tim that the specific proposal he mentioned was outlandish.

 

Why? I know Stanton has injury concerns and I don't follow the farm all that closely, but is Baez really that close to being a lock to succeeding? I tend to shrug off nearly any prospect in a trade for an established player, plus Vizcaino is coming back from surgery and if he does make there's a good chance it's in the bullpen as opposed to being a starter.

 

The second paragraph of XZero7's post right above yours perfectly sums up my thinking.

[Sammy Sofa]

2002

Guys, we can't trade Kerry Wood, Hee Seop Choi, Corey Patterson and Juan Cruz. That Pujols kid is a great hitter, but let's not go nuts.

/2002

 

We can stop with the stupidity of calling Stanton Pujols.

 

It's hyperbole; calm down, spaz.

[jersey cubs fan]

2002

Guys, we can't trade Kerry Wood, Hee Seop Choi, Corey Patterson and Juan Cruz. That Pujols kid is a great hitter, but let's not go nuts.

/2002

 

We can stop with the stupidity of calling Stanton Pujols.

 

It's hyperbole; calm down, spaz.

 

Hyperbole can't be stupid? Spaz.

[Sammy Sofa]

Besides, as good as he is now, imagine what he'll look like when we fix his swing and add another 100 points of OPS. Because that's what we do.

 

You're going to be choking on so many waffles next season.

[Sammy Sofa]

2002

Guys, we can't trade Kerry Wood, Hee Seop Choi, Corey Patterson and Juan Cruz. That Pujols kid is a great hitter, but let's not go nuts.

/2002

 

We can stop with the stupidity of calling Stanton Pujols.

 

It's hyperbole; calm down, spaz.

 

Hyperbole can't be stupid? Spaz.

 

Sweet, I broke gooney.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

2002

Guys, we can't trade Kerry Wood, Hee Seop Choi, Corey Patterson and Juan Cruz. That Pujols kid is a great hitter, but let's not go nuts.

/2002

 

We can stop with the stupidity of calling Stanton Pujols.

 

 

Never!

 

Age 22 wOBA

Stanton .405

Pujols .404

 

Sure, Stanton has to pick up another 60 points next year to keep up, but who's to say he can't? That's what fixing swings is for.

[jersey cubs fan]

There's no e in there, dweeb

[KingCubsFan]

December 4, 2007: Traded by the Florida Marlins with Dontrelle Willis to the Detroit Tigers for Dallas Trahern (minors), Burke Badenhop, Eulogio De La Cruz, Cameron Maybin, Andrew Miller and Mike Rabelo.

 

That was for Miguel Cabrera.

 

What's a comparable package to that? Stanton will be even more than that IMO since he will have more team control than Cabrera did when he was traded. Heck it's not said all that much, but age is a HUGE factor when you talk about Stanton. He's like what? 4 months older than Castro?

We don't really have a prospect comparable to Maybin. Baez is close, but I think Maybin was a consensus top 10 prospect at the time he was traded. We certainly don't have a pitching prospect close to Andrew Miller.

 

I would hate to give up Rizzo, but there's really no reason why anyone should be hesitant to give up any and all prospects for Stanton.

[Sammy Sofa]

December 4, 2007: Traded by the Florida Marlins with Dontrelle Willis to the Detroit Tigers for Dallas Trahern (minors), Burke Badenhop, Eulogio De La Cruz, Cameron Maybin, Andrew Miller and Mike Rabelo.

 

That was for Miguel Cabrera.

 

What's a comparable package to that? Stanton will be even more than that IMO since he will have more team control than Cabrera did when he was traded. Heck it's not said all that much, but age is a HUGE factor when you talk about Stanton. He's like what? 4 months older than Castro?

We don't really have a prospect comparable to Maybin. Baez is close, but I think Maybin was a consensus top 10 prospect at the time he was traded. We certainly don't have a pitching prospect close to Andrew Miller.

 

I would hate to give up Rizzo, but there's really no reason why anyone should be hesitant to give up any and all prospects for Stanton.

 

That's essentially my thinking; the argument that Shark and Rizzo in the same deal is too much makes much more sense as opposed to arguing that any prospect pushes the deal over the line (which I don't think anyone was actually doing).

[toonsterwu]

December 4, 2007: Traded by the Florida Marlins with Dontrelle Willis to the Detroit Tigers for Dallas Trahern (minors), Burke Badenhop, Eulogio De La Cruz, Cameron Maybin, Andrew Miller and Mike Rabelo.

 

That was for Miguel Cabrera.

 

What's a comparable package to that? Stanton will be even more than that IMO since he will have more team control than Cabrera did when he was traded. Heck it's not said all that much, but age is a HUGE factor when you talk about Stanton. He's like what? 4 months older than Castro?

 

The struggles of both Maybin and Miller makes that package look like highway robbery in retrospect, but that was considered an elite return at the time. Keep in mind that Willis was almost baggage in that trade. He had slipped from his high for the start of his career, and was coming off a bad season. Miller and Maybin were both top 10 prospects in 2007 for BA. Miller reached the bigs in 2008, and despite some struggles, most thought he would still be a quality starter in the majors, while Maybin was still considered an elite top 10 type prospect. When you factor in how teams tend to over-protect young arms, that was simply a big, big return.

[Guest]

December 4, 2007: Traded by the Florida Marlins with Dontrelle Willis to the Detroit Tigers for Dallas Trahern (minors), Burke Badenhop, Eulogio De La Cruz, Cameron Maybin, Andrew Miller and Mike Rabelo.

 

That was for Miguel Cabrera.

 

What's a comparable package to that? Stanton will be even more than that IMO since he will have more team control than Cabrera did when he was traded. Heck it's not said all that much, but age is a HUGE factor when you talk about Stanton. He's like what? 4 months older than Castro?

 

The struggles of both Maybin and Miller makes that package look like highway robbery in retrospect, but that was considered an elite return at the time. Keep in mind that Willis was almost baggage in that trade. He had slipped from his high for the start of his career, and was coming off a bad season. Miller and Maybin were both top 10 prospects in 2007 for BA. Miller reached the bigs in 2008, and despite some struggles, most thought he would still be a quality starter in the majors, while Maybin was still considered an elite top 10 type prospect. When you factor in how teams tend to over-protect young arms, that was simply a big, big return.

Both were still prospects. Everyone else in that list is pretty much filler like we included in the Garza trade. We don't have equivalent prospects right now, but we very well might next year. Adding Shark + Rizzo on top of two top end prospects is pretty outlandish.

[toonsterwu]

December 4, 2007: Traded by the Florida Marlins with Dontrelle Willis to the Detroit Tigers for Dallas Trahern (minors), Burke Badenhop, Eulogio De La Cruz, Cameron Maybin, Andrew Miller and Mike Rabelo.

 

That was for Miguel Cabrera.

 

What's a comparable package to that? Stanton will be even more than that IMO since he will have more team control than Cabrera did when he was traded. Heck it's not said all that much, but age is a HUGE factor when you talk about Stanton. He's like what? 4 months older than Castro?

 

The struggles of both Maybin and Miller makes that package look like highway robbery in retrospect, but that was considered an elite return at the time. Keep in mind that Willis was almost baggage in that trade. He had slipped from his high for the start of his career, and was coming off a bad season. Miller and Maybin were both top 10 prospects in 2007 for BA. Miller reached the bigs in 2008, and despite some struggles, most thought he would still be a quality starter in the majors, while Maybin was still considered an elite top 10 type prospect. When you factor in how teams tend to over-protect young arms, that was simply a big, big return.

Both were still prospects. Everyone else in that list is pretty much filler like we included in the Garza trade. We don't have equivalent prospects right now, but we very well might next year. Adding Shark + Rizzo on top of two top end prospects is pretty outlandish.

 

I don't think I've said otherwise. I simply said I'd be open to a package involving Rizzo (or Castro), but yes, I agree that a package of Rizzo/Shark (or whatever prospects you could swing for Shark since the Fish would seem like they wouldn't be interested)/Baez/Vizcaino for Stanton alone is probably a bit too much (I assume that was the package being referenced to). I also noted a couple pages back that the organization may be better off keeping whatever they could get for Shark (or Garza).

[Sammy Sofa]

Though the initial point is redundant to begin with since the Marlins are unlikely to even want Shark in the first place.

[Guest]

Though the initial point is redundant to begin with since the Marlins are unlikely to even want Shark in the first place.

The post I was responding to was suggesting to trade shark for prospects we could then flip to Miami. So the four players listed in my response would all be included in the price.

[KingCubsFan]

December 4, 2007: Traded by the Florida Marlins with Dontrelle Willis to the Detroit Tigers for Dallas Trahern (minors), Burke Badenhop, Eulogio De La Cruz, Cameron Maybin, Andrew Miller and Mike Rabelo.

 

That was for Miguel Cabrera.

 

What's a comparable package to that? Stanton will be even more than that IMO since he will have more team control than Cabrera did when he was traded. Heck it's not said all that much, but age is a HUGE factor when you talk about Stanton. He's like what? 4 months older than Castro?

 

The struggles of both Maybin and Miller makes that package look like highway robbery in retrospect, but that was considered an elite return at the time. Keep in mind that Willis was almost baggage in that trade. He had slipped from his high for the start of his career, and was coming off a bad season. Miller and Maybin were both top 10 prospects in 2007 for BA. Miller reached the bigs in 2008, and despite some struggles, most thought he would still be a quality starter in the majors, while Maybin was still considered an elite top 10 type prospect. When you factor in how teams tend to over-protect young arms, that was simply a big, big return.

Both were still prospects. Everyone else in that list is pretty much filler like we included in the Garza trade. We don't have equivalent prospects right now, but we very well might next year. Adding Shark + Rizzo on top of two top end prospects is pretty outlandish.

But we don't have two top-end prospects to trade right now. We only have one. That's why someone like Rizzo would have to come into play.

[davell]

It's scary how well the Cards match up to make a Stanton deal. Better than the Rangers easily.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

It's scary how well the Cards match up to make a Stanton deal. Better than the Rangers easily.

 

Favre to Rodgers.

Pujols to Stanton.

 

I hate sports.

[mookie]

Stanton will be a Cub. Don't talk about Cardinals. Ick.

[davell]

Rosenthal says a trade is extremely unlikely. Which probably winds up being our best case scenario. At any rate, it could very well mean next offseason has all 4 of Stanton, Upton, Price, and Felix on the market at the same time. with the horrible FA class, I can't imagine hoe high the price tags get.

[toonsterwu]

It's scary how well the Cards match up to make a Stanton deal. Better than the Rangers easily.

 

It's really a fabulous matchup if both sides wanted it. The Cardinals could offer Taveras as a near future replacement, plus Shelby Miller or Trevor Rosenthal, and then go with their 2nd tier guys to fill in the gaps.

 

That said, still makes more sense for the Fish to hold onto him for one more year, if only as a drawing attraction (but also because it buys them time to assess how their young core of guys in A+/AA do in the next year).

[Guest]

It's scary how well the Cards match up to make a Stanton deal. Better than the Rangers easily.

 

It's really a fabulous matchup if both sides wanted it. The Cardinals could offer Taveras as a near future replacement, plus Shelby Miller or Trevor Rosenthal, and then go with their 2nd tier guys to fill in the gaps.

 

That said, still makes more sense for the Fish to hold onto him for one more year, if only as a drawing attraction (but also because it buys them time to assess how their young core of guys in A+/AA do in the next year).

Wait, so the Cards trade two prospects and second tier guys, while we have to trade Shark (involving 3rd team), Rizzo, Baez and Vizcaino?

 

I'm not sure whether people are underrating our own assets or overrating others.

[toonsterwu]

It's scary how well the Cards match up to make a Stanton deal. Better than the Rangers easily.

 

It's really a fabulous matchup if both sides wanted it. The Cardinals could offer Taveras as a near future replacement, plus Shelby Miller or Trevor Rosenthal, and then go with their 2nd tier guys to fill in the gaps.

 

That said, still makes more sense for the Fish to hold onto him for one more year, if only as a drawing attraction (but also because it buys them time to assess how their young core of guys in A+/AA do in the next year).

Wait, so the Cards trade two prospects and second tier guys, while we have to trade Shark (involving 3rd team), Rizzo, Baez and Vizcaino?

 

I'm not sure whether people are underrating our own assets or overrating others.

 

TIm, when the heck have I ever said to trade Shark/Rizzo/Baez/Vizcaino?