can we talk about Starlin Castro?

[sweetpeteman]

In his age 23 season (next year for Castro), Ernie Banks made 34 errors. Eventually, he did move from shortstop... seven years later, and oddly, began the transition the year after winning the GG.

 

Just for reference sake, I went and looked at some past winners of the NL GG:

 

Castro at age 21: 158 G, 29 E, .961%

 

Age 22 season: (Games/Errors/Fielding %)

 

Renteria: 151, 26, .959%

O. Cabrera: 117, 28, .944% (Minors)

Larkin: 91, 17, .963% (Minors) (At age 24, in the majors: 148, 29, .960%)

Concepcion: 93, 22, .945%

[Soul]

Umm What?

 

Relax, it's just a joke.

[KaiserCesar]

I heard Karros was ragging on him about not working hard enough on his defense on the national telecast today. [face_palm]

 

I get the feeling that a lot of the national types who like to talk about Castro's work ethic and defense are probably just not aware how young he came into the league and how limited his minor league experience was.

[dew1679666265]

I get the feeling that a lot of the national types who like to talk about Castro's work ethic and defense are probably just not aware how young he came into the league and how limited his minor league experience was.

 

I think that's an important point for national types and Cub fans as well to keep in mind. It's so rare that a player comes up at Castro's age that it's easy to expect the same sort of development from him that you would a player who debuted at 24-25 and had 4-5 years of minor league experience. People don't see the development process a player goes through at 19/20/21, though, since it's pretty much always done in A ball.

[Guest]

I heard Karros was ragging on him about not working hard enough on his defense on the national telecast today. [face_palm]

 

I get the feeling that a lot of the national types who like to talk about Castro's work ethic and defense are probably just not aware how young he came into the league and how limited his minor league experience was.

Right, and also errors are a tangible thing. He's getting to balls, as long as he doesn't go Steve Sax he's going to be very good at fielding his position.

[Clem Fandango]

I heard Karros was ragging on him about not working hard enough on his defense on the national telecast today. [face_palm]

 

I get the feeling that a lot of the national types who like to talk about Castro's work ethic and defense are probably just not aware how young he came into the league and how limited his minor league experience was.

Right, and also errors are a tangible thing. He's getting to balls, as long as he doesn't go Steve Sax he's going to be very good at fielding his position.

 

This. It always pisses me off when people judge his entire defensive game on his throwing miscues. His range at short is well above league average and one of the better ones in the league and he made more throwing errors than fielding errors last year (16 to 11). His RF/9 was 4.59 to the league average 4.41 and his RF/G was 4.51 to the league average 4.40.

 

He's pretty darn good at FIELDING his position. It's his arm accuracy that needs help. I just hate it when people dismiss his entire defensive game because of that. if he cut down on half of his throwing errors last year, he'd be one of the top defensive SS in the game.

[PriortoTheoIhadWood]

Over/under on # of seasons Castro can be argued as the best player in the game over the next 12 years?

[davell]

I love Castro, but I'd set that squarely at 0.

[PriortoTheoIhadWood]

I love Castro, but I'd set that squarely at 0.

 

Not even 1, ala Jeter 1999?

[El Duderino]

I love Castro, but I'd set that squarely at 0.

 

This, unless Troy Tulowitzki dies.

[davell]

To me, Kemp is still very young, Harper is on the way, and I think while Castro is going to be the best SS in the game(offensively), I can't see him putting up more than a .325/.370/.500ish type line. I think Kemp, Harper, possibly Heyward, possibly Stanton, and who knows who else are going to be putting up monster 1.000+ OPS' for quite a while. Yeah, SS is a premium, but I still think it's likely to see him move off SS before he hits his prime, decreasing his value a tad as well. That said, I guess it's conceivable that he throws up a season where he flirts with a .350ish BA, I guess that'd get him in the discussion for a year anyway.

[treebird]

I love Castro, but I'd set that squarely at 0.

 

i am very interested in taking the over then, given that i'll either push or win

[PriortoTheoIhadWood]

To me, Kemp is still very young, Harper is on the way, and I think while Castro is going to be the best SS in the game(offensively), I can't see him putting up more than a .325/.370/.500ish type line. I think Kemp, Harper, possibly Heyward, possibly Stanton, and who knows who else are going to be putting up monster 1.000+ OPS' for quite a while. Yeah, SS is a premium, but I still think it's likely to see him move off SS before he hits his prime, decreasing his value a tad as well. That said, I guess it's conceivable that he throws up a season where he flirts with a .350ish BA, I guess that'd get him in the discussion for a year anyway.

 

1. Think it's a terrible idea.

 

2. Think they would have done it already. He doesn't really profile at any other position either except second base. MAYBE CF, but a SS to CF switch at the MLB level? That can't be easy or fun.

 

All it takes is one of those flirt with .350 years...and he's the kind of bat who might be able to do it.

[KingCubsFan]

To me, Kemp is still very young, Harper is on the way, and I think while Castro is going to be the best SS in the game(offensively), I can't see him putting up more than a .325/.370/.500ish type line. I think Kemp, Harper, possibly Heyward, possibly Stanton, and who knows who else are going to be putting up monster 1.000+ OPS' for quite a while. Yeah, SS is a premium, but I still think it's likely to see him move off SS before he hits his prime, decreasing his value a tad as well. That said, I guess it's conceivable that he throws up a season where he flirts with a .350ish BA, I guess that'd get him in the discussion for a year anyway.

 

1. Think it's a terrible idea.

 

2. Think they would have done it already. He doesn't really profile at any other position either except second base. MAYBE CF, but a SS to CF switch at the MLB level? That can't be easy or fun.

 

All it takes is one of those flirt with .350 years...and he's the kind of bat who might be able to do it.

I think the old regime would have done it this year to replace Aramis. Then they would have overpaid for a veteran SS for defensive purposes. Epstein knows how valuable Castro can be at SS, and my guess is that they're using at least this year to see how much he is able to improve defensively. If the throws remain an issue, I could see him eventually sliding over to 2B (especially since we don't have a long-term answer there anyways). But I think Epstein will give him every opportunity to stick at SS.

[abuck1220]

has there ever been a ss in the history of the world that was super good defensively in the big leagues at age 22?

[SouthSideRyan]

has there ever been a ss in the history of the world that was super good defensively in the big leagues at age 22?

 

A-Rod was pretty good. Ripken maybe?

[sneakypower]

Elvis Andrus

[PriortoTheoIhadWood]

Elvis Andrus

 

First name that came to mind.

[Splendid Splinter]

Surprised Tulo wasn't mentioned... Had the best defensive season as a rookie (I think as I can't think who else would've beaten him) and probably top 10 of all time.

[PriortoTheoIhadWood]

Surprised Tulo wasn't mentioned... Had the best defensive season as a rookie (I think as I can't think who else would've beaten him) and probably top 10 of all time.

 

It's because he's the quietest superstar in the game. I didn't even think of him.

[Clem Fandango]

Tulowitzki committed 6 errors last year at SS. SIX. He's committed 49 total errors in his entire CAREER. 6104 innings. 49 errors. That's 5 full seasons and small chunks of two. Ozzie Smith, "the greatest shortstop ever", reached 49 errors before he even got to the ASB during his 3rd season.

 

I mentioned Castro's RF/9 and RF/G earlier which was 4.59 and 4.51, both which are above the league average and respectable numbers. Tulo's was 5.05 and 4.84. His career rating is 5.02 and 4.85.

 

Over the last three seasons his triple slash has been .304/.376/.554 with a .931 OPS. (He also only committed 25 errors over those three seasons)

 

Troy Tulowitzki is [expletive] awesome.

[El Duderino]

Tulowitzki committed 6 errors last year at SS. SIX. He's committed 49 total errors in his entire CAREER. 6104 innings. 49 errors. That's 5 full seasons and small chunks of two. Ozzie Smith, "the greatest shortstop ever", reached 49 errors before he even got to the ASB during his 3rd season.

 

I mentioned Castro's RF/9 and RF/G earlier which was 4.59 and 4.51, both which are above the league average and respectable numbers. Tulo's was 5.05 and 4.84. His career rating is 5.02 and 4.85.

 

Over the last three seasons his triple slash has been .304/.376/.554 with a .931 OPS. (He also only committed 25 errors over those three seasons)

 

Troy Tulowitzki is [expletive] awesome.

 

Want more craziness? Starlin Castro isn't the only SS with 4 errors this season. Tulo made his 4th last night.

[Clem Fandango]

Tulowitzki committed 6 errors last year at SS. SIX. He's committed 49 total errors in his entire CAREER. 6104 innings. 49 errors. That's 5 full seasons and small chunks of two. Ozzie Smith, "the greatest shortstop ever", reached 49 errors before he even got to the ASB during his 3rd season.

 

I mentioned Castro's RF/9 and RF/G earlier which was 4.59 and 4.51, both which are above the league average and respectable numbers. Tulo's was 5.05 and 4.84. His career rating is 5.02 and 4.85.

 

Over the last three seasons his triple slash has been .304/.376/.554 with a .931 OPS. (He also only committed 25 errors over those three seasons)

 

Troy Tulowitzki is [expletive] awesome.

 

Want more craziness? Starlin Castro isn't the only SS with 4 errors this season. Tulo made his 4th last night.

 

HE'S GOT THE YIPS. BUY LOW!!!!!

[Omar]

Ozzie loves all the Castros'

[sneakypower]

i know one month of fielding stats is practically meaningless (for predictive purposes), but i'm really encouraged with early returns

 

per UZR, he leads all SS in range, to where he's still been average overall when factoring errors, and TZ (which had him -27 for '10-'11) has been a big fan so far, putting him at +5

 

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