Pujols signs with Angels pg 151

[CubsWin]

We'd still have Soto, Castro, Soriano, Colvin/Jackson and Byrd in the lineup. Second base will likely be weak, but we've got some options there coming up in the system. Third base could be a problem, but I've got more faith than most that Vitters will eventually be an above league average option there. For '12, we might be able to get a year out of Marquez Smith if we assume Vitters won't take the big step forward this season.

I don't think we'll be in the same position at all.

If Vitters isn't ready after this season and Ramirez performs well in 2011, instead of taking a chance on Smith for a season, why not pick up the option on Rammy? With all the other money coming off the books next season and the level to which Ramirez performs when healthy, I think the Cubs could afford it and it would likely be worth it, especially if Ramirez plays more than 130 games. For 6 consecutive seasons prior to last year, he posted an OPS of .898 or higher. Setting the money aside for a moment, ask yourself if the Cubs could find a replacement at 3B who could put up that kind of production? If it were possible to have Ramirez on the team in 2012 and still sign Pujols, I would want to do it.

 

Fukudome 13.5 million

Silva 9.5 million (11.5 million - 2 million buyout)

Pena 10.0 million

Grabow 4.8 million

Samardzija 2.0 million

 

Total 39.3 million

 

The nice part about the players above is that their replacements are already on the team or in the system, meaning they're all expendable and they won't cost anything to replace. Sign Pujols for 30 mill and use the 9.3 million for raises, and keep Ramirez.

 

C Soto

1B Pujols

2B ?

SS Castro

3B Ramirez

LF Soriano

CF Jackson

RF Colvin

 

SP Garza

SP Dempster

SP Zambrano

SP Cashner

SP Wells

 

RP Marmol

RP Wood

RP Marshall

?

?

?

 

That's not a bad team.

[Sammy Sofa]

Why the ? at 2B? Unless he tanks isn't it pretty much a given that it would be DeWitt there in 2012 in that scenario?

[CubsWin]

Why the ? at 2B? Unless he tanks isn't it pretty much a given that it would be DeWitt there in 2012 in that scenario?

Put him in there. 2B is just the least settled position of them all. If it's not Jackson in CF it will be Byrd, but that would be the only change. If DeWitt doesn't perform, it could be anybody. A trade. A free agent signing. Barney. Another minor leaguer.

 

I guess if Colvin struggles, they could be looking for another OFer...

Edited February 20, 2011 by CubsWin

[CubColtPacer]

We'd still have Soto, Castro, Soriano, Colvin/Jackson and Byrd in the lineup. Second base will likely be weak, but we've got some options there coming up in the system. Third base could be a problem, but I've got more faith than most that Vitters will eventually be an above league average option there. For '12, we might be able to get a year out of Marquez Smith if we assume Vitters won't take the big step forward this season.

I don't think we'll be in the same position at all.

If Vitters isn't ready after this season and Ramirez performs well in 2011, instead of taking a chance on Smith for a season, why not pick up the option on Rammy? With all the other money coming off the books next season and the level to which Ramirez performs when healthy, I think the Cubs could afford it and it would likely be worth it, especially if Ramirez plays more than 130 games. For 6 consecutive seasons prior to last year, he posted an OPS of .898 or higher. Setting the money aside for a moment, ask yourself if the Cubs could find a replacement at 3B who could put up that kind of production? If it were possible to have Ramirez on the team in 2012 and still sign Pujols, I would want to do it.

 

Fukudome 13.5 million

Silva 9.5 million (11.5 million - 2 million buyout)

Pena 10.0 million

Grabow 4.8 million

Samardzija 2.0 million

 

Total 39.3 million

 

The nice part about the players above is that their replacements are already on the team or in the system, meaning they're all expendable and they won't cost anything to replace. Sign Pujols for 30 mill and use the 9.3 million for raises, and keep Ramirez.

 

C Soto

1B Pujols

2B ?

SS Castro

3B Ramirez

LF Soriano

CF Jackson

RF Colvin

 

SP Garza

SP Dempster

SP Zambrano

SP Cashner

SP Wells

 

RP Marmol

RP Wood

RP Marshall

?

?

?

 

That's not a bad team.

 

The Cubs are only paying 6 million for Silva this year with Seattle paying the other 5.5 so that takes some money out of the equation. But I would agree that they would at least consider keeping Ramirez even if it meant raising the payroll a little bit (or maybe trading Byrd who you don't have in your lineup).

[CubsWin]

We'd still have Soto, Castro, Soriano, Colvin/Jackson and Byrd in the lineup. Second base will likely be weak, but we've got some options there coming up in the system. Third base could be a problem, but I've got more faith than most that Vitters will eventually be an above league average option there. For '12, we might be able to get a year out of Marquez Smith if we assume Vitters won't take the big step forward this season.

I don't think we'll be in the same position at all.

If Vitters isn't ready after this season and Ramirez performs well in 2011, instead of taking a chance on Smith for a season, why not pick up the option on Rammy? With all the other money coming off the books next season and the level to which Ramirez performs when healthy, I think the Cubs could afford it and it would likely be worth it, especially if Ramirez plays more than 130 games. For 6 consecutive seasons prior to last year, he posted an OPS of .898 or higher. Setting the money aside for a moment, ask yourself if the Cubs could find a replacement at 3B who could put up that kind of production? If it were possible to have Ramirez on the team in 2012 and still sign Pujols, I would want to do it.

 

Fukudome 13.5 million

Silva 9.5 million (11.5 million - 2 million buyout)

Pena 10.0 million

Grabow 4.8 million

Samardzija 2.0 million

 

Total 39.3 million

 

The nice part about the players above is that their replacements are already on the team or in the system, meaning they're all expendable and they won't cost anything to replace. Sign Pujols for 30 mill and use the 9.3 million for raises, and keep Ramirez.

 

C Soto

1B Pujols

2B ?

SS Castro

3B Ramirez

LF Soriano

CF Jackson

RF Colvin

 

SP Garza

SP Dempster

SP Zambrano

SP Cashner

SP Wells

 

RP Marmol

RP Wood

RP Marshall

?

?

?

 

That's not a bad team.

 

The Cubs are only paying 6 million for Silva this year with Seattle paying the other 5.5 so that takes some money out of the equation. But I would agree that they would at least consider keeping Ramirez even if it meant raising the payroll a little bit (or maybe trading Byrd who you don't have in your lineup).

I like keeping Byrd due to the unproven ability of both Colvin and Jackson, but that is certainly an option. And thanks on the Silva update. I thought that was applied last season. Oops.

[Outshined_One]

I like keeping Byrd due to the unproven ability of both Colvin and Jackson, but that is certainly an option.

 

There's something about Byrd that makes me wonder what the Cubs would do if they're out of it at the deadline this year. Relative to his performance last year, his contract is an absolute bargain. I could see a number of teams having interest in Byrd at the deadline this season if the Cubs are out of it and Byrd is producing near the level he was in 2010. I also could see the Cubs seriously consider trading him if Jackson is hitting the crap out of the ball in AAA.

[CubsWin]

I like keeping Byrd due to the unproven ability of both Colvin and Jackson, but that is certainly an option.

 

There's something about Byrd that makes me wonder what the Cubs would do if they're out of it at the deadline this year. Relative to his performance last year, his contract is an absolute bargain. I could see a number of teams having interest in Byrd at the deadline this season if the Cubs are out of it and Byrd is producing near the level he was in 2010. I also could see the Cubs seriously consider trading him if Jackson is hitting the crap out of the ball in AAA.

He's certainly tradeable, if that is even a word. And if the Cubs are out of it or if Jackson is killing it, then sure. But regardless of whether it is Byrd or some other more proven OFer, I wouldn't want to go into 2012 with Soriano, Jackson and Colvin and the starters and no other options.

[Sammy Sofa]

Soriano, Jackson and Colvin and the starters and no other options.

 

Definitely not. They should obviously be listening to deals for Byrd, but it might be in there best interests to keep him through his final year. I really don't think Colvin is going to be good enough to justify him being the regular RF, especially with Soriano's declining production over in LF. Who are going to be FA outfielders after 2011?

[Outshined_One]

Definitely not. They should obviously be listening to deals for Byrd, but it might be in there best interests to keep him through his final year. I really don't think Colvin is going to be good enough to justify him being the regular RF, especially with Soriano's declining production over in LF. Who are going to be FA outfielders after 2011?

 

Link

 

Outfielders

Bobby Abreu LAA *

Jose Bautista TOR

Carlos Beltran NYM

Milton Bradley SEA

Mike Cameron BOS

Ronny Cedeno PIT

Michael Cuddyer MIN

Jack Cust SEA

David DeJesus OAK

J.D. Drew BOS

Jeff Francoeur KC *

Jonny Gomes CIN

Gabe Gross OAK

Carlos Guillen DET

Corey Hart MIL

Raul Ibanez PHI

Conor Jackson ARZ

Jason Kubel MIN

Ryan Ludwick SD

Nate McLouth ATL *

Juan Pierre CWS

Juan Rivera TOR

Cody Ross SF

Grady Sizemore CLE *

Nick Swisher NYY *

Josh Willingham WAS

 

* indicates option for 2012

[mookie]

ronny cedeno

[Sammy Sofa]

Yeeeesh.

[CubsWin]

Yeeeesh.

What? Ryan Ludwick's got grit and Juan Pierre can really run.

[Little Slide Rooter]

Definitely not. They should obviously be listening to deals for Byrd, but it might be in there best interests to keep him through his final year. I really don't think Colvin is going to be good enough to justify him being the regular RF, especially with Soriano's declining production over in LF. Who are going to be FA outfielders after 2011?

 

Link

 

Outfielders

Bobby Abreu LAA *

Jose Bautista TOR

Carlos Beltran NYM

Milton Bradley SEA

Mike Cameron BOS

Ronny Cedeno PIT

Michael Cuddyer MIN

Jack Cust SEA

David DeJesus OAK

J.D. Drew BOS

Jeff Francoeur KC *

Jonny Gomes CIN

Gabe Gross OAK

Carlos Guillen DET

Corey Hart MIL

Raul Ibanez PHI

Conor Jackson ARZ

Jason Kubel MIN

Ryan Ludwick SD

Nate McLouth ATL *

Juan Pierre CWS

Juan Rivera TOR

Cody Ross SF

Grady Sizemore CLE *

Nick Swisher NYY *

Josh Willingham WAS

 

* indicates option for 2012

 

Bautista just signed a very ill advised 5 year extension and I could have sworn that Corey Hart signed an extension with the Brewers last season. Sizemores the only guy on that list that Id really want, assuming he bounces back from injury. However, if Sizemore really does have a bounceback, nobody not called the Yankees or Red Sox would be able to work him and Pujols into the budget.

[TruffleShuffle]

grady sizemore wasn't that good in 2008 and was bad/hurt all of last year, and had microfracture surgery, which is a really big deal. nobody is giving him a mega-deal.

[SouthSideRyan]

grady sizemore wasn't that good in 2008 and was bad/hurt all of last year, and had microfracture surgery, which is a really big deal. nobody is giving him a mega-deal.

 

The Cardinals will sign him along with Fielder, Buehrle and Aramis for ~20M

[Outshined_One]

Yeeeesh.

 

Kind of sad that David DeJesus might end up being the best bang for the buck name on that list.

[Little Slide Rooter]

We'd still have Soto, Castro, Soriano, Colvin/Jackson and Byrd in the lineup. Second base will likely be weak, but we've got some options there coming up in the system. Third base could be a problem, but I've got more faith than most that Vitters will eventually be an above league average option there. For '12, we might be able to get a year out of Marquez Smith if we assume Vitters won't take the big step forward this season.

I don't think we'll be in the same position at all.

If Vitters isn't ready after this season and Ramirez performs well in 2011, instead of taking a chance on Smith for a season, why not pick up the option on Rammy? With all the other money coming off the books next season and the level to which Ramirez performs when healthy, I think the Cubs could afford it and it would likely be worth it, especially if Ramirez plays more than 130 games. For 6 consecutive seasons prior to last year, he posted an OPS of .898 or higher. Setting the money aside for a moment, ask yourself if the Cubs could find a replacement at 3B who could put up that kind of production? If it were possible to have Ramirez on the team in 2012 and still sign Pujols, I would want to do it.

 

Fukudome 13.5 million

Silva 9.5 million (11.5 million - 2 million buyout)

Pena 10.0 million

Grabow 4.8 million

Samardzija 2.0 million

 

Total 39.3 million

 

The nice part about the players above is that their replacements are already on the team or in the system, meaning they're all expendable and they won't cost anything to replace. Sign Pujols for 30 mill and use the 9.3 million for raises, and keep Ramirez.

 

C Soto

1B Pujols

2B ?

SS Castro

3B Ramirez

LF Soriano

CF Jackson

RF Colvin

 

SP Garza

SP Dempster

SP Zambrano

SP Cashner

SP Wells

 

RP Marmol

RP Wood

RP Marshall

?

?

?

 

That's not a bad team.

 

The Cubs are only paying 6 million for Silva this year with Seattle paying the other 5.5 so that takes some money out of the equation. But I would agree that they would at least consider keeping Ramirez even if it meant raising the payroll a little bit (or maybe trading Byrd who you don't have in your lineup).

 

I agree fully. Ramirezes 2012 option is for 16 mil, but why not pick it up, sign Pujols, trade Byrd and call it an offseason? I agree with the 1-4 in the rotation, but I could see Jay Jackson, Carpenter, Coleman, or even McNutt giving Wells a challenge for that 5 spot. Even if we do stick with DeWitt at 2B, hes no worse than the majority of 8 hitters in the NL, hed probably be one of the better ones. I could see:

 

Jackson

Castro

Pujols

Ramirez

Soto

Soriano

Colvin

DeWitt

P

[squally1313]

Yeeeesh.

 

Kind of sad that David DeJesus might end up being the best bang for the buck name on that list.

 

I'd go with JD Drew, he always tends to be underrated for the production he provides. Obviously he'd be pretty old by then, but if he could give you a low 800s OPS for a cheap one year deal I think he'd be the best bet.

[XZero771679666304]

I'm hearing a lot of Cardinals fans trying to make thrmselves feel better by saying we don't have the payroll flexibility to sign Pujols. We not only do, but after 2012, Ricketts + Co. (hopefully not Hendry) will have the flexibility to fill in around him nicely as well.

 

The only contract we're committed to after 2012 is Soriano and the arbitration eligible guys. Absorbing a 10/300 deal would actually be quite feasible without impacting flexibility much at all (I would actually front load it).

 

Selling the Cubs to Pujols would be easy. Ricketts could just tell him "We'll give you your 10/300. We have some young talent and the flexibility to build around you for years, with your input. You can be the one to lead the Cubs to our first WS in over a century, and you'll be a bigger, more marketable icon than you could ever be in St. Louis. Between that and the records you may break, you could cement your place atop the pantheon of the all-time greats."

 

If Ricketts decided to go this route, the only thing that could impede it would be if Albert has such a strong loyalty to the Cardinals that he wouldn't sign a more lucrative contract with the Cubs because of it.

 

As for Ramirez, I think another possibility is declining his option and approaching him with a lower offer (say, 8-10MM, depending on his 2011 performance), with the bonus of hitting behind Pujols. Unless he has a fairly big bounceback year, I can't see him getting much more on the open market, given his recent injury and performance issues.

[Backtobanks]

I'm hearing a lot of Cardinals fans trying to make thrmselves feel better by saying we don't have the payroll flexibility to sign Pujols. We not only do, but after 2012, Ricketts + Co. (hopefully not Hendry) will have the flexibility to fill in around him nicely as well.

 

The only contract we're committed to after 2012 is Soriano and the arbitration eligible guys. Absorbing a 10/300 deal would actually be quite feasible without impacting flexibility much at all (I would actually front load it).

 

Selling the Cubs to Pujols would be easy. Ricketts could just tell him "We'll give you your 10/300. We have some young talent and the flexibility to build around you for years, with your input. You can be the one to lead the Cubs to our first WS in over a century, and you'll be a bigger, more marketable icon than you could ever be in St. Louis. Between that and the records you may break, you could cement your place atop the pantheon of the all-time greats."

 

If Ricketts decided to go this route, the only thing that could impede it would be if Albert has such a strong loyalty to the Cardinals that he wouldn't sign a more lucrative contract with the Cubs because of it.

 

As for Ramirez, I think another possibility is declining his option and approaching him with a lower offer (say, 8-10MM, depending on his 2011 performance), with the bonus of hitting behind Pujols. Unless he has a fairly big bounceback year, I can't see him getting much more on the open market, given his recent injury and performance issues.

 

Ramirez would probably have to be injured or have a terrible year to settle for $8-$10 million. Beltre (granted coming off of a great year) just signed for $96 million over 6 years and has career numbers less than Ramirez.

[XZero771679666304]

I'm hearing a lot of Cardinals fans trying to make thrmselves feel better by saying we don't have the payroll flexibility to sign Pujols. We not only do, but after 2012, Ricketts + Co. (hopefully not Hendry) will have the flexibility to fill in around him nicely as well.

 

The only contract we're committed to after 2012 is Soriano and the arbitration eligible guys. Absorbing a 10/300 deal would actually be quite feasible without impacting flexibility much at all (I would actually front load it).

 

Selling the Cubs to Pujols would be easy. Ricketts could just tell him "We'll give you your 10/300. We have some young talent and the flexibility to build around you for years, with your input. You can be the one to lead the Cubs to our first WS in over a century, and you'll be a bigger, more marketable icon than you could ever be in St. Louis. Between that and the records you may break, you could cement your place atop the pantheon of the all-time greats."

 

If Ricketts decided to go this route, the only thing that could impede it would be if Albert has such a strong loyalty to the Cardinals that he wouldn't sign a more lucrative contract with the Cubs because of it.

 

As for Ramirez, I think another possibility is declining his option and approaching him with a lower offer (say, 8-10MM, depending on his 2011 performance), with the bonus of hitting behind Pujols. Unless he has a fairly big bounceback year, I can't see him getting much more on the open market, given his recent injury and performance issues.

 

Ramirez would probably have to be injured or have a terrible year to settle for $8-$10 million. Beltre (granted coming off of a great year) just signed for $96 million over 6 years and has career numbers less than Ramirez.

 

Probably, but if he misses a few weeks again and doesn't OPS over .800 again, I don't think he'll get a lot of offers better than that. Beltre go a contract not many would have given him, doesn't have the injury concerns Ramirez does, is a year younger is a GG defender and had an OPS over .900.

 

Ramirez has been a much more consistent offensive force, but this is a big year for him. If he doesn't come up fairly big, his rep may be as a past his prime player, and in the same position as Pena was this offseason. Hitting behind Pujols for a year to boost his value might be very appealing in such a scenario.

 

Now I think he will rebound, but it's a distinct possibility he doesn't.

[CubsWin]

I'm hearing a lot of Cardinals fans trying to make thrmselves feel better by saying we don't have the payroll flexibility to sign Pujols. We not only do, but after 2012, Ricketts + Co. (hopefully not Hendry) will have the flexibility to fill in around him nicely as well.

 

The only contract we're committed to after 2012 is Soriano and the arbitration eligible guys. Absorbing a 10/300 deal would actually be quite feasible without impacting flexibility much at all (I would actually front load it).

 

Selling the Cubs to Pujols would be easy. Ricketts could just tell him "We'll give you your 10/300. We have some young talent and the flexibility to build around you for years, with your input. You can be the one to lead the Cubs to our first WS in over a century, and you'll be a bigger, more marketable icon than you could ever be in St. Louis. Between that and the records you may break, you could cement your place atop the pantheon of the all-time greats."

 

If Ricketts decided to go this route, the only thing that could impede it would be if Albert has such a strong loyalty to the Cardinals that he wouldn't sign a more lucrative contract with the Cubs because of it.

 

As for Ramirez, I think another possibility is declining his option and approaching him with a lower offer (say, 8-10MM, depending on his 2011 performance), with the bonus of hitting behind Pujols. Unless he has a fairly big bounceback year, I can't see him getting much more on the open market, given his recent injury and performance issues.

 

Ramirez would probably have to be injured or have a terrible year to settle for $8-$10 million. Beltre (granted coming off of a great year) just signed for $96 million over 6 years and has career numbers less than Ramirez.

 

Probably, but if he misses a few weeks again and doesn't OPS over .800 again, I don't think he'll get a lot of offers better than that. Beltre go a contract not many would have given him, doesn't have the injury concerns Ramirez does, is a year younger is a GG defender and had an OPS over .900.

 

Ramirez has been a much more consistent offensive force, but this is a big year for him. If he doesn't come up fairly big, his rep may be as a past his prime player, and in the same position as Pena was this offseason. Hitting behind Pujols for a year to boost his value might be very appealing in such a scenario.

 

Now I think he will rebound, but it's a distinct possibility he doesn't.

Yeah, those were my thoughts as well. If Rammy performs like he did before and it's clear that Vitters isn't ready, then pick up the club option on him. If he doesn't produce near his previous level, you can always renegotiate and bring him back for less.

 

As far as Pujols goes, I think the Cubs can easily afford him next season. And it gets even easier in the future if guys like Cashner, McNutt and Simpson come through as starting pitchers.

[daske17]

Well, we don't have to worry about Kenny Williams wanting any part of Pujols.

 

Kenny Williams[/url]"]If (Jerry Reinsdorf) gave me $30 million dollars right now, I’m not going to spend it on one guy. Sorry White Sox fans. But I tell you what, I’m going to take that $30 million and I’m going to distribute it around. My team is going to be better as a whole than it is with one player who might get hurt. Then you’re done. Sorry, that’s just me. And that’s no disrespect to a future Hall of Famer, first ballot, one of the greatest players in history.

 

In other news, Kenny wonders if he can still sign Carl Everett and Roberto Alomar at this year's trade deadline.

[Guest]

My question to Kenny would be what he'd do if he had $50M to spend this offseason, but not that many holes to fill.

[Clem Fandango]

Extend Paul Konerko again