NFL Week 4

[Guest]

Mangini won't make it through the season with that team.

 

Wherefor art thou, Romeo?

 

:stickman:

[Andy]

Derek Anderson named starter for Browns.

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=4519314

"I felt like I went out there and did what I can do," Anderson said.

Hysterical. 3 picks in a half - that's definitely what he can do.

 

Now I'm even happier about getting Jets/Saints.

[dew1679666265]

Collins rating is like 29 in the fourth quarter this season. They have held leads in all games if I'm not mistaken but have always given it up. That is a very large reason why. VY should be getting mixed in at the least.

 

The fact that we've held late leads every game means that the offense has been doing its job. It's been getting the team the lead, but the defense and special teams have been surrendering that lead. There's nothing a quarterback change will do to correct that.

 

The defense and special teams giving up the leads is also part of the reason why Collins has struggled in the fourth and I don't think Vince would be likely to be an improvement over that.

[dew1679666265]

it's puzzling why they haven't introduced really any wildcat plays with VY and johnson, seems worth a try

 

I wouldn't mind seeing Vince in a Wildcat type formation or contributing to the offense in some way. I am a bit surprised they haven't worked him in it in some capacity.

[inari]

Not to dig up something earlier in the thread, but it's just stunning that Mangini can really justify starting Anderson over Quinn to himself.

[CubbieBum]

Collins rating is like 29 in the fourth quarter this season. They have held leads in all games if I'm not mistaken but have always given it up. That is a very large reason why. VY should be getting mixed in at the least.

 

The fact that we've held late leads every game means that the offense has been doing its job. It's been getting the team the lead, but the defense and special teams have been surrendering that lead. There's nothing a quarterback change will do to correct that.

 

The defense and special teams giving up the leads is also part of the reason why Collins has struggled in the fourth and I don't think Vince would be likely to be an improvement over that.

 

Uhh he could complete passes to keep the offense on the field and let the defense rest. Looking it up this time he is 8 for 24 in the 4th quarter with an interception and rating of 25.9. He's also just 12 for 26 on third down. Essentially Collins is doing well in situations that other teams expect the Titans to be running and is sucking when other teams are expecting the pass.

 

Collins isn't solely to blame and the defense isn't without blame but Collins is the biggest culprit for the 4th quarter let downs.

[rocket]

chad ochocinco's autobiography sounds amazing

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/columns/story?columnist=reilly_rick&id=4519152

[Exile on Waveland]

it's puzzling why they haven't introduced really any wildcat plays with VY and johnson, seems worth a try

 

I wouldn't mind seeing Vince in a Wildcat type formation or contributing to the offense in some way. I am a bit surprised they haven't worked him in it in some capacity.

 

I'm expecting Fisher to at least break it out some in two weeks against the Colts.

[dew1679666265]

Uhh he could complete passes to keep the offense on the field and let the defense rest. Looking it up this time he is 8 for 24 in the 4th quarter with an interception and rating of 25.9. He's also just 12 for 26 on third down. Essentially Collins is doing well in situations that other teams expect the Titans to be running and is sucking when other teams are expecting the pass.

 

Collins isn't solely to blame and the defense isn't without blame but Collins is the biggest culprit for the 4th quarter let downs.

 

The Titans' offense is not designed to carry the team. The defense is designed to carry the team and the offense (primarily the running game) does enough to win the game. Kerry Collins is not a great quarterback, nor is he good enough to carry a team. But, when the defense is playing well, he is a good enough quarterback to make enough plays and avoid enough mistakes to allow the team to win games. If the offense has to carry the team, the team will not win games.

 

Of the 10 highest paid players on the Titans last season, 4 were offensive players. Three of those four were offensive linemen (Roos, Stewart and Mawae). The only player in the top 10 highest paid Titans was Vince Young - who was expected to be far better than he currently is.

 

The Titans spend far more money on building a great defense than they do on building a great offense that can consistently carry the team to victory. The Colts, for instance, wouldn't win many games if Peyton had a stretch of games where he completed 40% of his passes while throwing 10 INTs and 4 TDs. In the same vein, the Titans aren't winning when their defense is ranked 23rd in points allowed and 18th in yards allowed.

 

The Titans aren't spending the kind of money on receivers and starting quarterback that will allow them to make great comebacks consistently or have a lot of success in adverse conditions. What you're doing is looking at a symptom of the problem and citing it as the problem. If the defense were playing better (not even, necessarily, as well as last year) then Kerry's numbers would look better because the offense would be in better situations.

 

And on a side note, how many of those incompletions are drops? I don't have the number off the top of my head, but I counted 3-4 simply dropped passes by the receivers against the Jets and I know there were quite a few more before that. A number of those drops have come late in the first three games and hurting his overall numbers.

[dew1679666265]

it's puzzling why they haven't introduced really any wildcat plays with VY and johnson, seems worth a try

 

I wouldn't mind seeing Vince in a Wildcat type formation or contributing to the offense in some way. I am a bit surprised they haven't worked him in it in some capacity.

 

I'm expecting Fisher to at least break it out some in two weeks against the Colts.

 

I have to think it's in the works, but I'm still surprised it wasn't used in the Steelers game or even when the offense was struggling last week.

[dew1679666265]

"We had five drops in the second half and that does not allow you to make plays — three or four of them were on third down,'' Fisher said.

 

Jeff Fisher on the wide receivers in the Jets game.

[shnsajax]

Derek Anderson named starter for Browns.

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=4519314

"I felt like I went out there and did what I can do," Anderson said.

Hysterical. 3 picks in a half - that's definitely what he can do.

 

Now I'm even happier about getting Jets/Saints.

 

They both suck, whats the big deal. If Anderson seems more comfortable in practice I would make the move too.

[brinoch]

Derek Anderson named starter for Browns.

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=4519314

"I felt like I went out there and did what I can do," Anderson said.

Hysterical. 3 picks in a half - that's definitely what he can do.

 

Now I'm even happier about getting Jets/Saints.

 

They both suck, whats the big deal. If Anderson seems more comfortable in practice I would make the move too.

 

Given the sheer terribleness that is that offense, I think I'd take the QB out about 50% of the time, replacing him with a blocking TE and use the Wildcat. You'd turn the ball over a lot less and probably move the ball more effectively.

[JonJayCutler]

Apparently Briggs has some sort of foot injury and sat out practice today. Hopefully it was just precautionary. We're running out of linebackers.

[JonJayCutler]

Wrong thread but I guess it works here too.

[ISUCubsFan]

Derek Anderson named starter for Browns.

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=4519314

"I felt like I went out there and did what I can do," Anderson said.

Hysterical. 3 picks in a half - that's definitely what he can do.

 

Now I'm even happier about getting Jets/Saints.

 

They both suck, whats the big deal. If Anderson seems more comfortable in practice I would make the move too.

 

Given the sheer terribleness that is that offense, I think I'd take the QB out about 50% of the time, replacing him with a blocking TE and use the Wildcat. You'd turn the ball over a lot less and probably move the ball more effectively.

 

Taking the QB out has always seemed like a waste to me. It lets the defense change personnel since they know the wildcat is coming and takes the threat of the reverse pass away. Just split him out wide and let him block a CB. There's a slightly higher injury risk, but if your quarterbacks are Brady Quinn and Derek Anderson who cares?

[USSoccer]

chad ochocinco's autobiography sounds amazing

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/columns/story?columnist=reilly_rick&id=4519152

 

I love me some Ochocinco

[Soul]

Yeah, the Browns find themselves in that familiar Bears position -- choose whatever QB you want, neither is all that great.

 

Hopefully we're out of that mudhole for a good long time.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

Yeah, the Browns are in quite a conundrum. Anderson has the stronger arm, he's just not that accurate. Quinn may make better decisions than Anderson, but he's just not that good.

 

The Browns made the mistake of not trading one when they could. Now neither one would bring back much.

[CubbieBum]

Uhh he could complete passes to keep the offense on the field and let the defense rest. Looking it up this time he is 8 for 24 in the 4th quarter with an interception and rating of 25.9. He's also just 12 for 26 on third down. Essentially Collins is doing well in situations that other teams expect the Titans to be running and is sucking when other teams are expecting the pass.

 

Collins isn't solely to blame and the defense isn't without blame but Collins is the biggest culprit for the 4th quarter let downs.

 

The Titans' offense is not designed to carry the team. The defense is designed to carry the team and the offense (primarily the running game) does enough to win the game. Kerry Collins is not a great quarterback, nor is he good enough to carry a team. But, when the defense is playing well, he is a good enough quarterback to make enough plays and avoid enough mistakes to allow the team to win games. If the offense has to carry the team, the team will not win games.

 

Of the 10 highest paid players on the Titans last season, 4 were offensive players. Three of those four were offensive linemen (Roos, Stewart and Mawae). The only player in the top 10 highest paid Titans was Vince Young - who was expected to be far better than he currently is.

 

The Titans spend far more money on building a great defense than they do on building a great offense that can consistently carry the team to victory. The Colts, for instance, wouldn't win many games if Peyton had a stretch of games where he completed 40% of his passes while throwing 10 INTs and 4 TDs. In the same vein, the Titans aren't winning when their defense is ranked 23rd in points allowed and 18th in yards allowed.

 

The Titans aren't spending the kind of money on receivers and starting quarterback that will allow them to make great comebacks consistently or have a lot of success in adverse conditions. What you're doing is looking at a symptom of the problem and citing it as the problem. If the defense were playing better (not even, necessarily, as well as last year) then Kerry's numbers would look better because the offense would be in better situations.

 

And on a side note, how many of those incompletions are drops? I don't have the number off the top of my head, but I counted 3-4 simply dropped passes by the receivers against the Jets and I know there were quite a few more before that. A number of those drops have come late in the first three games and hurting his overall numbers.

 

All that defense carries the team stuff is fine and dandy but it is impossible for a defense to hold up when they are on the field constantly. The offense has to move the ball to let the defense rest. Not doing so skews the defenses ranks. The defense hasn't been what it used to be but thats to be expected. They lost the center piece of the defense. That is going to make the defense worse. If the offense could move the ball the defense would probably have respectable defense numbers bordering the top 10. Believe me I know all about this being a 49ers fan. The defense has had the skill to be very good for a couple seasons now but the offense continually having three and outs made it impossible for them to put up good numbers.

 

By the way NFC West blogger Mike Sando added up the league leaders in runs for no gains or losses and Chris Johnson leads the league with 21 and has 39.6% of his runs result in a no gain or loss. It's somewhat related but more so just an interesting stat. Johnson will get yards but he will get them on one or two carries and not do much on the other 10-15 carries.

[Soul]

Yeah, the Browns are in quite a conundrum. Anderson has the stronger arm, he's just not that accurate. Quinn may make better decisions than Anderson, but he's just not that good.

 

The Browns made the mistake of not trading one when they could. Now neither one would bring back much.

 

Romeo was still trying to win. In retrospect it would have worked out better if they just traded Anderson when they drafted Quinn. They'd have gotten something in return.

[dew1679666265]

All that defense carries the team stuff is fine and dandy but it is impossible for a defense to hold up when they are on the field constantly. The offense has to move the ball to let the defense rest. Not doing so skews the defenses ranks. The defense hasn't been what it used to be but thats to be expected. They lost the center piece of the defense. That is going to make the defense worse. If the offense could move the ball the defense would probably have respectable defense numbers bordering the top 10. Believe me I know all about this being a 49ers fan. The defense has had the skill to be very good for a couple seasons now but the offense continually having three and outs made it impossible for them to put up good numbers.

 

The defense actually got better as the game went along Sunday against the Jets. However, the offense wasn't able to run its gameplan because the special teams helped put it in a 14-0 hole before the offense stepped on the field. The offense didn't run a play until there were roughly 2 minutes left in the first quarter and the Titans were down by two touchdowns. That forced the offense to throw the ball more than it needs to and, thus, resulted in more 3-and-outs and turnovers than last year.

 

The offense will not be successful on its own, the talent is not there at quarterback and wide receiver for that to be the case. That's why the defense and special teams need to be solid and they have not been this season. The 49ers are a different case from the Titans because under Martz, the 49ers wanted to throw the ball. The Titans want to run it, but when they're down 14-0, they can't run it as much as they want.

 

By the way NFC West blogger Mike Sando added up the league leaders in runs for no gains or losses and Chris Johnson leads the league with 21 and has 39.6% of his runs result in a no gain or loss. It's somewhat related but more so just an interesting stat. Johnson will get yards but he will get them on one or two carries and not do much on the other 10-15 carries.

 

That's interesting, I didn't realize it. As good as Johnson is, though, he's still a "home run threat" type back who will have a lot of 0 yard runs and rushes for a loss because he shoots for that big gain. I would like to see them - and I'm sure Fisher and Heimerdinger want to - integrate LenDale into the offense more. He won't have the big runs CJ has, but he'll usually get some kind of yardage with each run.

 

However again, when we're playing from behind from the start of the game (Jets game) or when the defense is allowing huge gains (Houston game), LenDale's role becomes lessened.

[Andy]

Yeah, the Browns are in quite a conundrum. Anderson has the stronger arm, he's just not that accurate. Quinn may make better decisions than Anderson, but he's just not that good.

 

The Browns made the mistake of not trading one when they could. Now neither one would bring back much.

 

Romeo was still trying to win. In retrospect it would have worked out better if they just traded Anderson when they drafted Quinn. They'd have gotten something in return.

When they drafted Quinn, Anderson was still a nothing. Now if they'd traded him after 2007, it might have been a happy ending.

[Soul]

Yeah, the Browns are in quite a conundrum. Anderson has the stronger arm, he's just not that accurate. Quinn may make better decisions than Anderson, but he's just not that good.

 

The Browns made the mistake of not trading one when they could. Now neither one would bring back much.

 

Romeo was still trying to win. In retrospect it would have worked out better if they just traded Anderson when they drafted Quinn. They'd have gotten something in return.

When they drafted Quinn, Anderson was still a nothing. Now if they'd traded him after 2007, it might have been a happy ending.

 

That's right, my bad. '07 was his big year.

[CubbieBum]

Yeah, the Browns are in quite a conundrum. Anderson has the stronger arm, he's just not that accurate. Quinn may make better decisions than Anderson, but he's just not that good.

 

The Browns made the mistake of not trading one when they could. Now neither one would bring back much.

 

Romeo was still trying to win. In retrospect it would have worked out better if they just traded Anderson when they drafted Quinn. They'd have gotten something in return.

When they drafted Quinn, Anderson was still a nothing. Now if they'd traded him after 2007, it might have been a happy ending.

 

That's right, my bad. '07 was his big year.

 

They should have traded one of them. Not only because they could have gotten a good pick in return but also because whoever wasn't traded could worry about game planning rather than whether or not they will play. I still think both QB's could have been good but both have had their confidence completely obliterated by having to second guess themselves each week.