College Basketball 2009-10

[Guest]

So you admit that the resume is worthy....

Yes...

that must have hurt. :)

[illiniguy]

So you admit that the resume is worthy....

Yes...

that must have hurt. :)

Not really, I don't mind the guy. he's done really well with talent. I just don't think he can get the talent it takes. I think that Jerrance can get that talent, but if he messes around trying to teach life lessons to super talented kids not even Jerrance is going to be able to convince those kids to come.

[Magnetic Curses]

well, that's a different argument.

 

Unfortunately for most of us, the schools we root for are always going to be "stepping stone" jobs for coaches. Heck, when JoePa finally retires/croaks, I expect PSU football to be a stepping stone coaching job.

Yeah pretty much, although Weber's not stepping up for any other job.

That depends a lot on how the next couple years play out.

 

Bruce has been a head coach for 11 years coming into this year. During that time, he has 255 victories - 9th all time for the first 11 years of a coach's career. He also has a final four appearance, consecutive big 10 titles, two additional second place finishes in the big 10, and owns the highest winning percentage of any coach in big 10 history who has coached at least six seasons in the conference.

 

So the foundation of the resume is pretty freaking solid.

 

Let's say this team ends up doing reasonably well, but not spectacular. We'll get enough wins in the big 10 to get to the dance. The bottom of the conference is weak enough that we'll get there. I don't think we'll do much in the tournament unless: 1) paul & dj mature quickly, 2) dmac & davis start putting consistent effort forward throughout the game, 3) the overall defense improves.

 

The expectations next year are going to be huge with the incoming class, a year of experience for DJ & Paul and the three senior anchors. If we were to get to final four or championship level, it is conceivable that Bruce would be in line at that point for a top five job if one opened up (UK, KU, UNC, UCLA, Duke). What works against Bruce is age. He's not going to be looked at as an up and coming coach that is using us as a stepping stone to greener pastures. However, I don't think it matters as I don't see any of those jobs opening up during the near future and I don't see any other program being enough of an upgrade over Illinois to get him to leave.

 

I'd be much more concerned about someone hiring Howard away and hamstringing our recruiting efforts. It's great that Bruce latched onto him and is using his skills in recruiting, but he needs to start developing someone else, too, because Howard only has so long before he gets recruited elsewhere.

 

howard is an illini grad, though, which is very important.

[Guest]

well, that's a different argument.

 

Unfortunately for most of us, the schools we root for are always going to be "stepping stone" jobs for coaches. Heck, when JoePa finally retires/croaks, I expect PSU football to be a stepping stone coaching job.

Yeah pretty much, although Weber's not stepping up for any other job.

That depends a lot on how the next couple years play out.

 

Bruce has been a head coach for 11 years coming into this year. During that time, he has 255 victories - 9th all time for the first 11 years of a coach's career. He also has a final four appearance, consecutive big 10 titles, two additional second place finishes in the big 10, and owns the highest winning percentage of any coach in big 10 history who has coached at least six seasons in the conference.

 

So the foundation of the resume is pretty freaking solid.

 

Let's say this team ends up doing reasonably well, but not spectacular. We'll get enough wins in the big 10 to get to the dance. The bottom of the conference is weak enough that we'll get there. I don't think we'll do much in the tournament unless: 1) paul & dj mature quickly, 2) dmac & davis start putting consistent effort forward throughout the game, 3) the overall defense improves.

 

The expectations next year are going to be huge with the incoming class, a year of experience for DJ & Paul and the three senior anchors. If we were to get to final four or championship level, it is conceivable that Bruce would be in line at that point for a top five job if one opened up (UK, KU, UNC, UCLA, Duke). What works against Bruce is age. He's not going to be looked at as an up and coming coach that is using us as a stepping stone to greener pastures. However, I don't think it matters as I don't see any of those jobs opening up during the near future and I don't see any other program being enough of an upgrade over Illinois to get him to leave.

 

I'd be much more concerned about someone hiring Howard away and hamstringing our recruiting efforts. It's great that Bruce latched onto him and is using his skills in recruiting, but he needs to start developing someone else, too, because Howard only has so long before he gets recruited elsewhere.

 

howard is an illini grad, though, which is very important.

He'll get a mid-major job offer within a few years he won't be able to turn down.

[illiniguy]

well, that's a different argument.

 

Unfortunately for most of us, the schools we root for are always going to be "stepping stone" jobs for coaches. Heck, when JoePa finally retires/croaks, I expect PSU football to be a stepping stone coaching job.

Yeah pretty much, although Weber's not stepping up for any other job.

That depends a lot on how the next couple years play out.

 

Bruce has been a head coach for 11 years coming into this year. During that time, he has 255 victories - 9th all time for the first 11 years of a coach's career. He also has a final four appearance, consecutive big 10 titles, two additional second place finishes in the big 10, and owns the highest winning percentage of any coach in big 10 history who has coached at least six seasons in the conference.

 

So the foundation of the resume is pretty freaking solid.

 

Let's say this team ends up doing reasonably well, but not spectacular. We'll get enough wins in the big 10 to get to the dance. The bottom of the conference is weak enough that we'll get there. I don't think we'll do much in the tournament unless: 1) paul & dj mature quickly, 2) dmac & davis start putting consistent effort forward throughout the game, 3) the overall defense improves.

 

The expectations next year are going to be huge with the incoming class, a year of experience for DJ & Paul and the three senior anchors. If we were to get to final four or championship level, it is conceivable that Bruce would be in line at that point for a top five job if one opened up (UK, KU, UNC, UCLA, Duke). What works against Bruce is age. He's not going to be looked at as an up and coming coach that is using us as a stepping stone to greener pastures. However, I don't think it matters as I don't see any of those jobs opening up during the near future and I don't see any other program being enough of an upgrade over Illinois to get him to leave.

 

I'd be much more concerned about someone hiring Howard away and hamstringing our recruiting efforts. It's great that Bruce latched onto him and is using his skills in recruiting, but he needs to start developing someone else, too, because Howard only has so long before he gets recruited elsewhere.

 

howard is an illini grad, though, which is very important.

He'll get a mid-major job offer within a few years he won't be able to turn down.

That's a good thing I think though. let someone else pay him for on the job training.

[Magnetic Curses]

He'll get a mid-major job offer within a few years he won't be able to turn down.

 

no doubt, but he'll be back.

 

maybe he'll get a high-major offer and he'll build recruiting inroads.

[SouthSideRyan]

Yes, but I see no way we get to a final four next year. Still won't have a true point guard. At this point I just want a tournament win.

 

If we don't win a tournament game next season, Weber's seat is gonna be scalding.

 

Regarding Jerrance, I'm hoping Chester or Dee will be ready to step in his place once he leaves. The timing probably won't work out for Dee who could play another 10 years in Europe if he wants, but Frazier seems like a possibility. I'm not saying either can step right in and be as successful as Jerrance has been, but I'd like having the young Illinois alum in one of the 3 spots, especially if it was one as charismatic as Dee.

[SouthSideRyan]

As far as Weber "identifying" with the kids, I think that's a little overblown. Has Jim Boeheim ever looked like the type a kid could identify with? Grumpy old man Calhoun? Senile Lute? Deputy Dog Roy? Coach K? Thad Matta doesn't exactly look like a slick salesman himself.

 

My viewpoint is the assistant has to be the one the kid indentifies with, sees as somebody he wants to spend 4 years with, the head coach is there to sell the program, sell the system, and sell the kid on what he can do for him.

[Guest]

Some insight in the post-game from Bruce.

 

http://www.312sports.com/blog-entries/171-basketball/584-illini-press-conference-part-1-of-3

[Guest]

As far as Weber "identifying" with the kids, I think that's a little overblown. Has Jim Boeheim ever looked like the type a kid could identify with? Grumpy old man Calhoun? Senile Lute? Deputy Dog Roy? Coach K? Thad Matta doesn't exactly look like a slick salesman himself.

 

My viewpoint is the assistant has to be the one the kid indentifies with, sees as somebody he wants to spend 4 years with, the head coach is there to sell the program, sell the system, and sell the kid on what he can do for him.

 

The last sentence is very very true. And it's manifesting itself as a big problem for UCLA right now.

[illiniguy]

As far as Weber "identifying" with the kids, I think that's a little overblown. Has Jim Boeheim ever looked like the type a kid could identify with? Grumpy old man Calhoun? Senile Lute? Deputy Dog Roy? Coach K? Thad Matta doesn't exactly look like a slick salesman himself.

 

My viewpoint is the assistant has to be the one the kid indentifies with, sees as somebody he wants to spend 4 years with, the head coach is there to sell the program, sell the system, and sell the kid on what he can do for him.

 

The last sentence is very very true. And it's manifesting itself as a big problem for UCLA right now.

Don't you have a loaded class coming in again though? I thought your problem was just so many kids going pro early.

[Guest]

As far as Weber "identifying" with the kids, I think that's a little overblown. Has Jim Boeheim ever looked like the type a kid could identify with? Grumpy old man Calhoun? Senile Lute? Deputy Dog Roy? Coach K? Thad Matta doesn't exactly look like a slick salesman himself.

 

My viewpoint is the assistant has to be the one the kid indentifies with, sees as somebody he wants to spend 4 years with, the head coach is there to sell the program, sell the system, and sell the kid on what he can do for him.

 

The last sentence is very very true. And it's manifesting itself as a big problem for UCLA right now.

Don't you have a loaded class coming in again though? I thought your problem was just so many kids going pro early.

 

Ehh, only 3 commits so far. Josh Smith and Tyler Lamb are highly regarded and hopefully JC point guard Lazeric Jones can contribute.

 

Part of the problem are the early departures, part of the problem are recruiting misses (Jerime Anderson is horrible and he's the only PG on the roster) which I think are partly caused by assistants like Ziegler and Keating leaving and worse assistants coming in. UCLA is getting in later and later on recruits because of misevaluations by the newer assistants and Ben Howland can't show up late and get a recruit like Roy Williams probably can (the main reason UCLA lost out on James Harden and Deon Thompson).

 

Oh...and another problem is that Southern California HS basketball is really starting to fall off in terms of talent.

[snoodmonger]

It's interesting to hear people complain about Weber playing less talented, experienced "glue guys" over more talented freshman, because it seems like fans of every program bitch about that, with a few exceptions.

 

I know KU fans have railed on Self for sticking with hard-working, no talent guys over more physically gifted freshman. Even this year it's a running debate. Brady Morningstar clearly doesn't have the athletic ability/basketball talent of Elijah Johnson, a 5* freshman. But he's older (Morningstar is a RS Junior who came in a year late because of prep school, so dude is like 42), knows the system better, and is less prone to mistakes than EJ would be.

 

Right now, that chatter is at a minimum because we're undefeated and #1, but the moment we lose (especially if Brady is unimpressive in that loss), it'll hit the fan.

 

I don't know how comparable that situation is to the UI one because I really haven't seen the team play yet.

[CubbieBum]

It's interesting to hear people complain about Weber playing less talented, experienced "glue guys" over more talented freshman, because it seems like fans of every program bitch about that, with a few exceptions.

 

I know KU fans have railed on Self for sticking with hard-working, no talent guys over more physically gifted freshman. Even this year it's a running debate. Brady Morningstar clearly doesn't have the athletic ability/basketball talent of Elijah Johnson, a 5* freshman. But he's older (Morningstar is a RS Junior who came in a year late because of prep school, so dude is like 42), knows the system better, and is less prone to mistakes than EJ would be.

 

Right now, that chatter is at a minimum because we're undefeated and #1, but the moment we lose (especially if Brady is unimpressive in that loss), it'll hit the fan.

 

I don't know how comparable that situation is to the UI one because I really haven't seen the team play yet.

 

I think it is a pretty common trait amongst coaches. Weber was an assistant under Keady for a long time and Keady almost never gave freshman good minutes no matter how good they were.

[circlecitycub]

Evan Turner returns tonight vs IU.

[illiniguy]

Evan Turner returns tonight vs IU.

That's insane.

[soapy]

damnit (not that it really matters)

[SouthSideRyan]

Evan Turner returns tonight vs IU.

 

Holy [expletive]

[fromthestretch]

It's interesting to hear people complain about Weber playing less talented, experienced "glue guys" over more talented freshman, because it seems like fans of every program bitch about that, with a few exceptions.

 

I know KU fans have railed on Self for sticking with hard-working, no talent guys over more physically gifted freshman. Even this year it's a running debate. Brady Morningstar clearly doesn't have the athletic ability/basketball talent of Elijah Johnson, a 5* freshman. But he's older (Morningstar is a RS Junior who came in a year late because of prep school, so dude is like 42), knows the system better, and is less prone to mistakes than EJ would be.

 

Right now, that chatter is at a minimum because we're undefeated and #1, but the moment we lose (especially if Brady is unimpressive in that loss), it'll hit the fan.

 

I don't know how comparable that situation is to the UI one because I really haven't seen the team play yet.

 

I think it is a pretty common trait amongst coaches. Weber was an assistant under Keady for a long time and Keady almost never gave freshman good minutes no matter how good they were.

 

Almost never? Keady gave plenty of freshman decent playing time.

[Andy]

Mike Brey has everyone beat on the 'never playing young guys' front. We play a 7-man rotation currently and none are below juniors in eligibility. The only freshmen I can ever remember Brey playing more than a couple of minutes a game in 10 seasons as coach were Chris Thomas and Luke Zeller (because they were Mr. Basketballs in Indiana), Tory Jackson (out of necessity when McAlarney decided to drive around with weed) and Luke Harangody.

[SouthSideRyan]

Couldn't that Barbasol commercial have gotten a guy who had actually shaved within the past 24 hours?

[snoodmonger]

KU down 3 at the half to Cornell.

[CubbieBum]

It's interesting to hear people complain about Weber playing less talented, experienced "glue guys" over more talented freshman, because it seems like fans of every program bitch about that, with a few exceptions.

 

I know KU fans have railed on Self for sticking with hard-working, no talent guys over more physically gifted freshman. Even this year it's a running debate. Brady Morningstar clearly doesn't have the athletic ability/basketball talent of Elijah Johnson, a 5* freshman. But he's older (Morningstar is a RS Junior who came in a year late because of prep school, so dude is like 42), knows the system better, and is less prone to mistakes than EJ would be.

 

Right now, that chatter is at a minimum because we're undefeated and #1, but the moment we lose (especially if Brady is unimpressive in that loss), it'll hit the fan.

 

I don't know how comparable that situation is to the UI one because I really haven't seen the team play yet.

 

I think it is a pretty common trait amongst coaches. Weber was an assistant under Keady for a long time and Keady almost never gave freshman good minutes no matter how good they were.

 

Almost never? Keady gave plenty of freshman decent playing time.

 

Uh no he really didn't. In his last years he had to because his team sucked but for a large majority of his coaching career he wouldn't play freshman much. Like most of the guys from his coaching tree he prefers veterans who limit mistakes because his team's won by creating turnovers defensively and limiting turnovers offensively.

[UMFan83]

Why are Duke and Iowa State randomly playing each other at the United Center, and why is Duke the home team? Are they a traveling barnstorming team playing home games all over the country?

[bcl412]

Why are Duke and Iowa State randomly playing each other at the United Center, and why is Duke the home team? Are they a traveling barnstorming team playing home games all over the country?

 

Recruiting trip to Chicago?