Three Best NL Records

[NCCubFan]

I know it's been said before, but I think the Cardinals will fade away by the end of the year. The best records in the NL by season's end IMO will be:

 

1. Cubs (92-70)

2. Brewers (90-72)

3. Phillies (88-74)

4. D-Backs (86-76)

5. Cardinals (83-79)

I really think 92 wins is too low for this year's Cubs team (and I thought that before the Harden trade).

[Jehrico]

I know it's been said before, but I think the Cardinals will fade away by the end of the year. The best records in the NL by season's end IMO will be:

 

1. Cubs (92-70)

2. Brewers (90-72)

3. Phillies (88-74)

4. D-Backs (86-76)

5. Cardinals (83-79)

The DBacks won't finish over .500.

Sure they will.

Time will tell, but they've been horrible since the first month, and don't have alot of major injuries or anything like that to blame it on. They started 19-7, 12 games over .500. Since the hot start, they've gone 25-38, 13 games under (under .400). They need to improve considerably over what they did the last two months just to play .500 ball.

 

They are 21-10 against the West this year, and 41 of their last 73 games are against that putrid division. While I don't think it's a guarantee that they go over .500, it seems pretty likely.

 

Of course, I expect Colorado to get better as the season goes along which could cut into their wins, and I think the Dodgers are going to hang in there as well.

I forgot to consider how much they play the rest of their crappy division. They're not a .500 team, but they may finish over .500 based solely on their incredibly weak freaking schedule. We'd possibly win 110-120 games this year if we were in the west.

[Birdinal5]

I've yet to see reason 1 why everyone seems to think the Cardinals will "fade." They haven't been playing as well lately, but many forget that at the times when most teams start getting injuries and starters begin to lose stamina the Cardinals will have Mulder, Carpenter and Wainwright returning. This will send at least 2 of Looper, Wellemeyer, Piniero or Lohse to the bullpen. The Cubs made a trade to get Harden and the Brewers mortgaged a big part of their future to get Sabathia. The Cards are on the verge of trading nothing for Chris Carpenter and Adam Wainwright back. In that 28-28 stretch someone cited the Cards were without Pujols for a while, Wainwright, Pineiro missed some starts as well as Wellemeyer. The Cards have been in this for over half the season now and it's time to accept that the Cubs haven't earned the division crown yet.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

I've yet to see reason 1 why everyone seems to think the Cardinals will "fade." They haven't been playing as well lately, but many forget that at the times when most teams start getting injuries and starters begin to lose stamina the Cardinals will have Mulder, Carpenter and Wainwright returning. This will send at least 2 of Looper, Wellemeyer, Piniero or Lohse to the bullpen. The Cubs made a trade to get Harden and the Brewers mortgaged a big part of their future to get Sabathia. The Cards are on the verge of trading nothing for Chris Carpenter and Adam Wainwright back. In that 28-28 stretch someone cited the Cards were without Pujols for a while, Wainwright, Pineiro missed some starts as well as Wellemeyer. The Cards have been in this for over half the season now and it's time to accept that the Cubs haven't earned the division crown yet.

 

Getting Wainwright back may help, but I wouldn't count on anything from Carpenter.

[sneakypower]

i too cannot wait for Carpenter to return

 

thats one team quickly out of the race

[Birdinal5]

I've yet to see reason 1 why everyone seems to think the Cardinals will "fade." They haven't been playing as well lately, but many forget that at the times when most teams start getting injuries and starters begin to lose stamina the Cardinals will have Mulder, Carpenter and Wainwright returning. This will send at least 2 of Looper, Wellemeyer, Piniero or Lohse to the bullpen. The Cubs made a trade to get Harden and the Brewers mortgaged a big part of their future to get Sabathia. The Cards are on the verge of trading nothing for Chris Carpenter and Adam Wainwright back. In that 28-28 stretch someone cited the Cards were without Pujols for a while, Wainwright, Pineiro missed some starts as well as Wellemeyer. The Cards have been in this for over half the season now and it's time to accept that the Cubs haven't earned the division crown yet.

 

Getting Wainwright back may help, but I wouldn't count on anything from Carpenter.

Not expecting Cy Young Carp back, but even at 85% he is better than most MLB starters. Also, they've taken his rehab slowly and not pushed anything. I think he'll at least be able to contribute, plus with Lohse, Looper, Piniero and Wainwright pitching well we won't need him to be lights out.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

I've yet to see reason 1 why everyone seems to think the Cardinals will "fade." They haven't been playing as well lately, but many forget that at the times when most teams start getting injuries and starters begin to lose stamina the Cardinals will have Mulder, Carpenter and Wainwright returning. This will send at least 2 of Looper, Wellemeyer, Piniero or Lohse to the bullpen. The Cubs made a trade to get Harden and the Brewers mortgaged a big part of their future to get Sabathia. The Cards are on the verge of trading nothing for Chris Carpenter and Adam Wainwright back. In that 28-28 stretch someone cited the Cards were without Pujols for a while, Wainwright, Pineiro missed some starts as well as Wellemeyer. The Cards have been in this for over half the season now and it's time to accept that the Cubs haven't earned the division crown yet.

 

Getting Wainwright back may help, but I wouldn't count on anything from Carpenter.

Not expecting Cy Young Carp back, but even at 85% he is better than most MLB starters. Also, they've taken his rehab slowly and not pushed anything. I think he'll at least be able to contribute, plus with Lohse, Looper, Piniero and Wainwright pitching well we won't need him to be lights out.

 

It usually takes 18 months for a pitcher to come back fully from that surgery. He'll be able to throw, but I doubt he'll be the pitcher he needs to be. I may be wrong, but I'd bet that he's less than effective.

[SouthSideRyan]

I've yet to see reason 1 why everyone seems to think the Cardinals will "fade." They haven't been playing as well lately, but many forget that at the times when most teams start getting injuries and starters begin to lose stamina the Cardinals will have Mulder, Carpenter and Wainwright returning. This will send at least 2 of Looper, Wellemeyer, Piniero or Lohse to the bullpen. The Cubs made a trade to get Harden and the Brewers mortgaged a big part of their future to get Sabathia. The Cards are on the verge of trading nothing for Chris Carpenter and Adam Wainwright back. In that 28-28 stretch someone cited the Cards were without Pujols for a while, Wainwright, Pineiro missed some starts as well as Wellemeyer. The Cards have been in this for over half the season now and it's time to accept that the Cubs haven't earned the division crown yet.

 

Getting Wainwright back may help, but I wouldn't count on anything from Carpenter.

 

I'd count on Mulder being the worst pitcher in baseball.

[loukycub]

http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm16/dhohulin/lol.jpg

 

One of these things is not like the others.

http://www.stltoday.com/sports

 

ooh! ooh! lemme guess!

 

one of those pitchers hasn't hurt himself in their game this week.

 

maakmotaERRRRRRRRmark mulder was taken out of the game in the first inning against philadelphia.

[CubbieBum]

http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm16/dhohulin/lol.jpg

 

One of these things is not like the others.

http://www.stltoday.com/sports

 

ooh! ooh! lemme guess!

 

one of those pitchers hasn't hurt himself in their game this week.

 

maakmotaERRRRRRRRmark mulder was taken out of the game in the first inning against philadelphia.

 

Mulder needs to just give up that guy is as bad as Prior and was never as good to begin with.

[Jehrico]

http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm16/dhohulin/lol.jpg

 

One of these things is not like the others.

http://www.stltoday.com/sports

 

ooh! ooh! lemme guess!

 

one of those pitchers hasn't hurt himself in their game this week.

 

maakmotaERRRRRRRRmark mulder was taken out of the game in the first inning against philadelphia.

 

Mulder needs to just give up that guy is as bad as Prior and was never as good to begin with.

Mulder was never good? He was very good in 2001-2003 (142 ERA+ in 2003), and had a pretty good 2005 as well. He's been hurt, yes. Saying he was never good to begin with is just a flat out lie.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

As good as Prior he said.

[NCCubFan]

http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm16/dhohulin/lol.jpg

 

One of these things is not like the others.

http://www.stltoday.com/sports

 

ooh! ooh! lemme guess!

 

one of those pitchers hasn't hurt himself in their game this week.

 

maakmotaERRRRRRRRmark mulder was taken out of the game in the first inning against philadelphia.

 

Mulder needs to just give up that guy is as bad as Prior and was never as good to begin with.

Mulder was never good? He was very good in 2001-2003 (142 ERA+ in 2003), and had a pretty good 2005 as well. He's been hurt, yes. Saying he was never good to begin with is just a flat out lie.

He didn't say Mulder was never good. He said he was never AS good as Prior.

[Birdinal5]

What an awesome comeback for Mulder. :roll: If the doctors say that this injury requires surgery or another long time out I think Mulder will retire. He has already said that he will not try another surgery recovery.

 

Even if we assume the worst from Carpenter (he doesnt pitch well when he comes back) the Cards will still get Wainwright back and our starters (espescially Piniero and Looper) have not shown any performance decline yet.

 

I've still yet to see a valid reason why the Cards won't be in this race when they have been since the start.

[David]

What an awesome comeback for Mulder. :roll: If the doctors say that this injury requires surgery or another long time out I think Mulder will retire. He has already said that he will not try another surgery recovery.

 

Even if we assume the worst from Carpenter (he doesnt pitch well when he comes back) the Cards will still get Wainwright back and our starters (espescially Piniero and Looper) have not shown any performance decline yet.

 

I've still yet to see a valid reason why the Cards won't be in this race when they have been since the start.

 

Because they've been overachieving all year and have already slowed down quite a bit (granted, injuries have played a role).

[Birdinal5]

People keep saying that they are overachieving, but I don't think you can say something like that until the season is over or a few seasons pass. What if this is just the beginning for the likes of Ankiel, Schumaker, Ludwick, McClellan, Wainwright and the rest? What if they repeat this performance next year and keep getting better? Was it overachieving then? No. It was a young team just getting started. If next year with basically the same group of guys they lose 85 games or so then yeah they probably were overachieving, but as for right now you can only say that they are playing better than expected. These "overachieving" numbers from Ankiel and Ludwick may just be their normal numbers given playing time.

 

It's hard for a team to go weeks without its best hitter. A full season without its best pitcher and then more missed time from his replacement. I wonder if Harden goes down if Cubs fans will blame any slowing down on injuries...

 

I agree, as the numbers show, that the Cardinals have slowed down. But slowing down to just over .500 baseball in the NL is cruising to a potential WC berth.

[Banedon]

People keep saying that they are overachieving, but I don't think you can say something like that until the season is over or a few seasons pass. What if this is just the beginning for the likes of Ankiel, Schumaker, Ludwick, McClellan, Wainwright and the rest? What if they repeat this performance next year and keep getting better? Was it overachieving then? No. It was a young team just getting started. If next year with basically the same group of guys they lose 85 games or so then yeah they probably were overachieving, but as for right now you can only say that they are playing better than expected. These "overachieving" numbers from Ankiel and Ludwick may just be their normal numbers given playing time.

 

It's hard for a team to go weeks without its best hitter. A full season without its best pitcher and then more missed time from his replacement. I wonder if Harden goes down if Cubs fans will blame any slowing down on injuries...

 

I agree, as the numbers show, that the Cardinals have slowed down. But slowing down to just over .500 baseball in the NL is cruising to a potential WC berth.

 

This would be true if the Brewers hadn't picked it up and started playing a lot better.

 

The Cards are .500 since June 1.

 

The Brewers are 8 games over .500 since June 1.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

The Cardinals are where they are because of their starting pitching. Namely Lohse and Wellemeyer and Piniero, guys with plenty of history pointing towards them trending downward the remainder of the season.

 

And if the Cards hover at .500 for the rest of the season, they'll be out of the wild card by 5 games.

[bukie]

It's hard for a team to go weeks without its best hitter. A full season without its best pitcher and then more missed time from his replacement. I wonder if Harden goes down if Cubs fans will blame any slowing down on injuries...

 

Yeah, I couldn't imagine going 6 weeks without the Cubs' best hitter, or have their best pitcher on the DL...

[RedFlash]

It usually takes 18 months for a pitcher to come back fully from that surgery. He'll be able to throw, but I doubt he'll be the pitcher he needs to be. I may be wrong, but I'd bet that he's less than effective.

 

To expect a pitcher to jump back into major league baseball, after missing a yr worth of baseball, and to pick up where he left off, before TJS, is wishful thinking. If any Card fans are expecting to see Cy Chris Carpenter, when he comes back, then they are delusional. If they are lucky, they will 2008 Jason Marquis type production out of Carpenter. And for a guy who has missed a full yr of baseball that would be darn good.

[ELCABALLO45]

I don't think the Cardinals are going away. As long as that team has Albert Pujols I will never count them out.

[inari]

I don't think the Cardinals are going away. As long as that team has Albert Pujols I will never count them out.

 

Well that's a pretty foolish reason to never count them out.

[Keener98]

It's hard for a team to go weeks without its best hitter. A full season without its best pitcher and then more missed time from his replacement. I wonder if Harden goes down if Cubs fans will blame any slowing down on injuries...

 

Yeah, I couldn't imagine going 6 weeks without the Cubs' best hitter, or have their best pitcher on the DL...

 

 

The Cubs havent went 6 weeks without their best hitter, or their 2nd best hitter. At best Soriano is our 3rd best hitter. He may be our best power hitter, but hes nowhere close to being our best hitter.

[bukie]

It's hard for a team to go weeks without its best hitter. A full season without its best pitcher and then more missed time from his replacement. I wonder if Harden goes down if Cubs fans will blame any slowing down on injuries...

 

Yeah, I couldn't imagine going 6 weeks without the Cubs' best hitter, or have their best pitcher on the DL...

 

 

The Cubs havent went 6 weeks without their best hitter, or their 2nd best hitter. At best Soriano is our 3rd best hitter. He may be our best power hitter, but hes nowhere close to being our best hitter.

 

Up until Sunday, he was still leading the team in HRs despite 2 DL stints this year, and he leads the team in SLG. He's arguably the most dangerous hitter in the lineup when he's healthy. When he was healthy in May, he was unquestionably the team's best hitter. So, to say nowhere close is a fallacy.

 

Now, he's nowhere close to the most consistent hitter on the team, that's for sure. But when he's on, he's unstoppable.

 

It could be said, though, at different points in the year, 5 players have been the Cubs best hitter, and I'm not talking 1 or 2 games. This is why the Cubs have been well suited to deal with injuries and slumps to offensive players this year. When Soriano, Ramirez, Lee, Soto and Fukudome can all be fantastic players when hot, it only takes one or two of them being on to carry the team. That said, the remainder of the lineup is no slouch either with DeRosa, Theriot and heck, Edmonds.

[Keener98]

It's hard for a team to go weeks without its best hitter. A full season without its best pitcher and then more missed time from his replacement. I wonder if Harden goes down if Cubs fans will blame any slowing down on injuries...

 

Yeah, I couldn't imagine going 6 weeks without the Cubs' best hitter, or have their best pitcher on the DL...

 

 

The Cubs havent went 6 weeks without their best hitter, or their 2nd best hitter. At best Soriano is our 3rd best hitter. He may be our best power hitter, but hes nowhere close to being our best hitter.

 

Up until Sunday, he was still leading the team in HRs despite 2 DL stints this year, and he leads the team in SLG. He's arguably the most dangerous hitter in the lineup when he's healthy. When he was healthy in May, he was unquestionably the team's best hitter. So, to say nowhere close is a fallacy.

 

Now, he's nowhere close to the most consistent hitter on the team, that's for sure. But when he's on, he's unstoppable.

 

It could be said, though, at different points in the year, 5 players have been the Cubs best hitter, and I'm not talking 1 or 2 games. This is why the Cubs have been well suited to deal with injuries and slumps to offensive players this year. When Soriano, Ramirez, Lee, Soto and Fukudome can all be fantastic players when hot, it only takes one or two of them being on to carry the team. That said, the remainder of the lineup is no slouch either with DeRosa, Theriot and heck, Edmonds.

 

I wont argue that Soriano isnt this teams best power hitter, but Lee and Aram are head and shoulders above him as pure hitters.