Are the Brewers going to run away with the Central

[Keener98]

i don't understand why everyone discounts the brewers by saying "well, they're the brewers" as if the cubs are somehow entitled to win games and the brewers aren't.

 

Their lineup to date is better than the Cubs. I just don't think they are running away with the div., which I loosely define as being 10 games up on Sept. 1. They very well could win it, however.

 

Will it continue to be so once Soriano starts to hit? Having gotten nothing from Soriano, the Brewers have still only scored 5 more runs than the Cubs - 117-112.

 

and will hill, lilly and marquis continue to be three of the best pitchers in the NL?

 

Will Z continue to suck? Will our 5 starter spot continue to put up a 10+ ERA?

 

Yes Z will continue to suck, though the 5th slot is sure to be better.

 

And your basis for this is what?

 

Still waiting....

[seanimal]

Yes Z will continue to suck, though the 5th slot is sure to be better.

 

And your basis for this is what?

 

Still waiting....

 

I think that might have been sarcasm.

[brewfandave]

Moreover, your depth/top end talent argument has me scratching my head. Are you saying that their bench is able to replace or match production if someone goes down, but that they do not have the top end talent in the starting lineup that a team such as the Cubs has? Or are you making another argument?

 

Here's how it appears to me:

 

The Brewers have no, count 'em, zero offensive superstars. Count Fielder, Hall and *gulp* Craig Counsell as you will, but nobody on this Brewers team comes close to a performing-to-expectations Derrek Lee, Alfonso Soriano or Aramis Ramirez.

 

What they do have are seven position players (likely eight, upon the callup of Braun) in any given lineup who are capable of going out there and putting up performances upwards of an .800+ OPS. Then, yes, they do have a bench largely capable of replacing most of those players with capable production, especially in the outfield.

 

As for the defense, other than one brutal stretch by Hall and another brutal stretch by the entire infield, the Brewers have been solid on defense, and, as you would expect from a very young team, they're only going to get better. See: Weeks, Rickie.

[Outshined_One]

Here's how it appears to me:

 

The Brewers have no, count 'em, zero offensive superstars. Count Fielder, Hall and *gulp* Craig Counsell as you will, but nobody on this Brewers team comes close to a performing-to-expectations Derrek Lee, Alfonso Soriano or Aramis Ramirez.

 

What they do have are seven position players (likely eight, upon the callup of Braun) in any given lineup who are capable of going out there and putting up performances upwards of an .800+ OPS. Then, yes, they do have a bench largely capable of replacing most of those players with capable production, especially in the outfield.

 

Alright, that makes sense to me. Thanks.

 

Out of curiosity, do any of you Brewer fans know what they're planning for Braun and Gallardo? Both have been tearing it up in AAA in a short amount of time this season and probably could immediately upgrade the team upon getting called up.

[Keener98]

Yes Z will continue to suck, though the 5th slot is sure to be better.

 

And your basis for this is what?

 

Still waiting....

 

I think that might have been sarcasm.

 

I dont think it was. If I recall hes posted on here before about Zambrano. I believe it dealt with saying Sheets was far and away a better pitcher than Z coming into the season.

[seanimal]

Yes Z will continue to suck, though the 5th slot is sure to be better.

 

And your basis for this is what?

 

Still waiting....

 

I think that might have been sarcasm.

 

I dont think it was. If I recall hes posted on here before about Zambrano. I believe it dealt with saying Sheets was far and away a better pitcher than Z coming into the season.

 

Now that's just silly.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

Brewers losing to the Pirates tonight.

[98navigator]

Brewers lost to the Pirates tonight.

 

fixed :)

[seanimal]

If there is one way to ensure that something will not happen, I'm convinced it's by starting a thread on NSBB saying that it will happen. Convinced.

[Ender]

My understanding is that a .300 BABIP is above league average in BABIP

 

Its between .290-.300.

 

And your basis for this is what?

 

He certainly won't be as bad as he has been this year, but he'll be the pitcher who posted a 3.64 ERA/ 1.34 post all star break last year who only had 2 really good months the entire season. He has been abused for 3+ years and its catching up to him.

[Keener98]

My understanding is that a .300 BABIP is above league average in BABIP

 

Its between .290-.300.

 

And your basis for this is what?

 

He certainly won't be as bad as he has been this year, but he'll be the pitcher who posted a 3.64 ERA/ 1.34 post all star break last year who only had 2 really good months the entire season. He has been abused for 3+ years and its catching up to him.

 

And what will Ben Sheets be?

[brewfandave]

Out of curiosity, do any of you Brewer fans know what they're planning for Braun and Gallardo? Both have been tearing it up in AAA in a short amount of time this season and probably could immediately upgrade the team upon getting called up.

 

There are a couple of scenarios.

 

First, with Braun, the Brewers are waiting for enough time to pass to not burn too many pre-arbitration years. I don't know how that works because I know very little about the arbitration process, but I've heard late May-early June talked about for the cutoff date. This coincides pretty nicely with interleague play, methinks. With Braun's glove being the issue (although AAA reports show that he's only committed two errors), he's an ideal DH. From rumors I've heard (and these are friend of a sister of an illicit mistress of a Brewer scout's secretary sort of thing), this is most likely.

 

Then, when interleague play ends, we could slot him into the starting third base role vs lefties, leaving Graffanino and Counsell in their proper place, as a backup for Rickie Weeks and JJ Hardy, respectively. Of course, should there be any sort of injury to the starting infield, he'd be up by the end of the day. An amusing note - in Spring Training, in every game in which Braun committed an error, he later hit a home run. What happened this week in Nashville? He committed his second error and then hit his (eighth? ninth?) home run. This kid could hit balls out of the park with a whiffle bat.

 

I believe that Yo Gallardo is going to stay in AAA unless there's an injury or somebody explodes. With Carlos Villanueva really starting to pitch, and with Jose Capellan showing up at games, there's no reason to call up Yo for the bullpen. Remember that this kid started last year in A-ball. They don't want to rush him too much.

 

Gallardo is really exciting, though. Among scouts, he's considered to have "ace" stuff, and he's regarded in the same class as Philip Hughes or Cole Hamels. Of course, being in Milwaukee's farm system, he's a prospect, where a guy like Philip Hughes is a phenom. Such is the nature of the media.

[brewfandave]

My understanding is that a .300 BABIP is above league average in BABIP

 

Its between .290-.300.

 

And your basis for this is what?

 

He certainly won't be as bad as he has been this year, but he'll be the pitcher who posted a 3.64 ERA/ 1.34 post all star break last year who only had 2 really good months the entire season. He has been abused for 3+ years and its catching up to him.

 

And what will Ben Sheets be?

 

About the same - fewer walks, about the same number of hits and a slightly higher propensity to cough up gopher balls. Ben Sheets has finally figured out his curveball, which bodes poorly for opposing hitters.

 

It's easy to forget just how good Ben Sheets is since he's been hurt for so long, but his 2005 numbers were stellar before his injury, and his '06 numbers weren't terrible, either. They steadily improved from July. This tells me the injury is in the past, and he has his stuff back.

[Soul]

Brewers lost to the Pirates tonight.

 

fixed :)

 

I didn't watch closely, but I think the game was lost on a 3 run jack hit off the bullpen.

 

A chink in the armor, perhaps? :-k

[Keener98]

My understanding is that a .300 BABIP is above league average in BABIP

 

Its between .290-.300.

 

And your basis for this is what?

 

He certainly won't be as bad as he has been this year, but he'll be the pitcher who posted a 3.64 ERA/ 1.34 post all star break last year who only had 2 really good months the entire season. He has been abused for 3+ years and its catching up to him.

 

And what will Ben Sheets be?

 

About the same - fewer walks, about the same number of hits and a slightly higher propensity to cough up gopher balls. Ben Sheets has finally figured out his curveball, which bodes poorly for opposing hitters.

 

It's easy to forget just how good Ben Sheets is since he's been hurt for so long, but his 2005 numbers were stellar before his injury, and his '06 numbers weren't terrible, either. They steadily improved from July. This tells me the injury is in the past, and he has his stuff back.

 

The injuries are in the past, even though hes already left a start early in the first month of the season?

[brewfandave]

This tells me the injury is in the past, and he has his stuff back.

 

The injuries are in the past, even though hes already left a start early in the first month of the season?

 

Injury not injuries. The back injury is what ruined his seasons in '05 and '06. Pulling him from the game with a groin strain in 40 degree weather was a precaution. He returned the next start and pitched as well as he's pitched all year. Remember the "finding his curveball" part? His curve started dropping in that last start.

 

With his curveball dropping like it used to, expect the Ks to go up, as that's his "out" pitch, and hits and ERA to go down.

[Keener98]

This tells me the injury is in the past, and he has his stuff back.

 

The injuries are in the past, even though hes already left a start early in the first month of the season?

 

Injury not injuries. The back injury is what ruined his seasons in '05 and '06. Pulling him from the game with a groin strain in 40 degree weather was a precaution. He returned the next start and pitched as well as he's pitched all year. Remember the "finding his curveball" part? His curve started dropping in that last start.

 

With his curveball dropping like it used to, expect the Ks to go up, as that's his "out" pitch, and hits and ERA to go down.

 

Well call me pessimistic, but until Sheets finishes a full year of pitching I dont trust him. To me hes more at risk of being hurt than Zambrano. I know Z has had a big workload in the past but Sheets is a rather big guy, and its hard to rid yourself of a back injury. When healthy he is usually a great pitcher, but so are Mark Prior and Kerry Wood.

[brewfandave]

Well call me pessimistic, but until Sheets finishes a full year of pitching I dont trust him. To me hes more at risk of being hurt than Zambrano. I know Z has had a big workload in the past but Sheets is a rather big guy, and its hard to rid yourself of a back injury. When healthy he is usually a great pitcher, but so are Mark Prior and Kerry Wood.

 

Apples to oranges. The better risk comparison is this: What's more likely: Sheets getting injured or Zambrano succumbing to being a barely-contained lumpy wildman consisting chiefly of high fastballs and animal fury?

 

For the record, I was never implying or assuming Zambrano would get hurt. He doesn't seem like the injury-prone type.

[SouthSideRyan]

 

What's more likely: Sheets getting injured or Zambrano succumbing to being a barely-contained lumpy wildman consisting chiefly of high fastballs and animal fury?

 

Ahhh there it is. Zambrano will be worse because you don't like the way he acts.

[Keener98]

 

What's more likely: Sheets getting injured or Zambrano succumbing to being a barely-contained lumpy wildman consisting chiefly of high fastballs and animal fury?

 

Ahhh there it is. Zambrano will be worse because you don't like the way he acts.

 

Ya its funny how these Brewer fans are acting like Sheets is the next coming, and Z is a "barely contained lumpy(if u are calling Z lumpy I think you need to call Sheets lumpy) wildman consisting chiefly of high fastballs and animal fury?

[98navigator]

This tells me the injury is in the past, and he has his stuff back.

 

The injuries are in the past, even though hes already left a start early in the first month of the season?

 

Injury not injuries. The back injury is what ruined his seasons in '05 and '06. Pulling him from the game with a groin strain in 40 degree weather was a precaution. He returned the next start and pitched as well as he's pitched all year. Remember the "finding his curveball" part? His curve started dropping in that last start.

 

With his curveball dropping like it used to, expect the Ks to go up, as that's his "out" pitch, and hits and ERA to go down.

 

Wrong! Sheets has had shoulder and back issues. The fact remains that he's been DL'd 2 of the last 3 seasons. Cubs fans understand that a team can be derailed by an injury prone starting pitcher.

 

2006:

 

Limited to career-low 17 starts and 106 innings as a second straight season was cut short by injuries. ... Started the year on the disabled list with a strained muscle behind his right shoulder and missed a chance for his fifth consecutive Opening Day start. Returned for four starts, then suffered tendinitis in the front of his shoulder in early May and did not pitch again until July 25.

 

2005:

placed on the 15-Day Disabled List on April 29 with Vestibular neuritis...suffered a muscle strain on August 26 in his start against Atlanta ... left the game in the middle of the seventh inning ... placed on the 15-Day Disabled List on August 27 with a tear to his right latissimus dorsi muscle ... transfered to the 60-Day Disabled List on September 20

 

2004:

 

...had successful surgery on October 12 to repair a lumbar disk herniation ... the procedure, a microscopic lumbar discectomy, was performed by Dr. Drew Dossett in Dallas, Texas.

[brewfandave]

The Zambrano thing was a joke implying that he has command issues, especially when flustered. I was hoping to get laughs and maybe a "hey, he DOES have command issues!" out of it. I think Z is a tremendously talented pitcher occasionally held back by his tendency to melt down.

 

I thought "barely contained lumpy wildman consisting chiefly of high fastballs and animal fury" was clearly enough a joke. When it comes to performance, I don't care if he's an ass on the mound - I'm not saying his attitude will hold him back - I'm saying the lack of self-control that sometimes leads to meltdowns might.

 

I'm also waiting to see if Sheets can last a season. Good catch on the multiple injuries. I don't think he's the second coming. I think he's an ace-caliber pitcher when healthy, and hope he stays healthy. I also think Zambrano IS an ace pitcher.

 

Anyway, can we chalk this up to a joke blown way out of proportion?

 

PS - if you're going to call any Brewers "lumpy," Prince Fielder is usually the obvious choice - there's a great Dugout with him and the Miller Park Sausages...

[Keener98]

The Zambrano thing was a joke implying that he has command issues, especially when flustered. I was hoping to get laughs and maybe a "hey, he DOES have command issues!" out of it. I think Z is a tremendously talented pitcher occasionally held back by his tendency to melt down.

 

I thought "barely contained lumpy wildman consisting chiefly of high fastballs and animal fury" was clearly enough a joke. When it comes to performance, I don't care if he's an ass on the mound - I'm not saying his attitude will hold him back - I'm saying the lack of self-control that sometimes leads to meltdowns might.

 

I'm also waiting to see if Sheets can last a season. Good catch on the multiple injuries. I don't think he's the second coming. I think he's an ace-caliber pitcher when healthy, and hope he stays healthy. I also think Zambrano IS an ace pitcher.

 

Anyway, can we chalk this up to a joke blown way out of proportion?

 

PS - if you're going to call any Brewers "lumpy," Prince Fielder is usually the obvious choice - there's a great Dugout with him and the Miller Park Sausages...

 

Nvm anything I said Z sucks

[Ender]

My understanding is that a .300 BABIP is above league average in BABIP

 

Its between .290-.300.

 

And your basis for this is what?

 

He certainly won't be as bad as he has been this year, but he'll be the pitcher who posted a 3.64 ERA/ 1.34 post all star break last year who only had 2 really good months the entire season. He has been abused for 3+ years and its catching up to him.

 

And what will Ben Sheets be?

 

Hard to say, players coming off a lingering injury are harder to predict. My guess is he's in the low 3's with a solid WHIP but lower K rate than normal. He's a better pitcher than Zambrano in my opinion but Carlos has the better stuff, he's just more of a thrower than a pitcher.

 

I really do think the abuse has gotten to Zambrano's arm though, I don't think he's going to ever have that huge breakout year that was expected before because of it.

[SouthSideRyan]

I always hear about Zambrano's emotions causing him to get out of hand, the problem is, you never really see it. A guy who lets his emotions get the best of him doesn't bounce back from a 4 run 1st to allow no more runs the rest of the way.

 

Z's always been wild, he'll probably always be wild. But he's got a longer, better track record than Sheets and has managed to stay healthy throughout that time while Sheets has been bothered by nagging problems.