Great article on Prior... See's the other side of the story

[cubsfan5150]

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/columns/story?columnist=wojciechowski_gene&id=2851466&sportCat=mlb&CMP=OTC-DT9705204233

 

 

Very entertaining.

[Lockes Eye Scar]

Great read. I still have hope for him.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

Good article. I only hope there's a happy ending to the Prior saga.

[soccer10k]

Good article. I only hope there's a happy ending to the Prior saga.

 

Yup, more than anything I would like to see the guy healthy. Obviously I would prefer if he was healthy with the Cubs but I would like to see him get back to being a strong pitcher.

[Wilson A2000]

"That's a pretty high load for a guy," Woolner said. "At a very young age, [Prior] was worked harder than almost every other pitcher in the baseball. He and Wood were two of the four most heavily worked pitchers in 2003. And almost immediately after that, [Prior] started experiencing problems."

 

Did Baker, who was in a no-win situation, contribute to derailing Prior's career? Some have written, or at least hinted, at that. Woolner won't go that far because the research isn't conclusive. The July 11, 2003, collision with Atlanta Braves infielder Marcus Giles might have contributed to the shoulder problems. And Prior was a workhorse at USC even before he got to the Cubs (he threw 357 college innings).

 

Nobody knows for sure.

[RegulusBlue]

/sigh

 

I hope he comes back, but I've left him in the Cubs' past for now.

[TruffleShuffle]

this can't be right. he's a pansy.

[Wheelimus]

Not resigning Mark Prior would be the stupidest thing possible for the Cubs. Since he won't play any this year we'll have him for two more seasons. The first, no doubt, on the cheap. Now that we know there was a problem and it's been corrected, there is no reason not to give him the chance.

 

If not, well, get ready for the Cardinals to sign him up and for him to resurrect his career. I imagine we'd get to see it first hand when the Cardinals beat us 1-0 in game 7 of the NLCS. Seems like a fitting chapter in Cubbie hell...

[TruffleShuffle]

If not, well, get ready for the Cardinals to sign him up and for him to resurrect his career. I imagine we'd get to see it first hand when the Cardinals beat us 1-0 in game 7 of the NLCS. Seems like a fitting chapter in Cubbie hell...

 

the funniest part about this is the thing about the Cubs being in the NLCS

[Backtobanks]

Not resigning Mark Prior would be the stupidest thing possible for the Cubs. Since he won't play any this year we'll have him for two more seasons. The first, no doubt, on the cheap. Now that we know there was a problem and it's been corrected, there is no reason not to give him the chance.

 

If not, well, get ready for the Cardinals to sign him up and for him to resurrect his career. I imagine we'd get to see it first hand when the Cardinals beat us 1-0 in game 7 of the NLCS. Seems like a fitting chapter in Cubbie hell...

 

I agree. The Cubs have spent money on pitchers like Scott Williamson and Wade Miller to come back from serious injuries, you might as well invest a little in a guy that has (had) a world of talent and is still young. Of course, that's assuming Prior would agree to some kind of reasonable contract spread over the next few years. I know the history of Mark Prior in Chicago, but if the Cubs follow the same path as this year (don't count on him and anything at all is a plus) I think re-signing him would be a wise choice.

[DurbanJer]

makes me hate Dusty more than ever. Really. I want Prior back and healthy. A healthy Prior would makes us contenders again. Imagine Z and Hill and Prior in one rotation. Or being able to trade Z for ARod. Or Or Or

 

Ah hell. Stupid Dusty Baker. Stupid Marcus Giles. Stupid two years without diagnosing the problem.

 

Makes me wanna drink.

[ltb]

$3 million is nothing to this team, especially one that wastes millions of dollars on guys like cliff floyd, cesar izturis, and wade miller. letting prior simply walk (which i don't expect at all), in my opinion, would end up being one of the biggest blunders of the jim hendry era (yeah, that's big). it's a bit early to speculate on the terms of a contract, but as the tender deadline approaches, we should have a better idea of how his rehab is progressing.

 

to pay him for this year - to get the surgery and everything done - and then let him go just makes no sense to me, especially for a guy with that much talent who's only going to be 27 at the beginning of next year.

[seanimal]

/sigh

 

I hope he comes back, but I've left him in the Cubs' past for now.

 

+1

[DurbanJer]

somebody else said it, but we've given far lesser pitchers a chance after major arm surgery (Miller and Williamson), giving Prior a chance is a no-brainer.

[Sammy Sofa]

somebody else said it, but we've given far lesser pitchers a chance after major arm surgery (Miller and Williamson), giving Prior a chance is a no-brainer.

 

Of course, being the Cubs, they'll likely finally get tired of all those "repair projects" and decide Prior is the one where they'll take a stand and say, "NO MORE!" Figures.

[CaliforniaRaisin]

Not resigning Mark Prior would be the stupidest thing possible for the Cubs. Since he won't play any this year we'll have him for two more seasons. The first, no doubt, on the cheap. Now that we know there was a problem and it's been corrected, there is no reason not to give him the chance.

 

If not, well, get ready for the Cardinals to sign him up and for him to resurrect his career. I imagine we'd get to see it first hand when the Cardinals beat us 1-0 in game 7 of the NLCS. Seems like a fitting chapter in Cubbie hell...

 

I agree. The Cubs have spent money on pitchers like Scott Williamson and Wade Miller to come back from serious injuries, you might as well invest a little in a guy that has (had) a world of talent and is still young. Of course, that's assuming Prior would agree to some kind of reasonable contract spread over the next few years. I know the history of Mark Prior in Chicago, but if the Cubs follow the same path as this year (don't count on him and anything at all is a plus) I think re-signing him would be a wise choice.

 

Exactly. They've given chances to Williamson, Miller and Dempster (plus, they technically did with Woody this past offseason too). Hendry sure could do this if he got along with Prior.

[DivineBovine]

Go ahead and re-sign him.

 

But I simply don't get the thinking that since they've identified the problem, all is well. That's nonsense. It sounds like he had a lot of damage, and shoulder injuries are notorious in baseball. I don't see any real reason for optimism just because he had a surgery. He had an arthroscopic procedure to "debride" (a fancy term for "scraping off junk) and "repair" (who knows what that means) his shoulder.

 

It's not like he had a broken bone or torn ligament that nobody knew about that was repaired.

 

We can all be optimistic, but I'd be shocked if he ever returned to the Prior who won 18 games with a 2.45 ERA. It's too bad.

[tkenm356]

I hope his arm doesn't hurt enough to sign the baseball card I'm supposed to get.....

 

http://www.haloangel.net/damnyouprior.gif

 

The sad part is he's not listed in the price guides...... and I don'tr even know if I'd consider him a semi-star price anymore... he may just be a lowly common :(

 

 

 

I'll sell it for $25 when I get it, any takers? :)

 

In all seriousness though, I like the article, there may be hope for the fella yet

[Sarcastic]

The sad thing is that for every good article on Prior, there are 20 almost saying outright, "His career is over, and the Cubs need to dump him ASAP. Good riddance." Paul Sullivan, a few days ago, wrote an article impying Prior was gone for good after this year, not that I'd expect any less from a journalist of his standing. What I want to know is, where are these guys getting their material? In Sullivan's article, you could tell that it wass more or less a personal disdain for Prior, due to his uncooperative attitude toward the media during his rehabs. But are they really trying to run him out of town for that? Do they really think the Cubs are going to pay him to rehab this year and then cut him before he throws a pitch?

[Banedon]

The most stunning part of this good article is it's author.

[jersey cubs fan]

In Sullivan's article, you could tell that it wass more or less a personal disdain for Prior, due to his uncooperative attitude toward the media during his rehabs.

 

I think some people involved with the team have also contributed to the negative press around Prior. The tough guys who don't believe abusing a pitcher is a real concept don't think for a second they did anything wrong, and believe Prior is a wuss. Some writers are feeding on that.

[OleMissCub]

Baseball Prospectus, which publishes what amounts to an annual statistical research bible, details the effects of PAP -- Pitcher Abuse Point. Yeah, it's a seamhead thing, but in layman's terms, PAP is a way of predicting whether your arm is going to fall off if you keep putting up high pitch totals. It mostly shows short-term risk, but there's also a relationship between inflated pitch numbers and long-term risk.

 

So I called one of the co-authors of PAP research, Keith Woolner, a contributing writer for Baseball Prospectus. He looked up the 2003 PAP numbers. Kerry Wood had the second-highest PAP totals in the majors, Prior the fourth-highest.

[Section538]

From Will Carroll's chat at Baseball Prospectus yesterday:

 

http://www.baseballprospectus.com/chat/chat.php?chatId=289&mode=print&nocache=1178043605

 

 

Kelly (Cedar Rapids, IA): How close in severity were Prior's and Carpeter's injuries. Is there any reason that Prior couldn't come back the way Carpeter did?

 

Will Carroll: From my understanding, they were very similar. If anything, Carpenter's was a bit worse, plus had elbow problems before and after the shoulder surgery. There's plenty of reasons he couldn't come back, but I'd rather focus on the possibility that he could.

 

That's more promising than anything I'd heard previously. To me it's a no-brainer to hold on to him. I don't buy the whole 'he just needs a change of scenery' bs.

[Jon]

The sad thing is that for every good article on Prior, there are 20 almost saying outright, "His career is over, and the Cubs need to dump him ASAP. Good riddance." Paul Sullivan, a few days ago, wrote an article impying Prior was gone for good after this year, not that I'd expect any less from a journalist of his standing. What I want to know is, where are these guys getting their material? In Sullivan's article, you could tell that it wass more or less a personal disdain for Prior, due to his uncooperative attitude toward the media during his rehabs. But are they really trying to run him out of town for that? Do they really think the Cubs are going to pay him to rehab this year and then cut him before he throws a pitch?

Personal disdain is one way to put it, although it's not because of his rehabs. He told a class of mine a couple of years ago that not only does he have a grudge against Prior, but he sees no reason as to why he should even try and be impartial when he writes.

 

I believe it stems from being somewhat uncooperative with Sullivan early in Prior's career.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

The sad thing is that for every good article on Prior, there are 20 almost saying outright, "His career is over, and the Cubs need to dump him ASAP. Good riddance." Paul Sullivan, a few days ago, wrote an article impying Prior was gone for good after this year, not that I'd expect any less from a journalist of his standing. What I want to know is, where are these guys getting their material? In Sullivan's article, you could tell that it wass more or less a personal disdain for Prior, due to his uncooperative attitude toward the media during his rehabs. But are they really trying to run him out of town for that? Do they really think the Cubs are going to pay him to rehab this year and then cut him before he throws a pitch?

Personal disdain is one way to put it, although it's not because of his rehabs. He told a class of mine a couple of years ago that not only does he have a grudge against Prior, but he sees no reason as to why he should even try and be impartial when he writes.

 

I believe it stems from being somewhat uncooperative with Sullivan early in Prior's career.

 

I keep wondering how Sullivan keeps a job at a paper as large as the Tribune. He seems like he'd fit in better at the The News-Star.