Cubs re-sign Miller

[Wheelimus]

Resigning him had to be a no brainer since he was willing to take a one year deal. He'll (presumably) be coming into spring training healthy, which is a big change from the past two seasons for him.

 

I'm willing to bet that Wade Miller has one more solid year in his arm, and it mine as well be with us.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

I don't understand why Miller is a more appealing option than Marshall, Marmol, Mateo, Guzman, or Ryu.

 

He's actually performed at a high level before, none of those guys have.

 

Career ERA+ of 112. You might be lucky to get 100 innings of 90 ERA+ out of any of those other options. Miller might be able to give you 150 inning at 100-110, and it wouldn't be ridiculous if he gave you 190 innings at 120 ERA+.

 

What makes Miller more likely to be good than any of the younger guys? The Cubs made the playoffs the last time he threw a full season, he had major rotator cuff surgery, and he was terrible in his brief stint in the majors this year. He's done it in the past, but he's not the same guy he was when he was successful.

Edited November 9, 2006 by Transmogrified Tiger

[CubColtPacer]

I don't understand why Miller is a more appealing option than Marshall, Marmol, Mateo, Guzman, or Ryu.

 

He's actually performed at a high level before, none of those guys have.

 

Career ERA+ of 112. You might be lucky to get 100 innings of 90 ERA+ out of any of those other options. Miller might be able to give you 150 inning at 100-110, and it wouldn't be ridiculous if he gave you 190 innings at 120 ERA+.

 

What makes Miller more likely to be good than any of the younger guys? The Cubs made the playoffs the last time he threw a full season, he had major rotator cuff surgery, and he was terrible in his brief stint in the majors this year.

 

Miller's terrible end of 2006 was still much better than any of the young guys besides Hill end of 2006.

[Wheelimus]

And it's not like he's being given the rotation spot, if he sucks he'll wind up in the Glendon longman role and eat innings in blowouts.

[goonys evil twin]

I don't understand why Miller is a more appealing option than Marshall, Marmol, Mateo, Guzman, or Ryu.

 

He's actually performed at a high level before, none of those guys have.

 

Career ERA+ of 112. You might be lucky to get 100 innings of 90 ERA+ out of any of those other options. Miller might be able to give you 150 inning at 100-110, and it wouldn't be ridiculous if he gave you 190 innings at 120 ERA+.

 

What makes Miller more likely to be good than any of the younger guys? The Cubs made the playoffs the last time he threw a full season, he had major rotator cuff surgery, and he was terrible in his brief stint in the majors this year. He's done it in the past, but he's not the same guy he was when he was successful.

 

I'm not saying he's very likely to be good. But those kids are almost locks not to be good. They all sucked last year, and none of them should have, or would have, been in the majors anyway. Miller is probably a better bet to be good. But it's not an either/or situation here, and I don't see why you are trying to paint it as such. Miller should be viewed as another option in a big batch of other options. He's probably ahead of the rest as of this very moment. But hopefully they'd be more than willing to go to somebody else if another person proves more reliable.

 

FYI, Miller had an ERA+ of 101 in his brief stint this year.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

I don't understand why Miller is a more appealing option than Marshall, Marmol, Mateo, Guzman, or Ryu.

 

He's actually performed at a high level before, none of those guys have.

 

Career ERA+ of 112. You might be lucky to get 100 innings of 90 ERA+ out of any of those other options. Miller might be able to give you 150 inning at 100-110, and it wouldn't be ridiculous if he gave you 190 innings at 120 ERA+.

 

What makes Miller more likely to be good than any of the younger guys? The Cubs made the playoffs the last time he threw a full season, he had major rotator cuff surgery, and he was terrible in his brief stint in the majors this year.

 

Miller's terrible end of 2006 was still much better than any of the young guys besides Hill end of 2006.

 

Nope.

 

Miller: 21.2 IP, 1.71 WHIP, 1.11 K/BB, 1.66 HR/9, .232/.376/.402/.771 line against

 

Marshall: 125.2 IP, 1.52 WHIP, 1.30 K/BB, 1.43 HR/9, .270/.356/.444/.795 line against

 

Marmol: 77 IP, 1.69 WHIP, 1.00 K/BB, 1.63 HR/9, .250/.386/.482/.862 line against

 

Guzman: 56 IP, 1.88 WHIP, 1.62 K/BB, 1.44 HR/9, .308/.416/.507/.915 line against

 

Mateo: 45.2 IP, 1.62 WHIP, 1.52 K/BB, 1.18 HR/9, .288/.376/.475/.841 line against

 

Ryu: 15 IP, 1.93 WHIP, 2.83 K/BB, 4.26 HR/9, .348/.419/.758/1.160 line against

[Transmogrified Tiger]

I don't understand why Miller is a more appealing option than Marshall, Marmol, Mateo, Guzman, or Ryu.

 

He's actually performed at a high level before, none of those guys have.

 

Career ERA+ of 112. You might be lucky to get 100 innings of 90 ERA+ out of any of those other options. Miller might be able to give you 150 inning at 100-110, and it wouldn't be ridiculous if he gave you 190 innings at 120 ERA+.

 

What makes Miller more likely to be good than any of the younger guys? The Cubs made the playoffs the last time he threw a full season, he had major rotator cuff surgery, and he was terrible in his brief stint in the majors this year. He's done it in the past, but he's not the same guy he was when he was successful.

 

I'm not saying he's very likely to be good. But those kids are almost locks not to be good. They all sucked last year, and none of them should have, or would have, been in the majors anyway.

 

Again, why are all of those kids near locks to be terrible? Miller was just as bad as them, is 30 years old coming off major shoulder surgery, and he's a more reliable option? I don't buy that.

[CubColtPacer]

I don't understand why Miller is a more appealing option than Marshall, Marmol, Mateo, Guzman, or Ryu.

 

He's actually performed at a high level before, none of those guys have.

 

Career ERA+ of 112. You might be lucky to get 100 innings of 90 ERA+ out of any of those other options. Miller might be able to give you 150 inning at 100-110, and it wouldn't be ridiculous if he gave you 190 innings at 120 ERA+.

 

What makes Miller more likely to be good than any of the younger guys? The Cubs made the playoffs the last time he threw a full season, he had major rotator cuff surgery, and he was terrible in his brief stint in the majors this year.

 

Miller's terrible end of 2006 was still much better than any of the young guys besides Hill end of 2006.

 

Nope.

 

Miller: 21.2 IP, 1.71 WHIP, 1.11 K/BB, 1.66 HR/9, .232/.376/.402/.771 line against

 

Marshall: 125.2 IP, 1.52 WHIP, 1.30 K/BB, 1.43 HR/9, .270/.356/.444/.795 line against

 

Marmol: 77 IP, 1.69 WHIP, 1.00 K/BB, 1.63 HR/9, .250/.386/.482/.862 line against

 

Guzman: 56 IP, 1.88 WHIP, 1.62 K/BB, 1.44 HR/9, .308/.416/.507/.915 line against

 

Mateo: 45.2 IP, 1.62 WHIP, 1.52 K/BB, 1.18 HR/9, .288/.376/.475/.841 line against

 

Ryu: 15 IP, 1.93 WHIP, 2.83 K/BB, 4.26 HR/9, .348/.419/.758/1.160 line against

 

You didn't even put ERA on there or any of its derivitives-while not the end all be all, it still deserves to be on there as much as the other stats. Miller had the best ERA by far, and he had the best OPS overall with everybody but Marshall, who he had a slight edge with (and Marshall was known last year for keeping those other peripherals down by shutting down the opponent for a few innings and bunching all the hits and walks into one inning-which still makes for not a great pitcher).

 

If all 6 were to start and get a full season, then it likely would happen that 1 or 2 of the young guys might beat Miller. They only fill one spot though-and Miller is the most likely of any one of them individually to do well next year.

[goonys evil twin]

Again, why are all of those kids near locks to be terrible?

 

Are you kidding me? They were all terrible last year, and none of them are near being fantastic prospects who are just bound to improve in 2007.

[RichHillIsABeast]

Miller has pitched successfully at the ML level for more than 200 innings.

 

Miller is still healing up. Comparing his 2006 numbers to a bunch of minor leaguers is silly.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Again, why are all of those kids near locks to be terrible?

 

Are you kidding me? They were all terrible last year, and none of them are near being fantastic prospects who are just bound to improve in 2007.

 

Prospects who aren't top of the line have no progression or hope for improvement? And again, how are they different than Miller, who sucked too and has a major surgery casting doubt as to whether he'll ever be the same as before said procedure? I think it's really unlikely Miller is better than all of those younger guys next year.

[goonys evil twin]

Again, why are all of those kids near locks to be terrible?

 

Are you kidding me? They were all terrible last year, and none of them are near being fantastic prospects who are just bound to improve in 2007.

 

Prospects who aren't top of the line have no progression or hope for improvement? And again, how are they different than Miller, who sucked too and has a major surgery casting doubt as to whether he'll ever be the same as before said procedure? I think it's really unlikely Miller is better than all of those younger guys next year.

 

We're going to hold major surgery and rehab over Miller, but ignore than injury history of many of those same young guys?

 

Seriously, you're being ridiculous here. Sure they have chance for progression. But they were incredibly awful as a group last year. None of them showed much promise at all. That's fine. They still belong in the longterm picture. But none of them are good options for 2007. Miller might end up doing nothing either. But he's just one of a bunch, and happens to be at the head of the group. He is because he's actually been a good major league pitcher.

[Chocolate Milk]

 

Miller's terrible end of 2006 was still much better than any of the young guys besides Hill end of 2006.

 

Nope.

 

Miller: 21.2 IP, 1.71 WHIP, 1.11 K/BB, 1.66 HR/9, .232/.376/.402/.771 line against

 

Marshall: 125.2 IP, 1.52 WHIP, 1.30 K/BB, 1.43 HR/9, .270/.356/.444/.795 line against

 

Marmol: 77 IP, 1.69 WHIP, 1.00 K/BB, 1.63 HR/9, .250/.386/.482/.862 line against

 

Guzman: 56 IP, 1.88 WHIP, 1.62 K/BB, 1.44 HR/9, .308/.416/.507/.915 line against

 

Mateo: 45.2 IP, 1.62 WHIP, 1.52 K/BB, 1.18 HR/9, .288/.376/.475/.841 line against

 

Ryu: 15 IP, 1.93 WHIP, 2.83 K/BB, 4.26 HR/9, .348/.419/.758/1.160 line against

 

:?:

 

Not helping your cause here.

[soccer10k]

I'll wait to pass judgement until I hear how much Miller will be paid.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

We're going to hold major surgery and rehab over Miller, but ignore than injury history of many of those same young guys?

 

I'm not talking about any of them missing time, I'm talking about Miller's injuries taking away from his stuff. His arm isn't the same as it was when he was good 3+ years ago.

 

Seriously, you're being ridiculous here. Sure they have chance for progression. But they were incredibly awful as a group last year. None of them showed much promise at all. That's fine. They still belong in the longterm picture. But none of them are good options for 2007. Miller might end up doing nothing either. But he's just one of a bunch, and happens to be at the head of the group. He is because he's actually been a good major league pitcher.

 

Like I just said, I think you have to at the least call into question Miller's potential to return to that form. At that point, I don't see why he's any better of an option than any of the young guys, which is what I said in my original post.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

 

Miller's terrible end of 2006 was still much better than any of the young guys besides Hill end of 2006.

 

Nope.

 

Miller: 21.2 IP, 1.71 WHIP, 1.11 K/BB, 1.66 HR/9, .232/.376/.402/.771 line against

 

Marshall: 125.2 IP, 1.52 WHIP, 1.30 K/BB, 1.43 HR/9, .270/.356/.444/.795 line against

 

Marmol: 77 IP, 1.69 WHIP, 1.00 K/BB, 1.63 HR/9, .250/.386/.482/.862 line against

 

Guzman: 56 IP, 1.88 WHIP, 1.62 K/BB, 1.44 HR/9, .308/.416/.507/.915 line against

 

Mateo: 45.2 IP, 1.62 WHIP, 1.52 K/BB, 1.18 HR/9, .288/.376/.475/.841 line against

 

Ryu: 15 IP, 1.93 WHIP, 2.83 K/BB, 4.26 HR/9, .348/.419/.758/1.160 line against

 

:?:

 

Not helping your cause here.

 

It would've been disengenous to conveniently leave him off. The contention was that Miller was significantly better than all of them.

[goonys evil twin]

I'll wait to pass judgement until I hear how much Miller will be paid.

 

That is important. If he's getting $6m, it's a really risky move. If he's getting a much lower guarantee, it's a nice move.

[Soriano12]

Hey Hendry you freakin moron, how about you use every resource available and focus on Aram, then add trash like Miller afterwards.

[goonys evil twin]

We're going to hold major surgery and rehab over Miller, but ignore than injury history of many of those same young guys?

 

I'm not talking about any of them missing time, I'm talking about Miller's injuries taking away from his stuff. His arm isn't the same as it was when he was good 3+ years ago.

 

Seriously, you're being ridiculous here. Sure they have chance for progression. But they were incredibly awful as a group last year. None of them showed much promise at all. That's fine. They still belong in the longterm picture. But none of them are good options for 2007. Miller might end up doing nothing either. But he's just one of a bunch, and happens to be at the head of the group. He is because he's actually been a good major league pitcher.

 

Like I just said, I think you have to at the least call into question Miller's potential to return to that form. At that point, I don't see why he's any better of an option than any of the young guys, which is what I said in my original post.

 

Obviously that potential is being called into question, otherwise this wouldn't even be discussed. Unless he's guaranteed something stupid, it's a nice move.

 

He's a better option because he's shown an ability to be a good major league pitcher. None of the others have, and none looks anywhere close to being there.

[Chocolate Milk]

Hey Hendry you freakin moron, how about you use every resource available and focus on Aram, then add trash like Miller afterwards.

 

??

 

Do you think Hendry doesn't have time for both?

[Andy]

 

Miller's terrible end of 2006 was still much better than any of the young guys besides Hill end of 2006.

 

Nope.

 

Miller: 21.2 IP, 1.71 WHIP, 1.11 K/BB, 1.66 HR/9, .232/.376/.402/.771 line against

 

Marshall: 125.2 IP, 1.52 WHIP, 1.30 K/BB, 1.43 HR/9, .270/.356/.444/.795 line against

 

Marmol: 77 IP, 1.69 WHIP, 1.00 K/BB, 1.63 HR/9, .250/.386/.482/.862 line against

 

Guzman: 56 IP, 1.88 WHIP, 1.62 K/BB, 1.44 HR/9, .308/.416/.507/.915 line against

 

Mateo: 45.2 IP, 1.62 WHIP, 1.52 K/BB, 1.18 HR/9, .288/.376/.475/.841 line against

 

Ryu: 15 IP, 1.93 WHIP, 2.83 K/BB, 4.26 HR/9, .348/.419/.758/1.160 line against

 

:?:

 

Not helping your cause here.

 

It would've been disengenous to conveniently leave him off. The contention was that Miller was significantly better than all of them.

When in actuality, he was significantly better than all of them except Sean Marshall. Not sure what your point is.

 

I like the signing.

[CubinNY]

Depending on the money paid, I like this.

 

Maybe the Cubs are finally hoping for the best and planning for the worst, instead of planning for the best and not thinking about the worst.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

 

Miller's terrible end of 2006 was still much better than any of the young guys besides Hill end of 2006.

 

Nope.

 

Miller: 21.2 IP, 1.71 WHIP, 1.11 K/BB, 1.66 HR/9, .232/.376/.402/.771 line against

 

Marshall: 125.2 IP, 1.52 WHIP, 1.30 K/BB, 1.43 HR/9, .270/.356/.444/.795 line against

 

Marmol: 77 IP, 1.69 WHIP, 1.00 K/BB, 1.63 HR/9, .250/.386/.482/.862 line against

 

Guzman: 56 IP, 1.88 WHIP, 1.62 K/BB, 1.44 HR/9, .308/.416/.507/.915 line against

 

Mateo: 45.2 IP, 1.62 WHIP, 1.52 K/BB, 1.18 HR/9, .288/.376/.475/.841 line against

 

Ryu: 15 IP, 1.93 WHIP, 2.83 K/BB, 4.26 HR/9, .348/.419/.758/1.160 line against

 

:?:

 

Not helping your cause here.

 

It would've been disengenous to conveniently leave him off. The contention was that Miller was significantly better than all of them.

When in actuality, he was significantly better than all of them except Sean Marshall. Not sure what your point is.

 

I like the signing.

 

Aside from Ryu, there's not much separating all those guys. But I've said my piece and made the pont I wanted to make, so whatever.

[soccer10k]

Edited November 9, 2006 by soccer10k

[series65cubsfan]

Not that I agree or disagree, we should should attack the post, not the poster, no?

 

Or did I just not understand completely?