Offman (the Score) reporting Cubs hot after Lugo

[Tim]

I also forgot Mitre and intentionally Theriot.

[-X

Shame on you

[Deeg]

I don't buy it for a second, but on the off chance we did get Lugo he's the guy I'd put at 2B. I have more faith in Cedeno's defense at SS.

[CardsFanInChiTown]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Tampa want more than Andy Marte for Lugo? That's steep.

 

 

edit - Whoops, UK already made this point.

[CheeseHead Cubs Fan]

Be prepared to pay through the roof if this is true. Something like Hill, Guzman, Walker might get it done.

 

He is hot property right now and I don't want to get in a bidding war for him. However, the thought of Nefi on the bench does throw a touch of sun on this cloudy winter!

[ThePenguin11]

Be prepared to pay through the roof if this is true. Something like Hill, Guzman, Walker might get it done.

 

He is hot property right now and I don't want to get in a bidding war for him. However, the thought of Nefi on the bench does throw a touch of sun on this cloudy winter!

 

They can have all of those guys if we get to throw in Jones and take Huff and Gathright back in the deal.

[CP_414]

The Rays still have 5 outfielders for 3 spots (+DH). Maybe they are gettng desperate for pitching. What about Walker (DH/2B/1B for Tampa)+ Welly + Guzman + Novoa + Sing for Lugo + Huff.

 

It gives us the defensive presence we seem to be looking for in the middle infield, while also providing a legit #2 hitter in Lugo. Huff is a player who is either an emerging star coming off an off-year, or a decent to good player.

 

Huff can also play 1st and 3rd, so you would figure Murton could still start 75+ games. Murton could start 30 for Jones, 15 for Huff, 15 when Huff covers for Aramis, 10 when Huff covers for Lee, 5 when Jones covers for Pierre. Do we have the payroll available to make that work?

 

Pierre

Lugo

Lee

Aramis

Huff

Barrett

Jones

Cedeno

 

Murton, Hairston, Blanco, Perez, Mabry

 

Z, Prior, Wood, Maddux, Williams...Rusch, and Hill (AAA) can be the 6th and 7th starters in case of injury.

 

Dempster, Howry, Williamson, Eyre, Ohman, Wuertz

 

I have a hard time believing the Rays rejected Marte for Lugo.

[YearofDaCubs]

As long as we don't trade Cedeno for Lugo I'm ok with it. Play Lugo at SS put him in the 2hole and play Cedeno at 2B and place him lower in the batting order.

[Gunned]

They'll need to somehow find a taker for Walker and probably shift Cedeno to 2B and Lugo to SS. That'll boost the defense up the middle and create a poor man's version of the daily double that Florida had with Castillo and Pierre.

 

Lugo's potential value scares me as talks of Marte have been thrown around. The Cubs have no one of that value, including Pie. If they trade for him, he'll join the cast of thousands as far as being a FA after this year.

Mmm. Draft picks galore. :D

 

How's that '02 draft looking? :) David Weathers?

 

Brownlie, Hagerty, Clanton, Sisco, Dopirak....

 

This is just barely related, but I found it interesting. Posted today on another Cubs board, after Patterson was traded:

 

The Cubs 1998 draft:

3. Corey Patterson

46. David Kelton

62. Jeff Goldbach

76. Robert Bass

106. Jeramy Gomer

And... Anthony Schrager, Keola Delatori, Steven Reba, Nate Frese, Dustin Krug, Anthony Zamarripa, David Ericks, Thomas Lipari, Casey Grzecka, Omar Rohena, Carlton Wells, Joseph Ohm, Dennis Cervenka, Larry Dant, Mikel "don't call me Moses" Moreno, Michaey "No Relation" Carey, Charles Redmond, Justin Smith, Nick "Get a Brain" Moran, Eric "The Governator" Arnold, Tydus Meadows, Adam Cox, Lawrence Alvarez, Leonardo "DaVinci" Torres, Matthew "don't call my Ty" Griffin, Christopher Brown, Dustin Brentz, Matthew Whitehead, Benjamin Johanning, James Lunsford, Christopher "I'm no Kerry" Wood, Jerry Whatley, Jonathan Macklin, Nathaniel Beucler, Kevin Boles, Jacob Pierce, Justin Olson, Christopher Connally, Dustin "I'm no Gary, let alone Junior" Matthews, Justin Sprowl, Christopher Kellett, Greg "don't call me Bob" Eubanks, Daniel "no, not 'Danny'" Jackson.

226. Will Ohman

496. Eric Hinske

 

Ugh.

[Outshined_One]

The Rays still have 5 outfielders for 3 spots (+DH).

 

Actually, as memory serves me, they either have or could potentially have a heck of a lot more than five guys for those four spots within the next year.

[don_kessinger_was_good]

This is just barely related, but I found it interesting. Posted today on another Cubs board, after Patterson was traded:

 

The Cubs 1998 draft:

3. Corey Patterson

46. David Kelton

62. Jeff Goldbach

76. Robert Bass

106. Jeramy Gomer

And... Anthony Schrager, Keola Delatori, Steven Reba, Nate Frese, Dustin Krug, Anthony Zamarripa, David Ericks, Thomas Lipari, Casey Grzecka, Omar Rohena, Carlton Wells, Joseph Ohm, Dennis Cervenka, Larry Dant, Mikel "don't call me Moses" Moreno, Michaey "No Relation" Carey, Charles Redmond, Justin Smith, Nick "Get a Brain" Moran, Eric "The Governator" Arnold, Tydus Meadows, Adam Cox, Lawrence Alvarez, Leonardo "DaVinci" Torres, Matthew "don't call my Ty" Griffin, Christopher Brown, Dustin Brentz, Matthew Whitehead, Benjamin Johanning, James Lunsford, Christopher "I'm no Kerry" Wood, Jerry Whatley, Jonathan Macklin, Nathaniel Beucler, Kevin Boles, Jacob Pierce, Justin Olson, Christopher Connally, Dustin "I'm no Gary, let alone Junior" Matthews, Justin Sprowl, Christopher Kellett, Greg "don't call me Bob" Eubanks, Daniel "no, not 'Danny'" Jackson.

226. Will Ohman

496. Eric Hinske

 

Ugh.

 

Typical draft in that some of the players that turn out the best are drafted low. Ohman has made himself into a major league LOOGY, and Hinske won ROY. Poor Nate Frese, he was climbing the ladder nicely until he ripped up his legs. Patterson and Kelton though, colossal busts, and any draft where your 1st and 2nd rounders fail has to be considered a huge failure.

 

Which is also why recent drafts look so painful as well. Bobby Brownlie? Ryan Harvey? Grant Johnson? Not exactly inspiring. I am however pumped about Pawelek from last year, hope for once the Cubs can keep a young pitcher healthy.

[don_kessinger_was_good]

The Rays still have 5 outfielders for 3 spots (+DH).

 

Actually, as memory serves me, they either have or could potentially have a heck of a lot more than five guys for those four spots within the next year.

 

Delmon Young. Plus returnees Gomes, Crawford, Huff, and Gathright. And now Baldelli is back (and under contract) after his injury. If the Rays really are budget strapped, then Huff is the one that needs to go, he'll make $5MM+ in 2006.

 

If they're serious about keeping BJ Upton at SS, then they should move Lugo, too. But this is Tampa we're talking about, an incredibly intransigent organization. There may be new ownership, but they seem just as reluctant to trade talent as they've ever been. Too bad, too.

[SouthSideRyan]

This is just barely related, but I found it interesting. Posted today on another Cubs board, after Patterson was traded:

 

The Cubs 1998 draft:

3. Corey Patterson

46. David Kelton

62. Jeff Goldbach

76. Robert Bass

106. Jeramy Gomer

And... Anthony Schrager, Keola Delatori, Steven Reba, Nate Frese, Dustin Krug, Anthony Zamarripa, David Ericks, Thomas Lipari, Casey Grzecka, Omar Rohena, Carlton Wells, Joseph Ohm, Dennis Cervenka, Larry Dant, Mikel "don't call me Moses" Moreno, Michaey "No Relation" Carey, Charles Redmond, Justin Smith, Nick "Get a Brain" Moran, Eric "The Governator" Arnold, Tydus Meadows, Adam Cox, Lawrence Alvarez, Leonardo "DaVinci" Torres, Matthew "don't call my Ty" Griffin, Christopher Brown, Dustin Brentz, Matthew Whitehead, Benjamin Johanning, James Lunsford, Christopher "I'm no Kerry" Wood, Jerry Whatley, Jonathan Macklin, Nathaniel Beucler, Kevin Boles, Jacob Pierce, Justin Olson, Christopher Connally, Dustin "I'm no Gary, let alone Junior" Matthews, Justin Sprowl, Christopher Kellett, Greg "don't call me Bob" Eubanks, Daniel "no, not 'Danny'" Jackson.

226. Will Ohman

496. Eric Hinske

 

Ugh.

 

Typical draft in that some of the players that turn out the best are drafted low. Ohman has made himself into a major league LOOGY, and Hinske won ROY. Poor Nate Frese, he was climbing the ladder nicely until he ripped up his legs. Patterson and Kelton though, colossal busts, and any draft where your 1st and 2nd rounders fail has to be considered a huge failure.

 

Which is also why recent drafts look so painful as well. Bobby Brownlie? Ryan Harvey? Grant Johnson? Not exactly inspiring. I am however pumped about Pawelek from last year, hope for once the Cubs can keep a young pitcher healthy.

 

Writing off Harvey and Johnson seems a bit premature.

[don_kessinger_was_good]

Writing off Harvey and Johnson seems a bit premature.

 

If Harvey was "all that", don't you think he'd have progressed farther and faster by now, with improved numbers? I don't see anything encouraging from his 2005 performance, and he's still a long ways from the major leagues. He's yet another free swinging hacker. The kid has tons of power, but if he can't do better than this, where's the excitement?

 

2006 is make-or-break year for him. If he doesn't progress impressively, he's a bust.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Writing off Harvey and Johnson seems a bit premature.

 

If Harvey was "all that", don't you think he'd have progressed farther and faster by now, with improved numbers? I don't see anything encouraging from his 2005 performance, and he's still a long ways from the major leagues. He's yet another free swinging hacker. The kid has tons of power, but if he can't do better than this, where's the excitement?

 

2006 is make-or-break year for him. If he doesn't progress impressively, he's a bust.

 

That seems to be a bit dire for someone who didn't turn 21 until the very end of the season at Low A. A .275/.335/.500 line isn't very unfeasible at all, and would be a fine line for a 21 year old at High A.

[don_kessinger_was_good]

Writing off Harvey and Johnson seems a bit premature.

 

If Harvey was "all that", don't you think he'd have progressed farther and faster by now, with improved numbers? I don't see anything encouraging from his 2005 performance, and he's still a long ways from the major leagues. He's yet another free swinging hacker. The kid has tons of power, but if he can't do better than this, where's the excitement?

 

2006 is make-or-break year for him. If he doesn't progress impressively, he's a bust.

 

That seems to be a bit dire for someone who didn't turn 21 until the very end of the season at Low A. A .275/.335/.500 line isn't very unfeasible at all, and would be a fine line for a 21 year old at High A.

 

He has shown no progress in plate discipline. The K's are exceedingly high. His speed, cannon arm, and power are exciting, but if he never learns how to get on base....his progression arc looks too much like some other Cub prospects who we will not name.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Writing off Harvey and Johnson seems a bit premature.

 

If Harvey was "all that", don't you think he'd have progressed farther and faster by now, with improved numbers? I don't see anything encouraging from his 2005 performance, and he's still a long ways from the major leagues. He's yet another free swinging hacker. The kid has tons of power, but if he can't do better than this, where's the excitement?

 

2006 is make-or-break year for him. If he doesn't progress impressively, he's a bust.

 

That seems to be a bit dire for someone who didn't turn 21 until the very end of the season at Low A. A .275/.335/.500 line isn't very unfeasible at all, and would be a fine line for a 21 year old at High A.

 

He has shown no progress in plate discipline. The K's are exceedingly high. His speed, cannon arm, and power are exciting, but if he never learns how to get on base....his progression arc looks too much like some other Cub prospects who we will not name.

 

He had a .060 IsoD in '04, and while it dipped a bit last year, he also cut down on his K rate and rased his IsoP at the higher level. Judging a player who just barely came of drinking age and hasn't hit High A after 1.5 seasons is premature. He has problems for sure, but it's way too early to come to as definitive a conclusion that you've come to.

[NorthsideAvenger]

Writing off Harvey and Johnson seems a bit premature.

 

If Harvey was "all that", don't you think he'd have progressed farther and faster by now, with improved numbers? I don't see anything encouraging from his 2005 performance, and he's still a long ways from the major leagues. He's yet another free swinging hacker. The kid has tons of power, but if he can't do better than this, where's the excitement?

 

2006 is make-or-break year for him. If he doesn't progress impressively, he's a bust.

 

That seems to be a bit dire for someone who didn't turn 21 until the very end of the season at Low A. A .275/.335/.500 line isn't very unfeasible at all, and would be a fine line for a 21 year old at High A.

 

He has shown no progress in plate discipline. The K's are exceedingly high. His speed, cannon arm, and power are exciting, but if he never learns how to get on base....his progression arc looks too much like some other Cub prospects who we will not name.

 

Again, writing off Harvey--who is barely 21 YRS OLD---, and Grant Johnson---who has been in the system, what...1 or so yrs---is extremely short-sighted, and impatient. If they failed, so be it....but don't write them off, just because they haven't REACHED YOUR EXPECTATIONS by a certain age. I could live with Harvey/Dopirak/Pawelek,/Johnson/Pie all reaching the Cubs, and becoming impact players at 24 yrs of age or OLDER, if it meant they have the skills to become impact players and help the Cubs win a world championship.

[CuseCubFan69]

Does Tampa have a SS since they moved Upton to the OF? I see Cedeno being moved if that's the case and as others have mentioned Lugos cost is going to be steep in players traded for him and contract if the Cubs sign him. I'd like to see a Lugo/Walker middle but that isn't going to happen.

[goonys evil twin]

Again, writing off Harvey--who is barely 21 YRS OLD---, and Grant Johnson---who has been in the system, what...1 or so yrs---is extremely short-sighted, and impatient. If they failed, so be it....but don't write them off, just because they haven't REACHED YOUR EXPECTATIONS by a certain age.

 

I would not write them off, but I wouldn't hesitate to trade them if it made the team better. Neither has come close to living up to any sort of expectations yet. Neither has done anything to earn the benefit of the doubt. If somebody else values them highly and would take them in a deal that brings the Cubs a solid major leaguer, Hendry has to make the move.

[Cubzfan64]

I have to believe the Red Sox have the best shot to get Lugo - they are in dire need of a leadoff hitter and if they can get one in Lugo who plays SS, so much the better since their only other option there right now is Cora and I don't think they want to go through a full season with him at SS.

 

As others have said - the price will be steep.

[minnesotacubsfan]

didnt Lugo get into some trouble? a couple of DWI's? why would Hendy ditch Farnsworth/Walker because they have character issues and go pick up Lugo if he has proven to carry baggage as well?

 

WTF is going on in the Trib tower?

[Transmogrified Tiger]

didnt Lugo get into some trouble? a couple of DWI's? why would Hendy ditch Farnsworth/Walker because they have character issues and go pick up Lugo if he has proven to carry baggage as well?

 

WTF is going on in the Trib tower?

 

Some sort of spousal abuse charge. A couple days later his wife admitted she either made it up or really exaggerated it, can't remember which. A bit unfortunate for Julio though, I think the Astros released him because of it.

[minnesotacubsfan]

didnt Lugo get into some trouble? a couple of DWI's? why would Hendy ditch Farnsworth/Walker because they have character issues and go pick up Lugo if he has proven to carry baggage as well?

 

WTF is going on in the Trib tower?

 

Some sort of spousal abuse charge. A couple days later his wife admitted she either made it up or really exaggerated it, can't remember which. A bit unfortunate for Julio though, I think the Astros released him because of it.

 

IC..maybe I got the info wrong...

[goonys evil twin]

didnt Lugo get into some trouble? a couple of DWI's? why would Hendy ditch Farnsworth/Walker because they have character issues and go pick up Lugo if he has proven to carry baggage as well?

 

WTF is going on in the Trib tower?

 

Furcal was the DWI guy.

[Blueheart05]

didnt Lugo get into some trouble? a couple of DWI's? why would Hendy ditch Farnsworth/Walker because they have character issues and go pick up Lugo if he has proven to carry baggage as well?

 

WTF is going on in the Trib tower?

 

I didn't know about the DUI (I thought that was Furcal's issue). Wasn't Lugo in trouble for domestic abuse? In either case, I don't think character issues have much to do with Hendry (or many other GM's) decision making (teams didn't balk much at the idea of acquiring Milton Bradley). I think Walker is being shopped because of his defensive limitations.

 

 

Edit: Now I see others have clarified the offense... :D

Edited January 10, 2006 by Blueheart05