Per LaRussa: Ramirez to start ASG; Rolen out, Ensberg in

[brinoch]

Since we had two topics on the 3B situation for the ASG, I merged the two topics, and edited the title to reflect the contents of both threads.

[DEEPUJOLS]

I don't think our guy should be starting either....I would probably vote for the guy from cincy....Felipe Lopez.

[ThePenguin11]

:oops:

[gus_dog]

Carpenter will fade, IMO.

 

He's going to have to put together the complete good year before I'll believe he can actually do it.

 

He will fade but a career .270 hitter will probably continue to hit .370

 

Trolling huh? You won't last long here.

 

I guess he is...?

 

I really don't know what my opinion of Carpenter has to do with those batting averages, but whatever :?:

[reggiemiller rules]

The averages have to do with what he is saying, and that is that saying that carptenter has to keep up his career year to earn respect, and he feels the Lee has to as well. I think the whole argument is dumb because I dont see either of them slumping at any point this season.

[gus_dog]

The averages have to do with what he is saying, and that is that saying that carptenter has to keep up his career year to earn respect, and he feels the Lee has to as well. I think the whole argument is dumb because I dont see either of them slumping at any point this season.

 

Well, that's a different animal. I wasn't talking about Lee.

 

My opinion was with regard to Carpenter, and Lee has nothing to do with my observation and opinion there.

[ManEatingTarp]

The averages have to do with what he is saying, and that is that saying that carptenter has to keep up his career year to earn respect, and he feels the Lee has to as well. I think the whole argument is dumb because I dont see either of them slumping at any point this season.

 

Well, that's a different animal. I wasn't talking about Lee.

 

My opinion was with regard to Carpenter, and Lee has nothing to do with my observation and opinion there.

 

I agree with both of you.

I need to see Carp do it for an entire year.

I think he will, as I think Lee will have a good 2nd half as well.

 

Over/Under on DEEPUJOLS?

I'm setting it at 15 posts...

[DEEPUJOLS]

The point is that it is convienent for you to claim that Carpenter will start slumping but that Lee won't

 

 

 

What have I said so far that would get me booted from the board?

Edited July 11, 2005 by DEEPUJOLS

[bukie]

The point is that it is convienent for you to claim that Carpenter will start slumping but that Lee won't

 

Not sure where in his post he said Lee won't.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

The point is that it is convienent for you to claim that Carpenter will start slumping but that Lee won't

 

Not sure where in his post he said Lee won't.

 

Exactly, you're the only person to bring up Lee, and it's not really relevant to Carpenter.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

The point is that it is convienent for you to claim that Carpenter will start slumping but that Lee won't

 

 

 

What have I said so far that would get me booted from the board?

 

The point is that no one was discussing Lee. We were discussing Carp. It's a trollish behavior to try to divert one discussion to a criticism of Lee. If you would like to discuss Lee's chances at maintaining his current pace, there's a thread on Lee and his chances for the Triple Crown. Why not add your views there.

[TomAZZ]

The point is that it is convienent for you to claim that Carpenter will start slumping but that Lee won't

 

Not sure where in his post he said Lee won't.

 

Exactly, you're the only person to bring up Lee, and it's not really relevant to Carpenter.

 

regardless, the biggest difference is that DLee is notoriously horrid at the beginning of the year and red hot in the second half to bring his numbers up,,,all he has to do is have a normal second half,,,conversely Carpenter normally falls off at the end of the year

 

however it turns out, it should be an interesting second half

[Mizzou]

Back on topic... how cool is it that both our corner infielders will be starting in their first All Star game?

[gus_dog]

The averages have to do with what he is saying, and that is that saying that carptenter has to keep up his career year to earn respect, and he feels the Lee has to as well. I think the whole argument is dumb because I dont see either of them slumping at any point this season.

 

Well, that's a different animal. I wasn't talking about Lee.

 

My opinion was with regard to Carpenter, and Lee has nothing to do with my observation and opinion there.

 

I agree with both of you.

I need to see Carp do it for an entire year.

I think he will, as I think Lee will have a good 2nd half as well.

 

Over/Under on DEEPUJOLS?

I'm setting it at 15 posts...

 

I can agree with this Cardinal fan more often than not. :? Not so strange, huh?

 

You never know - he might make it to twenty. :wink:

[gus_dog]

The point is that it is convienent for you to claim that Carpenter will start slumping but that Lee won't

 

I never wrote that Lee wouldn't slump (at least not in this thread, anyway) - you imputed that. Besides, I wasn't talking about Lee, I was talking about Carpenter.

 

There is empirical evidence that Carpenter has faded, (albeit due to injury, I believe) and therefore, I will not predict Cy for him until he actually goes out and takes it.

 

I didn't write that he would NOT do it, just that I'll believe it if/when it does happen, and only then, that's all.

 

I think that is a reasonable approach, no?

[ManEatingTarp]

I can agree with this Cardinal fan more often than not. :? Not so strange, huh?

 

You never know - he might make it to twenty. :wink:

 

It's because we're both Salukis ;)

 

Brooks signed with the Mavs btw!

 

Back on topic, Aram, Lee, Pujols and Edmonds make a pretty awesome middle of the lineup!

 

I'm glad Rolen is going to rest. He didn't deserve the start.

[gus_dog]

Back on topic... how cool is it that both our corner infielders will be starting in their first All Star game?

 

VERY cool!!!

[daske17]

This will also be the first All-Star game with the two Cubs corners infielders starting. (1969 doesn't count because Banks didn't start).

[jaydee]

Lets compare him to Carpenter

 

Clemens: 1.48 ERA

Carpenter: 2.51 ERA

 

Clemens: 0.95 WHIP

Carpenter: 1.07 WHIP

 

 

Clemens: .188 BAA

Carpenter: .225 BAA

 

Carpenter has a slight edge in K/9 and K/BB. I would still start Clemens, mainly because he is the first pitcher in a long time to have an ERA this low this far into the season...

[ManEatingTarp]

Lets compare him to Carpenter

 

Clemens: 1.48 ERA

Carpenter: 2.51 ERA

 

Clemens: 0.95 WHIP

Carpenter: 1.07 WHIP

 

 

Clemens: .188 BAA

Carpenter: .225 BAA

 

Carpenter has a slight edge in K/9 and K/BB. I would still start Clemens, mainly because he is the first pitcher in a long time to have an ERA this low this far into the season...

 

Clemens: 7 W

Carpenter: 13 W

[wekse]

the cardinals have more wins as a team too, this is a ridiculous argument.

[somechick]

Lets compare him to Carpenter

 

Clemens: 1.48 ERA

Carpenter: 2.51 ERA

 

Clemens: 0.95 WHIP

Carpenter: 1.07 WHIP

 

 

Clemens: .188 BAA

Carpenter: .225 BAA

 

Carpenter has a slight edge in K/9 and K/BB. I would still start Clemens, mainly because he is the first pitcher in a long time to have an ERA this low this far into the season...

 

Clemens: 7 W

Carpenter: 13 W

 

Well, if we are going soley based on wins, then Willis should start. I mean, Willis has just as many wins, and his team scores far fewer runs as well. He has a lower ERA TOO. It isnt just about wins.

[gus_dog]

Clemens: 7 W

Carpenter: 13 W

 

Yes..., but if Clemens pitched for the Cardinals, he easily has 13 wins, no?

 

I really don't care who starts, but dragging out W-L record probably isn't the best stat to hang one's hat on for ASG. JMHO

[Mizzou]

Lets compare him to Carpenter

 

Clemens: 1.48 ERA

Carpenter: 2.51 ERA

 

Clemens: 0.95 WHIP

Carpenter: 1.07 WHIP

 

 

Clemens: .188 BAA

Carpenter: .225 BAA

 

Carpenter has a slight edge in K/9 and K/BB. I would still start Clemens, mainly because he is the first pitcher in a long time to have an ERA this low this far into the season...

 

Clemens: 7 W

Carpenter: 13 W

 

Clemens has fewer losses though, so he should start.

 

Seriously, you really need to set your homerism aside for a second here. Clemens is clearly the better pitcher this year. I don't know if any non-Cardinal fan would argue that.

[reggiemiller rules]

I am a cardinals fan, and I will admit that Clemens is the best pitcher in the league so far. But I also dont see a problem with Larussa picking Carpenter. There is nothign wrong with showing loyalty to your own guy, plus Clemens started last year. So even though Clemens is more deserving, there is nothing wrong with giving a guy having a career year his chance to start an allstar game.