Steele to IL, Roberts Recalled

[Stratos]

1 hour ago, Rcal10 said:

Assuming you are not a doctor, that is the only thing in your post that is correct. Why not wait and see what is up with his inflammation? His velocity down is not unusual to start a season and definitely not unusual in ridiculously cold conditions. Why does everything have to be doom and gloom? You don’t put him on a 60 day IL without even finding out what the problem is. He sounded like it was very precautionary by the Cubs and appeared a little annoyed they put him on the Il, at all. A 60 day IL at this time makes zero sense. If they do an MRI and find something there will be time to change his IL status. 
Oh, actually something else I agree with you on is how ridiculous playing a night game in Wrigley in early April is. Yes, it is very stupid.

I'm just saying out of an abundance of caution they should consider it.  Yes they have to do the MRI first.

This is very similar to what happened before Alzolay was sent off for TJS last year.  Elbow problems in Sept the season before, oddly poor performance early the next season, then shut down with more elbow problems.  The doctors and the MRIs didn't save him from that either.

[Stratos]

1 hour ago, mul21 said:

This is all incredibly dumb.

Not nearly as dumb as that response.

[Stratos]

38 minutes ago, Jason Ross said:

His velo has been down since August. Eovladi's velo was down 3mph on Monday, too. 

Velo drop could be anything, including just age, but it starting right before he went on the IL last Sept isn't exactly a good.

[Stratos]

2 hours ago, Hot Sauce said:

Tendonitis is not an indication for Tommy John surgery. 

Well they haven't done an MRI on Steele yet so they don't know the exact issue, all he's said is he had tightness and pain in the elbow during his last start and the day after.

Steele did say it felt the same as the discomfort last Sept

Edited April 9, 2025 by Stratos

[Rcal10]

6 minutes ago, Stratos said:

Well they haven't done an MRI on Steele yet so they don't know the exact issue, all he's said is he had tightness and pain in the elbow during his last start and the day after.

Steele did say it felt the same as the discomfort last Sept

But that is just it. They have  done anything with Steele yet and you want  out him in the 60 day IL! That is just an overreaction at this time. Sure you can point to Alzolay as an example. But there are numerous pitchers, including Steele, who have had elbow tightness and been out 15 to 20 days. Maybe you end up right, I certainly hope not. But to suggest it now is clearly a panic statement. In Steele’s interview he sounded frustrated the Cubs even put him in the 1( day IL. He expected to work through the soreness and not miss a start. Until we hear anything that might suggest the injury is bad, overreacting is not the way to go. Sure, I am concerned.  But for now the 15 day IL is the right call. 

[squally1313]

Just go trade for Alcantara and the best Marlins reliever. Pick up the Avisail Garcia contract if you have to. If you're going to earmark money for pitching at the deadline, use it when your top starter goes down. 

[Bertz]

3 hours ago, Stratos said:

His velo has been down a tick too, plus his performance has been terrible besides last start, which was helped by the wind/cold and a struggling Texas lineup.

I'm no doctor but they should really consider a 60-day IL stint and just shut him down.  If he's not throwing for a month then gears up + Iowa rehab that should cover the 60 days easily.

Also whoever is scheduling these early April night games is an idiot.

Ironically, given the way the Cubs talked about their fear around the ST/Japan/ST/regular season whiplash I think there's a decent chance this sort of proactive strategy is viewed as more likely to produce a long term injury.

[Stratos]

19 minutes ago, Rcal10 said:

But that is just it. They have  done anything with Steele yet and you want  out him in the 60 day IL! That is just an overreaction at this time. Sure you can point to Alzolay as an example. But there are numerous pitchers, including Steele, who have had elbow tightness and been out 15 to 20 days. Maybe you end up right, I certainly hope not. But to suggest it now is clearly a panic statement. In Steele’s interview he sounded frustrated the Cubs even put him in the 1( day IL. He expected to work through the soreness and not miss a start. Until we hear anything that might suggest the injury is bad, overreacting is not the way to go. Sure, I am concerned.  But for now the 15 day IL is the right call. 

I didn't say they should put him on the 60 day IL.   I said they should consider it.   There's no reason to put him on yet before an MRI, or even before his 15 day stint is done.  They need to be very cautious, which they are so far.  Saying it's "panic" to be very cautious when there's red flags everywhere is ridiculous.

[Stratos]

6 minutes ago, Bertz said:

Ironically, given the way the Cubs talked about their fear around the ST/Japan/ST/regular season whiplash I think there's a decent chance this sort of proactive strategy is viewed as more likely to produce a long term injury.

Explain.

[Bertz]

4 minutes ago, Stratos said:

Explain.

If ramping up from cold is viewed as an especially risky process, then even though it would give him extra rest your plan might ironically be more likely to lead to Steele e.g. blowing out his elbow.

[Jason Ross]

1 hour ago, Stratos said:

Velo drop could be anything, including just age, but it starting right before he went on the IL last Sept isn't exactly a good.

Well, "just before" is a bit spurious. His velo drop has been dating back for a while. It was after August it dipped below 92mph. The velo drop isn't new, and it's been persistent at around 92mph.

Again, it's not good, but creating order of panic by proclaiming it's TJS right now is quite early. Thus far the Cubs have done well to avoid blowing arms up - let's give them some credit that they understand what they're doing here. Position players have been less cut and dry with IL trips, but the Cubs do well by their pitchers.

I would say it's quite convenient from a Cubs perspective that he's hitting the 15 day IL now after a really cold week and a weird ST, especially with the off time they've had. Colin Rea has been used sparingly as well. It could be more of a planned break for Steele than a true TJS indicator (not to diminish the injury, Im sure hes banged up).

[Rcal10]

1 hour ago, Stratos said:

I didn't say they should put him on the 60 day IL.   I said they should consider it.   There's no reason to put him on yet before an MRI, or even before his 15 day stint is done.  They need to be very cautious, which they are so far.  Saying it's "panic" to be very cautious when there's red flags everywhere is ridiculous.

But you did say “they should consider putting him on the 60 day IL and just shut him down”. Those were your words. My only comment is it is a bit early for that. 

[Stratos]

1 hour ago, Bertz said:

If ramping up from cold is viewed as an especially risky process, then even though it would give him extra rest your plan might ironically be more likely to lead to Steele e.g. blowing out his elbow.

Who knows.  None of us are experts including me so I guess we'll just hope and stay tuned.

[Stratos]

1 hour ago, Jason Ross said:

1.  Well, "just before" is a bit spurious. His velo drop has been dating back for a while. It was after August it dipped below 92mph. The velo drop isn't new, and it's been persistent at around 92mph.

2.  Again, it's not good, but creating order of panic by proclaiming it's TJS right now is quite early. 

3.  Thus far the Cubs have done well to avoid blowing arms up - let's give them some credit that they understand what they're doing here. Position players have been less cut and dry with IL trips, but the Cubs do well by their pitchers.

1.  You said a velo drop started in Aug so I was assuming what you said was factual.

2.  I didn't say it's TJS, I said he's on TJS watch.  Which means there's some red flags that typically occur before TJS so the Cubs should be very cautious with him.  Nobody is saying he needs TJS, and it's not "panic" to be cautious about a pitcher's elbow when he's going through very similar as Alzolay did before he needed TJS.

3.  The Cubs under Jed have also had SP mostly with below-average velo (besides Taillon who was average when signed), which I think is a factor in them avoiding TJS for SP.

Alzolay and Steele both went down with elbow issues in early Sept and had a short IL stint, and then they brought both back later in Sept instead of shutting either of them down for the season, then they both sucked early the next season and went down early with elbow issues again.  Cubs know more than any of us here, but i'm not going to assume they're infallible either.

For the record I was someone who thought they should have just shut down Steele for the rest of the season last Sept while some others on here wanted him back "because he needs to build up innings to be able to throw a full season", which is an insane reason to bring back a guy who is having elbow issues.  But whatever, i guess i was just "panicking" LOL.

[javy knows my name]

11 minutes ago, Stratos said:

1.  You said a velo drop started in Aug so I was assuming what you said was factual.

2.  I didn't say it's TJS, I said he's on TJS watch.  Which means there's some red flags that typically occur before TJS so the Cubs should be very cautious with him.  Nobody is saying he needs TJS, and it's not "panic" to be cautious about a pitcher's elbow when he's going through very similar as Alzolay did before he needed TJS.

3.  The Cubs under Jed have also had SP mostly with below-average velo (besides Taillon who was average when signed), which I think is a factor in them avoiding TJS for SP.

Alzolay and Steele both went down with elbow issues in early Sept and had a short IL stint, and then they brought both back later in Sept instead of shutting either of them down for the season, then they both sucked early the next season and went down early with elbow issues again.  Cubs know more than any of us here, but i'm not going to assume they're infallible either.

For the record I was someone who thought they should have just shut down Steele for the rest of the season last Sept while some others on here wanted him back "because he needs to build up innings to be able to throw a full season", which is an insane reason to bring back a guy who is having elbow issues.  But whatever, i guess i was just "panicking" LOL.

Dig up

[Jason Ross]

1 hour ago, Stratos said:

1.  You said a velo drop started in Aug so I was assuming what you said was factual.

2.  I didn't say it's TJS, I said he's on TJS watch.  Which means there's some red flags that typically occur before TJS so the Cubs should be very cautious with him.  Nobody is saying he needs TJS, and it's not "panic" to be cautious about a pitcher's elbow when he's going through very similar as Alzolay did before he needed TJS.

3.  The Cubs under Jed have also had SP mostly with below-average velo (besides Taillon who was average when signed), which I think is a factor in them avoiding TJS for SP.

Alzolay and Steele both went down with elbow issues in early Sept and had a short IL stint, and then they brought both back later in Sept instead of shutting either of them down for the season, then they both sucked early the next season and went down early with elbow issues again.  Cubs know more than any of us here, but i'm not going to assume they're infallible either.

For the record I was someone who thought they should have just shut down Steele for the rest of the season last Sept while some others on here wanted him back "because he needs to build up innings to be able to throw a full season", which is an insane reason to bring back a guy who is having elbow issues.  But whatever, i guess i was just "panicking" LOL.

First - nothing I said was anything less than "factual". I wasn't telling lies, instead, I was expanding on data. That the velocity drop isnt new, its been on going for a while. His velo dipped below 92mph consistently after July. It was dipping before too. 

Secondly, you're the one who jumped *immediately* to "put him on the 60 day IL". Yes. That is panicking. There's plenty of steps in between that and what happened, jumping there is skipping a bunch.

Perhaps new information will come out as we go. It wouldnt be shocking to see him have an extended stay. It *may* lead to TJS. Jumping directly from "the Cubs put Steele on the 15 day IL" to where you did, is panic city. Let's see where it goes before we dump him on a 60 Day slot. Last time he did this he missed 15 days. It very well could be that again and there's enough reason to believe it'll be closer to that to stay grounded.

If he's still on the IL come Mid-May, it'll be closer to time to worry about a greater injury.  I'll probably join you on the highway to panic city myself. 

[Stratos]

4 hours ago, Jason Ross said:

1.  First - nothing I said was anything less than "factual". I wasn't telling lies, instead, I was expanding on data. That the velocity drop isnt new, its been on going for a while. His velo dipped below 92mph consistently after July. It was dipping before too. 

2.  Secondly, you're the one who jumped *immediately* to "put him on the 60 day IL". Yes. That is panicking. There's plenty of steps in between that and what happened, jumping there is skipping a bunch.

1.  I wasn't trying to say you were "telling lies".  You said my point on the velo drop in August was "spurious" so I  pointed out that I was just going by what you said on the velo drop.

2.  I didn't say "put him on the 60 day IL", I said they should consider it.

[JBears79]

Im gonna be cautiously optimistic about this. Tendonitis isnt worrying yet. If he responds well to treatment I wont be worried.

Luckily, I like the Cubs pitching depth and we have trade chips to add an arm at the deadline.  

[Hot Sauce]

18 hours ago, Stratos said:

Well they haven't done an MRI on Steele yet so they don't know the exact issue, all he's said is he had tightness and pain in the elbow during his last start and the day after.

Steele did say it felt the same as the discomfort last Sept

I have only seen that he is experiencing tendonitis, unless I am missing something. Where is it being reported that he's feeling pain?

[Bull]

3 hours ago, Hot Sauce said:

I have only seen that he is experiencing tendonitis, unless I am missing something. Where is it being reported that he's feeling pain?

Ever had tendinitis?

[Hot Sauce]

46 minutes ago, Bull said:

Ever had tendinitis?

Yes, many times. I suppose it’s just me in my medical brain nitpicking here. Tendonitis isn’t always accompanied by significant pain. In a thread discussing the possibility of Tommy John surgery, it’s important to distinguish the difference between tendonitis that simply requires rest and more severe elbow pain that could suggest a ligament tear and the possibility of a season ending injury. 

[Stratos]

9 hours ago, Hot Sauce said:

I have only seen that he is experiencing tendonitis, unless I am missing something. Where is it being reported that he's feeling pain?

Steele said so in the interview below.  He said tightness and pain.

Also, tendonitis is what the Cubs said it was, but this was announced before he even had an MRI, so them saying "tendonitis" is more of a guess, probably because he says its the same thing he felt last Sept when he went to the IL, which they at the time diagnosed as "left elbow flexor tendinitis", but I believe that was also before he had an MRI in Sept.

Key is that the UCL is a ligament, not a tendon, so a UCL could not have "tendonitis".  However, note that Alzolay also was diagnosed with "right flexor strain" in May 2024 when he went to the IL but ended up having TJS a few months later, so what the Cubs say may not be 100% accurate.

 

Edited April 11, 2025 by Stratos

[Hot Sauce]

30 minutes ago, Stratos said:

Steele said so in the interview below.  He said tightness and pain.

Also, tendonitis is what the Cubs said it was, but this was announced before he even had an MRI, so them saying "tendonitis" is more of a guess, probably because he says its the same thing he felt last Sept when he went to the IL, which they at the time diagnosed as "left elbow flexor tendinitis", but I believe that was also before he had an MRI in Sept.

Key is that the UCL is a ligament, not a tendon, so a UCL could not have "tendonitis".  However, note that Alzolay also was diagnosed with "right flexor strain" in May 2024 when he went to the IL but ended up having TJS a few months later, so what the Cubs say may not be 100% accurate.

 

Given that he has experienced it before I’m going to trust that he knows his body and what he’s feeling. 

[UMFan83]

Speculation from Jesse but certainly doesn't sound great:

 

 

[We Got The Whole 9]

Damn. Seems like a 60 day is a real possibility. Brown needs to get his horsefeathers together, hopefully Assad comes back and can eat some innings with Rea. I suspect we will see some Horton as they work guys in and out. That could be fun 🤷‍♂️