It's Maddoning

[sweetpeteman]

More disappointing: 2004 cubs or 2018 cubs?

 

Let’s say Chili is fired. Who do you want to replace him?

 

 

Manny.

 

 

But seriously, Andy Barkett from Boston or Jeff Albert from Houston would be the leading candidates I'd want (I'd probably rank Albert 1st).

[TruffleShuffle]

More disappointing: 2004 cubs or 2018 cubs?

 

Let’s say Chili is fired. Who do you want to replace him?

 

 

Manny.

 

 

But seriously, Andy Barkett from Boston or Jeff Albert from Houston would be the leading candidates I'd want (I'd probably rank Albert 1st).

 

keep hiring red sox hitting coaches until one of them turns out to be good.

 

fallback plan, skip the red sox hitting coaches and just steal their hitters instead.

[NotSoSober]

 

 

Manny.

 

 

But seriously, Andy Barkett from Boston or Jeff Albert from Houston would be the leading candidates I'd want (I'd probably rank Albert 1st).

 

keep hiring red sox hitting coaches until one of them turns out to be good.

 

fallback plan, skip the red sox hitting coaches and just steal their hitters instead.

Savethe money on Bryce and pick up Mookie in 2 years, I'd be down for hiring Manny

[TruffleShuffle]

 

 

But seriously, Andy Barkett from Boston or Jeff Albert from Houston would be the leading candidates I'd want (I'd probably rank Albert 1st).

 

keep hiring red sox hitting coaches until one of them turns out to be good.

 

fallback plan, skip the red sox hitting coaches and just steal their hitters instead.

Savethe money on Bryce and pick up Mookie in 2 years, I'd be down for hiring Manny

 

i would not hold your breath waiting for the red sox and their borderline unlimited payroll to start letting their elite young players walk out the door.

[NotSoSober]

 

keep hiring red sox hitting coaches until one of them turns out to be good.

 

fallback plan, skip the red sox hitting coaches and just steal their hitters instead.

Savethe money on Bryce and pick up Mookie in 2 years, I'd be down for hiring Manny

 

i would not hold your breath waiting for the red sox and their borderline unlimited payroll to start letting their elite young players walk out the door.

Theo will put together some footage of Chicago's finest bowling alleys

[UK]

More disappointing: 2004 cubs or 2018 cubs?

 

Let’s say Chili is fired. Who do you want to replace him?

 

 

Manny.

 

 

But seriously, Andy Barkett from Boston or Jeff Albert from Houston would be the leading candidates I'd want (I'd probably rank Albert 1st).

 

PJ Piliterre (sp?), Yankees assistant hitting coach. Please get someone who focuses on their lower halves to get their launch angles to pre-Chiliball.

[NotSoSober]

 

 

Manny.

 

 

But seriously, Andy Barkett from Boston or Jeff Albert from Houston would be the leading candidates I'd want (I'd probably rank Albert 1st).

 

PJ Piliterre (sp?), Yankees assistant hitting coach. Please get someone who focuses on their lower halves to get their launch angles to pre-Chiliball.

Darren Bush and lets dong everyone into oblivion

[Regular Show]

Well, that truly sucked. I think that awful ending to the season is warping our opinions on Maddon. Yeah, he made plenty of mistakes and said some really stupid things this year, but I don't think there are many better managers in MLB.

 

His lineups this year were really bizarre, he played Murphy way too much because he knew our offense was horsefeathers this year, his bullpen usage wasn't great but injuries and under-performance conspired against him. The offense disappeared for long stetches and I don't know if you can blame that on Maddon and Chili Davis. There is only so much a manager/coaches can do to get them to perform.

 

I would bring him back and even offer him a 3-year extension. I think he's still a very competent manager, but needs more micromanagement and advice from above. They also need to tell him to be less candid on issues he quite frankly doesn't have a good read on. His take on Addison Russell was horsefeathering terrible and the FO was pissed off about that. Bosio got fired partly for his dumb remarks to the media.

 

Anyway, there are plenty of problems that need to be addressed this offseason. I think Maddon is fine overall. I think Theo and Maddon have a good relationship so I seriously doubt his job is in jeopardy.

 

EDIT: If we want to sign Bryce this offseason we have to keep Maddon. I know Bryce was happy playing for Dave Martinez and he is a disciple of Maddon's coaching philosophy. I'm pretty sure one of the reasons Bryce wants to come to Chicago is to play under Maddon.

Edited October 3, 2018 by Regular Show

[Regular Show]

 

 

But seriously, Andy Barkett from Boston or Jeff Albert from Houston would be the leading candidates I'd want (I'd probably rank Albert 1st).

 

keep hiring red sox hitting coaches until one of them turns out to be good.

 

fallback plan, skip the red sox hitting coaches and just steal their hitters instead.

Savethe money on Bryce and pick up Mookie in 2 years, I'd be down for hiring Manny

 

You think they're letting Mookie get away lol? Save the money we should spend on Bryce this offseason for the very slim chance we might be able to sign Mookie in a couple years? WTH???

 

[Aaron_Kennelly]

"I hate this whole team!"

"We should sign Bryce Harper then."

"No, we should wait a couple years before making any changes."

[TruffleShuffle]

looking at free agent classes two or more years down the road is a fool’s errand. yeah they often look really great, but once the top guys either re-sign with their clubs or get traded to a bigger market club which ends up giving them a long-term deal, that offseason rolls around and you find yourself giving $35 million to tyler chatwood.

[Cubswin11]

I certainly get the fire Joe takes and agree with some, but I’m more for bringing him back than not. Mostly for stuff like this, he builds a culture/clubhouse like nobody else and manages the day to day minutiae better than anyone which I think is more important than anything (a drill sergeant like Girardi would ruin this team and culture). He makes guys want to be here with the atmosphere of the team he largely is responsible for overseeing. Seeing things like this makes me believe in it.

 

[tweet]

[/tweet]

[Regular Show]

I certainly get the fire Joe takes and agree with some, but I’m more for bringing him back than not. Mostly for stuff like this, he builds a culture/clubhouse like nobody else and manages the day to day minutiae better than anyone which I think is more important than anything (a drill sergeant like Girardi would ruin this team and culture). He makes guys want to be here with the atmosphere of the team he largely is responsible for overseeing. Seeing things like this makes me believe in it.

 

 

Absolutely. So many free agents want to come here now because of the culture he's built. The camaraderie and how close the players are in this clubhouse is special. I'm glad Jesse Chavez feels that way.

[Cubswin11]

I certainly get the fire Joe takes and agree with some, but I’m more for bringing him back than not. Mostly for stuff like this, he builds a culture/clubhouse like nobody else and manages the day to day minutiae better than anyone which I think is more important than anything (a drill sergeant like Girardi would ruin this team and culture). He makes guys want to be here with the atmosphere of the team he largely is responsible for overseeing. Seeing things like this makes me believe in it.

 

 

Absolutely. So many free agents want to come here now because of the culture he's built. The camaraderie and how close the players are in this clubhouse is special. I'm glad Jesse Chavez feels that way.

Yup and sure it’s more than Joe, it’s the amenities, character of the players here and the FO’s doings as well but they’ve trusted Joe to guide and oversee it all. The wrong manager with all this still could make it a spot guys don’t want to be.

[Cubswin11]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/carriemuskat/status/1047398817467916288[/tweet]

[Banedon]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/carriemuskat/status/1047398817467916288[/tweet]

 

[Banedon]

I mean, I'm ok with Joe still managing, even though he's far from perfect. But lets settle down there Rizz.

 

But put Chili out on his ass.

[Banedon]

https://theathletic.com/563917/2018/10/03/rosenthal-the-cubs-are-out-will-joe-maddon-soon-follow/

 

All speculation. No inside info here.

[Fro]

I really like Maddon outside of his bullpen management at times. That should be something the front office can fix a couple different ways.

 

Probably something you shouldn't mess with unless you have someone you can get who is clearly a better candidate.

 

The offense being feast or famine has been an issue with this group for the last 4 years. Some of that this year was obviously due to guys being hurt and not being themselves like Bryant.

[Sammy Sofa]

I certainly get the fire Joe takes and agree with some, but I’m more for bringing him back than not. Mostly for stuff like this, he builds a culture/clubhouse like nobody else and manages the day to day minutiae better than anyone which I think is more important than anything (a drill sergeant like Girardi would ruin this team and culture). He makes guys want to be here with the atmosphere of the team he largely is responsible for overseeing. Seeing things like this makes me believe in it.

 

 

Absolutely. So many free agents want to come here now because of the culture he's built. The camaraderie and how close the players are in this clubhouse is special. I'm glad Jesse Chavez feels that way.

Yup and sure it’s more than Joe, it’s the amenities, character of the players here and the FO’s doings as well but they’ve trusted Joe to guide and oversee it all. The wrong manager with all this still could make it a spot guys don’t want to be.

 

It's not hard to find a manager that players like; players have mostly loved playing for Dusty over the years, so I think it's overstating things to think that Joe is special in regards to creating an environment that draws players in, or makes them want to stick around. I think it was obviously the right move to do what they did to get Joe given the collection of players they had in the stages of their careers they were in, but at this point I'm not really worried about whether they have the right guy for the party planning committee. His approach to the Russell situation is garbage, his constant lineup tweaking is practically useless besides an ongoing exercise in too clever for the room wankery, he can't manage a bullpen, and his input in putting together a coaching staff is beyond suspect at this point. I have zero problem with them going with someone else; I'm confident they wouldn't go with some kind of meatball, regressive dork or a Girardi-like hardass. Try for a new approach to try and better maximize what they have.

[ConstableRabbit]

 

Absolutely. So many free agents want to come here now because of the culture he's built. The camaraderie and how close the players are in this clubhouse is special. I'm glad Jesse Chavez feels that way.

Yup and sure it’s more than Joe, it’s the amenities, character of the players here and the FO’s doings as well but they’ve trusted Joe to guide and oversee it all. The wrong manager with all this still could make it a spot guys don’t want to be.

 

It's not hard to find a manager that players like; players have mostly loved playing for Dusty over the years, so I think it's overstating things to think that Joe is special in regards to creating an environment that draws players in, or makes them want to stick around. I think it was obviously the right move to do what they did to get Joe given the collection of players they had in the stages of their careers they were in, but at this point I'm not really worried about whether they have the right guy for the party planning committee. His approach to the Russell situation is garbage, his constant lineup tweaking is practically useless besides an ongoing exercise in too clever for the room wankery, he can't manage a bullpen, and his input in putting together a coaching staff is beyond suspect at this point. I have zero problem with them going with someone else; I'm confident they wouldn't go with some kind of meatball, regressive dork or a Girardi-like hardass. Try for a new approach to try and better maximize what they have.

The guys who gushed over Dusty were veterans and many past-their-prime guys who got a ton of playing time. Let’s not understate how many positive reviews Joe gets from the entire 25-man roster.

[JennieGarthAlgar]

I certainly get the fire Joe takes and agree with some, but I’m more for bringing him back than not. Mostly for stuff like this, he builds a culture/clubhouse like nobody else and manages the day to day minutiae better than anyone which I think is more important than anything (a drill sergeant like Girardi would ruin this team and culture). He makes guys want to be here with the atmosphere of the team he largely is responsible for overseeing. Seeing things like this makes me believe in it.

 

[tweet]

[/tweet]

 

It probably just means Chavez finally found a good babysitter.

[Sammy Sofa]

Yup and sure it’s more than Joe, it’s the amenities, character of the players here and the FO’s doings as well but they’ve trusted Joe to guide and oversee it all. The wrong manager with all this still could make it a spot guys don’t want to be.

 

It's not hard to find a manager that players like; players have mostly loved playing for Dusty over the years, so I think it's overstating things to think that Joe is special in regards to creating an environment that draws players in, or makes them want to stick around. I think it was obviously the right move to do what they did to get Joe given the collection of players they had in the stages of their careers they were in, but at this point I'm not really worried about whether they have the right guy for the party planning committee. His approach to the Russell situation is garbage, his constant lineup tweaking is practically useless besides an ongoing exercise in too clever for the room wankery, he can't manage a bullpen, and his input in putting together a coaching staff is beyond suspect at this point. I have zero problem with them going with someone else; I'm confident they wouldn't go with some kind of meatball, regressive dork or a Girardi-like hardass. Try for a new approach to try and better maximize what they have.

The guys who gushed over Dusty were veterans and many past-their-prime guys who got a ton of playing time. Let’s not understate how many positive reviews Joe gets from the entire 25-man roster.

 

Players like playing for Dusty, for better or for worse; it's not a veterans-only thing. Acting like Joe is this rare bird in terms of players getting behind him isn't realistic at all.

[squally1313]

I might contradict myself like 4 times here, but whatever.

 

Anti-Joe: Basically the whole purpose of this thread. His bullpen decisions that at the seem made no logical sense, sticking with Almora as leadoff hitter for a month too long, Murphy as leadoff hitter in general, potentially screwing up the Morrow plan, definitely screwing up the Russell response, etc.

 

Pro-Joe: Basically the Rizzo quote. This was a team that was projected to win around 95 wins this year. None of those projections included 6 weeks of garbage from Rizzo, essentially a lost season from KB, 40 ineffective innings from Darvish, Chatwood doing what he did, and basically having to patch together a bullpen of castoffs (without your closer) for the last 6 weeks. And yet....95-67. Maybe he deserves a share of blame for a couple of those issues, but if so he also gets credit for a team where the skill players weren't on the field nearly as much as anticipated.

 

Anti-Joe: Seems like his main skill set isn't really needed with this group anymore. I see the Chavez quotes, and I know the confidence this team generally has, and I give him all the credit in the world for developing that over the last four years. But this is a team that's going to have Lester, Rizzo, Baez, Heyward, Contreras, and Strop (plus a few others) in the locker room for a good amount of time. They're the ones leading this team, and setting the expectations for success and for the atmosphere. Get someone in there who is tuned in with Theo/Jed in terms of in game decisions, and stays out of the way otherwise.

[abuck1220]

it's almost funny that the cubs smartest guys in the roomed themselves into believing "sure homers are up all across baseball, but what if i told you the next exploitable market inefficiency was NOT hitting homers."

 

horsefeathering dorks are so lucky jose ramirez wasn't standing four inches to his right...