Starting Pitching candidates

[Ding Dong Johnson]

if they’re dealing Eloy, they better be getting Scherzer AND Kershaw

[CaliforniaRaisin]

I just don't want Otani coming over this year. If he does, I can't see him taking 300k from us(or the Dodgers) and bypass the close to 10 mill the Yankees, Red Sox, Rangers, or whoever can offer him now.

 

While the Rangers, Red Sox and Yankees can get up to a pool of $8.3125 million, they have to subtract all their numerous July 2 signings from that amount. And so far, only the Red Sox have made a trade to increase their bonus pool.

 

The Red Sox spent $5.3 million on four guys (that's already taking out each guy's first $300k and I have no idea if they got anyone else over $300k) so they have $3 million for Otani if they maxed out their cap space. Obviously that's more than the $300k the Cubs can offer but at least the gap is a lot closer than we first assumed.

[Gmoney08]

If they want to pick up that contract and throw the Zagunis/Hatch/Candelario's of the farm then fine, whatever. However if they end up picking up that contract and dealing any of Eloy,Happ,Cease then that's going to be near impossible to justify to me.

 

Eloy and Happ id be pissed. Cease... id sigh damn but get over it because of Fuk Pitching Prospects

[weis21]

BOLD PREDICTION ALERT:

 

after seeing that picture of Theo from last night I predict the cubs make a trade today to make a splash before the ASB.

[Gmoney08]

[vine][/vine]

BOLD PREDICTION ALERT:

 

after seeing that picture of Theo from last night I predict the cubs make a trade today to make a splash before the ASB.

 

What was the picture? Hopefully not in a Gorilla suit..

[davell]

Anybody on board with flipping Wade for a tinstapp yet

 

I was 100% against this, now I'm not so sure.....5 and a half back, at Baltimore for 3, at Atlanta for 3, and 3 at home versus the Cards, coming out of the break. With the Brewers having 3 at home versus Philly, 4 at Pitt, and 3 at Philly......

 

It gets tougher for them after that, but still.....

 

I want Davis here next year, but I'm kind of open to pulling what the Yankees did last year with Chapman....

[17 Seconds]

based on what information we have as fans, i am firmly on team NO TRADE. i think our situation makes signing him this offseason a necessity, and i wouldn't want to potentially reduce the chances of that happening. also, this may be trivial, but i'd worry about another team doing to him what we did to chapman for a month.

[CaliforniaRaisin]

based on what information we have as fans, i am firmly on team NO TRADE. i think our situation makes signing him this offseason a necessity, and i wouldn't want to potentially reduce the chances of that happening. also, this may be trivial, but i'd worry about another team doing to him what we did to chapman for a month.

 

Also you have to remember the players aren't robots and likely won't respond well to a white flag trade like that. Even with the Pirates' miserly reputation, knowing full well Melancon was gone in the offseason, McCutcheon and Cole were super pissed when Melancon was traded last deadline (and they got big league pen help in Rivero, not some far away prospect).

[We Got The Whole 9]

Anybody on board with flipping Wade for a tinstapp yet

 

I was 100% against this, now I'm not so sure.....5 and a half back, at Baltimore for 3, at Atlanta for 3, and 3 at home versus the Cards, coming out of the break. With the Brewers having 3 at home versus Philly, 4 at Pitt, and 3 at Philly......

 

It gets tougher for them after that, but still.....

 

I want Davis here next year, but I'm kind of open to pulling what the Yankees did last year with Chapman....

They look miserable right now with no turnaround in sight. The Brewers could extend their lead quick after the break given they play the Phillies a ton.

 

I mean if we are 8-10 games back at the deadline I hope they blow the pen up. Selling quality relievers at the deadline usually brings back much bigger returns than most would expect. What a great time to load up on young, live arms.

 

I would shop him, Koji, Dunce, and probably Strop as well. Then re-load the pen in the offseason behind Carl, Grimm, Rondon, Carasiti (looks like a Strop type with his slider and the ground balls he generates), Monty, and a couple FA additions.

 

Maybe not so extreme... but definitely think we should be shopping our expiring guys who are having really good seasons.

[Bryants Disco Ball]

based on what information we have as fans, i am firmly on team NO TRADE. i think our situation makes signing him this offseason a necessity, and i wouldn't want to potentially reduce the chances of that happening. also, this may be trivial, but i'd worry about another team doing to him what we did to chapman for a month.

 

Just not sure Theo is interested in big money for a closer. Really think they plan to have CJ in that spot next season. L

[Gilby]

Mike Rizzo would probably be willing to trade his own right arm for a package of Davis and Uehara. Edited July 9, 2017 by Gilby

[17 Seconds]

based on what information we have as fans, i am firmly on team NO TRADE. i think our situation makes signing him this offseason a necessity, and i wouldn't want to potentially reduce the chances of that happening. also, this may be trivial, but i'd worry about another team doing to him what we did to chapman for a month.

 

Just not sure Theo is interested in big money for a closer. Really think they plan to have CJ in that spot next season. L

 

they play the same position, so carl will still be in carl's spot

 

he traded big assets for short term control of 2 different relievers recently. if he values elite relievers that much, i'd think any unease from a longer term version would be outweighed by the abundance of current payroll flexibility and a desperate need for pitching in the organization. also, i'm sure theo knows that trading a valuable asset for a dominant relief rental each season is not a long-term strategy.

[Bryants Disco Ball]

based on what information we have as fans, i am firmly on team NO TRADE. i think our situation makes signing him this offseason a necessity, and i wouldn't want to potentially reduce the chances of that happening. also, this may be trivial, but i'd worry about another team doing to him what we did to chapman for a month.

 

Just not sure Theo is interested in big money for a closer. Really think they plan to have CJ in that spot next season. L

 

they play the same position, so carl will still be in carl's spot

 

he traded big assets for short term control of 2 different relievers recently. if he values elite relievers that much, i'd think any unease from a longer term version would be outweighed by the abundance of current payroll flexibility and a desperate need for pitching in the organization. also, i'm sure theo knows that trading a valuable asset for a dominant relief rental each season is not a long-term strategy.

 

We will see. I don't believe this front office believes in giving multi year, big money to a closer. It's why they traded for them instead.

 

And, again, I think they are comfortable putting Carl there and spending less on the guys setting him up.

[17 Seconds]

 

Just not sure Theo is interested in big money for a closer. Really think they plan to have CJ in that spot next season. L

 

they play the same position, so carl will still be in carl's spot

 

he traded big assets for short term control of 2 different relievers recently. if he values elite relievers that much, i'd think any unease from a longer term version would be outweighed by the abundance of current payroll flexibility and a desperate need for pitching in the organization. also, i'm sure theo knows that trading a valuable asset for a dominant relief rental each season is not a long-term strategy.

 

We will see. I don't believe this front office believes in giving multi year, big money to a closer. It's why they traded for them instead.

 

And, again, I think they are comfortable putting Carl there and spending less on the guys setting him up.

 

that argument still makes no sense. you have 2 dominant relievers. if you let 1 go, you only have 1 dominant reliever. they're both allowed to pitch in the same game too

[Transmogrified Tiger]

They are not going to trade Davis because they're 4 losses behind the Brewers at the all star break. I also don't really think they want to extend Davis. They paid a decent player cost for the right to pay Davis 10 million so clearly they aren't above having money invested in the bullpen, but they likely don't want to invest dollars+years in the same person when it's very likely that will turn out poorly. They had their chance to do it that way just a few months ago with Jansen, Chapman, and Melancon all available and they basically paid lip service to pursuing any of them.

[Bryants Disco Ball]

 

they play the same position, so carl will still be in carl's spot

 

he traded big assets for short term control of 2 different relievers recently. if he values elite relievers that much, i'd think any unease from a longer term version would be outweighed by the abundance of current payroll flexibility and a desperate need for pitching in the organization. also, i'm sure theo knows that trading a valuable asset for a dominant relief rental each season is not a long-term strategy.

 

We will see. I don't believe this front office believes in giving multi year, big money to a closer. It's why they traded for them instead.

 

And, again, I think they are comfortable putting Carl there and spending less on the guys setting him up.

 

that argument still makes no sense. you have 2 dominant relievers. if you let 1 go, you only have 1 dominant reliever. they're both allowed to pitch in the same game too

 

It's more that they think they can find good relievers for much cheaper rather than paying huge money for the closer title.

 

They had a need before trading for Davis and had no interest in signing any of the three big guys on the market and instead gave up an asset for a guy on a one-year deal.

 

I'll have to go back and check the history of Theo and Jed and see if they ever invested big time money and years into a closer.

[Bryants Disco Ball]

They are not going to trade Davis because they're 4 losses behind the Brewers at the all star break. I also don't really think they want to extend Davis. They paid a decent player cost for the right to pay Davis 10 million so clearly they aren't above having money invested in the bullpen, but they likely don't want to invest dollars+years in the same person when it's very likely that will turn out poorly. They had their chance to do it that way just a few months ago with Jansen, Chapman, and Melancon all available and they basically paid lip service to pursuing any of them.

 

I'm not sure the discussion was about right now but more if they are 8 games back at the deadline.

[We Got The Whole 9]

I feel like they did make a mistake not making an offer to Jansen just to at least see if he would have been interested. I don't see him having major durability concerns because he throws nothing but cutters and he's a freaking house. Could be wrong but he feels like a great 5 year investment.

[17 Seconds]

i don't doubt that they would reeeeeallly like to avoid large contracts for relievers, but i think the pitching situation is in such peril that they almost don't have much of a choice. they went with the all hitter approach to building the team, which is great, but it also meant they'd likely be in this situation at some point. if you only develop hitting then you have to pay for pitching, and paying for real pitching comes with the risk. it would be nice if theo could keep pulling guys like jake and hendricks out of his ass, but you can't count on that. definitely not for 2018, at least. with arrieta and lackey on the way out, we already have a tough task of filling out the 2018 rotation to a point of acceptable confidence, and losing davis just makes it even more difficult.

[Bryants Disco Ball]

i don't doubt that they would reeeeeallly like to avoid large contracts for relievers, but i think the pitching situation is in such peril that they almost don't have much of a choice. they went with the all hitter approach to building the team, which is great, but it also meant they'd likely be in this situation at some point. if you only develop hitting then you have to pay for pitching, and paying for real pitching comes with the risk. it would be nice if theo could keep pulling guys like jake and hendricks out of his ass, but you can't count on that. definitely not for 2018, at least. with arrieta and lackey on the way out, we already have a tough task of filling out the 2018 rotation to a point of acceptable confidence, and losing davis just makes it even more difficult.

 

The fact they need to replace those staters you mention might make it even more unlikely they spend an aav of $15 million on a reliever when a lot of money might be needed for starters.

 

We will see. I'd be shocked if the Cubs are out of it at the deadline and don't move Davis.

[Clem Fandango]

I know the playoffs are not a foregone conclusion, but what the Cubs can get for Davis is probably < the value Davis provides to the team if the Cubs make the playoffs.

[Tryptamine]

If say the Cubs are 7 or 8 back at the deadline and they forego moving Davis for MLB ready arms like Fedde or Chance Adams or slightly further away but high upside guys like Franklin Perez then that will be a shortsighted mistake because I'm at the point where I think odds are against this team figuring out anything this year.

[Tim]

1) We're not going to be 8-9 down at the end of the month

2) Think of the comparison this way: What Cubs players would you trade for a Brewer at the same position?

[Aaron_Kennelly]

You don't piss away chances to win the World Series, even if it's like a 5% chance to win the World Series. It's only 5 games. It's not the end of the world. Make this team better. And horsefeathers Erick Fedde. He sucks and will inevitably be injured within the next 12 months.horsefeathers that. He can kiss my ass.

[Tryptamine]

1) We're not going to be 8-9 down at the end of the month

2) Think of the comparison this way: What Cubs players would you trade for a Brewer at the same position?

 

and yet here we are more than half of the way into this season 5.5gb and closer to last place in the division than 1st place. They just haven't shown any signs of waking up at all.