Re: Geovany Soto Traded Thread

[toonsterwu]

Eh ... once upon a time, I would've been pissing and moaning about this trade (a righty that's only effective against righties is a middle reliever that's interchangeable unless he improves). But while bad luck can be utilized to explain some of Soto's issues, at the end of the day, the combination of low production and high cost makes this an okay move. I don't have any high expectations for Brigham, but okay, I get it. Castillo/Clevenger can probably be a decent enough combination.

[Little Slide Rooter]

most people don't get that the minors aren't about winning or even putting the best team on the field. It's completely about development.

a lot like spring training for pitchers. They are sent out to work on things in order advance, not necessarily just go to their strength and try to win.

Need to work on your slider? then they'll be throwing it when every the time is right. Even if it may be a disadvantage for the pitcher/team.

 

Then you can talk position players. Making a catcher a 3b to try to get his bat up to the majors? guess who plays third regardless of defensive liabilities?

The teams best shortstop might actually be the organizations future 2b..so guess who plays 2nd while a non-prospect plays at short..

 

I'm pretty sure everyone gets that, with the possible exception of the busses full of 6-10 year olds on day-camp field trips at the games.

[TruffleShuffle]

that's not totally true. There are some guys in Iowa who are there because they are good AAA players and you need that kind of thing in the high minors, unless you want to lose 110 games and have your affiliate start shopping around for a new parent club.

[neely crenshaw]

that's not totally true. There are some guys in Iowa who are there because they are good AAA players and you need that kind of thing in the high minors, unless you want to lose 110 games and have your affiliate start shopping around for a new parent club.

 

Absolutely. I was not trying to say it's only about working on things, but in some respects it's completely different to the game most people know. Baseball decisions are made all the time based on business not production. Yes, the affiliates care about winning, but the coaches work for the organization. What the organization want comes first. Now of course it's not a free for all of bad choices but guys, especially pitchers are constantly working on things, developing that 3rd pitch or refining the breaking ball.

 

and yes, there place holders to help keep teams competitive but don't think mike brumley is playing short if starlin castro is there.

 

and castro, I know most regular "posters" know this but we did have posts showing quotes of people who were pissed we traded johnson and maholm, and talked of building around them.

[RynoRules]

For those of you who are disappointed, what did you expect to get back for Geo a this point? He's working on his second straight awful year at the plate.

 

If Brigham turns into a solid 6th-7th-8th inning guy I'd be happy with the return.

[Little Slide Rooter]

that's not totally true. There are some guys in Iowa who are there because they are good AAA players and you need that kind of thing in the high minors

 

But even then, they're there to 1st be spare parts if the big league club has a need, 2nd help mentor the young players, and 3rd to help their team win. The players and managers want to win, but that's more due to their competitive nature than it being in the interest of the team. The Tolberts, Amezagas, and DeWitts are out their busting their asses for one more crack at the big leagues before they have to start thinking Indy league or Japan, with organizationals like Adducci, Wright, and Lalli looking for that one cup of coffee in hopes of catching someone's eye. Sprinkle in the actual prospects, and the result is a very competitive bunch of guys who want to win.

 

unless you want to lose 110 games and have your affiliate start shopping around for a new parent club

 

the same goes for every minor league team, so they can't all lose 110 games.

[Banedon]

For those of you who are disappointed, what did you expect to get back for Geo a this point? He's working on his second straight awful year at the plate.

 

If Brigham turns into a solid 6th-7th-8th inning guy I'd be happy with the return.

 

There's been a lot written on this board in the last few hours, but did I miss where someone was disappointed? I think if anything, we're disappointed that Soto didn't turn out to be the consistent offensive catcher we all hoped he'd become. But I think everyone understands this deal.

[jersey cubs fan]

I'm going to miss Geo.

[Exile on Waveland]

Sad to see Soto go. Not because I retained hope that he'd return to form, nor because I don't like this trade, but just because I always liked Soto.

 

Geovany Soto.

[dew1679666265]

I should have read this thread first and then got into the Maholm/Reed trade thread because maybe my expectations got too high. I kinda wish we had held onto Geo and tried again at next year's deadline (wasn't a fan of non-tendering him).

 

Nothing really wrong with the trade I guess, I just have a nagging feeling that there were ways we could have gotten more. Maybe it's my love of Geo, though.

[BeerHere]

I'm going to miss Geo.

I'm not. Don't let the door hit you in the ass on your way out Geo.

[biittner77]

There are organizations that value winning at the minor league level- even to the point of making curious moves. The O's have been demoting pitchers to low A Delmarva to make playoff pushes. I seem to remember the Cards used to value winning down their, something about fostering a winning attitude.

[BeerHere]

I should have read this thread first and then got into the Maholm/Reed trade thread because maybe my expectations got too high. I kinda wish we had held onto Geo and tried again at next year's deadline (wasn't a fan of non-tendering him).

 

Nothing really wrong with the trade I guess, I just have a nagging feeling that there were ways we could have gotten more. Maybe it's my love of Geo, though.

I think this board over-values Soto. I'm sure the FO did their best and a reliever is about all the market was willing to do for Soto.

[jersey cubs fan]

I'm going to miss Geo.

I'm not. Don't let the door hit you in the ass on your way out Geo.

 

that's a stupid thing to say

[dew1679666265]

I think this board over-values Soto. I'm sure the FO did their best and a reliever is about all the market was willing to do for Soto.

 

There's no doubt Brigham is the best the FO could've done right now, I'm not questioning that. I just wonder if we had kept Geo, tendered him this offseason, and then tried again next year if we could have gotten more if he had a rebound year.

[fromthestretch]

I've always been a fan of Geo. It didn't bother me one bit when they showed Reed Johnson shaking hands in the dugout after he was pulled from the game, but I was a little sad when Soto was doing the same thing, knowing he had just played his last game as a Cub.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

I've always been a fan of Geo. It didn't bother me one bit when they showed Reed Johnson shaking hands in the dugout after he was pulled from the game, but I was a little sad when Soto was doing the same thing, knowing he had just played his last game as a Cub.

[expletive] it, I'll say it. I was even sad to see Reed go.

[XZero771679666304]

I've always been a fan of Geo. It didn't bother me one bit when they showed Reed Johnson shaking hands in the dugout after he was pulled from the game, but I was a little sad when Soto was doing the same thing, knowing he had just played his last game as a Cub.

[expletive] it, I'll say it. I was even sad to see Reed go.

 

Me too. Had to be done, but it was a little sad.

[fromthestretch]

I've always been a fan of Geo. It didn't bother me one bit when they showed Reed Johnson shaking hands in the dugout after he was pulled from the game, but I was a little sad when Soto was doing the same thing, knowing he had just played his last game as a Cub.

[expletive] it, I'll say it. I was even sad to see Reed go.

 

I had nothing against Reed...more indifferent than anything.

[Guest]

Looks like this deal went official, and the Cubs twitter announcement says that a PTBNL is coming with Brigham.

[jersey cubs fan]

Paul Sullivan ‏@PWSullivan

Cubs get PTBNL or cash along with Brigham for Soto

[jersey cubs fan]

Paul Sullivan ‏@PWSullivan

Since the Cubs are already paying part of Soto's salary w/ Texas, they'd get a refund on some if they don't choose PTBNL.

[Guest]

Official PR:

 

CUBS ACQUIRE RIGHTHANDER JAKE BRIGHAM

FROM TEXAS FOR CATCHER GEOVANY SOTO

TUESDAY, JULY 31, 2012

 

CHICAGO – The Chicago Cubs today acquired right-handed pitcher Jake Brigham and a player to be named or cash consideration from the Texas Rangers for catcher Geovany Soto and a cash consideration.

 

Brigham, 24, is 5-5 with a 4.28 ERA (59 ER/124.0 IP) in 21 starts for Double-A Frisco this season, though he entered the 2012 campaign ranked as the seventh-best right-handed relief prospect in the Rangers organization by Baseball America after pitching exclusively in relief the second half of the 2011 campaign. He went 3-1 with a 3.60 ERA (16 ER/40.0 IP) in 21 relief outings last season. In 2012, Brigham was named to the mid-season Texas League All-Star team.

 

The 6-foot-3, 210-pound righthander was originally selected by the Rangers in the sixth round of the 2006 Draft out of Central Florida Christian Academy in Orlando, Florida. Brigham is 27-42 with one save and a 4.40 ERA (291 ER/595.2 IP) in 135 minor league appearances, including 101 starts.

 

Soto, 29, batted .199 (35-for-176) with six home runs and 14 RBI in 52 games for the Cubs this season. The 2008 National League Rookie of the Year concludes 12 seasons in the Cubs organization since being selected by the club in the 11th round of the 2001 Draft.

[davell]

I think this board over-values Soto. I'm sure the FO did their best and a reliever is about all the market was willing to do for Soto.

 

There's no doubt Brigham is the best the FO could've done right now, I'm not questioning that. I just wonder if we had kept Geo, tendered him this offseason, and then tried again next year if we could have gotten more if he had a rebound year.

Not worth it. You're blocking Castillo that much longer in hopes that a catcher who looks to be in decline has a hot first half.

[dew1679666265]

Not worth it. You're blocking Castillo that much longer in hopes that a catcher who looks to be in decline has a hot first half.

 

If Castillo were likely to be a really good starting catcher that would concern me, but there's not much to indicate that he is. I've never quite gotten the Castillo love - he looks like a nice backup or ok starter, but that's not the type of player you worry about blocking.