Chicago Bears Offseason 2012

[Guest]

Romo may lead the league in smiles but I do not see why else he needs to be put any higher. I would take Cutler ahead of him 101 times out of a 100.

 

Thanks. I was wonder why we suddenly love Romo.

 

I was probably a little stupid about putting him ahead of Cutler. But yeah, he's about where he should be, but Flacco is not better than he is. Romo 10, Stafford 9, Cutler 8 (or 7 ahead of Rivers if you ask me).

 

Cutler ahead of Rivers?

 

So it's OK to be skeptical of Stafford's insanely good 2011 season because he only did it once, but Rivers has one year that isn't awesome and now he's ranked below Cutler?

 

 

I love Jay and I'm really excited about our offense this year but you guys are being ridiculous homers. That or you're not paying close enough attention to the rest of the league, because there is no case you can make with any sort of objective evidence that would paint Cutler as a better quarterback than Romo or Rivers. Even Stafford made a pretty strong case last year, although I would suspect Cutler would do pretty damn well throwing to that guy (who sulley somehow thinks Brandon Marshall is better than), too.

[rawaction]

Romo may lead the league in smiles but I do not see why else he needs to be put any higher. I would take Cutler ahead of him 101 times out of a 100.

 

Thanks. I was wonder why we suddenly love Romo.

 

I was probably a little stupid about putting him ahead of Cutler. But yeah, he's about where he should be, but Flacco is not better than he is. Romo 10, Stafford 9, Cutler 8 (or 7 ahead of Rivers if you ask me).

 

Cutler ahead of Rivers?

 

So it's OK to be skeptical of Stafford's insanely good 2011 season because he only did it once, but Rivers has one year that isn't awesome and now he's ranked below Cutler?

 

 

I love Jay and I'm really excited about our offense this year but you guys are being ridiculous homers. That or you're not paying close enough attention to the rest of the league, because there is no case you can make with any sort of objective evidence that would paint Cutler as a better quarterback than Romo or Rivers. Even Stafford made a pretty strong case last year, although I would suspect Cutler would do pretty damn well throwing to that guy (who sulley somehow thinks Brandon Marshall is better than), too.

 

You know this discussion started on a list started by a pretty good QB evaluator who has Cutler better than Romo on his list, right?

 

Cutler's last year with Brandon Marshall, a real WR....he threw for 4500 yards. Romo has never done that, and he's thrown to a legit star WR every year of his career. You can throw out the QB rating and INTs, but Cutler has done more with less than any QB in the league.

[Guest]

Romo may lead the league in smiles but I do not see why else he needs to be put any higher. I would take Cutler ahead of him 101 times out of a 100.

 

Thanks. I was wonder why we suddenly love Romo.

 

I was probably a little stupid about putting him ahead of Cutler. But yeah, he's about where he should be, but Flacco is not better than he is. Romo 10, Stafford 9, Cutler 8 (or 7 ahead of Rivers if you ask me).

 

Cutler ahead of Rivers?

 

So it's OK to be skeptical of Stafford's insanely good 2011 season because he only did it once, but Rivers has one year that isn't awesome and now he's ranked below Cutler?

 

 

I love Jay and I'm really excited about our offense this year but you guys are being ridiculous homers. That or you're not paying close enough attention to the rest of the league, because there is no case you can make with any sort of objective evidence that would paint Cutler as a better quarterback than Romo or Rivers. Even Stafford made a pretty strong case last year, although I would suspect Cutler would do pretty damn well throwing to that guy (who sulley somehow thinks Brandon Marshall is better than), too.

 

You know this discussion started on a list started by a pretty good QB evaluator who has Cutler better than Romo on his list, right?

 

Cutler's last year with Brandon Marshall, a real WR....he threw for 4500 yards. Romo has never done that, and he's thrown to a legit star WR every year of his career. You can throw out the QB rating and INTs, but Cutler has done more with less than any QB in the league.

 

The list, like many like it, is flawed, at best. Look no further than Flacco's placement. On what do you base your opinion that he's a pretty good QB evaluator?

 

Total yards in one season is all you can come up with. Quite probably the least important of all the stats you listed or could have listed. There's no good statistical argument you can make in Cutler's favor.

 

Prove to me that Cutler is better than Romo and Rivers. Make a case that isn't entirely based on a yardage total (in one season, no less). They have him crushed in every other category and they've done it many times. Jay has had one season that can really be even put in the conversation. TD, INT, TD to INT, yards per attempt, completion percentage.. Rivers and Romo win all of them by a wide margin.

 

That's not to mention Stafford, who just put up one of the greatest seasons ever by a QB (one EASILY better than Cutler's best year).

 

If you go into advanced metrics, like the FO DVOA stuff, he's even more crushed.

 

I understand that Cutler hasn't always had a lot to work with, but that doesn't mean you can just subjectively say that, based on the eye test, he's just better than guys who have had much more success.

[rawaction]

 

The list, like many like it, is flawed, at best. Look no further than Flacco's placement. On what do you base your opinion that he's a pretty good QB evaluator?

 

Total yards in one season is all you can come up with. Quite probably the least important of all the stats you listed or could have listed. There's no good statistical argument you can make in Cutler's favor.

 

Prove to me that Cutler is better than Romo and Rivers. Make a case that isn't entirely based on a yardage total (in one season, no less). They have him crushed in every other category and they've done it many times. Jay has had one season that can really be even put in the conversation. TD, INT, TD to INT, yards per attempt, completion percentage.. Rivers and Romo win all of them by a wide margin.

 

That's not to mention Stafford, who just put up one of the greatest seasons ever by a QB (one EASILY better than Cutler's best year).

 

If you go into advanced metrics, like the FO DVOA stuff, he's even more crushed.

 

I understand that Cutler hasn't always had a lot to work with, but that doesn't mean you can just subjectively say that, based on the eye test, he's just better than guys who have had much more success.

 

Yes, that's exactly what it means. This is a subjective list. Based on the eye test, Cutler is better than Romo. Rivers has a better argument, though but both have had monumentally more talent than Cutler has had to work with. And again, the one year Cutler had talent he was very good.

 

I'm not saying this list or Jaws are the end-all, be-all of QB ranking lists...but the bottom line is you shouldn't be all up in arms that people think Cutler is better than Romo, when a supposed "expert" thinks so. And you shouldn't be up in arms when Rivers is the most likely the name ahead of Cutler on the list. If Rivers and Cutler repeat their 2012s, Cutler will be higher ranked.

[Guest]

 

The list, like many like it, is flawed, at best. Look no further than Flacco's placement. On what do you base your opinion that he's a pretty good QB evaluator?

 

Total yards in one season is all you can come up with. Quite probably the least important of all the stats you listed or could have listed. There's no good statistical argument you can make in Cutler's favor.

 

Prove to me that Cutler is better than Romo and Rivers. Make a case that isn't entirely based on a yardage total (in one season, no less). They have him crushed in every other category and they've done it many times. Jay has had one season that can really be even put in the conversation. TD, INT, TD to INT, yards per attempt, completion percentage.. Rivers and Romo win all of them by a wide margin.

 

That's not to mention Stafford, who just put up one of the greatest seasons ever by a QB (one EASILY better than Cutler's best year).

 

If you go into advanced metrics, like the FO DVOA stuff, he's even more crushed.

 

I understand that Cutler hasn't always had a lot to work with, but that doesn't mean you can just subjectively say that, based on the eye test, he's just better than guys who have had much more success.

 

Yes, that's exactly what it means. This is a subjective list. Based on the eye test, Cutler is better than Romo. Rivers has a better argument, though but both have had monumentally more talent than Cutler has had to work with. And again, the one year Cutler had talent he was very good.

 

I'm not saying this list or Jaws are the end-all, be-all of QB ranking lists...but the bottom line is you shouldn't be all up in arms that people think Cutler is better than Romo, when a supposed "expert" thinks so. And you shouldn't be up in arms when Rivers is the most likely the name ahead of Cutler on the list. If Rivers and Cutler repeat their 2012s, Cutler will be higher ranked.

 

Sorry, but just the opinion that Cutler hasn't had the "opportunity" to do as well as the others isn't enough of an argument to somehow definitively say he's better than guys who have actually done it. I can't believe I'm even having to say that. I don't see the case you're making other than your contention that Cutler wins on the eye test and "because Jaws says so." Extremely shaky, at best. If your only argument is "because the eye test says so (in my opinion)" then there's not much of a discussion to be had.

[bukie]

The problem with objective individual stats in foorball is that they just, well, aren't. Any objective stat for QBs in football is heavily influenced both by the player's offensive line and receiving corps. So, it's a lousy way to rank individual ability. At best, one could suggest that the team's passing offense wasn't top 10, and that's just a no brainer.

 

But the sheer difference in offense between when Cutler was in there and Hanie/McCown would suggest that Cutler alone is an enormous boost to the passing offense, more so than the difference between Romo and Kitna last year, for sure.

[Guest]

The problem with objective individual stats in foorball is that they just, well, aren't. Any objective stat for QBs in football is heavily influenced both by the player's offensive line and receiving corps. So, it's a lousy way to rank individual ability. At best, one could suggest that the team's passing offense wasn't top 10, and that's just a no brainer.

 

But the sheer difference in offense between when Cutler was in there and Hanie/McCown would suggest that Cutler alone is an enormous boost to the passing offense, more so than the difference between Romo and Kitna last year, for sure.

 

Hanie is really, really, really bad.

 

I understand the problem with individual stats. Whatever other method you want to use is way worse.

[Soul]

But you asked for absolute proof, and there is none to be had in the game of football. So why are you asking for it?

[Magnetic Curses]

Romo may lead the league in smiles but I do not see why else he needs to be put any higher. I would take Cutler ahead of him 101 times out of a 100.

 

Thanks. I was wonder why we suddenly love Romo.

 

I was probably a little stupid about putting him ahead of Cutler. But yeah, he's about where he should be, but Flacco is not better than he is. Romo 10, Stafford 9, Cutler 8 (or 7 ahead of Rivers if you ask me).

 

Cutler ahead of Rivers?

 

So it's OK to be skeptical of Stafford's insanely good 2011 season because he only did it once, but Rivers has one year that isn't awesome and now he's ranked below Cutler?

 

 

I love Jay and I'm really excited about our offense this year but you guys are being ridiculous homers. That or you're not paying close enough attention to the rest of the league, because there is no case you can make with any sort of objective evidence that would paint Cutler as a better quarterback than Romo or Rivers. Even Stafford made a pretty strong case last year, although I would suspect Cutler would do pretty damn well throwing to that guy (who sulley somehow thinks Brandon Marshall is better than), too.

 

i'm a ridiculous homer, but' i'd take cutler over either of those guys. in fact, there's one quarterback i'd take over cutler in the entire league.

 

i see him play every game, i don't see the other guys, but i see enough of other quarterbacks to know he's better than they are, and he's equipped with the ability to do things that maybe one other qb in the league can do. you don't have to believe me, i don't have a very strong statistical case, but i see him dodging zombies and firing lasers every sunday and imo, rodgers is the only qb that can do the same thing. roethlisberger and romo are up there, too.

[Guest]

I give up. I'm not having fun arguing against one of my favorite players.

 

However, I CONCEDE NOTHING.

[Magnetic Curses]

when cutler wins his first MVP next year, i will count you as a hater.

[Soul]

Hehe, you've been tagged.

[Banedon]

Romo may lead the league in smiles but I do not see why else he needs to be put any higher. I would take Cutler ahead of him 101 times out of a 100.

 

Thanks. I was wonder why we suddenly love Romo.

 

Because he's really, really good? WTH

 

And he's definitely better than Cutler.

 

What is this??? I don't even....

 

Romo is really, really overrated. Seriously, he's done ok with a ton of resources. Yayyy.

[Guest]

Romo is really, really overrated. Seriously, he's done ok with a ton of resources. Yayyy.

 

He's done "ok?"

 

Seriously?

[Sammy Sofa]

So it's settled: a Cutler-hater and Romo-fanboy. MAKE A NOTE.

[Magnetic Curses]

you will never live this down, vance jr.

[Sammy Sofa]

This dude loves Romo like the Bum loves cheese.

[Magnetic Curses]

more than andy loves flapjacks

[Guest]

More than Chuck Cubs loves thick onion gravy?

[minnesotacubsfan]

Doubtful

[XZero771679666304]

Romo is really, really overrated. Seriously, he's done ok with a ton of resources. Yayyy.

 

He's done "ok?"

 

Seriously?

 

Given the talent he's been surrounded by, he sure could have done a hell of a lot better.

 

I'm kind of a passive observer here, but your're laying on the Romo love a bit heavy.

[Magnetic Curses]

it's because he loves romo more than you love sony

[pitchcs]

All aboard the Romo is OK train

[Guest]

Romo is really, really overrated. Seriously, he's done ok with a ton of resources. Yayyy.

 

He's done "ok?"

 

Seriously?

 

Given the talent he's been surrounded by, he sure could have done a hell of a lot better.

 

I'm kind of a passive observer here, but your're laying on the Romo love a bit heavy.

 

By saying that he's better than Jay Cutler and by saying that a guy who has a CAREER QB rating of 97 (flawed stat or no, that is an indication of damn good performance) has been better than OK?

 

I feel like I'm taking crazy pills. Is this going to turn into a clutchitude and winnability conversation?

 

I don't even like Tony Romo.

[Banedon]

Romo is really, really overrated. Seriously, he's done ok with a ton of resources. Yayyy.

 

He's done "ok?"

 

Seriously?

 

Given the talent he's been surrounded by, he sure could have done a hell of a lot better.

 

I'm kind of a passive observer here, but your're laying on the Romo love a bit heavy.

 

By saying that he's better than Jay Cutler and by saying that a guy who has a CAREER QB rating of 97 (flawed stat or no, that is an indication of damn good performance) has been better than OK?

 

lol. He's better than Tom Brady! (Career QB rating of 96.4) He's only behind Aaron Rodgers.

 

Since we're arguing with admittedly flawed stats, I'm going to submit a Sportsnation poll.

 

http://espn.go.com/sportsnation/post/_/id/7932812/tony-romo-top-five-qb

 

41% have him in the top half, and not the top 10. Though it's a reasonably close poll. So there's obviously a lot of dispute on the topic. It's at the very least, not as clear cut as you believe it is, for a lot of us.

 

I couldn't find a sportsnation poll on Jay.