2011-2012 NBA Season

[Sammy Sofa]

How many "bad" playoff games does Kobe have though?

 

I'm not sure but soccer's aspergery post of a bunch of box score inks without taking into account how long and consistently Jordan made deep playoff runs was clearly to make it seem like a big number.

 

Don't look too much into it. The point was simply to show that even the almighty Michael Jordan wasn't immune to the occasional bad elimination/closeout game in the postseason (not to say that MJ had a ton of them or even had them frequently). So the fact that Kobe didn't have a great game isn't all that big of a deal.

 

No way, dude, that was totes aspergery.

[bcl412]

Hibbert is a decent post scorer. Why not utilize him instead of chucking up threes against a great fast break team?

[PosterToBeNamedLater]

Kobe is a great player. And I know that the point of posting Jordan's games wasn't to somehow argue that he is better than Jordan, but I remember looking up some stats last year that covered their careers when someone (not on this board) was trying to argue that Kobe was better than Jordan. I was really surprised at the difference in PER and Win Shares. Not sure how good of stats those are, but I remember seeing that Jordan's career averages (both regular season and post-season) were higher than Kobe's single best numbers. And Jordan had something like 10 years where his win shares were higher than Kobe's best year. He also had something like 10 playoff years where his PER was higher than Kobe's single best year. I could be wrong on those numbers now, but I was pretty shocked that it wasn't closer.

 

And that includes the two years in his prime that he was gone (or at least gone for most of the second year).

[Formerly Snayke]

This isnt a lot of "bad" games at all though when you make deep playoff runs almost every year

 

Which isn't the point. The harping on Kobe because he didn't have an amazing game is ridiculous.

[SouthSideRyan]

17 points on 16 shots from an NBA great in a game 7. Bravo.

 

From another NBA great:

 

19 points on 18 shots in an elimination game.

30 points on 30 shots in an elimination game.

25 points on 22 shots in an elimination game.

31 points on 27 shots in an elimination game.

21 points on 25 shots in a closeout game.

25 points on 24 shots in a closeout game.

23 points on 19 shots in a closeout game.

22 points on 19 shots in a closeout game.

24 points on 23 shots in a closeout game.

28 points on 31 shots in a closeout game.

39 points on 35 shots in a closeout game.

28 points on 25 shots in a Game 7.

28 points on 26 shots in a closeout game including an airballed three-pointer at the buzzer.

 

 

44.4% (also 10 rebs and 9 asts)

30% (11 rebs/7 asts)

45.5% (8 rebs/8 asts)

48.1% (8 rebs/9 asts)

36% (4 rebs/8 asts)

33.3% (2rebs/9 asts)

31.6% (3 rebs/2 asts)

26.3% (9 rebs/7asts)

39.1% (7 rebs/7 asts)

35.5% (6 rebs/5 asts)

42.9% (11 rebs/4 asts)

36% (9 rebs/8 asts)

34.6% (4 rebs/4 asts)

 

Bulls went 6-7 in those games... the 44.4/45.5/48.1 games shouldn't be there IMO. Take those 3 games out and the record is now 6-4.

 

The Lakers went 1-0 in the games that started this conversation.

[Sammy Sofa]

Kobe's 8 assists just didn't have that Jordan magic, man.

[Warpticon]

I love when people can't say Jordan was better than Kobe without trying to harp on every single little thing Kobe does that isn't Mount Olympus status. It's comical. Also, "overrated" is pretty much the most useless word in the English language.

[DivineBovine]

Kobe is damn good. I don't get the overrated talk. He's clearly in decline, but Kobe in his prime was the closest thing to MJ the NBA has seen since. Clearly, he's no MJ. But I don't get the Bulls fans who refuse to give him credit for being really good.

 

I'd take Kobe in his prime over LeBron in his prime.

[17 Seconds]

no talk on the bosh injury? mri tomorrow, and the buzz is that he'll probably miss this series and maybe more.

 

that's a devstasting injury if true. i think it makes the boston/miami series a tossup, and there is no way the heat are beating san antonio or okc without him. they are just too thin, especially with bigs.

[Cubswin11]

no talk on the bosh injury? mri tomorrow, and the buzz is that he'll probably miss this series and maybe more.

 

that's a devstasting injury if true. i think it makes the boston/miami series a tossup, and there is no way the heat are beating san antonio or okc without him. they are just too thin, especially with bigs.

Or even either LA team (more the Lakers than Clips), I know it's very unlikely they get by OKC/SA but they obivously have big guys that would cause the Heat trouble without Bosh.

[CubColtPacer]

I go back and forth on Bosh's value. I tend to agree with some people who think the Heat are better defensively when he's out of the lineup, and LeBron and Wade taking more shots isn't too bad for them offensively. But at times like the first half yesterday they need Bosh to pick up the slack because nobody else on that roster can when LeBron and Wade aren't hitting.

 

I feel more confident about the Pacers chances of winning this series after the game yesterday. They have a good gameplan against the Heat, and now they just need to hit a couple of those 3's that turned into transition opportunities for the Heat instead yesterday. I still think it's likely the Heat win the series especially after having won the first close game, but the Pacers aren't going anywhere either.

[Magnetic Curses]

oh lord, now it's cool to hate on jordan

[Sammy Sofa]

No, it's pointing out that recognizing that Jordan was better than Kobe doesn't have to involve trying to make Kobe a far worse player than he's actually been.

[SouthSideRyan]

no talk on the bosh injury? mri tomorrow, and the buzz is that he'll probably miss this series and maybe more.

 

that's a devstasting injury if true. i think it makes the boston/miami series a tossup, and there is no way the heat are beating san antonio or okc without him. they are just too thin, especially with bigs.

 

I'd say it's far from a given they beat Indiana without him.

[Magnetic Curses]

No, it's pointing out that recognizing that Jordan was better than Kobe doesn't have to involve trying to make Kobe a far worse player than he's actually been.

 

ok, agreed.

[Sammy Sofa]

I mean, I'll kill someone who doesn't recognize Jordan is the greatest. Kill them like a damn dirty hobo.

[UMFan83]

17 points on 16 shots from an NBA great in a game 7. Bravo.

 

Good point. Should they start Bryant against Oklahoma City or has Steve Blake overtaken him?

 

I don't get the snark or the wasted hours of MJ research. Did he have a unwhelming game? Yes. That's all that this discussion was about. 17 points on 16 shots is underwhelming. Doesn't mean he's NOT an all time great or that no great players have bad playoff games, just that this particular game was bad.

 

No need to make a mountain out of an anthill.

[SouthSideRyan]

But Michael wouldn't have done that.

[Sammy Sofa]

17 points on 16 shots from an NBA great in a game 7. Bravo.

 

Good point. Should they start Bryant against Oklahoma City or has Steve Blake overtaken him?

 

I don't get the snark or the wasted hours of MJ research. Did he have a unwhelming game? Yes. That's all that this discussion was about. 17 points on 16 shots is underwhelming. Doesn't mean he's NOT an all time great or that no great players have bad playoff games, just that this particular game was bad.

 

No need to make a mountain out of an anthill.

 

Yes, you dropping that little nugget immediately after pages of people trying to make the argument that Kobe Bryant is overrated makes it ridiculous for anyone to assume that you too shared that opinion.

[Formerly Snayke]

17 points on 16 shots from an NBA great in a game 7. Bravo.

 

Good point. Should they start Bryant against Oklahoma City or has Steve Blake overtaken him?

 

I don't get the snark or the wasted hours of MJ research. Did he have a unwhelming game? Yes. That's all that this discussion was about. 17 points on 16 shots is underwhelming. Doesn't mean he's NOT an all time great or that no great players have bad playoff games, just that this particular game was bad.

 

No need to make a mountain out of an anthill.

 

I guess it depends on the proper context of "underwhelming." Again, he played 45 minutes, had eight assists and made a big 3-pointer. He played more minutes than anyone else in the series and he's 33-years-old coming off a compressed 66-game schedule. Given all those issues, I'd say his Game 7 was a solid performance that, most importantly, helped them win.

[DivineBovine]

Bosh out "indefinitely". Miami is not good enough to win it all without him.

[bcl412]

no talk on the bosh injury? mri tomorrow, and the buzz is that he'll probably miss this series and maybe more.

 

that's a devstasting injury if true. i think it makes the boston/miami series a tossup, and there is no way the heat are beating san antonio or okc without him. they are just too thin, especially with bigs.

 

I'd say it's far from a given they beat Indiana without him.

 

I would think that would require a big series from Hibbert. I don't know if he can do that or not.

[UMFan83]

17 points on 16 shots from an NBA great in a game 7. Bravo.

 

Good point. Should they start Bryant against Oklahoma City or has Steve Blake overtaken him?

 

I don't get the snark or the wasted hours of MJ research. Did he have a unwhelming game? Yes. That's all that this discussion was about. 17 points on 16 shots is underwhelming. Doesn't mean he's NOT an all time great or that no great players have bad playoff games, just that this particular game was bad.

 

No need to make a mountain out of an anthill.

 

Yes, you dropping that little nugget immediately after pages of people trying to make the argument that Kobe Bryant is overrated makes it ridiculous for anyone to assume that you too shared that opinion.

 

lol...to be honest, I didn't read any of that argument, it didnt interest me. Guess I should have before posting that.

[SpongeWorthy]

Nice job Boston combining for 24 points in the 2nd and 3rd quarters

[CubColtPacer]

no talk on the bosh injury? mri tomorrow, and the buzz is that he'll probably miss this series and maybe more.

 

that's a devstasting injury if true. i think it makes the boston/miami series a tossup, and there is no way the heat are beating san antonio or okc without him. they are just too thin, especially with bigs.

 

I'd say it's far from a given they beat Indiana without him.

 

I would think that would require a big series from Hibbert. I don't know if he can do that or not.

 

No, he honestly can't. He's not a guy who will put a team on his back for multiple nights in a row. But I don't think he needs to. He just needs to draw enough attention (and West as well, who could possibly put the team on his back himself) to give the perimeter scorers some room. The Pacers were close on Sunday and got 23 points combined from Granger, George, and Hill on 25 shots. Those are the players who need to play decently to give the team a shot.