Joe Paterno

[SouthSideRyan]

Yep, this is why you don't let Joe Paterno have a press conference today Truffle. That video made things worse IMO

 

i guess you see the video as making it seem like he doesn't care about the victims. i see something different. to each his own opinion.

 

also i'm not sure how he could "make things worse" considering that he's being accused of being a despicable human being, complicit in allowing child rape, PSU football should get the death penalty, etc. unless he comes out and says that he supports child rape in all its forms, things aren't really going to get worse.

 

I wouldn't say those accusations/suggestions have exactly gone mainstream. I have a hard time believing ESPN will be rushing to anything but the rosiest of judgments on Paterno, and those students cheering him on (for what exactly?) certainly aren't thinking the same thing.

 

The best a Paterno supporter can go with from that video is the thought that he's clearly gone upstairs and has no concept of the gravity of the situation. Take away the sentence about the victims and you'd think it was a pep rally. Surreal.

[snoodmonger]

I don't see anything inaccurate with what he stated above.

 

there isn't literally a plausible case that Paterno actively covered up for him by downgrading the seriousness of the allegations when he reported it to the AD and President.

 

(a) he didn't report it to the AD and the president. he reported it verbally to the AD, who along with another administrator interviewed the grad assistant (mcqueary). they subsequently spoke to the president.

 

(b) paterno has said that he didn't know the exact nature of the sexual abuse, which seems logical to me - when you're talking to a conservative old man/coaching icon, do you tell him that you saw inappropriate sexual contact between sandusky and a minor, or do you tell him that you saw sandusky anally penetrating a young boy? i suspect it is the former, which is what paterno testified to in front of the grand jury. neither mcqueary nor curley has claimed that paterno knew more than what he let on. what kyle said above (about downgrading the seriousness of the allegations) is just making [expletive] up that is based on nothing whatsoever.

 

so you're telling me this guy went to to JoePa and said, "I saw your friend have inappropriate sexual contact with a young boy," and that was the extent of the description? Joe didn't say, "what do you mean inappropriate sexual contact?" He didn't dig deeper for details? He didn't ask questions about what the guy saw specifically, hoping it was a misunderstanding? He just said, "Cool, thanks, I'll talk to someone"?

 

That's what you believe? You believe Joe had no idea what happened, even after it was reported?

[snoodmonger]

How much money do you have to donate to Special Olympics to make it okay to let a kid get raped? $1 million? $10 million? What's the $ to CRAR conversion formula?

 

i said what i wanted to say. if this is your response then there's no point in discussing anything with you any more.

 

it's a legit response. You are excusing a rich child rape enabler by saying he donated money.

 

"Listen, I said what I wanted to say. Now I'm going to stick my fingers back in my ears and pretend nothing bad happened."

[snoodmonger]

dbl post Edited November 9, 2011 by snoodmonger

[snoodmonger]

i will change my screen name to raging anus

 

you've pretty much already done that in spirit here.

[TruffleShuffle]

so you're telling me this guy went to to JoePa and said, "I saw your friend have inappropriate sexual contact with a young boy," and that was the extent of the description? Joe didn't say, "what do you mean inappropriate sexual contact?" He didn't dig deeper for details? He didn't ask questions about what the guy saw specifically, hoping it was a misunderstanding? He just said, "Cool, thanks, I'll talk to someone"?

 

That's what you believe? You believe Joe had no idea what happened, even after it was reported?

 

i don't know that he knew the exact detail that mcqueary described to the grand jury (that sandusky was having anal sex with the boy). i figure we'll find that out eventually, through mcqueary's testimony. regardless, he told curley and schultz (the overseer of campus police, who would have had jurisdiction in this matter) that mcqueary had witnessed "fondling or doing something of a sexual nature to a young boy," which is certainly enough to trigger an investigation. so as i've said, i don't think it matters much because paterno told the that mcqueary claimed to have witnessed something clearly criminal in nature, and this led to them interviewing mcqueary directly (where he says he told them about the anal sex).

[Derwood]

I'm moving towards the "Paterno doesn't understand the gravity of the situation" camp and away from the "Paterno maliciously hid evidence" camp the more I see and read about the situation

[jersey cubs fan]

I wouldn't say those accusations/suggestions have exactly gone mainstream. I have a hard time believing ESPN will be rushing to anything but the rosiest of judgments on Paterno,

 

They already did that. After I saw the video last night espn was running a scroll of the text on the bottom line and they completely edited what he said, taking out the parts about "victims, or whatever they are" and a couple others things.

[wolf stansson]

I'm moving towards the "Paterno doesn't understand the gravity of the situation" camp and away from the "Paterno maliciously hid evidence" camp the more I see and read about the situation

 

It's still his fault for not putting forth the effort to understand the gravity of the situation. It's also still his fault that he fostered the kind of culture in a town that allowed someone to have unfettered access to victims in their schools, homes, his home and even PSU facilities. In a town where Paterno is god and football is everything, his right hand man had so much more leeway than the average pedophile. That lack of accountability is on Joe Pa. And I'm not talking about doddering old senile Joe Pa. I'm talking Joe Pa years ago when allegations first started coming out.

 

But yes, in the big lineup of people who should have done more, the half-wit coward McQueary is #1.

Edited November 9, 2011 by wolf stansson

[Hairyducked Idiot]

A number of people had a choice, and in each case that choice was:

 

1) Inaction or insufficient action, which made their lives or the lives of their friends and colleagues easier.

2) Action, which prevented children from being abused and raped by a predatory pedophile.

 

Every single person who could have chosen 2 and instead chose 1 deserves all the scorn they have gotten, and for the ones who are famous enough to be remembered, that will be their legacy. Those people can be found in PSU football, PSU administration, Second Mile and local law enforcement.

[jersey cubs fan]

I'm moving towards the "Paterno doesn't understand the gravity of the situation" camp and away from the "Paterno maliciously hid evidence" camp the more I see and read about the situation

 

It's still his fault for not putting forth the effort to understand the gravity of the situation. It's also still his fault that he fostered the kind of culture in a town that allowed someone to have unfettered access to victims in their schools, homes, his home and even PSU facilities. In a town where Paterno is god and football is everything, his right hand man had so much more leeway than the average pedophile. That lack of accountability is on Joe Pa. And I'm not talking about doddering old senile Joe Pa. I'm talking Joe Pa years ago when allegations first started coming out.

 

But yes, in the big lineup of people who should have done more, the half-wit coward McQueary is #1.

 

People seem to be glossing over the fact that this stuff started at least as early as the 90's. Paterno may be a senile old man today, but he wasn't in the 90's and early 2000's, when he had the opportunity to do something and chose not to.

[UK1679666180]

He has been molesting kids probably a lot longer than the late 90s. He didn't hit a mid-life crisis once he turned 50 and started this.

[jersey cubs fan]

He has been molesting kids probably a lot longer than the late 90s. He didn't hit a mid-life crisis once he turned 50 and started this.

 

Absolutely. I'm sure he's been going at it a lot longer, and I'm sure somebody at least had an inkling for a long time before then. But Penn State football was aware of it at least as early as the 90's, and Joe Paterno is Penn State Football. He's known since the late 90's, some indications that it was the mid 90's, and it's quite possible earlier.

 

 

Senile old man Paterno today is not the man who knew what happened well over a decade ago.

[jersey cubs fan]

peterno stepping down at end of season

 

 

 

pretty cowardly end if that's how it goes down

[Tracer Bullet]

i.e., Joe Paterno has decided not to change his retirement plans in the least, thank you.

[erik316wttn]

peterno stepping down at end of season

 

 

 

pretty cowardly end if that's how it goes down

 

He's "retiring." I bet he got the old "quit or be fired" option and he chose retirement to save a little face.

[SouthSideRyan]

I'm moving towards the "Paterno doesn't understand the gravity of the situation" camp and away from the "Paterno maliciously hid evidence" camp the more I see and read about the situation

 

It's still his fault for not putting forth the effort to understand the gravity of the situation. It's also still his fault that he fostered the kind of culture in a town that allowed someone to have unfettered access to victims in their schools, homes, his home and even PSU facilities. In a town where Paterno is god and football is everything, his right hand man had so much more leeway than the average pedophile. That lack of accountability is on Joe Pa. And I'm not talking about doddering old senile Joe Pa. I'm talking Joe Pa years ago when allegations first started coming out.

 

Yeah, as fun as it is to paint Paterno as a rambling old fool who poops his pants with regularity(especially now), I have a hard time buying that 10 years ago he didn't realize that someone even fondling young boys = a horrible situation that needs to be dealt with.

 

ETA: Or what gooney said (though the pants pooping still stands)

[jersey cubs fan]

[Yeah, as fun as it is to paint Paterno as a rambling old fool who poops his pants with regularity(especially now), I have a hard time buying that 10 years ago he didn't realize that someone even fondling young boys = a horrible situation that needs to be dealt with.

 

but he passed it along to his "boss" who doesn't have the power to fire him

[javy knows my name]

I might punch somebody

[Derwood]

I'm not arguing senility, I'm arguing naivety (or his being sheltered from the situation).

 

Going back to the possible NCAA involvement, anything that might happen won't (can't?) happen until Sandusky is actually tried and found guilty. That looks like it's 100% going to happen, but as long as (legally) everything is just "alleged", there isn't much the NCAA can (or should) do

[Theo]

I'm moving towards the "Paterno doesn't understand the gravity of the situation" camp and away from the "Paterno maliciously hid evidence" camp the more I see and read about the situation

laughable.

[Tracer Bullet]

I'm not arguing senility, I'm arguing naivety (or his being sheltered from the situation).

 

Going back to the possible NCAA involvement, anything that might happen won't (can't?) happen until Sandusky is actually tried and found guilty. That looks like it's 100% going to happen, but as long as (legally) everything is just "alleged", there isn't much the NCAA can (or should) do

 

why?

[Tracer Bullet]

CNN's spin: "Paterno: Pray for alleged victims"

 

Yeah, that's what he said.

[jersey cubs fan]

CNN's spin: "Paterno: Pray for alleged victims"

 

Yeah, that's what he said.

 

or whatever they are

[SouthSideRyan]

I'm not arguing senility, I'm arguing naivety (or his being sheltered from the situation).

 

Going back to the possible NCAA involvement, anything that might happen won't (can't?) happen until Sandusky is actually tried and found guilty. That looks like it's 100% going to happen, but as long as (legally) everything is just "alleged", there isn't much the NCAA can (or should) do

 

So if Sandusky offs himself tomorrow, the NCAA can never act on this? You're conflating both what the NCAA can do versus a school, and the repercussions for NCAA violations versus legal/moral violations. This isn't Jim O' Brien at Ohio State.