Total Hypothetical Here...

[Sammy Sofa]

Off the top of my head, all I've got is Longoria.

 

Probably Harper and Moore.

I'd probably do Bumgarner, too. Maybe Upton.

 

If Kemp even comes close to replicating his 2011 next year I'd consider him, too (if there wasn't such a good a chance he'd be a FA).

[Clem Fandango]

Would love to have him, but the money to pay him can be better spent elsewhere and I'm not really down for gutting the system for one player. I know he's an unbelievable pitcher, but I kinda want to see how resourceful Theo can be with what he's been given.

 

turning the Cubs second rate high level prospects into an ace would be pretty damn resourceful.

 

Eh, I worded that a little inappropriately. I don't NOT want Felix on the Cubs, I've just been hyped up on Theo & Co. building a winner from within while utilizing smart trades and free agency moves. A trade like this would make building a winner from within a longer term process instead of a more shorter term one, and I'm kind of tired of the build-through-free-agency model we've been employing the past 10 years, and it seems like a move like this would make us have to do that over the next few seasons if we want to contend.

 

I think they can make smaller, wiser moves and still build a winner within the next 2-3 years without Felix. I'm kind of more interested in seeing that happen than making a huge trade for Felix. Plus, for some reason, I'm cautious of his durability. I know he's been incredibly durable, but he just seems like he's primed for an injury in the next couple of years. He's put nearly 1400 MLB innings on his arm and he's not even 26 yet. Zambrano was the rubber arm durability machine and he started to show signs of wearing down when he was nearing 1400 innings as well (Z was 27). I don't know... it's just my opinion and personal preference, I'm not trying to make a case for that to convince anyone.

[SouthSideRyan]

Off the top of my head, all I've got is Longoria.

 

Probably Harper and Moore.

I'd probably do Bumgarner, too. Maybe Upton.

 

If Kemp even comes close to replicating his 2011 next year I'd consider him, too (if there wasn't such a good a chance he'd be a FA).

 

You'd trade Starlin Castro straight up for Matt Kemp?

[Little Slide Rooter]

Off the top of my head, all I've got is Longoria.

 

Probably Harper and Moore.

I'd probably do Bumgarner, too. Maybe Upton.

 

If Kemp even comes close to replicating his 2011 next year I'd consider him, too (if there wasn't such a good a chance he'd be a FA).

 

If he does come close, he'll be looking at Yankee money.

[jersey cubs fan]

I really think people have a strange obsession with this building from within, stop spending on the best free agents, be patient and only make small moves theory.

 

 

Part of building from within is trading your prospects for valuable pieces. The Chicago Cubs will never win with a team filled only with internally drafted players.

 

Acquiring Felix is nothing like the way Hendry would do things. The Cubs never went after the best of the best, they always went after the 2nd choice on the shelf. Hendry's Cubs absolutely built from within. But building from within with Hendry's prospects was part of the problem, and trading Hendry's prospects for an ace is hardly a move that will cripple the future.

 

Theo Epstein is not going to run the Cubs on a series of small moves. He's going to make splashes. So try to not be disappointed when that happens.

[Sammy Sofa]

Off the top of my head, all I've got is Longoria.

 

Probably Harper and Moore.

I'd probably do Bumgarner, too. Maybe Upton.

 

If Kemp even comes close to replicating his 2011 next year I'd consider him, too (if there wasn't such a good a chance he'd be a FA).

 

You'd trade Starlin Castro straight up for Matt Kemp?

 

If he had a similar 2012 to 2011 and wasn't likely to be a FA, yeah. Dude was a 9 WAR player this season.

[Sammy Sofa]

Off the top of my head, all I've got is Longoria.

 

Probably Harper and Moore.

I'd probably do Bumgarner, too. Maybe Upton.

 

If Kemp even comes close to replicating his 2011 next year I'd consider him, too (if there wasn't such a good a chance he'd be a FA).

 

If he does come close, he'll be looking at Yankee money.

 

And I really hope the Cubs are the ones shelling out.

[Sammy Sofa]

Basically what I'm saying is is that I heart Matt Kemp.

[SouthSideRyan]

Off the top of my head, all I've got is Longoria.

 

Probably Harper and Moore.

I'd probably do Bumgarner, too. Maybe Upton.

 

If Kemp even comes close to replicating his 2011 next year I'd consider him, too (if there wasn't such a good a chance he'd be a FA).

 

You'd trade Starlin Castro straight up for Matt Kemp?

 

If he had a similar 2012 to 2011 and wasn't likely to be a FA, yeah. Dude was a 9 WAR player this season.

 

K, I'd trade Castro for Barry Bonds in his prime.

[jersey cubs fan]

K, I'd trade Castro for Barry Bonds in his prime.

 

I'm not interested in that sort of Jim Hendry move.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

K, I'd trade Castro for Barry Bonds in his prime.

 

I'm not interested in that sort of Jim Hendry move.

 

I'm tired of these short-term band-aid solutions that sacrifice the future of the team. We aren't going to compete in 2012.

[Clem Fandango]

I really think people have a strange obsession with this building from within, stop spending on the best free agents, be patient and only make small moves theory.

 

 

Part of building from within is trading your prospects for valuable pieces. The Chicago Cubs will never win with a team filled only with internally drafted players.

 

Acquiring Felix is nothing like the way Hendry would do things. The Cubs never went after the best of the best, they always went after the 2nd choice on the shelf. Hendry's Cubs absolutely built from within. But building from within with Hendry's prospects was part of the problem, and trading Hendry's prospects for an ace is hardly a move that will cripple the future.

 

Theo Epstein is not going to run the Cubs on a series of small moves. He's going to make splashes. So try to not be disappointed when that happens.

 

Touché. Good point, sir.

[Guest]

I don't think I'd trade Castro for Felix, but I would consider it long and hard. Castro is a great talent, but he has serious flaws in his game that need to be corrected if he's going to live up to the expectation that many have for him. I guess the question I'd need to ask myself and my people if I'm Theo is, how likely is Castro to reach a level that Felix is currently at?

 

Flaws:

-His value as an offensive player is incredibly prone to luck that could create severe swings in his BA, and his BA is going to make up a significant portion of his OBP if he doesn't become more selective at the plate.

-His defensive footwork is not good.

-Will his power come?

 

All those things are correctable and/or could come with maturity.

 

However, I agree with Gonny 100%. Part of having a great system is that there are tradable assets to go get top caliber established ballplayers.

Edited October 31, 2011 by CubinNY

[Guest]

The timing comment is more in regards to the Cubs simply not having the right "sexy" prospects to make them any kind of favorites in a deal like this (unless the Mariners are more about quantity over quality or would rather pick up a bunch of really young high ceiling guys) as opposed to the Cubs needing to hang on to what they have.

 

A bit late to this thread but I agree with you. Of course Theo is known to love Felix...hopefully the Mariners hold onto him and he's available next offseason.

[SouthSideRyan]

Starlin Castro is already a really good baseball player, will be 22 next season, and is essentially free.

[Exile on Waveland]

I wouldn't trade Castro alone for him.

 

Me neither. Nor would that involve much contemplation.

[Outshined_One]

Setting aside the idea of cost, I really like the idea of acquiring King Felix. Yeah, the 3/$60 is going to cost the Cubs, but they should be able to absorb that hit with a bunch of contracts coming off the books after 2012. There are always concerns about injuries and the like, but it's incredibly rare for ace caliber starters to be available in their primes. Cripes, Felix is still only 25 years old.

 

That said, I don't think I'd do Castro for Felix straight up, given the money, the lack of quality shortstops available, and Castro's upside. It'd be one thing if the Cubs had someone in the system waiting in the wings who could fill in for Castro...but right now those options include Darwin Barney, DJ LeMahieu, and Marwin Gonzalez. That isn't particularly inspiring.

[KingKongvs.Godzilla]

I really think people have a strange obsession with this building from within, stop spending on the best free agents, be patient and only make small moves theory.

 

 

Part of building from within is trading your prospects for valuable pieces. The Chicago Cubs will never win with a team filled only with internally drafted players.

 

Acquiring Felix is nothing like the way Hendry would do things. The Cubs never went after the best of the best, they always went after the 2nd choice on the shelf. Hendry's Cubs absolutely built from within. But building from within with Hendry's prospects was part of the problem, and trading Hendry's prospects for an ace is hardly a move that will cripple the future.

 

Theo Epstein is not going to run the Cubs on a series of small moves. He's going to make splashes. So try to not be disappointed when that happens.

 

[expletive] THANK YOU. The point of having those nobody prospects is that they can become somebody, and the single most underrated way to guarantee that is to trade them for good ML talent.

 

The farm system is ripe for a trade, and like you say I'm not all that worried about losing Hendry prospects. Barney, LeMahieu, Flaherty, Castillo, Clevenger, Dolis, Carpenter, Cabrera, McNutt,, Jackson, Szczur, Rusin, Gaub, Beliveau, Watkins, Crawford...*all* these guys are part of the future of the Cubs on the field? I like most of those guys in the long run to put up maybe even above average careers, but here? Meh.

 

As far as Castro is concerned there's not anyone I can for sure name that I'd trade him for. Castro screams future superstar to me. I hate to get hyperbolic on a young player, but he really does remind me of a young Jeter (for the 0 that's worth). If only he were taller and biracial...

[davell]

I would definitely trade Starlin for Kershaw. And I could possibly be talked into trading him for Heyward or Posey. Longoria? Yeah. Probably Pineda. At any rate, I'd only deal him for guys under control for at least 3 more years and at a solid discount. Hell, maybe I better rethink Kershaw, since he's going to get really expensive really quickly himself.

[KingKongvs.Godzilla]

I would definitely trade Starlin for Kershaw. And I could possibly be talked into trading him for Heyward or Posey. Longoria? Yeah. Probably Pineda. At any rate, I'd only deal him for guys under control for at least 3 more years and at a solid discount. Hell, maybe I better rethink Kershaw, since he's going to get really expensive really quickly himself.

 

OK so Kershawis one....everyone else I'd still have to be convinced...I didn't even name Justin Upton that's how highly I think of Castro.

[davell]

I looked at Longoria's stats, I may recant on him. Like I said, not sure whether I would trade him for Posey or Heyward, possible though. I like Pineda a lot. How about David Price? He's a possibility for sure.

[El Duderino]

I looked at Longoria's stats, I may recant on him. Like I said, not sure whether I would trade him for Posey or Heyward, possible though. I like Pineda a lot. How about David Price? He's a possibility for sure.

 

No way on Heyward after his 2011. Maybe if he bounces back next year.

[KingKongvs.Godzilla]

I looked at Longoria's stats, I may recant on him. Like I said, not sure whether I would trade him for Posey or Heyward, possible though. I like Pineda a lot. How about David Price? He's a possibility for sure.

 

Another name that I didn't mention because of how big time a talent I think Castro is. I think Price is basically skinny CC, and will be an elite pitcher/horse for a long time. I'm a big fan of Ryan Zimmerman amongst the 3B too, which I think hurts Longoria as far as having a bias. Still wouldn't do it.

[davell]

Strasburg or Harper, even though he's not made it up yet?

[Splendid Splinter]

Mike Trout