2011 NFL Draft Thread

[shnsajax]

I cannot believe how quickly Andy has thrown Clausen under the bus. The entire team is garbage, why are you so anxious to replace one of your few players who still has potential.

Because it's depressing to watch him get killed out there, that's why. I've said repeatedly that them drafting Luck really isn't fair to him because he deserves a shot with a team whose coach hasn't quit on them and whose offensive line doesn't appear to be double agents, but the NFL is full of QBs unfairly being chucked out on their butts before they're clearly done. And I want Carolina to win games, and I think Luck's their best shot of doing that.

 

luck is going to be about as successful as clausen.

 

i don't see luck being anything special.

 

Based on...?

[SouthSideRyan]

It's not about being fair to Clausen, it's about upgrading one of the 50 other holes on your team rather than going out of your way to marginalize one of the few spots that could be a positive in the near future.

[SpongeWorthy]

I cannot believe how quickly Andy has thrown Clausen under the bus. The entire team is garbage, why are you so anxious to replace one of your few players who still has potential.

Because it's depressing to watch him get killed out there, that's why. I've said repeatedly that them drafting Luck really isn't fair to him because he deserves a shot with a team whose coach hasn't quit on them and whose offensive line doesn't appear to be double agents, but the NFL is full of QBs unfairly being chucked out on their butts before they're clearly done. And I want Carolina to win games, and I think Luck's their best shot of doing that.

 

luck is going to be about as successful as clausen.

 

i don't see luck being anything special.

 

Based on...?

 

Pure contrarianism and literally nothing else.

[dew1679666265]

luck is going to be about as successful as clausen.

 

i don't see luck being anything special.

 

What don't you like about Luck?

[Andy]

It's not about being fair to Clausen, it's about upgrading one of the 50 other holes on your team rather than going out of your way to marginalize one of the few spots that could be a positive in the near future.

I guess that depends on whether Carolina agrees that he can be. I think it's possible, but he sure didn't go out of his way to give them any reason to believe it.

[TruffleShuffle]

the colts and cowboys were God-awful during the early manning and aikman years. any qb is going to suck if the players around them suck; if the guy is going to be good then build a good team around him so that he can succeed. it would be dumb to not draft a really good qb because the pieces around him suck right now.

[Guest]

If Luck is significantly better than Clausen, you should draft him. You could spin Clausen away in a trade. Whether you have Luck or Clausen, you need to upgrade the rest of the team. I think Luck *is* significantly better than Clausen and warrants selecting him at the expense of a trade down (unless a team overwhelms Carolina).

[rawaction]

If Luck is significantly better than Clausen, you should draft him. You could spin Clausen away in a trade. Whether you have Luck or Clausen, you need to upgrade the rest of the team. I think Luck *is* significantly better than Clausen and warrants selecting him at the expense of a trade down (unless a team overwhelms Carolina).

 

I think we all agree Luck will be the better QB. The question is how much better? Peyton Manning is significantly better than Jay Cutler, but Cutler is still a pretty good QB. If they think Clausen can still be pretty good, then it becomes a tough decision no matter what you think of Luck.

 

Plus, you still have Mallett and Newton in the draft. Carolina could still draft Newton or

Mallett and get a couple more picks on top of that. In the case of Newton, you could still keep Clausen around and get Newton ready for when the team is potentially good again if necessary.

[Guest]

Are those trade charts for picks legit? I'm not sure how to determine what is good value on a trade down.

[rawaction]

Are those trade charts for picks legit? I'm not sure how to determine what is good value on a trade down.

 

I don't think they are that good of a measurement anymore. The problem is there isn't really a precedent for a recent #1 pick trade. The Eli/Rivers thing was 7 years ago now.

[Andy]

the colts and cowboys were God-awful during the early manning and aikman years. any qb is going to suck if the players around them suck; if the guy is going to be good then build a good team around him so that he can succeed. it would be dumb to not draft a really good qb because the pieces around him suck right now.

The Colts were God-awful in Manning's rookie year, but any moron could see the kid playing and tell he was going to be good even if he was on an awful team. He threw a lot of picks but also moved the ball for his team to the tune of 3,700 yards through the air. And then they drafted Edge James and in year 2 of Manning they went 13-3.

 

Clausen has shown none of that. Apart from bits and pieces of the New Orleans (in NO) and Cleveland games, he hasn't shown any ability to be a difference-maker. I wouldn't mind giving him another shot - God knows I'm not ready for another Notre Dame product to be prematurely tossed out on his ass and then joked about for the next 5 years - but I can't in any way fault the Panthers if they decide that this isn't going to work, because they haven't seen anything to show otherwise.

[Banedon]

I base this on my years of insightful draft analysis, and my keen scouting skills....

 

Notre Dame QB's are crappy NFL QB's...at least since Joe Montana. I don't expect Clausen will ever develop into much.

[Andy]

I base this on my years of insightful draft analysis, and my keen scouting skills....

 

Notre Dame QB's are crappy NFL QB's...at least since Joe Montana. I don't expect Clausen will ever develop into much.

Clausen's failure, if it happens, has nothing to do with Notre Dame.

[Banedon]

I base this on my years of insightful draft analysis, and my keen scouting skills....

 

Notre Dame QB's are crappy NFL QB's...at least since Joe Montana. I don't expect Clausen will ever develop into much.

Clausen's failure, if it happens, has nothing to do with Notre Dame.

 

How about Brady Quinn? Rick Mirer? Yes, I'm going back to Rick Mirer.

 

;)

[davell]

I think Clausen sucks and I feel rather confident in saying that whoever it is that takes over Carolina next year will think the same. That said, I'd still expect the Panthers to try to trade down(depending on new CBA and such), because I doubt Richardson wants to pay THAT much for an unknown(although I would and think he's going to be Peyton moreso than Eli as far as franchise types go). I think both Newton and Mallet are top 10 picks as well and could see the Panthers going that route and taking the accumulated picks that come with it, especially since they've dealt their 2nd rounder already.

 

The other possibility I can see with them is staying put and taking Daquan Bowers as kind of a Julius Peppers "homegrown" franchise type guy, if he impresses as much as I think he will in the combines. Easier to do if Luck doesn't come out obviously.

[Andy]

There is basically no chance Carolina drafts Cam Newton if they trade down. They lack any ingenuity whatsoever and wouldn't have a clue how to create a system for Newton to thrive in.

 

Carolina needs to take Luck if they want a QB. If they don't, they should trade down and pick somebody else like Bowers or Prince Amakamura or whoever.

[jersey cubs fan]

There is basically no chance Carolina drafts Cam Newton if they trade down. They lack any ingenuity whatsoever and wouldn't have a clue how to create a system for Newton to thrive in.

 

Carolina needs to take Luck if they want a QB. If they don't, they should trade down and pick somebody else like Bowers or Prince Amakamura or whoever.

 

They are changing coaches right? It shouldn't be too hard to change the lack of ingenuity thing just with that one hire.

[rawaction]

Corey Liuget must leave college this year and get drafted in the 1st round by the Chicago Bears.

[Andy]

There is basically no chance Carolina drafts Cam Newton if they trade down. They lack any ingenuity whatsoever and wouldn't have a clue how to create a system for Newton to thrive in.

 

Carolina needs to take Luck if they want a QB. If they don't, they should trade down and pick somebody else like Bowers or Prince Amakamura or whoever.

 

They are changing coaches right? It shouldn't be too hard to change the lack of ingenuity thing just with that one hire.

Carolina's lack of originality is a top-down thing. I don't see them hiring anyone with any brilliant new ideas. I'm just hoping they can hire a guy like Harbaugh who does really really well with old ones.

[mul21]

Corey Liuget must leave college this year and get drafted in the 1st round by the Chicago Bears.

 

That was a pretty good Ndamakong Suh impression he was doing last night. He was freaking everywhere. He's been a beast all year.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

So what round is Mike Pouncey expected to go? He's raw at center, but watching him today, I think he's going to be a great right guard in the NFL.

[SpongeWorthy]

He's easily in the first round.

[dew1679666265]

He's easily in the first round.

 

Yeah, he's easily as good as his brother. I'm curious to see if the bad snaps will downgrade his perception some, even though I doubt anybody will draft him as a center.

[rawaction]

He's easily in the first round.

 

Yeah, he's easily as good as his brother. I'm curious to see if the bad snaps will downgrade his perception some, even though I doubt anybody will draft him as a center.

 

That's not true. Mike is at least a step and a 1/2 behind his brother. For one, there's a reason why Maurkice came out and Mike didn't. Secondly, Maurkice has played at an all-pro level this year and has been the best C in the AFC. Mike is only a 1st rounder if a team like Philly, Pittsburgh, or Indianapolis feel like they have to reach to get him because he wont' come back to them in the 2nd.

 

Most websites have Mike Pouncey at a 2nd round grade right now. I think the snaps have downgraded his perception. He's now viewed as just a guard instead of a versatile OL. He also has always had questions about his athleticism and pass blocking ability.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

He's easily in the first round.

 

Yeah, he's easily as good as his brother. I'm curious to see if the bad snaps will downgrade his perception some, even though I doubt anybody will draft him as a center.

 

That's not true. Mike is at least a step and a 1/2 behind his brother. For one, there's a reason why Maurkice came out and Mike didn't. Secondly, Maurkice has played at an all-pro level this year and has been the best C in the AFC. Mike is only a 1st rounder if a team like Philly, Pittsburgh, or Indianapolis feel like they have to reach to get him because he wont' come back to them in the 2nd.

 

Most websites have Mike Pouncey at a 2nd round grade right now. I think the snaps have downgraded his perception. He's now viewed as just a guard instead of a versatile OL. He also has always had questions about his athleticism and pass blocking ability.

 

So in your opinion, he's going to go somewhere from late first to middle second?