2011 NFL Draft Thread

[mul21]

Saben is cautioning his juniors about entering the draft this year. Guessing we will see a lot of this over the next month.

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/draft2011/news/story?id=5938951

Some agents who represent NFL players are taking a different tact, however. One prominent sports agent who represents players said he's advising juniors to enter the draft as soon as possible because of the possibility of a rookie wage scale that could limit players' earnings in the first few years of their careers.

 

"I tell them, 'You need to get into the system as quickly as possible,' " the agent said. 'You'll need to get to that second contract as soon as you can.' "

This makes no sense to me. If they declare for the draft and hire representation then there's a lockout and new agreement with changes to rookie wages before the draft, aren't they also subject to the new wage scale?

 

I think this guy is talking about just acting as an unpaid adviser. And all he's suggesting is that they get into the NFL and on somebody's payroll so that when that first contract is up and the guy is an FA, they're 24 or 25 in stead of 25 or 26 and have an extra year of earning potential. How that actually works out for anybody, who knows, but it makes sense to have one less year of unpaid mileage on the body, especially for linemen and running backs who get the crap beat out of them on every play.

[Guest]

Carimi is a RT and Love a guard in the NFL (imo). There's not a lot of scouting reports out there on Smith but I totally agree with rawaction on his talent level. He might be the most athletic OT in this draft; especially when compared to Carimi, Love and Matt Reynolds.

 

And if you're not sold on the OTs at the end of the 1st round, I'd go guard/center. One of Pouncey or Brewster should be available and should be able to start from day 1.

 

 

Part of me wouldn't mind Pouncey or Brewster, but I think we can find value later in the draft with an interior lineman and would prefer to use the 1st on something else, if it came to it.

 

I like Carimi myself, but I do keep forgetting that Webb is possibly a bright spot on the O-Line right now and we may not need to change positions with him.

 

I'm really not a big fan of Webb. I don't think he's going to improve from what he is now and that is below average.

[Productive Outs]

why did the Bengals have to win? :(

 

looking at the SoS for this season (tiebreaker for the draft order), the bengals' opponents so far have a winning percentage of .583

 

the panthers' opponents have a winning percentage of .570.

 

had the bengals lost, it would have greatly increased their chances of owning the #1 pick. the panthers close out with the steelers and the falcons. it is very unlikely they win either of those games.

 

:(

[javy knows my name]

Do you pick Mallett or Luck before Newton? I think yes on Luck, no on Mallett.

 

Are the Bengals definitely picking a QB, Dob?

[dew1679666265]

Do you pick Mallett or Luck before Newton? I think yes on Luck, no on Mallett.

 

I'd probably pick both Luck and Mallett over Newton. Both Luck and Mallett have run more of a pro-style offense than Newton has, making their transition to an NFL offense much easier.

 

I like Newton a lot, though. I just like Mallett and Luck more.

[hawkeyecub]

Where do you find the strength of schedule percentages that the NFL uses for tiebreakers? The Vikings would be tied between 7-12 right now.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

Where do you find the strength of schedule percentages that the NFL uses for tiebreakers? The Vikings would be tied between 7-12 right now.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/standings/_/type/playoffs/sort/conferenceRank/order/false

[hawkeyecub]

Where do you find the strength of schedule percentages that the NFL uses for tiebreakers? The Vikings would be tied between 7-12 right now.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/standings/_/type/playoffs/sort/conferenceRank/order/false

 

Thanks.

[Productive Outs]

Do you pick Mallett or Luck before Newton? I think yes on Luck, no on Mallett.

 

Are the Bengals definitely picking a QB, Dob?

 

most of the mock drafts that i've seen have them taking Bowers, the DE from Clemson. they have not been able to generate much pressure with their front four this year. however, Carlos Dunlap (DE), their second round pick last year, has improved all year, and has recorded 7 sacks in fairly limited playing time. i guess you go with Bowers if you want an elite pass rush (every team does, but you know what i mean) in the next 1-3 years, but i really think they need to get Luck however they can. at this point, they would probably have to trade up. Palmer has been a shell of himself since he returned from the knee injury. it's hard to watch him anymore.

 

either trade for the #1 pick, have the panthers inexplicably pass on him (i don't see that happening), or win games and drop down to Mallett's range.

[Warpticon]

Do you pick Mallett or Luck before Newton? I think yes on Luck, no on Mallett.

 

Are the Bengals definitely picking a QB, Dob?

 

Unless Newton shows better footwork and/or a demonstration that he can make reads other than run/throw the ball downfield, I absolutely pick Mallett over Newton. And I pick Luck above anybody, free. Not to say Newton can't play QB at the next level, he's just been limited in what he's been required to do and has gotten by a lot on just being a physical beast. That will only take him so far at the next level. At some point he's going to have to start reading defenses and checking down regularly, and we can't honestly say we have any idea how well he's capable of doing those things based on his play in college.

[rawaction]

Newton has some crazy upside though. He obviously has the arm and mobility. He just needs to be taught the QB position. And I actually don't think the learning curve is as bad as people make it out to be. Look at Joe Webb. He barely practiced at QB all year, and has put together a couple good drives in the last 2 weeks. Give Newton an entire offseason (if there is offseason football activities), camp, and a half season worth of reps, I don't think he will kill you at the QB position.

 

I'd pick Newton over Mallett. Mallett is a statue. Get him out of the pocket and he's completely ineffective. He does have some upside too, as he has an elite arm also. Has shown he can make multiple reads, but also can lock in on a WR and try to make a tight throw. I actually think he would be fine doing that if he threw a little harder. He can do it, but I think he uses too much touch at times, if that makes any sense.

[jersey cubs fan]

Look at Joe Webb. He barely practiced at QB all year, and has put together a couple good drives in the last 2 weeks.

 

When all you have to do is come in and work a drive or two while down by a couple scores, that type of QB can flourish without much exposure. It's the 4 quarters worth of hits and full weeks of opposing defenses preparing for you that can be tough.

[rawaction]

Look at Joe Webb. He barely practiced at QB all year, and has put together a couple good drives in the last 2 weeks.

 

When all you have to do is come in and work a drive or two while down by a couple scores, that type of QB can flourish without much exposure. It's the 4 quarters worth of hits and full weeks of opposing defenses preparing for you that can be tough.

 

Yeah, but it's hard to prepare for the speed of Webb or Newton. And it's hard to prepare for Newton's arm strength. It's definitely more difficult to play 4 good quarters than it is to move the ball on 2 drives vs. a laxed defense. But it will also help for Newton to have 6 months to prepare for game action than it was for Webb who didn't get any practice reps at QB until last week.

[dew1679666265]

Yeah, but it's hard to prepare for the speed of Webb or Newton. And it's hard to prepare for Newton's arm strength. It's definitely more difficult to play 4 good quarters than it is to move the ball on 2 drives vs. a laxed defense. But it will also help for Newton to have 6 months to prepare for game action than it was for Webb who didn't get any practice reps at QB until last week.

 

Pretty much all the arguments you made could have been said (and were said) when Vince Young entered the draft. I don't disagree with a lot of your arguments, I'm generally a big fan of mobile QBs. But I've seen first hand how hard it can be for a QB who has never had to read defenses before to start doing it at the NFL level.

 

I like Newton's upside a lot, but I wouldn't consider taking him if I needed a QB to step on the field immediately. If I'm a team with a stable, older QB and I can afford to groom Newton for 2-3 years, I take him. But if I'm looking for a QB to come in and start immediately, I go with Luck/Mallett first without much thought.

[Guest]

The same arguments were also made with regards to McNair and Freeman. It comes down to how Newton adapts and how well and quickly he learns the position and the complexities of an NFL offense.

[cubbyvirus00]

I was thinking Chicago goes with a DT or a WR in the first round, OL will get addressed with 2 picks in the first 4 rounds.

[dew1679666265]

The same arguments were also made with regards to McNair and Freeman. It comes down to how Newton adapts and how well and quickly he learns the position and the complexities of an NFL offense.

 

Freeman I'll give you, but McNair sat for 3 years behind Chris Chandler before taking over. That's exactly what I'm arguing should be done with Newton - get a stable, veteran QB in front of him and give him time to learn and adapt to an NFL offense.

 

It does depend on how serious a player is about studying, putting in the extra work and learning the offense. If you're looking for a QB who can contribute immediately, the chances are much better with Mallett and Luck than with Newton, though, because Mallett and Luck have played in much more NFL-oriented offenses and have no choice but to go through progressions and make good reads. Newton hasn't been in an offense that's required him to do that.

[hawkeyecub]

I'd pick Newton over Mallett. Mallett is a statue. Get him out of the pocket and he's completely ineffective. He does have some upside too, as he has an elite arm also. Has shown he can make multiple reads, but also can lock in on a WR and try to make a tight throw. I actually think he would be fine doing that if he threw a little harder. He can do it, but I think he uses too much touch at times, if that makes any sense.

 

Statues can do well in the NFL if they're smart and have a quick release. I know he has the latter. I have no idea whether he can make the quick reads that will be necessary.

 

I know I want the Vikings to draft him though.

[rawaction]

AJ Green is gone from Georgia. Entering the draft.

[Warpticon]

I'd pick Newton over Mallett. Mallett is a statue. Get him out of the pocket and he's completely ineffective. He does have some upside too, as he has an elite arm also. Has shown he can make multiple reads, but also can lock in on a WR and try to make a tight throw. I actually think he would be fine doing that if he threw a little harder. He can do it, but I think he uses too much touch at times, if that makes any sense.

 

The bolded is flat false. He's no more of a "statue" than any other pocket passer, and he's a better play action passer than all of them. He's also done great things on bootlegs and called rollouts. Does that make him a threat to gain yards with his legs? No. But the lack of a strength is not the same thing as a weakness. His biggest weaknesses as a passer are:

 

* He doesn't make touch passes as much as he should: tends to rifle the ball in when he could stand to take something off it (I have no idea how you managed to see the opposite of this)

* He trusts his arm too much and can make dangerous throws because of this.

* Last year he was really bad about screwing up his mechanics under pressure. When guys got in his face, he would fail to square his shoulder and step into his throws, which would result in wild inaccuracy. This year he got A LOT better about this (and it's reflected in a nearly 11% increase in completion %) , but he still has those moments from time to time.

 

Cam has a huge arm, amazing physique, and special mobility, but he has work to do as well. His footwork is poor, his mechanics could use some fine tuning, and his decision making is still a big question mark. Also there will be questions in how well he handles pressure, considering he played behind arguably the best offensive line in the country this year and thereby rarely saw any. I think he can play QB in the NFL, but I don't see him doing it particularly well right away.

[davell]

Walterfootball.com's latest mock draft has the Bears taking Anthony Castonzo in the 1st, Marvin Austin in the 2nd and Titus Young in the 3rd. If that actually were to happen, I'm happy as hell.

[SpongeWorthy]

Titus Young is a Knox clone.

[Butterscup1679666578]

Castonzo needs to get stronger but I'd be pumped with him.

 

Austin would be a first rounder if he wasn't kicked off the team. That would essentially be two first rounders for us.

 

Don't want Young at all. I want a big 6'3"+ possession WR to compliment Knox, Bennett and Hester

[davell]

I agree that Young isn't ideal for us, but the 1st 2 picks would have me excited and in a perfect world, we could get a WR and an OG thru FA.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

Walterfootball has the Cowboys getting Prince Amukamara in the first, Rhaim Moore in the second, and Christian Ballard in the third. I would be pleased with that, though I think one of Dallas's first three picks should be an o-lineman unless that is addressed with FA.