When should Cubs think about docking D-Lee's playing time?

[badnews]

I'm actually not 100% sold on the idea of doing so but I think the idea deserves consideration.

 

Since May 13th, Derrek Lee has posted a .743 OPS. That's not good enough and it's been going on too long. In the same time period Soto has posted an .804 OPS and Aramis an .878.

 

Since June 1st, Lee has had 4 home runs. In that time period, Skip Schumaker, Fukudome, Jose Reyes and Placido Polanco have had 5 in that time period. Jody Gerut has 10. Ronnie Belliard has 8, Geoff Blum has 8, Jose Lopez has 8, Mark DeRosa has 9, Willie Harris has 7, Freddy Sanchez has 6, Fontenot has 6... come on.

 

I know this is a radical suggestion, but should the Cubs expect more out of their 1b than defense? Should a 1b be able to outslug Willie Harris playing half of his game in Washington?

 

Also since June 1, Paul Konerko and Lee have basically the same OPS, and Konerko has seen his time cut. The situational numbers don't look great, .859 OPS with the bases empty, 13 home runs, .741 OPS, 1 home run with RISP, .589 OPS with RISP 2/outs.

 

Lee is hitting lefties a lot better than righties, maybe a modified platoon with Hoffpauir? You don't need to give Hoffpauir more than enough rope to hang himself, but just see if he can catch fire and maybe light a fire under Lee.

 

What do you think?

[Cynosure]

Bench time and call up Hoffpauir would be my remedy.

[badnews]

I don't know what the answer is but I think we've run with "status quo" long enough, and it may be time for "not status quo."

[Derwood]

someone in the clubhouse needs to be a leader and tell Lou that Lee can't play anymore

[rynefan]

Yeah, in a season of pleasant surprises (Soto, Dempster, Johnson, etc.), Lee has not been where he should be for a while now. What would it hurt, maybe the break would do him good.

[erik316wttn]

Are there any obtainable 1B on the free-agent market this offseason? I know Teixeria is going to cost a bundle.

[Illini Iceman]

Despite Hoff's recent surge at AAA I still don't feel at all confident he could match Lee's production even if he just played against righties. With Lee's defense the overall offensive numbers he is putting up still make him the best available option the Cubs currently have in their system to play first base.

[sneakypower]

how about just moving him down in the order?

 

there are worse things in the world than having a 820 OPS gold glover on your team

[UMFan83]

I've never seen a team that is 28 games over .500 in mid-August bench a player that had a +.900 OPS the previous year with very good defense and is generally considered the team leader.

[sneakypower]

this looked like an idea to consider around this time last year, before Lee went on a power surge in September to the tune of a .365 avg and 16 XBHs

 

whatever happens, I don't think I ever want him sitting on the bench for home games; give him a break when we're away

[Jehrico]

I've been questioning why Lee is our 3 hitter for several months now. I don't think he needs to be "benched" though. Hit him 6th (where he always used to hit in the order his whole career until halfway through his monster 2005 campaign) in the order, and give him more days off for rest.

 

I'd also like to see Hoff called up, but Ward isn't going anywhere right now after the homer last night, so we may as well wait for 1 Sep for that.

[TysonCBulls423]

I've never seen a team that is 28 games over .500 in mid-August bench a player that had a +.900 OPS the previous year with very good defense and is generally considered the team leader.

 

I'm starting to agree with you a lot more these days! :lol:

 

On a serious note, it's not going to happen and right now isn't the time either. Lee is basically the captain of the team and the offense has gelled all year long with Lee in the 3 hole. While he's had his slumps, there is no point in messing with the chemistry and what's been working all year. Calling for a platoo with Hoffpauir in any way you want to break it down is ridiculous and baseball people everywhere would laugh at that idea. But I already know what's going to happen to this thread. Someday soon Lee will have a big game with a few doubles and a homer and it's going to turn into another Alfonso Soriano April/May slump thread.

[Soul]

I don't think I'd call it "docking" his play time. Yeah, that's the way to work with your players, LOL.

 

Lee needs more frequent rest than he used to. He's an older ballplayer now. I don't think there's a reason why it can't be understood that he should get a little more time off. One of the best games I've seen him play recently was the one coming off a day's rest.

[Butterscup1679666578]

Lee doesn't need to be benched or anything ridiculous like that, but a game off once every week, week and a half or so would definitely help. He also needs be moved down in the order.

 

The bottom line is Lee's skills are quickly declining. He'll be 33 in a few weeks, and his numbers are down across the board this year, including his defense, where he has been quite average for a lot of this year.

[rawaction]

My guess is when they should. Which would be when they have someone better to take his playing time. And that won't be any time soon. Talking about getting Hoffpauir playing time is a ridiculous joke.

 

Konerko has lost playing time because the Sox have better options. You are kidding yourself if you think Hoffpauir, Ward, or Fontenot (with Edmonds at 1B, Fukudome in CF, Derosa in RF) are even close to the same league as Derrek Lee.

[Soul]

My guess is when they should. Which would be when they have someone better to take his playing time. And that won't be any time soon. Talking about getting Hoffpauir playing time is a ridiculous joke.

 

Konerko has lost playing time because the Sox have better options. You are kidding yourself if you think Hoffpauir, Ward, or Fontenot (with Edmonds at 1B, Fukudome in CF, Derosa in RF) are even close to the same league as Derrek Lee.

 

That's true. But you can rest Lee -- not because you have a better option, but because you are hoping to get a net performance gain from Lee due to the extra time off.

[rawaction]

My guess is when they should. Which would be when they have someone better to take his playing time. And that won't be any time soon. Talking about getting Hoffpauir playing time is a ridiculous joke.

 

Konerko has lost playing time because the Sox have better options. You are kidding yourself if you think Hoffpauir, Ward, or Fontenot (with Edmonds at 1B, Fukudome in CF, Derosa in RF) are even close to the same league as Derrek Lee.

 

That's true. But you can rest Lee -- not because you have a better option, but because you are hoping to get a net performance gain from Lee due to the extra time off.

 

Agreed. Resting him is a big difference from docking his PT.

[Little Slide Rooter]

I dont know about docking play time, but he certainly shouldnt be a #3 hitter. If only Soriano could do what he does from the 1 spot at the 3 spot, all would be good, and Derrek could be a number 2, 5, or 6. I know some posters here seem to think that where a batter bats in the lineup doesnt matter, but unless they know somethign that pretty much every manager in history of the game doesnt, it means something.

[Outshined_One]

Hoffpauir is not the answer, people. His recent hot streak has been nice and I'm rooting for the guy to do well, but Lee has provided his usual excellent defense and has managed to post above average offensive numbers. Hoffpauir has put up his numbers against AAA pitchers in bandboxes.

 

Lee needs to be moved down in the order, but to think the Cubs should bench him in favor of Hoffpauir is lunacy. Lee could use a few days off here and there, but I think that should be more for rest than anything else.

[David]

I dont know about docking play time, but he certainly shouldnt be a #3 hitter. If only Soriano could do what he does from the 1 spot at the 3 spot, all would be good, and Derrek could be a number 2, 5, or 6. I know some posters here seem to think that where a batter bats in the lineup doesnt matter, but unless they know somethign that pretty much every manager in history of the game doesnt, it means something.

 

 

lol yea, it's terrible right now

 

 

btw, that second bolded part is a terrible argument and it's one of the reasons why people have continued to do stupid things throughout history.

[David]

you're right though, these changes to the order might make the best offense in the national league better.

[Irrelevant Dude]

The bottom line is Lee's skills are quickly declining. He'll be 33 in a few weeks, and his numbers are down across the board this year, including his defense, where he has been quite average for a lot of this year.

I agree that a part of Lee's production decrease is the result of an age-related decline. I think he'll be ok through 2009, but I'm definitely worried about the last year of that contract. With that said, this year is really all that matters and I'll live with a sub-par Lee for the next 2 years if we can win a World Series now.

[Little Slide Rooter]

I dont know about docking play time, but he certainly shouldnt be a #3 hitter. If only Soriano could do what he does from the 1 spot at the 3 spot, all would be good, and Derrek could be a number 2, 5, or 6. I know some posters here seem to think that where a batter bats in the lineup doesnt matter, but unless they know somethign that pretty much every manager in history of the game doesnt, it means something.

 

 

lol yea, it's terrible right now

 

 

btw, that second bolded part is a terrible argument and it's one of the reasons why people have continued to do stupid things throughout history.

 

So your saying it's just a big coincedence that every manager in the modern era of the game has batted their best hitters 3-5?

 

And nothings terrible right now, Im just saying the rather than take D-Lee and his great defense but mediocre but not horrible offense should not be taken out of the lineup, just moved down, unless its a Sammy thing where the manager is scared to take him out of his comfort zone, and I cant see Lou worrying about that.

[bhogg]

I'd love to see what Ramirez could do in the 3 spot.

[Little Slide Rooter]

I'd love to see what Ramirez could do in the 3 spot.

 

Im equally intrigued to see what Edmonds could do at cleanup.