Prior to start 3/22ST vs SD (was: Sun-Times)

[goonys evil twin]

How the mighty have fallen. Can we go back a year and do the Prior for Tejada and Bedard trade? :lol:

 

I hear ya but believe it or not, I wouldn't want Tejada. The dark steroid/HGH cloud seems to be following him around. This team doesn't need that kind of distraction (as it is, some people in the local media are speculating that Prior was on 'roids).

 

Who cares about a distraction of rumors. You don't need to be distraction free to win a World Series. You need production. This isn't math class.

[98navigator]

How the mighty have fallen. Can we go back a year and do the Prior for Tejada and Bedard trade? :lol:

 

I hear ya but believe it or not, I wouldn't want Tejada. The dark steroid/HGH cloud seems to be following him around. This team doesn't need that kind of distraction (as it is, some people in the local media are speculating that Prior was on 'roids).

 

Who cares about a distraction of rumors. You don't need to be distraction free to win a World Series. You need production. This isn't math class.

 

No, a team doesn't have to be distraction free to win a WS... The Cubs WS drought and media hype are built-in distractions, there's really no good reason to invite a potential dark cloud... I'm of the opinion that Tejada hasn't faced the kind of nasty, local media, barrage (in OAK or BAL) that he would likely get here. It could very well effect his production.

[CubinNY]

It could very well effect his production.

 

Bolderdash.

 

I like that word and it fits. The baseball diamond is an oasis where those things matter least.

[Magnetic Curses]

It could very well effect his production.

 

Bolderdash.

 

I like that word and it fits. The baseball diamond is an oasis where those things matter least.

 

balderdash.

[NCCubFan]

When I think of a great player who had injuries and tried to come back and was never the same even when healthy enough to run again, my mind goes to Gale Sayers.

He actually came back fairly well in 1969 after his first knee injury, but when he was injured again in 1970 he wasn't able to come back at any level of effectiveness (he played in two games each in 1970 and 1971, with less than 100 yards total and less than 3 yards per carry each year). It would have been nice to see what he could have been if only he played 10 or 20 years or so later, with substantial improvements in knee surgery.

 

Randy Hundley is another player who was never the same after injuries.

[goonys evil twin]

How the mighty have fallen. Can we go back a year and do the Prior for Tejada and Bedard trade? :lol:

 

I hear ya but believe it or not, I wouldn't want Tejada. The dark steroid/HGH cloud seems to be following him around. This team doesn't need that kind of distraction (as it is, some people in the local media are speculating that Prior was on 'roids).

 

Who cares about a distraction of rumors. You don't need to be distraction free to win a World Series. You need production. This isn't math class.

 

No, a team doesn't have to be distraction free to win a WS... The Cubs WS drought and media hype are built-in distractions, there's really no good reason to invite a potential dark cloud... I'm of the opinion that Tejada hasn't faced the kind of nasty, local media, barrage (in OAK or BAL) that he would likely get here. It could very well effect his production.

 

I'm of the opinion that that's all a bunch of malarkey. If Tejada showed up in Chicago and produced from day 1, without all the Sammy Sosa sideshow (meaning, the stereo, the "my house" talk, the gladiator stuff, the kissing and hopping) the media would be more than willing to play along. If he got busted tomorrow, that's a different thing, but that could happen to anybody (see Palmeiro, in Baltimore).

 

That's overly cautious on your part and a great way to sell your team short. The Cubs need to stop worrying about all the non baseball nonsense they've concerned themselves with over the years (purging "cancers", talking up the need for a change in mindset, getting guys who can handle the chicago media) and just acquire some baseball players. They need production, not match.com compatibility.

[98navigator]

It could very well effect his production.

 

Bolderdash.

 

I like that word and it fits. The baseball diamond is an oasis where those things matter least.

 

I disagree. There are players that allow outside distractions to effect on field play. It wouldn't be as big of a concern if Tejada had played in a large sports market previously; I don't consider Oakland or Baltimore in that class...

 

In a way, it's like Dusty Baker managing in San Francisco and never being scrutinized only to find his every word (rightly or wrongly) analyzed in Chicago. Or ARod going from Seattle and Texas to NYC. While his overall numbers are impressive he seems unnerved by the off-the-field talk. It's hard to believe, but ARod may actually be more productive if he played in a different environment.

[wilk]

So it's possible he won't be able to be demoted?

Ouch. I would imagine some club would pick him up on waivers. He's not making superstar money.

 

It's possible he could be claimed if the Cubs put him on waivers, yes. But if so, they are revocable so the Cubs could pull him back and then they'd either have to DL him or keep him on the 25-man. But these waivers are generally easier to get a player through because there is some level of courtesy involved since every GM wants it in return. If you know there's no chance you'd get the player as the waiver request would be revoked, then there would be little motivation to put in a claim other than to screw with the team and then expect it to happen to you. That's not to say there's nothing to fear but it's certainly not irrevocable waivers.

[frostwyrm]

We've finally come to the point where we are not relying on Wood and Prior. I think that bodes much better for this organization. If one or both come back strong, then that's a big plus. If not, our team is not hanging it's cap on the hopes that they will be our saviors.

 

I was one of the very early ones to stop counting on Wood and also on Prior. At this point I've got my fork in hand and I'm almost ready to stick it in Prior. It's a shame, not so long ago we were all projecting a Hall of Fame career. Now I'd be happy if he could just become a solid #3 starter. Kerry looks like a better bet to have success, obviously not as a starter though. I'm not sure Prior will be particularly good in any role.

[bc2k]

If Prior were to spend the season in AAA, does it count towards his service time? Would it give the Cubs another year with him?

[Mephistopheles]

If Prior were to spend the season in AAA, does it count towards his service time? Would it give the Cubs another year with him?

It shouldn't and it should, respectively.

[BigbadB]

It could very well effect his production.

 

Bolderdash.

 

I like that word and it fits. The baseball diamond is an oasis where those things matter least.

 

I disagree. There are players that allow outside distractions to effect on field play. It wouldn't be as big of a concern if Tejada had played in a large sports market previously; I don't consider Oakland or Baltimore in that class...

 

In a way, it's like Dusty Baker managing in San Francisco and never being scrutinized only to find his every word (rightly or wrongly) analyzed in Chicago. Or ARod going from Seattle and Texas to NYC. While his overall numbers are impressive he seems unnerved by the off-the-field talk. It's hard to believe, but ARod may actually be more productive if he played in a different environment.

 

The scrutiny in Chicago has everything to do with production. Jacque Jones didn't like it here his first month in Wrigley because he wasn't producing. Sammy Sosa has been in the midst of steroid allegations along with guys like Tejada, Palmeiro, McGwire, etc...infinity. The distractions for Sammy in Chicago weren't steroid related. They were his boom box, leaving early, not making adjustments at the plate that made him an easy out on the outside corner (ie, significant drop in production).

 

Heck, Cubs fans didn't even make a big fuss about the corked bat. The rest of the baseball world did, but Cubs fans didn't. There is a level of loyalty to a guy who produces in a big way. Miguel Tejada might not produce like Sammy in his hey day, but a shortstop that hits like Tejada would be a warm welcome after Izturis, Cedeno, Neifi, Gonzalez, Ordonez, etc... infinity.

 

The likelihood these guys (Tejada, Giambi, Sosa, etc..) ever get busted for using steroids is very slim.

[98navigator]

It could very well effect his production.

 

Bolderdash.

 

I like that word and it fits. The baseball diamond is an oasis where those things matter least.

 

I disagree. There are players that allow outside distractions to effect on field play. It wouldn't be as big of a concern if Tejada had played in a large sports market previously; I don't consider Oakland or Baltimore in that class...

 

In a way, it's like Dusty Baker managing in San Francisco and never being scrutinized only to find his every word (rightly or wrongly) analyzed in Chicago. Or ARod going from Seattle and Texas to NYC. While his overall numbers are impressive he seems unnerved by the off-the-field talk. It's hard to believe, but ARod may actually be more productive if he played in a different environment.

 

The scrutiny in Chicago has everything to do with production. Jacque Jones didn't like it here his first month in Wrigley because he wasn't producing. Sammy Sosa has been in the midst of steroid allegations along with guys like Tejada, Palmeiro, McGwire, etc...infinity. The distractions for Sammy in Chicago weren't steroid related. They were his boom box, leaving early, not making adjustments at the plate that made him an easy out on the outside corner (ie, significant drop in production).

 

Heck, Cubs fans didn't even make a big fuss about the corked bat. The rest of the baseball world did, but Cubs fans didn't. There is a level of loyalty to a guy who produces in a big way. Miguel Tejada might not produce like Sammy in his hey day, but a shortstop that hits like Tejada would be a warm welcome after Izturis, Cedeno, Neifi, Gonzalez, Ordonez, etc... infinity.

 

The likelihood these guys (Tejada, Giambi, Sosa, etc..) ever get busted for using steroids is very slim.

 

The harsh treatment I'm talking about is mostly media driven. In the case of Jones, it was certainly the fans that gave him a hard time, for his poor play, but I think the media helped to fuel the fire as well. His blunders were repeated fodder for local sports talk radio as well as being immortalized on the back pages of the newspapers. The amount of media attention was curious when you consider how marginal a player he has been in his career.

 

A high profile player like Miguel Tejada would be under a greater microscope with the Cubs. In addition, he would be grilled about his purported link to steroids and connection to guys who have used steroids (especially when the inevitable story breaks about player X's use).

 

Whether or not the guys are caught is immaterial. The suspicion of enhancement drugs is enough to cause problems. Mark Prior was forced to deny steroid rumors, brought on in-part because of Jack McDowell, in a press conference. The speculation continues; I heard Dan Bernstein say on the radio yesterday that he thinks that either Prior is secretly hurt or he has used steroids... Prior's name has never even surfaced in any steroid scandal yet his integrity is questioned. The innuendo would be much more magnified for an everyday player like Tejada who has been linked to a number of steroid rumors in both Oakland and Baltimore (Canseco & Palmerio).

 

By the way, the Chicago media did make a BIG deal out of the corked bat incident (they still talk about it). If the Cubs hadn't been winning in 2003 it would have been an even bigger story. At the time, Sosa was already the subject of ridicule because he was mired in a slump (and some speculate that he used the corked bat on purpose for this reason)...

 

Even though there had been whispers all along, the strong innuendo of steroid usage did not start with Sosa until late 2004/2005 (and by the time he testified before Congress he was no longer a Cubs player). On the issue of general criticism, don't forget that Sosa was being booed routinely in mid-late 2004. He was also getting really bad press. Whether or not those things had a direct effect on his decreased production is up for debate...

 

Given a choice, I wouldn't want Miguel Tejada because he comes with baggage. I would be very concerned about his production (or lack thereof) when the heat is on. In Baltimore he is revered. He's never played in a big sports market under the kind of microscope that players face with the Cubs. It concerns me that his suspected steroid usage would become a distraction. Heck, many people think Wood and Prior are distractions and they are pitchers. Imagine how bad it could get if an everyday player had an ongoing issue with the media? I'm not interested in finding out.

[Sarcastic]

Does anyone know when Prior's minor league start was supposed to be today?

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

Does anyone know when Prior's minor league start was supposed to be today?

 

Read this.

[Sarcastic]

Does anyone know when Prior's minor league start was supposed to be today?

 

Read this.

 

Ugh. I'd say that I'd wait to hear a report from someone who didn't seem to have already decided Prior was on steriods/injured, but pretty much everyine in the Chicago media is against him at this point. Regardless, there's no question that he needs a lot more work than he can put in in one spring training. Hopefully he can come back to pitching for the major league team at some point this season.

[Laura]

The Cubs.com article is up. Not surprisingly, it's a different take.

[E.J.]

The Cubs.com article is up. Not surprisingly, it's a different take.

 

Good to hear he actually hit 90 on the radar gun. He's been gaining MPH every outing. I don't have a problem with him starting in the minors or in extended spring training as long as he keeps showing improvement.

[Sarcastic]

The Cubs.com article is up. Not surprisingly, it's a different take.

 

When I said that I wanted to wait for a report from someone who didn't think Prior was injured or on steriods, I should have added, excluding Muskat. Still, its nice to see that he made any kind of progress at all.

 

As a side note, either the blogger or Muskat mixed up the pitch numbers of Marquis and Prior.

[Mizzou]

Prior's cavles are basically half the size that they used to be.

[Sarcastic]

Prior's cavles are basically half the size that they used to be.

 

This has been said a million times, and it still doesn't prove anything.

[Mizzou]

Prior's cavles are basically half the size that they used to be.

 

This has been said a million times, and it still doesn't prove anything.

I wasn't making any accusations. Prior's one of my favorite Cubs. But it is odd to see his calves (which used to be huge) so much smaller.

[UMFan83]

http://www.sun-inet.or.jp/~mlbddf/mark_prior.jpg

This picture was obviously taken somewhere between 2002 and 2004 (name on back of jersey)

 

http://d.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20070310/capt.aztg10803102357.cubs_royals_spring_baseball_aztg108.jpg

 

Taken this spring in a game.

[Sarcastic]

http://www.sun-inet.or.jp/~mlbddf/mark_prior.jpg

This picture was obviously taken somewhere between 2002 and 2004 (name on back of jersey)

 

http://d.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20070310/capt.aztg10803102357.cubs_royals_spring_baseball_aztg108.jpg

 

Taken this spring in a game.

 

Yes, we've established that his calves are smaller.

[UMFan83]

Good, and I've reaffirmed it