The Soccer Thread

[wolf stansson]

------------------------------Altidore-----------------------------

-------------------------------Adu---------------------------------

---Torres------Mastro-------Feilhaber--------Dempsey---

-Spector------Bocanegra----DeMerit-------Hejduk------

---------------------------Howard---------------------------------

 

If Hejduk isn't ready, Move Spector right, and start Bornstein.

 

 

Edit - the Confeds Roster:

 

GOALKEEPERS- Tim Howard, Brad Guzan, Luis Robles

 

DEFENDERS- Carlos Bocanegra, Oguchi Onyewu, Jonathan Spector, Jonathan Bornstein, Marvell Wynne, Jay DeMerit, Danny Califf, Heath Pearce.

 

MIDFIELDERS-Michael Bradley, Clint Dempsey, Sacha Kljestan, Jose Francisco Torres, Benny Feilhaber, Ricardo Clark, DaMarcus Beasley, Freddy Adu

 

FORWARDS- Landon Donovan, Jozy Altidore, Conor Casey, Charlie Davies.

I like the Casey inclusion. He's very much like Kenny Cooper, and I'm not sure he's international quality, but he's one of the players in MLS I'll watch with interest. It also suggests Davies will have a bigger role as the third forward. I like Charlie a lot. He's a little dirty and temperamental, but you don't mind that in a striker.

[USSoccer]

Sacha isn't suspended for the game after all. I think you'll see this:

 

Altidore

Davies

Donovan Sacha Mastro Dempsey

Spector Boca Gooch Bornstein

 

Hejduk is still out, supposedly, so Spector almost has to start, and one would think Bradley would not start the rotting corpse of DMB again, although I suppose you could see him slide back up to LM and Donovan slot in up front in place of Davies.

 

I also suppose you could see Torres supplant Clint on the wing, and Benny in place of Mastro. I'd love to see Adu in place of Davies in that withdrawn role, but I doubt it would happen. I'd REALLY love to move Boca out to the LB spot, where he was playing at Rennes all year, and then put Spector in the center, but that won't happen as long as Bradley is the coach.

 

Given that this game is an absolute, must win game in every sense of the word, Bradley will probably not screw around and play the safest lineup possible. With how good Honduras are in the attack, we need actual defenders on the back line.

[wvcbxl]

So Japan, Australia and South-Korea are already officially qualified for the WC.

Good win by England today, and the Netherlands and Brazil are cruising in their away games at the moment.

[wvcbxl]

And the Dutch also book their place for SA with a win in Iceland. 8-)

[USSoccer]

Word on the street is that we're back to the empty bucket.

 

Casey and Jozy

LD and CD

 

Clark and Mastro

 

Specs Boca Gooch Bornstein

 

And even better, Torres and Adu not in the 18...which means if we go down a goal we're so boned.

[SpongeWorthy]

I'm a complete soccer noob but I like to watch the games the national team plays so maybe one of you knowledgeable types can answer a question or two for me.

 

Does the US have at least one player that would be widely considered one of the top 25 players in the world? Top 50? If not, where are the preponderance of our national team players relative to the international talent? I know that not many of the players play in the best European leagues. Why is that? And if there aren't that many how is the US ranked respectably high in the FIFA rankings (which I understand mean very little in the grand scheme of things but it should be somewhat illustrative of a relative talent level)?

[USSoccer]

I'm a complete soccer noob but I like to watch the games the national team plays so maybe one of you knowledgeable types can answer a question or two for me.

 

Does the US have at least one player that would be widely considered one of the top 25 players in the world? Top 50? If not, where are the preponderance of our national team players relative to the international talent? I know that not many of the players play in the best European leagues. Why is that? And if there aren't that many how is the US ranked respectably high in the FIFA rankings (which I understand mean very little in the grand scheme of things but it should be somewhat illustrative of a relative talent level)?

 

FIFA rankings are horribly flawed. The ELO rankings have us in the mid 20's, which is about correct.

 

As far as a top 50 player, Tim Howard might make that list if you allow for GK's. No field player would make the top 100, sadly. Also, you have to somehow weigh that subjective list for club v country. For example, Dempsey plays much better for Fulham than the USMNT. Is it because of tactics? His team mates? Coaching? Donovan has top 100 talent, but is missing any sort of competitive fire (he's my least favorite player on the 'Nats of any consequence) and has been a failure in Europe all three times he's been there. Altidore and Bradley might well be a top 50/100 guys in a year or two. Adu has top 50 talent but can't see the field anywhere, and the reasons for that might be anything from attitude to the clubs he's been at.

 

There's also a difference in performance from those who went through the USSF's developmental system in Bradenton and those who did not. As a general rule, those who didn't (Torres, Sacha, Benny, Jozy, and Dempsey) all are technically superior players when compared to their peers who went through Bradenton (Eddie Johnson, DMB, Donovan, Gooch, and a host of guys you will never, ever hear from). The USSF has a horrid developmental system that's skewed towards upper middle class kids, ignored technical ability in favor of measurables, and discourages individual flair in favor of effort and workrate. What's worse is that when the players reach the senior Nat level, the USSF seems to favor "their guys" when it comes to callups and such. A player from outside that development system has to work twice as hard to break through and is less likely to get a second chance should he fail to impress in a camp or match.

 

Until that changes, we'll be stuck in the third tier of soccer nations.

Edited June 6, 2009 by USSoccer

[SpongeWorthy]

I'm a complete soccer noob but I like to watch the games the national team plays so maybe one of you knowledgeable types can answer a question or two for me.

 

Does the US have at least one player that would be widely considered one of the top 25 players in the world? Top 50? If not, where are the preponderance of our national team players relative to the international talent? I know that not many of the players play in the best European leagues. Why is that? And if there aren't that many how is the US ranked respectably high in the FIFA rankings (which I understand mean very little in the grand scheme of things but it should be somewhat illustrative of a relative talent level)?

 

FIFA rankings are horribly flawed. The ELO rankings have us in the mid 20's, which is about correct.

 

As far as a top 50 player, Tim Howard might make that list if you allow for GK's. No field player would make the top 100, sadly.

 

It seems pretty disjointed that a team in the top 25 of the world wouldn't have one guy who you'd say was at least approaching a world class level.

[USSoccer]

I'm a complete soccer noob but I like to watch the games the national team plays so maybe one of you knowledgeable types can answer a question or two for me.

 

Does the US have at least one player that would be widely considered one of the top 25 players in the world? Top 50? If not, where are the preponderance of our national team players relative to the international talent? I know that not many of the players play in the best European leagues. Why is that? And if there aren't that many how is the US ranked respectably high in the FIFA rankings (which I understand mean very little in the grand scheme of things but it should be somewhat illustrative of a relative talent level)?

 

FIFA rankings are horribly flawed. The ELO rankings have us in the mid 20's, which is about correct.

 

As far as a top 50 player, Tim Howard might make that list if you allow for GK's. No field player would make the top 100, sadly.

 

It seems pretty disjointed that a team in the top 25 of the world wouldn't have one guy who you'd say was at least approaching a world class level.

 

See my edit. I went a little more specific the second time around.

[USSoccer]

Back to tonight's game....

 

I am at home, since I thought that a 2.9 year old in the rain wouldn't be a great idea. However...tonight's lineup is a really good example of why Bob Bradley isn't an international-caliber coach:

 

-Starting a player like Conor Casey, who is in great MLS form, but who is a player who thrives on service into the box, however, we have:

 

-Donovan and Dempsey on the wings. Not only are those two guys not actually wingers, neither one is particularly good at crossing the ball-Dempsey in particular. They are actually guys who need decent service from the center mids and the back four to be effective. So, you start:

 

-Clark and Mastroeni in the middle. Twin destroyers. Mastro has 0 goals and 2 assists in 60-odd caps. Clark has like 1 goal. Nether one of them could be called creative, offensive minded mids in any sense of the word. So, on the bench, we DON'T have:

 

-Torres and Adu.

 

At least we're starting actual defenders tonight.

[USSoccer]

Ugh. Lalas talking about the opinions of his team mates back in the day is lol-y.

 

Our B team now would beat those guys 8-0. Work rate and effort isn't the problem.

[USSoccer]

Always awesome to be outnumbered 70-30 at home...and yes i'm aware that I'm not there.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

Top 100 is an awfully high standard. This isn't a 30-team baseball league. This is a sport almost every country in the world plays.

 

Top 100 would mean breaking the starting lineup in one of the top 9 club teams in the world (not exactly, but give or take), and I don't think we've got any guys outside of Howard who could be considered a real threat to do that anytime soon. The USMNT has gotten by in past years a lot on stamina and speed across the entire starting 11.

 

Someone who knows the team better than I do feel free to correct that if I'm wildly off.

[Exile on Waveland]

Ugh, what a disappointing lineup. Maybe I'm glad I didn't make it.

[Jon]

I didn't go, either...

[Exile on Waveland]

The top 100 is also a difficult standard as those players would not be equally distributed among 100 teams, or 50 or 25, etc. A few certain countries would have an inordinate amount.

[manbearcub]

are there any US fans there?

[USSoccer]

Have I mentioned how happy I am that Beasley isn't starting??

[USSoccer]

AWFUL by Dempsey. AWFUL

[Exile on Waveland]

Cripes.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

You have to be kidding me.

[Guest]

What the [expletive].

[USSoccer]

Clint needs to wake up or be benched.

[Guest]

This is a joke.

[USSoccer]

Bradley is going to get fired if they lose tonight.