Japanese Pitcher Daisuke Matsuzaka

[Mephistopheles]

I've watched Matsuzaka at least 10 times over the last two years, back when Seibu broadcasted all of their home games, a couple this season and two of the WBC. No, there's not a pitch he throws that's a gyro or something like that.

 

He throws a fourseam fastball in the 92-96 MPH range, topping out at 100 at the Athens Olympics, the fastest I've seen him throw on a TV gun was 159 KPH a year ago, that's 98.8 MPH. To compliment it he has a forkball, curveball, slider and an occasional two seam fastball. The first three are above average offerings. His slider runs in 80-82 and his best and most used offspeed pitch. It's a very good slider. His curveball is thrown in the high 70s with very good movement. It's a very, very good pitch that he doesn't use often, unless it's to a lefty because his slider is much more efficient against righties. His forkball is like a change up with good downward action. He throws it in the low 70s, and it's actually a very good fourth pitch. He doesn't use it more than three or four times a start because he really doesn't need it and it's a popular pitch in Japan. I could seem him using it a lot and having a lot of success with it because it's not used with regularity in the states. He really made some of the Mexican and Cuban hitters look bad with it in the WBC. I remember a couple of the American players in the 2004 Japan/US All Star series hating that pitch in particular. His two seam is a very new pitch. With the balls that they use in Japan, it's very hard to get movement on it using the seams. They're really low seams, one of the reasons the forkball has become the staple of the league. It's also the reason a lot of Japanese pitchers lost consistency on the breaking pitches in the WBC but it actually gave them better movement on their pitches. Matsuzaka started working on his two seam last off season for the purpose of throwing it in the WBC and America when he comes here. It's a work in progress and I haven't seen him enough this season to really comment on it. Early reports were that he used it to baffle Japanese hitters in the preseason. He apparently used it a lot in the opening round of the WBC, but I can't verify that.

 

Is slider, fastball and curve combination probably reminded you of Mark Prior, which he does a lot in his pitching. He's not a trickster, he'll throw 150 pitches a game with 100 of them being fourseam fastballs. He lives off his 93-94 fastball and has impeccable command on it (vintage Prior). His command on his offspeed pitches are not as crisp, but rate as solid across the board. He's also a gamer who loves to compete and go balls out. He's had his share of injuries in the past, but he's fine now and the only concern there could be the high pith counts he has sustained in Japan, although the concerns IMO are overblown, he usually pitches with five days of rest each time out, not four.

 

Finally he won't come cheap if he's posted. Seibu may need the cash, but he's the face of the franchise. People at BTF have been floating around 20M to Seibu and 75M to sign him, making it a 9 figure investment on some teams.

[Outshined_One]

I heard that MLB has to approve it, I beleive they did it for Hideo Nomo, So im sure theyll aprove his motion

 

They had a weird ruling for Akinori Otsuka, who had the ball slap in the glove in his delivery. He could do it with no one on base, but would be called for a balk if anyone was on.

[Mephistopheles]

Matsuzaka used a more Americanized windup in the WBC. It shouldn't be an issue. I'm all for stops and stuff in windups.

 

Give the pitcher's something. Either that or go back to the 1968 mound height.

[RonnieWooWooSanto]

I don't think it's a done deal that he'll be a Yankee. I believe that he'll be a free agent so he'll get to choose where he wants to go to. While Hideki Matsui has had success there, Kaz Matsui was pretty much disrespected, ran out of town, and now isn't even in the majors. I think he'll go to a smaller market club, probably somewhere on the west coast so that he's closer to home. Seattle fits that as do a few other teams.

 

I guess in a perfect Cubbie world, the Yankees would be consumed by the signing of Barry Zito.

 

The Mariners would sign Schmidt allowing him to come home and pitch; therefore, they are not willing to ante up for Matsuzaka.

 

And well, since the Mets and Kaz Matsui had a bad experience together this scares Matsuzaka and his agent forcing them to look elsewhere. (If he's friends with Kaz Matsui this may help out more).

 

Oh and of course the Cubs have to be willing to spend the big bucks for him.

[A New Era]

Recipe for success:

 

1. Trade Prior for Tejada.

2. Sign Matsuzaka and Zito.

That's a good team.

 

1) no way only Prior nets Tejada

2) Not very likely you'll have enough money for that. Not to mention we need a huge bopper in either LF or RF.

[CaliforniaRaisin]

I don't think it's a done deal that he'll be a Yankee. I believe that he'll be a free agent so he'll get to choose where he wants to go to. While Hideki Matsui has had success there, Kaz Matsui was pretty much disrespected, ran out of town, and now isn't even in the majors. I think he'll go to a smaller market club, probably somewhere on the west coast so that he's closer to home. Seattle fits that as do a few other teams.

 

I guess in a perfect Cubbie world, the Yankees would be consumed by the signing of Barry Zito.

 

The Mariners would sign Schmidt allowing him to come home and pitch; therefore, they are not willing to ante up for Matsuzaka.

 

And well, since the Mets and Kaz Matsui had a bad experience together this scares Matsuzaka and his agent forcing them to look elsewhere. (If he's friends with Kaz Matsui this may help out more).

 

Oh and of course the Cubs have to be willing to spend the big bucks for him.

 

And the Dodgers and Angels forget that Matsuzaka is available?

[Transmogrified Tiger]

Why would the Angels want him? Colon, Lackey, Weaver, Santana, Escobar

[baseball7897]

Why would the Angels want him? Colon, Lackey, Weaver, Santana, Escobar

 

Joe Saunders also.

[RonnieWooWooSanto]

I don't think it's a done deal that he'll be a Yankee. I believe that he'll be a free agent so he'll get to choose where he wants to go to. While Hideki Matsui has had success there, Kaz Matsui was pretty much disrespected, ran out of town, and now isn't even in the majors. I think he'll go to a smaller market club, probably somewhere on the west coast so that he's closer to home. Seattle fits that as do a few other teams.

 

I guess in a perfect Cubbie world, the Yankees would be consumed by the signing of Barry Zito.

 

The Mariners would sign Schmidt allowing him to come home and pitch; therefore, they are not willing to ante up for Matsuzaka.

 

And well, since the Mets and Kaz Matsui had a bad experience together this scares Matsuzaka and his agent forcing them to look elsewhere. (If he's friends with Kaz Matsui this may help out more).

 

Oh and of course the Cubs have to be willing to spend the big bucks for him.

 

And the Dodgers and Angels forget that Matsuzaka is available?

 

The Dodgers devote all their time to Zito fighting off the Yanks(but lose out).

 

Would the Angels be interested in pitching? They have a pretty good staff as it is unless Colon's injury is something that will persist next season. (Note: I don't know his injury) Since they were rumored to be willing to part with Ervin Santana I sort of ruled them out whether right or wrong in that assessment.

 

Lackey

Colon

Weaver

Escobar

E. Santana

[A New Era]

Why would the Angels want him? Colon, Lackey, Weaver, Santana, Escobar

 

Joe Saunders also.

 

And how much money do the dodgers have after spending $13mil on furcal? I realize Nomar and others might be coming off the books. But I don't know if they'll have the $13mil or so it might take to sign Matsuzaka San.

[CUBZ99]

I know this is stretching, but does anyone else remember the rain delay last week, when Gary Hughes said that him and another one of the Cubs top scouts were flying to Japan for a couple of weeks? Maybe they are scouting other players, who knows.

[BeerHere]

What exactly is this "gyro-ball." I hope it has nothing to do with gyros, the wonderful cuisine served with cucumber sauce.

 

Post of the year!!!!!!!!!!!!

LMFAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Well done.

[baseball7897]

I don't think it's a done deal that he'll be a Yankee. I believe that he'll be a free agent so he'll get to choose where he wants to go to. While Hideki Matsui has had success there, Kaz Matsui was pretty much disrespected, ran out of town, and now isn't even in the majors. I think he'll go to a smaller market club, probably somewhere on the west coast so that he's closer to home. Seattle fits that as do a few other teams.

 

I guess in a perfect Cubbie world, the Yankees would be consumed by the signing of Barry Zito.

 

The Mariners would sign Schmidt allowing him to come home and pitch; therefore, they are not willing to ante up for Matsuzaka.

 

And well, since the Mets and Kaz Matsui had a bad experience together this scares Matsuzaka and his agent forcing them to look elsewhere. (If he's friends with Kaz Matsui this may help out more).

 

Oh and of course the Cubs have to be willing to spend the big bucks for him.

 

And the Dodgers and Angels forget that Matsuzaka is available?

 

The Dodgers devote all their time to Zito fighting off the Yanks(but lose out).

 

Would the Angels be interested in pitching? They have a pretty good staff as it is unless Colon's injury is something that will persist next season. (Note: I don't know his injury) Since they were rumored to be willing to part with Ervin Santana I sort of ruled them out whether right or wrong in that assessment.

 

Lackey

Colon

Weaver

Escobar

E. Santana

 

Batrolo Colon has a partial torn rotator cuff . He has said he would like to come back in Septemeber, but isnt totally sure about that. He wants to rehab the injury, but isnt really sure just yet either. With only 7 weeks left in the year, he is probably done for the year.

 

That being said, yeah its a big loss for the Angels, but Joe Saunders has thrown the ball very well so far this year. You might want to pick him up on your fantasy team if he is still on waivers. Joe Saunders elected to rehab his rotator cuff tear, and he is pitching pretty well right now.

[1908]

I believe that he'll be a free agent so he'll get to choose where he wants to go to.

Nope. He won't be a free agent until after the 2007 season. He'd need to be posted to play in MLB next year. I don't think Seibu will post him, but if they do, the team that bids the most wins the right to try to sign him. If that system doesn't favor the Yankees, nothing does.

[1908]

People at BTF have been floating around 20M to Seibu and 75M to sign him, making it a 9 figure investment on some teams.

I could see the posting fee approach $20M, but I don't think it'll take anything close to $15M per season to sign him if he's posted. He's making less than $3M this season.

[CuseCubFan69]

I can't imagine the Cubs doing anything this radical. They still use chewed Wrigleys gum to hold the bases in place.

[Deeg]

Matsuzaka pitched in the WBC, and he was extremely impressive - Maddux like movement on a 92-93 MPH fastball, perfect control, excellent offspeed stuff. He works his pitches very much like Maddux, and as for the "gyroball" - thanks to a bogus piece by Will Carroll many people think its the same pitch as the "shuuto" (which Maddux throws, though he doesn's call it that) but it most definitely isn't. It's a semi-mythical pitch but it exists, and probably moves more like a late-breaking screwball than any other pitch. The whole idea is to get the ball rotating like a bullet fired from a gun, which is apparently damn tough or else everyone would do it.

 

Matsuzaka is a stud, and he would be a very solid #2 starter type in the majors, maybe better. No way the Cubs will be interested.

[mg420]

Matsuzaka pitched in the WBC, and he was extremely impressive - Maddux like movement on a 92-93 MPH fastball, perfect control, excellent offspeed stuff. He works his pitches very much like Maddux, and as for the "gyroball" - thanks to a bogus piece by Will Carroll many people think its the same pitch as the "shuuto" (which Maddux throws, though he doesn's call it that) but it most definitely isn't. It's a semi-mythical pitch but it exists, and probably moves more like a late-breaking screwball than any other pitch. The whole idea is to get the ball rotating like a bullet fired from a gun, which is apparently damn tough or else everyone would do it.

 

Matsuzaka is a stud, and he would be a very solid #2 starter type in the majors, maybe better. No way the Cubs will be interested.

 

from wikipedia:

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shuuto

[NorthsideAvenger]

Recipe for success:

 

1. Trade Prior for Tejada.

2. Sign Matsuzaka and Zito.

That's a good team.

 

1) no way only Prior nets Tejada

2) Not very likely you'll have enough money for that. Not to mention we need a huge bopper in either LF or RF.

 

1: Tejada would not be WORTH more then Prior by himself. Anybody with Prior would be overpayment for Tejada. Miguel is good, but not THAT good. The only way they get multiple players for Tejada, is if they settle for prospects.

 

2: I'm not convince at this Matsuzaka. I know he has the talent, but with Mac Suzuki (not ex-Sea closer), Hedeki Irabu, Hideo Nomo, Shingo, Ishii etc, etc Japan hasn't exactly set the world on fired with exported pitching talent. And with this Mats commanding front-line money, I would just rather go after Schdmit, since we know what he can do in MLB, something we don't know with Mats.

[ManCrushOnNomar]

Recipe for success:

 

1. Trade Prior for Tejada.

2. Sign Matsuzaka and Zito.

That's a good team.

 

1) no way only Prior nets Tejada

2) Not very likely you'll have enough money for that. Not to mention we need a huge bopper in either LF or RF.

 

1: Tejada would not be WORTH more then Prior by himself. Anybody with Prior would be overpayment for Tejada. Miguel is good, but not THAT good. The only way they get multiple players for Tejada, is if they settle for prospects.

 

2: I'm not convince at this Matsuzaka. I know he has the talent, but with Mac Suzuki (not ex-Sea closer), Hedeki Irabu, Hideo Nomo, Shingo, Ishii etc, etc Japan hasn't exactly set the world on fired with exported pitching talent. And with this Mats commanding front-line money, I would just rather go after Schdmit, since we know what he can do in MLB, something we don't know with Mats.

The difference is Matsuzaka is to Japanese baseball what Michael Jordan was to American basetball. He's a national hero over there, everybody knows his name. You cannot compare him to Shingo and Nomo, that's just not fair.

[synergy]

Matsuzaka is a big game pitcher and you can't compare him to Nomo and Shingo. The comparison you are making is like comparing the caliber of Roger Clemens to the caliber of Jon Lieber. Lieber had a couple good seasons but is really just a bit above average pitcher. All those other japanese guys you listed do not compare favorably to Matsuzaka. Just because the others weren't successful, you can't pass a talent like that up.

[Pickle]

I'm pretty sure that Nomo was considered a big game pitcher in Japan. And Nomo had a quite a few good years.

[texascub]

I think one thing that hurts alot of Asian pitchers that come over to America is that by the time they get over here they're all close to 30, and none of them throw hard. I really can't remember an Asian pitcher that has come over here and threw harder than 90-92. While that's decent, it isn't going to get blown by anyone. Japanese baseball seems based more around offspeed pitches and deception which don't work as good over here. Matsuzaka can throw harder and is already learning to adapt his game to the American style which should benefit him. He should have a few good seasons and maybe be someone's ace for a couple, but his success won't last forever.

[NorthsideAvenger]

The difference is Matsuzaka is to Japanese baseball what Michael Jordan was to American basetball. He's a national hero over there, everybody knows his name. You cannot compare him to Shingo and Nomo, that's just not fair.

 

We STILL don't know how Matsuzaka will fair in the ML. I remember Contreras being hot stuff when he was pitching for Cuba, and while he has been a good find for the White Sox, he hasn't been as advertise. In fact....Contreras has been a minor disappointment, considering his abilitites.

 

So, UNTIL, Mats dominates the major leagues, YOU CAN'T COMPARE him to the Roger Clemens, or the John Smoltz of the the league. And I am not comparing the pitchers, because of abilities, but comparing them because they had ??? about their ability to pitch in the United States.

[NorthsideAvenger]

Matsuzaka is a big game pitcher and you can't compare him to Nomo and Shingo. The comparison you are making is like comparing the caliber of Roger Clemens to the caliber of Jon Lieber.

 

So you're saying it's ok to compare Matsuzaka to Clemens---

without knowing what he can do in the US---but not ok compare him to Nomo and Shingo? Look, I know this kid can pitch, but 90% of the Japanese pitchers that has come to the US, has to a certain degree been overmatched, plain and simple. Mats is a big game pitcher in JAPAN, but doesn't mean he would be a big game pitcher in say......New York. I mean Jose Contreras was considered a "Big Game Pitcher" in Cuba, but flaked out in New York. So the people annoited him a "big game pitcher" is based ONLY of what he has done in Japan, and not in the MLB. And no the WBC is to SMALL SAMPLE SIZE. And while it does give promise the kid can pitch, it does not, in fact, guarantees he will continue to pitch well at the ML level. For goodness sake...Chan Ho Park dominated the WBC as a reliever....

 

Lieber had a couple good seasons but is really just a bit above average pitcher. All those other japanese guys you listed do not compare favorably to Matsuzaka. Just because the others weren't successful, you can't pass a talent like that up.

 

I'm not saying to pass on Mats, because of the past failures of Japan's OTHER top pitchers, but all I am saying is...I wouldn't pay the money that it will require to get him posted, and THEN signed him. He has too many questioned marks, and not enough answers to warrant the contract he is going to get. I prefer going after Schmidt or Zito, who we know can pitch in the major leagues.

 

I never made the comparasion, that was on you. I wouldn't make a comparasion of Mats until I saw enough of him at the ML level to justify to make a comparasion. But if I had to make a comparasion, I would compare him closer to Jose Contreras---in terms of talent, and hype---then to Roger Clemens. Simply put, I would pass on Mats, simply because I don't think he will be "all that" in his tenure in the US.