Kerry Wood out for year with partially torn rotator cuff

CubbieRich · July 10, 2006

Bilking? Give me a break.

Bilk-
1. To defraud, cheat, or swindle
2. To thwart or frustrate
3. To elude

$32.5 million for 12 wins in 3 years.

Let me know when he wants to give any of the cash back for doing nothing.

I don't care how many job sites you pmed me, your posts are moronic. I wish I could ignore posters, because I can't read anymore crap out of CubbieRich's keyboard.

Always good to hear from you, Badger. I hope the new job and the new digs in The Cities are GREAT! Say 'Hello' to Don and Amelia on 'CCO for me.

While the truth about truth about Wood is hard for many to swallow, it's right there for you. He's finished...with his bloated $12 million for the year. Having him wear the Cubs uniform in the dugout any more is sending the wrong message to the real players who may have a career left. Send him on his way and worry about the players you have.

badger1679666666 · July 11, 2006

Bilking? Give me a break.

Bilk-
1. To defraud, cheat, or swindle
2. To thwart or frustrate
3. To elude

$32.5 million for 12 wins in 3 years.

Let me know when he wants to give any of the cash back for doing nothing.

I don't care how many job sites you pmed me, your posts are moronic. I wish I could ignore posters, because I can't read anymore crap out of CubbieRich's keyboard.

Always good to hear from you, Badger. I hope the new job and the new digs in The Cities are GREAT! Say 'Hello' to Don and Amelia on 'CCO for me.

While the truth about truth about Wood is hard for many to swallow, it's right there for you. He's finished...with his bloated $12 million for the year. Having him wear the Cubs uniform in the dugout any more is sending the wrong message to the real players who may have a career left. Send him on his way and worry about the players you have.

No one is arguing that he hasn't lived up to his contract. Only an idiot would argue that. But when you use the word "bilk", it implies intentionality. That Kerry intentionally injured his elbow, labrum, and now rotator cuff. That's complete BS, and maybe if you didn't present your view in such an inflammatory and innaccurate way, just to get a rise out of his supporters, people wouldn't have an issue with what you post. But you insist on trying to instigate and spew crap. If you can show how Kerry intentionally injured himself just to steal money from the Cubs, I'll buy you a round trip ticket to Hawaii. Please, show us how that happened, or quit typing idiotic crap.

Sammy Sofa · July 11, 2006

*Stands*

*Slow claps*

vance_the_cubs_fan · July 11, 2006

Bilking? Give me a break.

Bilk-
1. To defraud, cheat, or swindle
2. To thwart or frustrate
3. To elude

$32.5 million for 12 wins in 3 years.

Let me know when he wants to give any of the cash back for doing nothing.

CubbieRich, do me a favor. Research and find how many times a team, not just a baseball team, signs a player to a big money contract based on performance and then the player, for whatever reasons, suffers an injury. In how many of those instances has the player given back money?

You won't find any.

The fact is, no one made the Cubs sign him to that contract. Kerry signed his deal after having two very good years in 2002 and 2003. He was 27 years old and looking to be breaking through into a dominant starter. The Cubs took a calculated risk in signing him.

Obviously, you have something against Wood. Why not come clean and tell us why you really don't like him.

Kerry didn't injure himself on purpose. Is Ben Sheets biling the Brewers since signing his contract?

Is Eric Gagne bilking the Dodgers?

Did Mo Vaughn bilk the Angels?

Did Darren Driefort bilk the Dodgers out of 55 million?

I could go on.

I don't see you railing that Wade Miller bilked us out of 1 million. Injuries happen in pro-sports. You anti-Wood crusade is comical. You try to make Wood's injuries out to be a character flaw or use it to attack his integrity. What's funny is it makes me question yours. There's obviously a hidden reason behind this because no rational person would think this way.

CubbieRich · July 11, 2006

CubbieRich, do me a favor. Research and find how many times a team, not just a baseball team, signs a player to a big money contract based on performance and then the player, for whatever reasons, suffers an injury. In how many of those instances has the player given back money?

You won't find any.

Vance, your education is not yet complete. Today's lesson-Lyman Bostock.

Bostock was an OF with the California Angels in the 1970's. He signed a long term contract. Bostock's 1978 season started off a disaster, with him batting only .150 for the month of April. Bostock went to Angels' owner Gene Autry and attempted to give back his April salary, saying he hadn't earned it. Autry refused, so Bostock announced he would be donating his April salary to charity. Thousands of requests came in for the money, and Bostock went through each of them, trying to determine who needed it the most.

Tsk..tsk.

CubbieRich · July 11, 2006

No one is arguing that he hasn't lived up to his contract. Only an idiot would argue that. But when you use the word "bilk", it implies intentionality. That Kerry intentionally injured his elbow, labrum, and now rotator cuff. That's complete BS, and maybe if you didn't present your view in such an inflammatory and innaccurate way, just to get a rise out of his supporters, people wouldn't have an issue with what you post. But you insist on trying to instigate and spew crap. If you can show how Kerry intentionally injured himself just to steal money from the Cubs, I'll buy you a round trip ticket to Hawaii. Please, show us how that happened, or quit typing idiotic crap.

I don't imply intentions, just presenting the facts. He was a vastly overpaid and under productive thrower. Those brief moments when he was on his game, he was very good. But those moments were few and far between. On too many big games for the Cubs he did not perform. When the Cubs gave him the chance to win one game in 2003 to be in the World Series-he spit the bit. When they needed him to stop the slide in September of 2004-he was nowhere to be found.

With big money contracts comes big responsibility. You can't be the highest paid pitcher on the Cubs and then only have a career high of a mere 14 games. He refused to change his mechanics to avoid some of these re-occuring injuries, even though many former pitchers said he needed to do so. He thought having 80 pitches in 4 innings was just fine. But he had to do it his own way and that's fine. He got his wish. Many successful pitchers have been hurt in the past, realize they needed to change their delivery and then went on to long, productive careers

There's plenty of blame to go around. But Wood must bear the majority of it. Too many times on the DL, too many missed games and too many dashed hopes for Cubs fans. I want this team to win as bad as all of us do. But Wood has shown he can't be counted on. His escapades have cost this team millions, taken starts away from young pitchers, worn out the middle relievers and driven everyone nuts.

It's time to cut him lose.

fromthestretch · July 11, 2006

I don't imply intentions, just presenting the facts. He was a vastly overpaid and under productive thrower. Those brief moments when he was on his game, he was very good. But those moments were few and far between. On too many big games for the Cubs he did not perform. When the Cubs gave him the chance to win one game in 2003 to be in the World Series-he spit the bit. When they needed him to stop the slide in September of 2004-he was nowhere to be found.

If it wasn't for Wood's 2003 regular season and post-season performance prior to that game, they probably never would have been that close to reaching the World Series in the first place.

With big money contracts comes big responsibility. You can't be the highest paid pitcher on the Cubs and then only have a career high of a mere 14 games. He refused to change his mechanics to avoid some of these re-occuring injuries, even though many former pitchers said he needed to do so. He thought having 80 pitches in 4 innings was just fine. But he had to do it his own way and that's fine. He got his wish. Many successful pitchers have been hurt in the past, realize they needed to change their delivery and then went on to long, productive careers

There's plenty of blame to go around. But Wood must bear the majority of it. Too many times on the DL, too many missed games and too many dashed hopes for Cubs fans. I want this team to win as bad as all of us do. But Wood has shown he can't be counted on. His escapades have cost this team millions, taken starts away from young pitchers, worn out the middle relievers and driven everyone nuts.

It's time to cut him lose.

So let me get this straight...you're complaining that he hasn't pitched enough because of injury yet, at the same time, claiming he's taken starts away from young pitchers? If he's not pitching, how is he taking starts away from young pitchers? If any pitcher on this staff is blocking the young guys, it's Rusch.

CubbieRich · July 11, 2006

So let me get this straight...you're complaining that he hasn't pitched enough because of injury yet, at the same time, claiming he's taken starts away from young pitchers? If he's not pitching, how is he taking starts away from young pitchers?

It's pretty easy to understand. Rehab starts in the minors take away starts from the young pitching.

Here's what this guy did when we needed him most down the stretch.

2004

Aug. 27th vs. Houston LOSS

Sept. 10th vs Florida LOSS

Sept.16th vs. CIN WIN

Sept. 26th vs NYM LOSS

Oct. 1st vs ATL LOSS

bukie · July 11, 2006

CubbieRich, do me a favor. Research and find how many times a team, not just a baseball team, signs a player to a big money contract based on performance and then the player, for whatever reasons, suffers an injury. In how many of those instances has the player given back money?

You won't find any.

Vance, your education is not yet complete. Today's lesson-Lyman Bostock.

Bostock was an OF with the California Angels in the 1970's. He signed a long term contract. Bostock's 1978 season started off a disaster, with him batting only .150 for the month of April. Bostock went to Angels' owner Gene Autry and attempted to give back his April salary, saying he hadn't earned it. Autry refused, so Bostock announced he would be donating his April salary to charity. Thousands of requests came in for the money, and Bostock went through each of them, trying to determine who needed it the most.

Tsk..tsk.

So, once in the 70's. Must be the running standard then.

Why are you trying to pick fights and instigate in every post you make?

bukie · July 11, 2006

I don't imply intentions, just presenting the facts. He was a vastly overpaid and under productive thrower. Those brief moments when he was on his game, he was very good. But those moments were few and far between. On too many big games for the Cubs he did not perform. When the Cubs gave him the chance to win one game in 2003 to be in the World Series-he spit the bit. When they needed him to stop the slide in September of 2004-he was nowhere to be found.

You present your own twisted view of the facts.

When the Cubs gave him the chance to win one game in 2003 to be in the NLCS, he came through. Came through all month in September to get the Cubs to the playoffs.

But you're right, one start in game 7 ruins his whole career.

He was nowhere to be found in 2004 because of his overuse in 2003, which he's still feeling the effects of this day.

Perhaps if you didn't let your personal bias and hatred of Kerry Wood get in the way, you'd see that very little of the last 3 years is actually Kerry Wood's fault.

vance_the_cubs_fan · July 11, 2006

CubbieRich, do me a favor. Research and find how many times a team, not just a baseball team, signs a player to a big money contract based on performance and then the player, for whatever reasons, suffers an injury. In how many of those instances has the player given back money?

You won't find any.

Vance, your education is not yet complete. Today's lesson-Lyman Bostock.

Bostock was an OF with the California Angels in the 1970's. He signed a long term contract. Bostock's 1978 season started off a disaster, with him batting only .150 for the month of April. Bostock went to Angels' owner Gene Autry and attempted to give back his April salary, saying he hadn't earned it. Autry refused, so Bostock announced he would be donating his April salary to charity. Thousands of requests came in for the money, and Bostock went through each of them, trying to determine who needed it the most.

Tsk..tsk.

Continue to answer my questions then. Do you think Gagne bilked the Dodgers? Did Driefort bill the Dodgers?

Did Mo Vaughn bilk the Angels? Or furthermore, did Kaz Matsui bilk the Mets?

Did Chan Ho Park bilk the Rangers?

Is Adrian Beltre bilking the Mariners right now?

The fact is, Wood along with all these players, signed negotiated contracts. There was no swindling involved. The teams could have said no to length and dollars. Might someone else have paid up? Likely. That's the game one plays with these big money deals.

When you use a term like "bilk" along with the other vitriol you spew toward Wood, it implies something dishonest on Wood's part. It implies that he knew he couldn't live up to the contract and signed it anyway.

Wood had the following numbers in 2002-2003:

2002: 213.7 IP, 110 ERA+

2003: 211 IP, 133 ERA+

He was 26 during the 2003 season. After that season he signed the 4/32.5 contract. Including the buyout of the option it was guranteed 4/37.5 contract for an average of 9 million a season.

Ben Sheets pitched220.7 innings in 2003 and posted a 98 ERA+ and then 237 innings in 2004 and posted a 154 ERA+. He was also 26 in the 2004 season. He followed those two years by signing a 4/38.5 million contract, essientially one million less than Wood. While Sheets 2004 was better than Wood's 2003, the combination of their work is eerily similar.

Next, let's look at AJ Burnett.

Burnett only pitched 120 innings in 2004 while posting a 112 ERA+. His 2004 was remarkably similar to Wood's 2002, except for the fact Wood was healthy and Burnett was not. Burnett then pitched 209 innings in 2005 and posted a 117 ERA+. Wood's 2003 was better. Burnett was already 28 in 2005.

Burnett was able to turn those two years into a 5/55 contract. Much greater than anything Sheets or Wood received, partially because he could negotiate on the open market. But it goes to show what both the Brewers and Cubs knew could happen if they let their big fish out to play on the open market.

I could go on, but I think I have aptly proven that your use of the word bilk is in error.

It's obvious you have other issues with Wood other than the contract he signed. While the Cubs never did get a return on their investment, the contract signed in good faith by two parties seems right in line with what other players with similar performance coming off two healthy seasons would have signed. In some ways, it seems Wood may have given a bit, yet only a small bit, of a hometown discount.

NCCubFan · July 11, 2006

Vance, your education is not yet complete. Today's lesson-Lyman Bostock.

Bostock was an OF with the California Angels in the 1970's. He signed a long term contract. Bostock's 1978 season started off a disaster, with him batting only .150 for the month of April. Bostock went to Angels' owner Gene Autry and attempted to give back his April salary, saying he hadn't earned it. Autry refused, so Bostock announced he would be donating his April salary to charity. Thousands of requests came in for the money, and Bostock went through each of them, trying to determine who needed it the most.

I remember the Bostock sithation well. Tragically, he was killed in an automobile accident near the end of that very same season, after he put it together and raised his average to .296 (second lowest of his four year career). He's not comparable to Wood's situation, however. Wood's missed time is due to injury. Bostock was healthy but simply not producing. Completely different situations. You obviously have a deep hatred of Wood that makes you think he's a bum, which he is not.

vance_the_cubs_fan · July 11, 2006

So let me get this straight...you're complaining that he hasn't pitched enough because of injury yet, at the same time, claiming he's taken starts away from young pitchers? If he's not pitching, how is he taking starts away from young pitchers?

It's pretty easy to understand. Rehab starts in the minors take away starts from the young pitching.

Here's what this guy did when we needed him most down the stretch.

2004
Aug. 27th vs. Houston LOSS
Sept. 10th vs Florida LOSS
Sept.16th vs. CIN WIN
Sept. 26th vs NYM LOSS
Oct. 1st vs ATL LOSS

What's interesting is to look at the game logs of those games. He had a horrible start against Houston. Against Florida, it was neither good nor bad. He allowed four runs in six innings, but since we were shut-out, I'd place that loss on the offense. Wood wasn't "good" by any stretch, but when the offense scores zero, it really doesn't matter much.

You also left off his ND against Pittsburgh on 9/21 in which the team won. He went 6IP and allowed on 3, so it was a quality start.

In the loss against the Mets, he turned in another quality start, allowing only three over 7 IP. Our offense once again was woefully inept, only scoring twice.

The Atlanta game was bad, but saying we needed that game is a stretch. I don't think we were mathematically eliminated yet, but the nails were already in the coffin.

I wouldn't say Wood performed well in those last games, but your characterization of them, like all your posts about Wood is clouded in some misguided agenda.

I think it would do you well to make clear your real reason for despising Wood.

Chocolate Milk · July 11, 2006

CubbieRich, do me a favor. Research and find how many times a team, not just a baseball team, signs a player to a big money contract based on performance and then the player, for whatever reasons, suffers an injury. In how many of those instances has the player given back money?

You won't find any.

Vance, your education is not yet complete. Today's lesson-Lyman Bostock.

Bostock was an OF with the California Angels in the 1970's. He signed a long term contract. Bostock's 1978 season started off a disaster, with him batting only .150 for the month of April. Bostock went to Angels' owner Gene Autry and attempted to give back his April salary, saying he hadn't earned it. Autry refused, so Bostock announced he would be donating his April salary to charity. Thousands of requests came in for the money, and Bostock went through each of them, trying to determine who needed it the most.

Tsk..tsk.

Bahahaha. Well played. This is clearly the standard. I am convinced.

fromthestretch · July 11, 2006

So let me get this straight...you're complaining that he hasn't pitched enough because of injury yet, at the same time, claiming he's taken starts away from young pitchers? If he's not pitching, how is he taking starts away from young pitchers?

It's pretty easy to understand. Rehab starts in the minors take away starts from the young pitching.

Oh please. Pushing a pitcher back one day in the Daytona rotation so someone can make a rehab start isn't going to stunt his growth. It's not like Wood was bumping a kid out of a minor league rotation for half a season.

The thing that's been "pretty easy to understand" is your hatred for Wood. No one here is claiming that he's even come close to earning his contract, but his injuries are far from intentional.

CubbieRich · July 11, 2006

I remember the Bostock sithation well. Tragically, he was killed in an automobile accident near the end of that very same season, after he put it together and raised his average to .296 (second lowest of his four year career). He's not comparable to Wood's situation, however. Wood's missed time is due to injury. Bostock was healthy but simply not producing. Completely different situations. You obviously have a deep hatred of Wood that makes you think he's a bum, which he is not.

You remembered incorrectly. He was killed in the backseat of an automobile in Gary from a shotgun blast.

I was challenged to produce one player who gave back contract money due to poor performance, irregardless of the reason for his poor performance.

vance_the_cubs_fan · July 11, 2006

I remember the Bostock sithation well. Tragically, he was killed in an automobile accident near the end of that very same season, after he put it together and raised his average to .296 (second lowest of his four year career). He's not comparable to Wood's situation, however. Wood's missed time is due to injury. Bostock was healthy but simply not producing. Completely different situations. You obviously have a deep hatred of Wood that makes you think he's a bum, which he is not.

You remembered incorrectly. He was killed in the backseat of an automobile in Gary from a shotgun blast.

I was challenged to produce one player who gave back contract money due to poor performance, irregardless of the reason for his poor performance.

So, there was one. Are all the others who haven't which is far more likely the norm, bilking their teams out of money?

Would you treat these others with the same contempt that you treat Wood or is there something else that makes you act this way toward Wood?

fromthestretch · July 11, 2006

I remember the Bostock sithation well. Tragically, he was killed in an automobile accident near the end of that very same season, after he put it together and raised his average to .296 (second lowest of his four year career). He's not comparable to Wood's situation, however. Wood's missed time is due to injury. Bostock was healthy but simply not producing. Completely different situations. You obviously have a deep hatred of Wood that makes you think he's a bum, which he is not.

You remembered incorrectly. He was killed in the backseat of an automobile in Gary from a shotgun blast.

I was challenged to produce one player who gave back contract money due to poor performance, irregardless of the reason for his poor performance.

Looking over what vance had requested, that's not at all what you were asked to produce:

CubbieRich, do me a favor. Research and find how many times a team, not just a baseball team, signs a player to a big money contract based on performance and then the player, for whatever reasons, suffers an injury. In how many of those instances has the player given back money?

mul21 · July 11, 2006

So let me get this straight...you're complaining that he hasn't pitched enough because of injury yet, at the same time, claiming he's taken starts away from young pitchers? If he's not pitching, how is he taking starts away from young pitchers?

It's pretty easy to understand. Rehab starts in the minors take away starts from the young pitching.

Here's what this guy did when we needed him most down the stretch.

2004
Aug. 27th vs. Houston LOSS
Sept. 10th vs Florida LOSS
Sept.16th vs. CIN WIN
Sept. 26th vs NYM LOSS
Oct. 1st vs ATL LOSS

I noticed you left a couple of good performances out......

Sept. 1 8IP 0R

Sept. 21 7IP 3R

So, of the starts that actually occurred, not just the ones you looked at, 3 were quality, 3 were average, and 1 was crap. And I won't go into how meaningless a statistic wins are for a pitcher. In those games where Wood was avg. or less, a playoff level team picks up the pitcher and actually scores some runs. They don't have a monumental collapse like the Cubs did. You can't possibly put that much blame on 1 guy going out every 5th day.

Wheelimus · July 11, 2006

There's no way any team gives Kerry major money next season after barely pitching in the last two seasons.

He's given no indication that I've ever seen that he was hoping to leave after this season or was even thinking about it.

I understand people are mad about how little we got for his last contract, but it's maddening to let him go just because you're mad about that. We know we're going to have to pay him 3 million (which, as Hendry has stated before, buyouts are calculated into the previous years budget, so that isn't even on the books for next seasons payroll), why not pay him another 2 or 3 to see if he can stay healthy as a reliever?

It's pretty good logic, this last time around it seemed like he was fine up to 50 pitches. What if his arm can handle 30 an outing and stay healthy?

Are we going to be petty and let another team have Kerry Wood, lights out closer, because we're mad he didn't pan out as a starter? If so, I hope he goes to the freaking Cardinals because we'd damn sure deserve it.

NCCubFan · July 11, 2006

You remembered incorrectly. He was killed in the backseat of an automobile in Gary from a shotgun blast.

That sounds right now that you mention it. I remember him being killed while in a car; I was off on exactly how he was killed. I was living in Indiana at the time; the killing was early during my freshman year in college.

DanzaSlap · July 11, 2006

As a Cards fan, I do kidna feel bad for Wood. It always sucks to watch someone's career take a downturn due to something they really have no control over.

That being said, why not talk to Kerry about moving to the bullpen and maybe closing, or a set-up man/occasional closer? He's got the heat (or, at least, had it -- I haven't seem him pitch in a couple years, so I'm not sure where his velocity is at currently) to be able to step in and blow hitters away. Seems like a pretty natural fit (plus, he had success there last year, if I recall correctly), and I imagine it would be easier on his arm to throw 70-75 innings a year instead of 180+. Do you guys think Wood would be open to a permanent move to the bullpen?

It Mabry Our Year · July 11, 2006

As a Cards fan, I do kidna feel bad for Wood. It always sucks to watch someone's career take a downturn due to something they really have no control over.

That being said, why not talk to Kerry about moving to the bullpen and maybe closing, or a set-up man/occasional closer? He's got the heat (or, at least, had it -- I haven't seem him pitch in a couple years, so I'm not sure where his velocity is at currently) to be able to step in and blow hitters away. Seems like a pretty natural fit (plus, he had success there last year, if I recall correctly), and I imagine it would be easier on his arm to throw 70-75 innings a year instead of 180+. Do you guys think Wood would be open to a permanent move to the bullpen?

We can't even count on him to pitch every other season much less every other night. :?

DanzaSlap · July 11, 2006

We can't even count on him to pitch every other season much less every other night. :?

You make a compelling point.

Andy · July 12, 2006

CubbieRich's Competely and Utterly Devoid of Logic Hate List:

Wood

Pujols

More?

Kerry Wood out for year with partially torn rotator cuff

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Create an account or sign in to comment

Create an account

Sign in

Member Statistics

Prospect News & Highlights

Recent News

Notes & Rumors

Recent Blogs