ARam Sounds Off

[SouthSideRyan]

"Nobody is doing his job here. When a team loses like we are, nobody is doing his job, so nobody can point fingers."

 

Seeing the full quote makes this look a lot less accusatory.

[Laura]

The Muskat version:

 

That's true. Ramirez didn't help. Although he hit several balls hard, he hit them right at the Astros' fielders and went 0-for-4, stranding five baserunners. Ramirez is batting .252 overall after hitting .307 last year.

 

"It's not the hitting," Ramirez said. "Every time we lose the game, everybody points to us not driving in runs and that kind of stuff. It's everybody. We allow a lot of runs every day, too. We don't shut people down. We allow a lot of runs, too."

 

Isn't it a combination? Walking 10 batters doesn't help, but stranding 10 runners isn't going to win a game either.

 

"It is a combination," Ramirez said. "We're not pitching well, we're not hitting well. It's not just the hitting."

 

Ramirez has usually been the Cubs' most reliable RBI man. Baker wouldn't even talk about the third baseman's inability to drive in runs after the game.

 

"That happens," Ramirez said. "They pitch me tough and I haven't been able to come through with the big hit last two games. What can I do? I have to go up there and play again.

 

"Like I said, I don't know why when we lose a game, everybody points at the hitters," he said. "It's not the hitters. If we look at the scoreboard, we allow a lot of runs, too. Today, yesterday, day before, every day. It's everything."

 

Told Ramirez's comments, Cubs first baseman Derrek Lee took a different approach.

 

"We're the ones with the bats," Lee said. "We've got to hit. Obviously, you're going to face good pitching. More times than not, we're not getting the job done. It comes down on us."

 

The wheels have come off, that's pretty clear.

 

I still place a lot of value on Ramirez and try to keep him unless it's a truly amazing deal. He hasn't been in the spotlight before and that takes some getting used to. It's a really frustrating year and it can't be much fun for him going through it, just like it's not much fun for anyone else.

[abuck1220]

of course, baker doesn't think it's the hitting or the pitching...it's clutchness.

 

"They got two-out hits, and we didn't get any," manager Dusty Baker said.

 

argh...the whole season's down the toilet and the cubs are 8 gagillion under .500 all because of the lack of those pesky two out hits.

[Warpticon]

And the stupid thing is that the cubs DO get 2-out hits. They just don't get the guy in because they don't get the hit until there are two outs half the time.

[Tracer Bullet]

"Nobody is doing his job here. When a team loses like we are, nobody is doing his job, so nobody can point fingers."

 

Seeing the full quote makes this look a lot less accusatory.

 

The one you quoted doesn't, but the quote in Serena's post looks pretty accusatory to me.

[impaler_240]

He is talking about Rusch. :roll:

[Jehrico]

I think they should be able to speak their mind without retribution.

 

It makes things colorful.

 

Remember that scene from Major League II when they got into a brawl with themselves, and the other team just stood there watching?

 

We could be headed that way ourselves...except, of course, without the second half run to put us in the playoffs...

 

Maybe we need that Japanese guy to tell everyone else on the team that they have no marbles.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

Pardon me for coming to the party late, but Aramis's message is being taken way out of context here. He did not shift blame onto the pitchers -- he was merely pointing out that it is the entire team that is sucking. He's 100% correct. Too much has been made of the offense being horrible (deservedly so), but the pitching staff has been abysmal as well. He wasn't pulling a "prima donna" act or pointing his finger to deflect criticism of himself.

[RynoRules]

Pardon me for coming to the party late, but Aramis's message is being taken way out of context here. He did not shift blame onto the pitchers -- he was merely pointing out that it is the entire team that is sucking. He's 100% correct. Too much has been made of the offense being horrible (deservedly so), but the pitching staff has been abysmal as well. He wasn't pulling a "prima donna" act or pointing his finger to deflect criticism of himself.

 

Agreed. I thought he was simply saying "We all stink", and not "Its the pitchers fault."

[Chocolate Milk]

Aramis is right. Our pitching is terrible. We are 27th in ERA.

 

I'm not sure I see what the issue is here. Our pitching sucks and our hitting sucks. Did Aramis say anything that wasn't completely obvious?

[daske17]

Aramis is right. Our pitching is terrible. We are 27th in ERA.

 

I'm not sure I see what the issue is here. Our pitching sucks and our hitting sucks. Did Aramis say anything that wasn't completely obvious?

 

Not only that, but as a result of his statements, I don't see him opting out at the end of the year. He recognizes that he hasn't been the best player this year, and regardless of a weak free agent market, he's still guaranteed mucho dinero next year. He always seemed like the player who would rather be paid fairly and be comfortable within a team than be high-priced and not enjoy the market he's playing in.

[Mizzou]

Good for Aram.

 

And the opting out thing seems farfetched. At this rate, he wont get a better contract this offseason.

[goonys evil twin]

Good for Aram.

 

And the opting out thing seems farfetched. At this rate, he wont get a better contract this offseason.

 

A 2 year $22.5m deal is not that hard to beat, not to mention, playing for somebody other than the Cubs is probably worth an additional $4-5m per year in happiness.

[Mizzou]

Good for Aram.

 

And the opting out thing seems farfetched. At this rate, he wont get a better contract this offseason.

 

A 2 year $22.5m deal is not that hard to beat, not to mention, playing for somebody other than the Cubs is probably worth an additional $4-5m per year in happiness.

You really think he'd get a deal that pays him more than 11 million a year at this point? I don't. He might settle for less to get out of this circus though, I know I sure would if I were in his shoes.

[daske17]

Good for Aram.

 

And the opting out thing seems farfetched. At this rate, he wont get a better contract this offseason.

 

A 2 year $22.5m deal is not that hard to beat, not to mention, playing for somebody other than the Cubs is probably worth an additional $4-5m per year in happiness.

 

It may not be hard to beat, but why bother? He's never intimated that he's unhappy in Chicago. To the contrary, he's always seemed a lot more at peace where the spotlight is off of him and he can produce with a higher-profile talent in front of him.

 

Any team that would be looking to sign him would probably see him as a front-line talent with expectations on production. And any large market team that would see him more as a supporting player may not be willing to pay him top dollar. I know I wouldn't.

[Abe Frohman]

After reading the whole Aramis "interview," it seems he is not necessarily trying to shift the criticism to the pitching as the original quote makes it sound.

 

Still, it shows internal lack of harmony - which is never good. Losing sucks.

[goonys evil twin]

Good for Aram.

 

And the opting out thing seems farfetched. At this rate, he wont get a better contract this offseason.

 

A 2 year $22.5m deal is not that hard to beat, not to mention, playing for somebody other than the Cubs is probably worth an additional $4-5m per year in happiness.

You really think he'd get a deal that pays him more than 11 million a year at this point? I don't. He might settle for less to get out of this circus though, I know I sure would if I were in his shoes.

 

It's the years that are the deal breaker. He's only guaranteed 2 more years. Ballplayers crave longterm contracts.

[goonys evil twin]

Good for Aram.

 

And the opting out thing seems farfetched. At this rate, he wont get a better contract this offseason.

 

A 2 year $22.5m deal is not that hard to beat, not to mention, playing for somebody other than the Cubs is probably worth an additional $4-5m per year in happiness.

 

It may not be hard to beat, but why bother? He's never intimated that he's unhappy in Chicago. To the contrary, he's always seemed a lot more at peace where the spotlight is off of him and he can produce with a higher-profile talent in front of him.

 

Any team that would be looking to sign him would probably see him as a front-line talent with expectations on production. And any large market team that would see him more as a supporting player may not be willing to pay him top dollar. I know I wouldn't.

 

A rich large market team wouldn't pay him as much as a smaller team? I could easily see a large market team giving him a 4/46m deal to come in and be their #5 hitter.

[Soul]

Aramis is right. Our pitching is terrible. We are 27th in ERA.

 

I'm not sure I see what the issue is here. Our pitching sucks and our hitting sucks. Did Aramis say anything that wasn't completely obvious?

 

Nope. He told the truth. And with the Cubs, telling the truth can get you destroyed.

[jwhatti]

Nope. He told the truth. And with the Cubs, telling the truth can get you destroyed.

 

Isn't that the "real" reason they are always trying to trade Walker?

[Sammy Sofa]

I have no problem with what he said, and I agree with him...I'm just terrified of the idea of him opting out and the Cubs end up even worse than they are now.

 

Oh, 'lizabeth! It's the big one!

[Chocolate Milk]

Is this the beginning of a "Clutch Pitching" stance by the organization?

 

Yeah, we are having trouble getting that last out. We just need to make some clutch pitches but haven't been able to get the job done.

[daske17]

A rich large market team wouldn't pay him as much as a smaller team? I could easily see a large market team giving him a 4/46m deal to come in and be their #5 hitter.

 

Really? I don't. Granted, I see several large market teams that would be interested in his services (Angels, Dodgers, maybe Boston), but I think the expectation would be that he would be a #4 hitter and a big cog into stepping up the offense.

 

What teams do you think would allow him to sneak into the 5 spot without high expectations for performance? That's the point I'm trying to make. Large market, higher expectations. And Aramis never seems comfortable with that. When he was traded in 2003, he was the #5 guy and had Alou and Sosa in front of him. Hence the lower expectations.

[Soul]

Nope. He told the truth. And with the Cubs, telling the truth can get you destroyed.

 

Isn't that the "real" reason they are always trying to trade Walker?

 

It's probably among the reasons. Another one is probably the unfounded trust in Neifi, and also the idea that a SS is more important than a 2B and the Cubs desperately need a bargaining chip on a talent-light ballclub.

 

I notice Todd has been quiet lately though.

[Magnetic Curses]

i, personally, amdshocked that we got rid of all of our "chemistry" problems yet more continue to pop up.

 

could winning and losing dictate mood and not the other way around?

 

the answer is almost without any doubt: yes.

 

this cubs team is such a deliciously perfect illustration of why team chemistry, defense, speed, and blah blah blah smallballfundamentalsjustputtingtheballinplay and whatever antiquated idea some people have of what it takes to win is so vastly overrated it's not even funny.

 

it's also a perfect example of why getting on base and driving the ball are the REAL fundamentals of the game. and you don't have to be everyone's best friend to do these things.

Edited July 5, 2006 by Stannis