what is the deal with prior???

[fiver]

Raw oysters, sushi, and rare steaks are all staples of my diet, and I've never had food poisoning in my entire life. Where and what is Prior eating? Stay in the restroom for a couple of hours if needbe, but resume your daily work activities the next day, Mark.

 

I'm pretty frustrated myself, but food poisoning can be really debilitating. It's definitley not just a matter of being in the restroom for a few hours, believe me.

 

I admit I'm beyond frustrated.

[E.J.]

Food poisoning? hahahaha. It just keeps getting better everyday.

 

I think Prior's nickname should be Tinkerbell. I love Mark, but he is just the biggest girl I've ever seen.

 

Why do people feel it necessary to constanty question Prior's manhood?

 

No one here knows how much pain he is in, or his workout regim, or how sick he was over the winter, or anything about his character.

 

I am as frustrated as anyone that he seems to be unable to pitch, but I believe if he were able to he'd be out there. This is the smae kid who threw 200+ innings in 2003 and the same one who didn't back down to Bonds.

 

I don't think he has the willingness to push himself through anything. I don't believe for a second that a strained shoulder and an illness in January should be enough to keep him out this long.

 

I wish we could go back in time and draft Tex. Prior is a very good talent, but he has to actually pitch in order to be of any use to this team.

 

Maybe he pitched too much in 2002 and 2003 and we are seeing the after affects? I'm not saying it is so but as long as we can make wild speculation on what is ailing Prior this should not be out of bounds either. If the injury is beyond Prior's control, asking him to suck it up is like asking Derrek Lee to suck it up and play first.

 

But more to the point, what does it matter that he wasn't sitting on the bench last night? That's what seems to have everyone's painties in a bunch here.

 

I personally don't care if he wasn't on the bench. It makes no difference to me. I'd rather he be getting ready to come back than sitting in the dugout.

 

I can see overuse in 2003 affecting 2004. I cannot see it having a 3 year effect, especially considering he's not pitched a lot since 2003. It's something else at this point.

 

And if it's something serious and he needs surgery just do it already. Stop stringing us along with these "illnesses" that he keeps coming up with.

[badger1679666666]

Food poisoning? hahahaha. It just keeps getting better everyday.

 

I think Prior's nickname should be Tinkerbell. I love Mark, but he is just the biggest girl I've ever seen.

 

Why do people feel it necessary to constanty question Prior's manhood?

 

No one here knows how much pain he is in, or his workout regim, or how sick he was over the winter, or anything about his character.

 

I am as frustrated as anyone that he seems to be unable to pitch, but I believe if he were able to he'd be out there. This is the smae kid who threw 200+ innings in 2003 and the same one who didn't back down to Bonds.

 

I don't think he has the willingness to push himself through anything. I don't believe for a second that a strained shoulder and an illness in January should be enough to keep him out this long.

 

I wish we could go back in time and draft Tex. Prior is a very good talent, but he has to actually pitch in order to be of any use to this team.

 

Maybe he pitched too much in 2002 and 2003 and we are seeing the after affects? I'm not saying it is so but as long as we can make wild speculation on what is ailing Prior this should not be out of bounds either. If the injury is beyond Prior's control, asking him to suck it up is like asking Derrek Lee to suck it up and play first.

 

But more to the point, what does it matter that he wasn't sitting on the bench last night? That's what seems to have everyone's painties in a bunch here.

 

I personally don't care if he wasn't on the bench. It makes no difference to me. I'd rather he be getting ready to come back than sitting in the dugout.

 

I can see overuse in 2003 affecting 2004. I cannot see it having a 3 year effect, especially considering he's not pitched a lot since 2003. It's something else at this point.

 

It's gotta be mental. Everytime he gets checked out, it's like he has a boo-boo that he can't play through.

 

At least Wood is messing up his elbow, and tearing his shoulder muscles - and then still pitching in some capacity. Prior's fraility is really starting to bother me, and this coming from someone who views Prior as his second favorite Cub.

 

I want him to suck it up, and get his ass out on the diamond and help this freaking team.

[USSoccer]

Food poisoning is often a euphemism given by teams to cover-up a plethora of ailments.

 

I have to think the Cubs are getting pretty frustrated with Prior as well, which is why they've not really talked about his rehab much.

 

Maybe after the debacle of the last injury, Prior asked the Cubs not to talk to the media about this one?

 

IIRC Hendry made a comment last season after Prior left the mound in the 1st or 2nd along the lines of "he needs to pitch, and there's nothing wrong with him".

 

There's at least proof of the Cubs' irritation of him. There's no proof that Prior asked then to say quiet.

[goonys evil twin]

Maybe he pitched too much in 2002 and 2003 and we are seeing the after affects? I'm not saying it is so but as long as we can make wild speculation on what is ailing Prior this should not be out of bounds either. If the injury is beyond Prior's control, asking him to suck it up is like asking Derrek Lee to suck it up and play first.

 

But more to the point, what does it matter that he wasn't sitting on the bench last night? That's what seems to have everyone's painties in a bunch here.

 

My panties are in a bunch for an entirely different reason. I don't care about whether he's on the bench.

 

I think his injuries could easily be related to the misuse of past years. When Dusty was hired I predicted that at least 1 of the big 3 (who were all healthy at the time), and probably 2, would miss a lot of time to injury and/or lose effectiveness during his tenure.

 

I'm not pissed at Prior himself. I'm pissed that the Cubs decided 12 years ago to try and emulate the Braves, and have thus far done a piss-poor job of even coming close. I think the "we'll put all our hopes on the arms and just trade for bats later" gameplan was a very bad one. And not only was the plan bad, but the implementation of the plan has been bad. Pitcher injuries are extremely common, and when you risk pitcher's health as brazenly as the Cubs do, you should not be surprised when multiple pitchers go down.

[CubinNY]

Maybe he pitched too much in 2002 and 2003 and we are seeing the after affects? I'm not saying it is so but as long as we can make wild speculation on what is ailing Prior this should not be out of bounds either. If the injury is beyond Prior's control, asking him to suck it up is like asking Derrek Lee to suck it up and play first.

 

But more to the point, what does it matter that he wasn't sitting on the bench last night? That's what seems to have everyone's painties in a bunch here.

 

My panties are in a bunch for an entirely different reason. I don't care about whether he's on the bench.

 

I think his injuries could easily be related to the misuse of past years. When Dusty was hired I predicted that at least 1 of the big 3 (who were all healthy at the time), and probably 2, would miss a lot of time to injury and/or lose effectiveness during his tenure.

 

I'm not pissed at Prior himself. I'm pissed that the Cubs decided 12 years ago to try and emulate the Braves, and have thus far done a piss-poor job of even coming close. I think the "we'll put all our hopes on the arms and just trade for bats later" gameplan was a very bad one. And not only was the plan bad, but the implementation of the plan has been bad. Pitcher injuries are extremely common, and when you risk pitcher's health as brazenly as the Cubs do, you should not be surprised when multiple pitchers go down.

 

I don't disagree at all. To me Prior seems to be the victim here.

[Ding Dong Johnson]

He pitched 167 innings in 2002 and 211 in 2003. If that's overuse, he needs to be dealt elsewhere.

[neely crenshaw]

i think the mystery is that plain and simple you do not miss 3 months with a "strain". the mystary is that this is something worse and they are not honest about it.

[badger1679666666]

Maybe he pitched too much in 2002 and 2003 and we are seeing the after affects? I'm not saying it is so but as long as we can make wild speculation on what is ailing Prior this should not be out of bounds either. If the injury is beyond Prior's control, asking him to suck it up is like asking Derrek Lee to suck it up and play first.

 

But more to the point, what does it matter that he wasn't sitting on the bench last night? That's what seems to have everyone's painties in a bunch here.

 

My panties are in a bunch for an entirely different reason. I don't care about whether he's on the bench.

 

I think his injuries could easily be related to the misuse of past years. When Dusty was hired I predicted that at least 1 of the big 3 (who were all healthy at the time), and probably 2, would miss a lot of time to injury and/or lose effectiveness during his tenure.

 

I'm not pissed at Prior himself. I'm pissed that the Cubs decided 12 years ago to try and emulate the Braves, and have thus far done a piss-poor job of even coming close. I think the "we'll put all our hopes on the arms and just trade for bats later" gameplan was a very bad one. And not only was the plan bad, but the implementation of the plan has been bad. Pitcher injuries are extremely common, and when you risk pitcher's health as brazenly as the Cubs do, you should not be surprised when multiple pitchers go down.

 

I don't disagree at all. To me Prior seems to be the victim here.

 

I'm not pissed at Prior either, but he's a wuss. Until he shows me differently, that's what I believe. He needs to get mentally tougher and not succumb to every ache, pain, and strain in his body.

[badger1679666666]

i think the mystery is that plain and simple you do not miss 3 months with a "strain". the mystary is that this is something worse and they are not honest about it.

 

But then why would he keep throwing and working up to pitching to rookie leaguers?

[CubinNY]

He pitched 167 innings in 2002 and 211 in 2003. If that's overuse, he needs to be dealt elsewhere.

 

He was also very young and comming off of almost constant work the year before. And it is not so much the innings but the pitch counts in those innings.

[badger1679666666]

He pitched 167 innings in 2002 and 211 in 2003. If that's overuse, he needs to be dealt elsewhere.

 

He was also very young and comming off of almost constant work the year before. And it is not so much the innings but the pitch counts in those innings.

 

Anyway you slice it, he's soft. And he needs to get tougher, and he needs to get tougher soon.

[CubinNY]

He pitched 167 innings in 2002 and 211 in 2003. If that's overuse, he needs to be dealt elsewhere.

 

He was also very young and comming off of almost constant work the year before. And it is not so much the innings but the pitch counts in those innings.

 

Anyway you slice it, he's soft. And he needs to get tougher, and he needs to get tougher soon.

 

You crack me up. Have you ever met Prior?

[CheeseHead Cubs Fan]

He pitched 167 innings in 2002 and 211 in 2003. If that's overuse, he needs to be dealt elsewhere.

 

He was also very young and comming off of almost constant work the year before. And it is not so much the innings but the pitch counts in those innings.

 

Anyway you slice it, he's soft. And he needs to get tougher, and he needs to get tougher soon.

 

You crack me up. Have you ever met Prior?

 

That has no relevance to this argument. I agree with Badger, Prior has and will continue to be the biggest waste of talent there is. He is soft and appears to rather stay in Mesa and rehab than get healthy and actually earn his paycheck. C'mon, the flu and now this... I agree, get tougher or just retire and go play golf all day Mark!

[badger1679666666]

He pitched 167 innings in 2002 and 211 in 2003. If that's overuse, he needs to be dealt elsewhere.

 

He was also very young and comming off of almost constant work the year before. And it is not so much the innings but the pitch counts in those innings.

 

Anyway you slice it, he's soft. And he needs to get tougher, and he needs to get tougher soon.

 

You crack me up. Have you ever met Prior?

 

You act like I enjoy coming to these realizations about my second favorite Cubs player in the last 10 years. I don't, but at some point, I have to stop making excuses for even my favorite players.

 

I don't need to MEET him to look at his track record.

[Banedon]

You know...at least when Wood is out, he has MRI's and surgery's to prove that he's actually hurt. I can accept that. This stuff with Prior is just irritating.

[CubDad4Ever]

I have said this before. Prior cant hold madduxs jock. I dont want to hear overuse and other excuses that are not validated with proof. Great pitching includes picking up the ball. This pattern by prior is more than disturbing. We need hitters and pitchers who can take on a challenge like maddux and z . at least they take their turn in the rotation. coach L.

[CubinNY]

He pitched 167 innings in 2002 and 211 in 2003. If that's overuse, he needs to be dealt elsewhere.

 

He was also very young and comming off of almost constant work the year before. And it is not so much the innings but the pitch counts in those innings.

 

Anyway you slice it, he's soft. And he needs to get tougher, and he needs to get tougher soon.

 

You crack me up. Have you ever met Prior?

 

You act like I enjoy coming to these realizations about my second favorite Cubs player in the last 10 years. I don't, but at some point, I have to stop making excuses for even my favorite players.

 

I don't need to MEET him to look at his track record.

 

it has every relavence. If you don't know someone, have never met or spoken to someone, don't know how little or much they work towards a goal, how can you possible call that person soft, a wuss, a sissy, a girl?

 

We went through this last year when people said Patterson was stupid, lazy, and doesn't care.

 

How do you know what his injury status is? Are you privy to information no one else is?

 

How do you know the Cubs aren't lying and there really is something wrong with him?

 

How do you know he hasn't told the Cubs to not disclose his medical status?

 

It is not making excuses for Prior. Last year he was hit on the elbow by a line drive and came back, after he ran into Giles he came back. That doesn't sound like someone who is soft to me. That is part of his track record too.

Edited May 4, 2006 by CubinNY

[goonys evil twin]

He pitched 167 innings in 2002 and 211 in 2003. If that's overuse, he needs to be dealt elsewhere.

 

For an established pro pitcher, those aren't big innings. But 2002 was his first pro season, and he went well beyond what he was used to. 2003 was only his 2nd season, and he was just 22. While pitching injuries are still a mystery, most people who have put much thought into the issue agree that pre 24 year old pitchers are at the greatest risk, and should be treated accordingly. That means not overexerting the youngest pitchers, both in individual games and for the season. Prior threw over 100 pitches in his first major league start. Not a real big deal, but he did it in 6 innings, which means he had some big pitch count innings. He then threw 124 in his 4th start of his career, absurd. He followed that up with 12 straight 100+ pitch outings, including 6 over 110 pitches, and one of 136 pitches (more absurdity). He had 3 more 100+ pitch outings before being shut down. That's a string of risky treatment of a 21 year old kid pitcher who had never before pitched against professional hitters.

 

In 2003, at 22/23, with under 200 pro innings under his belt (most pitchers, even really good ones, get several hundred under their belt before they debut) his first outing was 100+. 3 of his next 4 were 110+. He then went on a string of 12 straight 100+ pitch outings, including 124, 123, 124, 119 and 127.

 

Then, he went out and injured his shoulder in a game, BUT WENT BACK OUT TO PITCH ANYWAY. Following that game, in which he pitched 3 innings after the injury, he missed a month of the season, due to that injury. Some excused Dusty and the Cubs saying, "well, he said he was fine", to which the only reasonable response is "HE WAS 22 YEARS OLD WITH VERY LIMITED EXPERIENCE AND HE WAS TRYING TO IMPRESS HIS MANAGER AND TEAMMATES, OF COURSE HE SAID HE WAS FINE, THAT SHOULDN'T BE HIS CALL TO MAKE. YOU DON'T ASK A BOXER IF HE IS GOOD ENOUGH TO GO ON, HIS TRAINER/CORNERMAN MAKES THAT DECISION FOR HIM."

 

So anyway, after this nearly month long abscense, they eased him back in with a nice little 79 pitch outing. Then they let him go 116, 118, 100, 116, 131, 129, 110, 124, 131 and 133 to finish off the season. Mind you, he turned 23 the day after the 129 pitch outing.

 

In his first postseason experience, he goes 9 full innings throwing 133 pitches. In his 2nd outing, he went 7 innings, racking up 116 pitches (and the Cubs were blowing out Florida in a 12-3 win, the perfect opportunity to rest a starting pitcher).

 

It came out later that during this stretch run, Prior was complaining of a little ankle issue, that many attributed to his later achilles problem.

 

So, going into what would be his last playoff start of the year, his third start of the playoffs, Prior came in averaging 121.4 pitches per game for 12 games over the course of 2 months, COMING OFF INJURY. He threw 119 pitches in that fateful game, about 110 of which were brilliant. And some people have the audacity for calling him out for "blowing the game", even though, with any sense of perspective, somebody could look at the treatment of a 21, 22 and 23 year old kid seeing his first pro competition, and say no wonder he started to unravel at the end.

 

The Cubs and Dusty Baker abused Prior so much that he racked up an incredible number of pitcher abuse points. He could ask out of games early because he would be seen as a coward in the macho man culture of baseball, where injuries are a sign of mental weakness and losing a game is due to not being tough enough to know how to win.

 

Is it any wonder how, at 23, 24 and 25, Prior has come down with a string of strange ailments, and has, at times, not pitched as brilliantly as some would expect?

 

The kid was killed, in a baseball sense, at an incredibly young age. The Cubs don't throw established veterans with no future out there that frequently that long and that recklessly. But they treat their kids that way.

 

Brilliant!

[JGalt73]

He pitched 167 innings in 2002 and 211 in 2003. If that's overuse, he needs to be dealt elsewhere.

 

...The kid was killed, in a baseball sense, at an incredibly young age. The Cubs don't throw established veterans with no future out there that frequently that long and that recklessly. But they treat their kids that way.

 

Brilliant!

 

Bravo on that whole post!

[Jon]

Jon, I'm not slamming the Cubs. I'm questioning Prior and questioning why 2 relatively minor things have sidelined him and set him back 5 months. There's no reason a shoulder strain and a flu like virus should be worse to come back from than shoulder surgery and a knee surgery. He should be back pitching, he should have been pitching a long time ago. He's not. I don't think any of it is the Cubs' fault, because I think they're probably as frustrated as anyone.

It's the timing that did him in. The nasty case of bronchitis left Prior out out of shape going into ST and the shoulder strain caused him to be shut down for about 12 days. He was probably pretty close to a Cactus League game since he was coming off a batting practice session, but it really set him back. Wood, on the other hand, hasn't had those kinds of setbacks. The knee surgery proved to be a relatively minor bump in the road and even him not throwing for a week recently didn't do that much since his arm strength was coming along.

 

It's really easy to blast the Cubs on pitching injuries, but it's often not deserved.

 

Yes, yes it is.

 

I can't count on one hand how many trainers we've had. Remember when Corey got hurt and they just left him in the game anyway? Meh, who cares right?

I was more referring to the lying. Certain instances have certainly be questionable and perhaps incompetency has played a role at certain points (see the past two trainer controversies).

 

 

And apparently someone needs to screen all of Prior's food from now on. But hopefully he can get over it quickly. He'd still probably have to throw a BP session before facing rookies a couple of times, though.

[Banedon]

Great post Goony.

[CubsInNC]

Great post Goony.

 

 

Yeah, that one just made the quote wall in the computer room.

 

Good work, well thought out. Sure there will be arguments, but that summarily ties up the facts.

[Transmogrified Tiger]

So anyway, after this nearly month long abscense, they eased him back in with a nice little 79 pitch outing. Then they let him go 116, 118, 100, 116, 131, 129, 110, 124, 131 and 133 to finish off the season. Mind you, he turned 23 the day after the 129 pitch outing.

 

Astonishing to see all those consecutively. Or maybe criminal is a better word.

[Magnetic Curses]

He pitched 167 innings in 2002 and 211 in 200

 

Is it any wonder how, at 23, 24 and 25, Prior has come down with a string of strange ailments, and has, at times, not pitched as brilliantly as some would expect?

 

but that's not the real issue, the real issue is: why has kerry wood failed to have a 700 strikeout season? i mean honestly, he obviously sucks.