Justice Finally (FKA- Reyes Vs. Ponson )

[1908]

Excellent news. The better Ponson looks(stat wise obviously) in spring, the better chance he has of wasting the Cards first 10-15 starts out of the 5 spot.

 

You can only hope.

 

It's been many years since a Cardinal starter has wasted 10 or 15 starts, and it won't happen this year, either.

How quickly we forget. :D

 

Forget what? You think the Cards had better options than Stephenson that year?

Well, I was just pointing out that Stephenson quite effectively wasted 10-15 starts in 2003.

C'mon, Tim. Many = two. Get with the program.

[K-Town]

Excellent news. The better Ponson looks(stat wise obviously) in spring, the better chance he has of wasting the Cards first 10-15 starts out of the 5 spot.

 

You can only hope.

 

It's been many years since a Cardinal starter has wasted 10 or 15 starts, and it won't happen this year, either.

How quickly we forget. :D

 

Forget what? You think the Cards had better options than Stephenson that year?

Well, I was just pointing out that Stephenson quite effectively wasted 10-15 starts in 2003.

 

"Wasted" means that the Cards had better options, and didn't use them. Keep this thing in context, please.

[SouthSideRyan]

Well it could be argued that the Cards wasted 32 starts from Mulder last year by acquiring him in the first place rather than keeping Haren.

 

Bud Smith, Travis Smith, and Stephenson certainly wasted 10 starts apiece in '02. Andy Benes did a fabulous job putting up a 7.38 ERA in 19 starts in '01. I'm wagering somebody (like me for instance) could've bested Jose Jimenez's 5.85 ERA in '99.

[K-Town]

Well it could be argued that the Cards wasted 32 starts from Mulder last year by acquiring him in the first place rather than keeping Haren.

 

Bud Smith, Travis Smith, and Stephenson certainly wasted 10 starts apiece in '02. Andy Benes did a fabulous job putting up a 7.38 ERA in 19 starts in '01. I'm wagering somebody (like me for instance) could've bested Jose Jimenez's 5.85 ERA in '99.

 

 

2001 was 4 years ago.

[SouthSideRyan]

4 years is many??

 

Is there anything different about this year's Cardinals management and their approach to the game compared to 2001?

[K-Town]

4 years is many??

 

Is there anything different about this year's Cardinals management and their approach to the game compared to 2001?

 

Nope. You're right. The Cards are screwed. History has proved it.

[SouthSideRyan]

The Cards are screwed. History has proved it.

 

Once again you've nailed it.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20060317/capt.flbj11103172334.yankees_cardinals_baseball_flbj111.jpg

 

"Hey....Can I get another beer and dog please!"

[XZero771679666304]

http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20060317/capt.flbj11103172334.yankees_cardinals_baseball_flbj111.jpg

 

"Hey....Can I get another beer and dog please!"

 

 

He just uses that line to lure the vendors close enough to eat them.

[Andy]

Freakin' St. Patty's Day uniforms. I haven't seen them look good on any team yet.

[SouthSideRyan]

Freakin' St. Patty's Day uniforms. I haven't seen them look good on any team yet.

 

When the model is Sidney Ponson, it's gonna be a struggle no matter who designed them.

[CardsFanInChiTown]

Looks like Ponson is leading for the #5 spot....

 

After the game, La Russa remained mum about his leanings, saying no decision has been made about the No. 5 starter. However, numerous indicators point to Ponson having a stranglehold on the job. Reyes, who has allowed 15 hits, two home runs and an 8.58 ERA in 9 1/3 exhibition innings, will start this afternoon's game against the Braves while Mark Mulder pitches on a rear field against minor-league competition.

 

La Russa said, "You're getting to the point where you have to make a decision so that guy gets in turn. That's the ideal thing. Except you can't make the decision until you're ready to make it."

 

The Cardinals are believed likely to option Reyes to Class AAA Memphis, where they would like him to complement a riding four-seam fastball with a sinking two-seamer.

 

 

The link to the story is here here.

[wolf stansson]

The parts of that article Vance would enjoy:

He lumbered from first base to third on a hit-and-run after singling to fuel a two-run third inning. And he bounced from the mound to field a ball and get an assist on his last out.

 

I know the man is fat, but that is pretty insensitive to have in a millions plus circulation paper.

[CardsFanInChiTown]

So I gotta ask Wolf - Are you still against Ponson getting the 5th spot?

[wolf stansson]

Not as much as I was, but I'd still prefer Reyes by far. Ponson has been effective in ST so far in putting up zeros and eating some innings, but when given a choice between someone strikes out a batter an inning and Ponson, I'm taking the other guy. It's one thing to pitch to contact, but Ponson so far hasn't shown much ability to make anyone swing and miss ever.

 

More than anything I'm disappointed in this farcical competition. Tony and Duncan have tried to trade for Ponson in the past because he is the typical Duncan reclamation project (marginal to good stuff but tried to overthrow too much then Duncan gets them to use their sinker almost exclusively. People think they are good because of their high innings and win totals, but crap k rates, high whip, and poor opp avg ensue). This method works great when the project is a guy with great stuff like Carp and Darryl Kile, but when it is a Kent Bottenfield, Garrett Stephenson, Dustin Hermanson, or Brett Tomko they just suck but some people don't realize it. This is why I think watching Jason Marquis' developement has been interesting. He basically has the ability to go either way. He has great velocity but no offspeed/strike out pitch. If he developes one he could be a top of the rotation guy, if not he'll just be another sinkerballer inning eater.

 

When they finally got Ponson they basically all but gave him the spot by making Reyes throw a new pitch to live hitting. His (Reyes) st numbers are inflated because of this and he never got a fair shake at a rotation spot. If having a two seamer was so essential to his big league success and they were really planning on there being a competition this spring don't you think they might have mentioned this at some point in the last 2 spring trainings or when he was up with the club last year?

 

Don't get me wrong, I think Duncan is a good pitching coach, I just don't always agree with his methods.

[cajanek]

lol. eating some innings.

[wolf stansson]

lol. eating some innings.

I like your name.

[cajanek]

Thanks. I love the player. I also love the Cardinals. I just threw the obvious "eating some innings" joke out there to keep with the theme of this thread... which has been quite funny.

[sethuel1]

lol. eating some innings.

 

Haha

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

The day Ponson is declared the fifth starter, I'm sending a case of scotch to him as a congratulations gift.

[indifferent]

The day Ponson is declared the fifth starter, I'm sending a case of scotch to him as a congratulations gift.

 

Please do it, that way he won't last long for the 5th spot.

[CardsFanInChiTown]

Not as much as I was, but I'd still prefer Reyes by far. Ponson has been effective in ST so far in putting up zeros and eating some innings, but when given a choice between someone strikes out a batter an inning and Ponson, I'm taking the other guy. It's one thing to pitch to contact, but Ponson so far hasn't shown much ability to make anyone swing and miss ever.

 

More than anything I'm disappointed in this farcical competition. Tony and Duncan have tried to trade for Ponson in the past because he is the typical Duncan reclamation project (marginal to good stuff but tried to overthrow too much then Duncan gets them to use their sinker almost exclusively. People think they are good because of their high innings and win totals, but crap k rates, high whip, and poor opp avg ensue). This method works great when the project is a guy with great stuff like Carp and Darryl Kile, but when it is a Kent Bottenfield, Garrett Stephenson, Dustin Hermanson, or Brett Tomko they just suck but some people don't realize it. This is why I think watching Jason Marquis' developement has been interesting. He basically has the ability to go either way. He has great velocity but no offspeed/strike out pitch. If he developes one he could be a top of the rotation guy, if not he'll just be another sinkerballer inning eater.

 

When they finally got Ponson they basically all but gave him the spot by making Reyes throw a new pitch to live hitting. His (Reyes) st numbers are inflated because of this and he never got a fair shake at a rotation spot. If having a two seamer was so essential to his big league success and they were really planning on there being a competition this spring don't you think they might have mentioned this at some point in the last 2 spring trainings or when he was up with the club last year?

 

Don't get me wrong, I think Duncan is a good pitching coach, I just don't always agree with his methods.

 

Great post, I pretty much agree with everything.

[jjgman21]

Reyes with a rough outting today.

 

4 IP, 3 H, 3 ER, 1 BB, 3 K, 2 HR

 

here comes Ponson, St. Louis.

 

did you know he was fat?

[Banedon]

Reyes with a rough outting today.

 

4 IP, 3 H, 3 ER, 1 BB, 3 K, 2 HR

 

here comes Ponson, St. Louis.

 

did you know he was fat?

 

Wha-wha-whaaaat?

 

Stop the presses!

[MeatampPotatoesMan]

The decision has already been made internally in the Cards organization. Reyes is going to AAA Memphis. Ponson has won the #5 spot.