Sounds good to me.

[Tim]

Blech. No Lofton for me. There's about 12 other ways I'd prefer to handle CF next season. Especially if we go out and sign Furcal. There's no need for a leadoff CF, then.

[vance_the_cubs_fan]

Blech. No Lofton for me. There's about 12 other ways I'd prefer to handle CF next season. Especially if we go out and sign Furcal. There's no need for a leadoff CF, then.

 

I'm for signing Lofton, only if we don't sign Furcal. If we get Furcal, I'd rather have Preston Wilson out there than Lofton, and I have little love Preston Wilson.

 

My ideal scenario is to re-sign Nomar, sign Giles, and then sign Lofton for CF.

 

If we sign Furcal, I'd still hope to sign Giles, but I'd prefer someone like Preston Wilson in CF or just keep Patterson around.

[nilodnayr]

Blech. No Lofton for me. There's about 12 other ways I'd prefer to handle CF next season. Especially if we go out and sign Furcal. There's no need for a leadoff CF, then.

 

I'm for signing Lofton, only if we don't sign Furcal. If we get Furcal, I'd rather have Preston Wilson out there than Lofton, and I have little love Preston Wilson.

 

My ideal scenario is to re-sign Nomar, sign Giles, and then sign Lofton for CF.

 

If we sign Furcal, I'd still hope to sign Giles, but I'd prefer someone like Preston Wilson in CF or just keep Patterson around.

Im for Milton Bradley, other than that I guess Id take a flyer on lofton and if he regresses as his BA/BIP shows then I'll give the job to JHJR.

[HoopsCubs]

... or just keep Patterson around.

 

Now that's blech. Low trade or value not, Patterson's got to go in order for the organization to start its renewal process.

[Jehrico]

A team can only sign three type A free agents unless they lose more than that to FA. I'm not sure how many of those guys are type A, but I think that may be an infeasible offseason.

 

Thats a good point, I'd have to think Seanez would be a type A, making it 4. Does resigning your own players in the exclusive period count to that total...i.e. resigning nomar and not picking up furcal?

Nope. I'm pretty sure re-signing your own players doesn't count against your total. But if Nomar were to re-sign before declaring, it definitely wouldn't count.

 

Ok, then everything rotoauthority said except Nomar instead of Furcal, I like it.

 

I think you could still do Furcal instead of Nomar and be under the limit. If I understand it right, you can sign 3 Class A FAs if you lose 0. If you lose one, you can sign 4. If you lose 2, you can sign 5, etc...

 

Am I mistaken?

[Tim]

I believe the rule is that you would have to lose 4 type A's to sign 4 type A's.

[Jazz]

6 FA's

 

If history is indicative of anything, it will tell us this will not happen, i think that 2-3 of the listed will sign, and those are Furcal, Howry, and Lofton.

 

The rest of the team will be filled through trades IMO. Hendry will definately need to get creative, and start looking at the entire league and every trade possibility possible. I Think the way hendry handles this offseason will say alot about how he will handle this team in the long run.

 

1) will he control the team, or is Baker still control what players he acquires?

2) will he be aggresive enough, and forfeit big money on a maruqee player, or be creative and make another out of nowhere trade?

3) and what direction does he want this team to go in?

[SCCubbieFAN]

I think Giles should be the first priority given that the Cubs don't have as many fall back options for a RF as they do for ss/2b and they have enough $ to lure Giles away from the coast. I can live with an offseason of Giles, Lofton/some other reliable CF w/good obp, and a SP and a reliever--as long as they resign Nomar and TWalker and let Macias and Perez go.

[Jehrico]

I think Giles should be the first priority given that the Cubs don't have as many fall back options for a RF as they do for ss/2b and they have enough $ to lure Giles away from the coast. I can live with an offseason of Giles, Lofton/some other reliable CF w/good obp, and a SP and a reliever--as long as they resign Nomar and TWalker and let Macias and Perez go.

 

Giles has always struck me as an exception to the rule, I think money is less important than other factors, such as location and winning (given that the money is decent, however). I don't think he'll sign for the highest offer unless the highest offer is also from the team that he feels is the best fit. He'll take a small discount to sign for the right team. The question is, exactly what size of discount, and how far off of "the right fit" are the Cubs?

[Magnetic Curses]

I think Giles should be the first priority given that the Cubs don't have as many fall back options for a RF as they do for ss/2b and they have enough $ to lure Giles away from the coast. I can live with an offseason of Giles, Lofton/some other reliable CF w/good obp, and a SP and a reliever--as long as they resign Nomar and TWalker and let Macias and Perez go.

 

Giles has always struck me as an exception to the rule, I think money is less important than other factors, such as location and winning (given that the money is decent, however). I don't think he'll sign for the highest offer unless the highest offer is also from the team that he feels is the best fit. He'll take a small discount to sign for the right team. The question is, exactly what size of discount, and how far off of "the right fit" are the Cubs?

 

i think the cubs will have to offer a lot of money to get him. wrigley's not exactly a huge lefty upgrade to petco and it's definitely not close to an ocean, unless he likes windsurfing on lake michigan.

 

i'd love to get him and think we will, but we aren't getting a discount.

[Jehrico]

I think Giles should be the first priority given that the Cubs don't have as many fall back options for a RF as they do for ss/2b and they have enough $ to lure Giles away from the coast. I can live with an offseason of Giles, Lofton/some other reliable CF w/good obp, and a SP and a reliever--as long as they resign Nomar and TWalker and let Macias and Perez go.

 

Giles has always struck me as an exception to the rule, I think money is less important than other factors, such as location and winning (given that the money is decent, however). I don't think he'll sign for the highest offer unless the highest offer is also from the team that he feels is the best fit. He'll take a small discount to sign for the right team. The question is, exactly what size of discount, and how far off of "the right fit" are the Cubs?

 

i think the cubs will have to offer a lot of money to get him. wrigley's not exactly a huge lefty upgrade to petco and it's definitely not close to an ocean, unless he likes windsurfing on lake michigan.

 

i'd love to get him and think we will, but we aren't getting a discount.

 

Exactly...I guess I could have said it in fewer words...with Giles, we're going to have to outbid other teams by a good margin to get him. Just barely having the highest offer won't cut it.

[goonys evil twin]

... or just keep Patterson around.

 

Now that's blech. Low trade or value not, Patterson's got to go in order for the organization to start its renewal process.

 

Why? I don't understand this thought process. Why does Corey have to leave for this team to be good? That sounds an awful lot like last year's "get rid of the bad apples" strategy that failed oh so miserably. If you want Corey replaced with somebody who is guaranteed to be much better, fine. If you're looking for more CF production, I can't argue. But the "he has to go before this team can win" theory doesn't add up. I think if you can get the necessary improvements elsewhere, they'd be justified in giving Corey another year to make something of his skills.

[badger1679666666]

... or just keep Patterson around.

 

Now that's blech. Low trade or value not, Patterson's got to go in order for the organization to start its renewal process.

 

Why? I don't understand this thought process. Why does Corey have to leave for this team to be good? That sounds an awful lot like last year's "get rid of the bad apples" strategy that failed oh so miserably. If you want Corey replaced with somebody who is guaranteed to be much better, fine. If you're looking for more CF production, I can't argue. But the "he has to go before this team can win" theory doesn't add up. I think if you can get the necessary improvements elsewhere, they'd be justified in giving Corey another year to make something of his skills.

 

Because he's awful and Baker will still try to bat him #1 because of his "speed".

[goonys evil twin]

 

Because he's awful and Baker will still try to bat him #1 because of his "speed".

 

If I thought he was going to repeat 2005, no doubt I'd be very much anti-Corey. Also, if the concern is how Baker will use him, then perhaps the focus should be on ridding the team of Dusty before the renewal can begin, rather than one of his misused players.

 

I'm all for an improvement in CF, if they can find it. But I'm not currently 100% anti-Corey. A small part of me wants to see one more try (with Hairston ready to fill-in if need be). What I wouldn't want is dumping Corey and then going hard after a guy like Preston Wilson.

[CuseCubFan69]

I don't have a problem with Patterson and Hairston being the 4th and 5th OF's.

[HoopsCubs]

... or just keep Patterson around.

 

Now that's blech. Low trade or value not, Patterson's got to go in order for the organization to start its renewal process.

 

Why? I don't understand this thought process. Why does Corey have to leave for this team to be good? That sounds an awful lot like last year's "get rid of the bad apples" strategy that failed oh so miserably. If you want Corey replaced with somebody who is guaranteed to be much better, fine. If you're looking for more CF production, I can't argue. But the "he has to go before this team can win" theory doesn't add up. I think if you can get the necessary improvements elsewhere, they'd be justified in giving Corey another year to make something of his skills.

 

We'll have to agree to disagree on this one. To me, getting rid of him is an addition by subtraction move - it's a gut thing - obviously, someone else will be playing CF if Patterson is gone. As long as that somebody isn't Marquis Grissom, Endy Chavez, Laynce Nix, Steve Finley, or Tike Redman (and I wouldn't expect Hendry to get any of those guys), the Cubs will be better off.

[BigbadB]

I don't have a problem with Patterson and Hairston being the 4th and 5th OF's.

 

That's what I think as well. I'd also be fine with Patterson as the starting centerfielder if they made the necessary improvements elsewhere.

 

Hairston is Patterson's protection. Lofton wouldn't be a bad stop gap, as he'd come cheap, wouldn't need a long term contract and provides a decent top of the order OBP. Patterson makes for a decent late inning defensive replacement. If he solves his offensive woes, he could be a decent lefty bat off the bench, a decent pinch runner, etc....

[HoopsCubs]

 

Because he's awful and Baker will still try to bat him #1 because of his "speed".

 

If I thought he was going to repeat 2005, no doubt I'd be very much anti-Corey. Also, if the concern is how Baker will use him, then perhaps the focus should be on ridding the team of Dusty before the renewal can begin, rather than one of his misused players.

 

I'm all for an improvement in CF, if they can find it. But I'm not currently 100% anti-Corey. A small part of me wants to see one more try (with Hairston ready to fill-in if need be). What I wouldn't want is dumping Corey and then going hard after a guy like Preston Wilson.

 

I'm cool with Preston Wilson playing CF, just as long as one of these guys is playing corner OF:

 

Manny Ramirez

Brian Giles

Pat Burrell

Bobby Abreu

Gary Sheffield

Adam Dunn

Cliff Floyd

[Tim]

 

Because he's awful and Baker will still try to bat him #1 because of his "speed".

 

If I thought he was going to repeat 2005, no doubt I'd be very much anti-Corey. Also, if the concern is how Baker will use him, then perhaps the focus should be on ridding the team of Dusty before the renewal can begin, rather than one of his misused players.

 

I'm all for an improvement in CF, if they can find it. But I'm not currently 100% anti-Corey. A small part of me wants to see one more try (with Hairston ready to fill-in if need be). What I wouldn't want is dumping Corey and then going hard after a guy like Preston Wilson.

 

I'm cool with Preston Wilson playing CF, just as long as one of these guys is playing corner OF:

 

Manny Ramirez

Brian Giles

Pat Burrell

Bobby Abreu

Gary Sheffield

Adam Dunn

Cliff Floyd

I'm not okay with gambling my season on Cliff Floyd staying healthy, myself. He, Aramis and Kerry can have a "race to the DL" contest if they're all on the team.

[goonys evil twin]

I'm cool with Preston Wilson playing CF,

 

I know you are, which really makes me question your logic in every other thread. :wink:

 

I don't think the Cubs will be better off with Wilson in center instead of Corey.

[BigbadB]

... or just keep Patterson around.

 

Now that's blech. Low trade or value not, Patterson's got to go in order for the organization to start its renewal process.

 

Why? I don't understand this thought process. Why does Corey have to leave for this team to be good? That sounds an awful lot like last year's "get rid of the bad apples" strategy that failed oh so miserably. If you want Corey replaced with somebody who is guaranteed to be much better, fine. If you're looking for more CF production, I can't argue. But the "he has to go before this team can win" theory doesn't add up. I think if you can get the necessary improvements elsewhere, they'd be justified in giving Corey another year to make something of his skills.

 

We'll have to agree to disagree on this one. To me, getting rid of him is an addition by subtraction move - it's a gut thing - obviously, someone else will be playing CF if Patterson is gone. As long as that somebody isn't Marquis Grissom, Endy Chavez, Laynce Nix, Steve Finley, or Tike Redman (and I wouldn't expect Hendry to get any of those guys), the Cubs will be better off.

 

I'm going to disagree with you also, Hoops. They did the whole addition by subtraction thing last year with Alou, Sosa and Mercker. They had a worse year than the previous year. Pat "The Bat" Burrell had a horrible year recently in arguably one of the worst places to play, as far as fans getting on the players is concerned, and a whole bunch of Cub fans were clamoring about wanting to trade for Burrell this year. He came out of his year long slump in fine fashion. For those that don't recall, Burrell had a .209 AVG and a .713 OPS as a corner outfielder in 2003. Take away some of Burrell's 72 walks that year, and you have Corey Patterson Jr. Even worse though, is the fact that Burrell plays a much more offense oriented position than Patterson.

 

I tend to believe Patterson will be gone this offseason, but this would be another really bad trade on the Cubs part, because all they will be asking in return is a bucket of balls. Cubs management shoot themselves in the foot once again if that's the trade that happens. They paid someone for Sosa to play somewhere else. If they hadn't glorified the whole "Sosa is a plague" routine, they might have been able to get a team to pay more of his salary and get something a little more significant than Hairston in return. They've done nothing to give any team the impression that Patterson would be worth trading for, so what exactly do they get in return for trading him? Nothing. If nothing is all he is worth on the market, then why not give him a bench job? His offense may not provide any value this year, but his speed and defensive skills make him a decent #8 hitter in a line up that has lots of quality offensive production. He can bunt his way on in the 8 hole and let pitchers bunt him over. He can steal 2nd and let pitchers bunt him to 3rd. He can work on his plate discipline in the 8 hole as pitchers tend to pitch around the 8 hitter.

 

I understand the frustration with Patterson, but I'm not ready to give up on him if it means just giving him away.

[HoopsCubs]

I'm cool with Preston Wilson playing CF,

 

I know you are, which really makes me question your logic in every other thread. :wink:

 

I don't think the Cubs will be better off with Wilson in center instead of Corey.

 

If Giles or Abreu is playing RF, I think Wilson in CF batting 6th or 7th is a huge upgrade over Patterson. Yes, I do believe that. :wink:

 

What I have said repeatedly is that I don't want Preston Wilson, if he's the only move Hendry makes in the OF.

[HoopsCubs]

I'm not okay with gambling my season on Cliff Floyd staying healthy, myself. He, Aramis and Kerry can have a "race to the DL" contest if they're all on the team.

 

Fair enough. What about the other 6? If we got one of those guys, would you consider Wilson an upgrade over Patterson?

[USSoccer]

I'm cool with Preston Wilson playing CF,

 

I know you are, which really makes me question your logic in every other thread. :wink:

 

I don't think the Cubs will be better off with Wilson in center instead of Corey.

 

If Giles or Abreu is playing RF, I think Wilson in CF batting 6th or 7th is a huge upgrade over Patterson. Yes, I do believe that. :wink:

 

What I have said repeatedly is that I don't want Preston Wilson, if he's the only move Hendry makes in the OF.

 

I'm with you, Hoops. Wilson on his own isn't very good, but compared to Corey he'd be a nice upgrade-so long as RF is also upgraded.

 

For instance, if you go Murton/Wilson/Giles, you are better than you were last year.

 

Wilson is a better player than Corey.

[HoopsCubs]

I'm going to disagree with you also, Hoops. They did the whole addition by subtraction thing last year with Alou, Sosa and Mercker. They had a worse year than the previous year. Pat "The Bat" Burrell had a horrible year recently in arguably one of the worst places to play, as far as fans getting on the players is concerned, and a whole bunch of Cub fans were clamoring about wanting to trade for Burrell this year. He came out of his year long slump in fine fashion. For those that don't recall, Burrell had a .209 AVG and a .713 OPS as a corner outfielder in 2003. Take away some of Burrell's 72 walks that year, and you have Corey Patterson Jr. Even worse though, is the fact that Burrell plays a much more offense oriented position than Patterson.

 

I tend to believe Patterson will be gone this offseason, but this would be another really bad trade on the Cubs part, because all they will be asking in return is a bucket of balls. Cubs management shoot themselves in the foot once again if that's the trade that happens. They paid someone for Sosa to play somewhere else. If they hadn't glorified the whole "Sosa is a plague" routine, they might have been able to get a team to pay more of his salary and get something a little more significant than Hairston in return. They've done nothing to give any team the impression that Patterson would be worth trading for, so what exactly do they get in return for trading him? Nothing. If nothing is all he is worth on the market, then why not give him a bench job? His offense may not provide any value this year, but his speed and defensive skills make him a decent #8 hitter in a line up that has lots of quality offensive production. He can bunt his way on in the 8 hole and let pitchers bunt him over. He can steal 2nd and let pitchers bunt him to 3rd. He can work on his plate discipline in the 8 hole as pitchers tend to pitch around the 8 hitter.

 

I understand the frustration with Patterson, but I'm not ready to give up on him if it means just giving him away.

 

I have no problem with CP as the 5th OF - I have a problem paying him $3M to be one, which is what he will get through arbitration. Batting 8th or not, he does not deserve to start until he proves he has plate discipline.