Trib says Walker "probably as good as gone"

[cjbucks]

HE SUCKS HE DOESNT TURN AS MANY DOUBLE PLAYS AS OTHER SECOND BASEMEN

 

PLUS I HEARD HE WON'T TURN OFF HIS CAP LOCK!! :shock:

[Productive Outs]

CANT TURN CLUTCH NOT A GOOD HITTER IN THE DOUBLE PLAY

 

hahaha, not a good hitter in the double play

[CubfaninCA]

As other's have said, if you trade Walker, it's better to deal him in the offseason. Perhaps Minnesota would be interested and would give up Radke for Walker and couple other Cubbies. Iirc Radke gets $9 million next year, and Minny needs to fill several holes. The Cubs could give them something like Walker, J. Williams and Mitre. I'll play it conservatively, and won't throw Welly in or any other prospects, since I'll don't want to get hammered w/ MITRE & WELLY ARE GREAT! LOOK WHAT THEY DID @ IOWA!!.... etc., etc... :o

[dnana86]

yeah, Minnesota really wants Walker....they're the team that nearly ran him out of baseball. They could not stand him when he was a Twin.

[fromthestretch]

As other's have said, if you trade Walker, it's better to deal him in the offseason. Perhaps Minnesota would be interested and would give up Radke for Walker and couple other Cubbies. Iirc Radke gets $9 million next year, and Minny needs to fill several holes. The Cubs could give them something like Walker, J. Williams and Mitre. I'll play it conservatively, and won't throw Welly in or any other prospects, since I'll don't want to get hammered w/ MITRE & WELLY ARE GREAT! LOOK WHAT THEY DID @ IOWA!!.... etc., etc... :o

 

I think Radke would be a decent mid-to-back of the rotation starter, but not for $9 million. Opponents hit about .270 off the guy, and he'll give up 25-30 homers in any given season. The only thing he does really well is limit his walks. I wouldn't even consider giving up a second baseman that can hit .280-.300, get on base, and hit for some power from the left side (all for the low price of $2.5 mil) PLUS prospects in exchange for a less than stellar right-hander making $9 million.

 

I'm more willing to give Jerome Williams the offseason to get back into shape and see what he can do for ohhh, say $500,000 than I am to pay $8.5 million more to Radke who might only be marginally better.

[Backtobanks]

For all of you Hendry critics, I hope you acknowledge that he did what was in the best interest of the Cubs by keeping Walker. I think it would have been an interesting year if Hendry would have managed the Cubs (or had a manager that agreed with Hendry). The final results might not be much different, but we would certainly have more insight on the 2006 and beyond Cubs team.

[JC]

For all of you Hendry critics, I hope you acknowledge that he did what was in the best interest of the Cubs by keeping Walker. I think it would have been an interesting year if Hendry would have managed the Cubs (or had a manager that agreed with Hendry). The final results might not be much different, but we would certainly have more insight on the 2006 and beyond Cubs team.

 

I'm one of the staunchest Hendry critics around. However, that doesn't mean I, or anyone else I've seen, doesn't think Hendry has made good decisions on occassion. I don't understand the need for such an admonishment.

 

In actuality, keeping Walker should have been a no-brainer. He has a lefty bat that keeps a good average and has pop. His OBP is sufficient to lead off, though Cub management can't grasp Walker's own remarks that "you can't steal first base."

 

He is relatively cheap with a cost effective option for 2006. His defense is better than he is given credit for and he wants to play for the Cubs (which shouldn't be dismissed). Finally, there is nobody ready in the system.

 

So, I'll give Hendry credit for not moving Walker. But, is the credit for making the obvious decision or not doing something stupid?

[abuck1220]

For all of you Hendry critics, I hope you acknowledge that he did what was in the best interest of the Cubs by keeping Walker. I think it would have been an interesting year if Hendry would have managed the Cubs (or had a manager that agreed with Hendry). The final results might not be much different, but we would certainly have more insight on the 2006 and beyond Cubs team.

 

if hendry didn't 'agree with baker' then he shouldn't have hired him. people are acting like hendry and baker have drastically different philosophies. dusty's philosophy/strategy/reputation was well-established when hendry hired him. if hendry is now unhappy with how dusty has run the team, then it's hendry's fault for not knowing what he was getting himself into

 

and i don't know how much credit i want to give hendry for not trading walker. he didn't trade lee for humberto cota either, but i'm not about to throw him a parade for that. keeping walker was a no-brainer.

[JC]

For all of you Hendry critics, I hope you acknowledge that he did what was in the best interest of the Cubs by keeping Walker. I think it would have been an interesting year if Hendry would have managed the Cubs (or had a manager that agreed with Hendry). The final results might not be much different, but we would certainly have more insight on the 2006 and beyond Cubs team.

 

if hendry didn't 'agree with baker' then he shouldn't have hired him. people are acting like hendry and baker have drastically different philosophies. dusty's philosophy/strategy/reputation was well-established when hendry hired him. if hendry is now unhappy with how dusty has run the team, then it's hendry's fault for not knowing what he was getting himself into

 

and i don't know how much credit i want to give hendry for not trading walker. he didn't trade lee for humberto cota either, but i'm not about to throw him a parade for that. keeping walker was a no-brainer.

 

A deft observation.

[goonys evil twin]

For all of you Hendry critics, I hope you acknowledge that he did what was in the best interest of the Cubs by keeping Walker. I think it would have been an interesting year if Hendry would have managed the Cubs (or had a manager that agreed with Hendry). The final results might not be much different, but we would certainly have more insight on the 2006 and beyond Cubs team.

 

Well, it was an easy decision not to trade Walker for the spare parts you'd get this time of year, so yeah, um okay, good job not screwing up Jim.

 

Newsflash, Jim hired Dusty and has allowed him to mismanage this team. Something tells me they do agree on most things.

 

The Chicago Bears are an inept organization. One of their biggest failings for years has been sticking with what wasn't and wouldn't be working. But recently, they've realized what all successful teams realize, that you must cut bait at times. They let Shea go when he proved incompetent. They went from Hutchinson to Orton when Kyle clearly outplayed Chad. Hendry has seen failure, but has stuck with it. If Jim fired Dusty this offseason and actively pursued targets who could improve the many needs on this team, then I'd give him all the credit in the world. But as long as he remains on the track they are currently riding, I will be critical of his work.

[rawaction]

For all of you Hendry critics, I hope you acknowledge that he did what was in the best interest of the Cubs by keeping Walker. I think it would have been an interesting year if Hendry would have managed the Cubs (or had a manager that agreed with Hendry). The final results might not be much different, but we would certainly have more insight on the 2006 and beyond Cubs team.

 

Well, it was an easy decision not to trade Walker for the spare parts you'd get this time of year, so yeah, um okay, good job not screwing up Jim.

 

Newsflash, Jim hired Dusty and has allowed him to mismanage this team. Something tells me they do agree on most things.

 

The Chicago Bears are an inept organization. One of their biggest failings for years has been sticking with what wasn't and wouldn't be working. But recently, they've realized what all successful teams realize, that you must cut bait at times. They let Shea go when he proved incompetent. They went from Hutchinson to Orton when Kyle clearly outplayed Chad. Hendry has seen failure, but has stuck with it. If Jim fired Dusty this offseason and actively pursued targets who could improve the many needs on this team, then I'd give him all the credit in the world. But as long as he remains on the track they are currently riding, I will be critical of his work.

 

I'm so on the fence with Hendry. He shows he at least knows what OBP is by going out and getting guys like Lee, Walker, and Nomar. He shows that he knows the team needs to get good young production by going out and getting Barrett and Ramirez, and putting as many eggs in the Patterson basket as he did....and staying away from the retreads that this team was known for under Lynch.

 

But then he does stuff like trade value for Macias. Allows Burnitz and Hollandsworth to be his starting corner OFs. And allows Baker to mismanage this team.

 

I just don't know what direction Jim is going in, and actually that's probably enough reason to be critical of him.

[JC]

 

I'm so on the fence with Hendry. He shows he at least knows what OBP is by going out and getting guys like Lee, Walker, and Nomar. He shows that he knows the team needs to get good young production by going out and getting Barrett and Ramirez, and putting as many eggs in the Patterson basket as he did....and staying away from the retreads that this team was known for under Lynch.

 

But then he does stuff like trade value for Macias. Allows Burnitz and Hollandsworth to be his starting corner OFs. And allows Baker to mismanage this team.

 

I just don't know what direction Jim is going in, and actually that's probably enough reason to be critical of him.

 

Does he really value OPB though?

 

To me, Hendry is moreso trying to emulate the Yankees than show legitimate concern for OPB. For example, the Yanks collect superstars. Sheff, Giambi, ARod, etc. are all players brought in by the the Yankees because the are superstars. Sure, their stardom arises partially due to their strong OBP statistics, but those are likely incidental to the fact that the Yanks want them.

 

Due to payroll constraints (as everyone has who aren't the Yankees), Hendry is kind of the poor-man's Brian Cashman. He collects lesser star players on the cheap. He appreciates that Lee, ARam and Nomar have potential to produce, but OBP is incidental.

 

Hendry hasn't shown a willingness to chase, or force the play of, high OBP players with limited power like Boston or Oakland does. OBP just doesn't seem to be a priority in the supporting cast.

[abuck1220]

 

I'm so on the fence with Hendry. He shows he at least knows what OBP is by going out and getting guys like Lee, Walker, and Nomar. He shows that he knows the team needs to get good young production by going out and getting Barrett and Ramirez, and putting as many eggs in the Patterson basket as he did....and staying away from the retreads that this team was known for under Lynch.

 

But then he does stuff like trade value for Macias. Allows Burnitz and Hollandsworth to be his starting corner OFs. And allows Baker to mismanage this team.

 

I just don't know what direction Jim is going in, and actually that's probably enough reason to be critical of him.

 

Does he really value OPB though?

 

To me, Hendry is moreso trying to emulate the Yankees than show legitimate concern for OPB. For example, the Yanks collect superstars. Sheff, Giambi, ARod, etc. are all players brought in by the the Yankees because the are superstars. Sure, their stardom arises partially due to their strong OBP statistics, but those are likely incidental to the fact that the Yanks want them.

 

Due to payroll constraints (as everyone has who aren't the Yankees), Hendry is kind of the poor-man's Brian Cashman. He collects lesser star players on the cheap. He appreciates that Lee, ARam and Nomar have potential to produce, but OBP is incidental.

 

Hendry hasn't shown a willingness to chase, or force the play of, high OBP players with limited power like Boston or Oakland does. OBP just doesn't seem to be a priority in the supporting cast.

 

i agree w/ you, jc.

 

the only guy he's gotten that would indicate that he cares about OBP is lawton...and his OBP sucked while he was here. so i don't know if he'll go that route again any time soon.

[rawaction]

 

I'm so on the fence with Hendry. He shows he at least knows what OBP is by going out and getting guys like Lee, Walker, and Nomar. He shows that he knows the team needs to get good young production by going out and getting Barrett and Ramirez, and putting as many eggs in the Patterson basket as he did....and staying away from the retreads that this team was known for under Lynch.

 

But then he does stuff like trade value for Macias. Allows Burnitz and Hollandsworth to be his starting corner OFs. And allows Baker to mismanage this team.

 

I just don't know what direction Jim is going in, and actually that's probably enough reason to be critical of him.

 

Does he really value OPB though?

 

To me, Hendry is moreso trying to emulate the Yankees than show legitimate concern for OPB. For example, the Yanks collect superstars. Sheff, Giambi, ARod, etc. are all players brought in by the the Yankees because the are superstars. Sure, their stardom arises partially due to their strong OBP statistics, but those are likely incidental to the fact that the Yanks want them.

 

Due to payroll constraints (as everyone has who aren't the Yankees), Hendry is kind of the poor-man's Brian Cashman. He collects lesser star players on the cheap. He appreciates that Lee, ARam and Nomar have potential to produce, but OBP is incidental.

 

Hendry hasn't shown a willingness to chase, or force the play of, high OBP players with limited power like Boston or Oakland does. OBP just doesn't seem to be a priority in the supporting cast.

 

i agree w/ you, jc.

 

the only guy he's gotten that would indicate that he cares about OBP is lawton...and his OBP sucked while he was here. so i don't know if he'll go that route again any time soon.

 

I think he valued Lee's OBP. Lee didn't have the huge upside of Ramirez or Barrett when acquired. He didn't have the big name of Nomar. The only things that stood out about Lee is that he had the walk rate and the power/size to do well outside of Florida and defense. The move for Lawton gives me hope that Hendry values OBP a little. Going out and getting and then retaining Todd Walker gives me hope (of course the love for Soriano over Walker causes my indifference that I wrote about last post).

 

And acquiring Matt Murton and subsequently trading Lawton and Hollandsworth to get him on the field gives me hope. Calling up Adam Greenberg gives me hope. Getting Jerry Hairston gives me hope.

 

I guess I can't say for a fact that Hendry values OBP, but you can't say that the moves are incidental.

[Backtobanks]

For all of you who think it was a "no-brainer" to not trade Walker, there are 20 pages of posts discussing the fact that "Walker is as good as gone."

[goonys evil twin]

For all of you who think it was a "no-brainer" to not trade Walker, there are 20 pages of posts discussing the fact that "Walker is as good as gone."

 

That was the title, but not the contention of the majority of those who wrote in that thread.

[imb]

 

I'm so on the fence with Hendry. He shows he at least knows what OBP is by going out and getting guys like Lee, Walker, and Nomar. He shows that he knows the team needs to get good young production by going out and getting Barrett and Ramirez, and putting as many eggs in the Patterson basket as he did....and staying away from the retreads that this team was known for under Lynch.

 

But then he does stuff like trade value for Macias. Allows Burnitz and Hollandsworth to be his starting corner OFs. And allows Baker to mismanage this team.

 

I just don't know what direction Jim is going in, and actually that's probably enough reason to be critical of him.

 

Does he really value OPB though?

 

To me, Hendry is moreso trying to emulate the Yankees than show legitimate concern for OPB. For example, the Yanks collect superstars. Sheff, Giambi, ARod, etc. are all players brought in by the the Yankees because the are superstars. Sure, their stardom arises partially due to their strong OBP statistics, but those are likely incidental to the fact that the Yanks want them.

 

Due to payroll constraints (as everyone has who aren't the Yankees), Hendry is kind of the poor-man's Brian Cashman. He collects lesser star players on the cheap. He appreciates that Lee, ARam and Nomar have potential to produce, but OBP is incidental.

 

Hendry hasn't shown a willingness to chase, or force the play of, high OBP players with limited power like Boston or Oakland does. OBP just doesn't seem to be a priority in the supporting cast.

 

i agree w/ you, jc.

 

the only guy he's gotten that would indicate that he cares about OBP is lawton...and his OBP sucked while he was here. so i don't know if he'll go that route again any time soon.

 

I think he valued Lee's OBP. Lee didn't have the huge upside of Ramirez or Barrett when acquired. He didn't have the big name of Nomar. The only things that stood out about Lee is that he had the walk rate and the power/size to do well outside of Florida and defense. The move for Lawton gives me hope that Hendry values OBP a little. Going out and getting and then retaining Todd Walker gives me hope (of course the love for Soriano over Walker causes my indifference that I wrote about last post).

 

And acquiring Matt Murton and subsequently trading Lawton and Hollandsworth to get him on the field gives me hope. Calling up Adam Greenberg gives me hope. Getting Jerry Hairston gives me hope.

 

I guess I can't say for a fact that Hendry values OBP, but you can't say that the moves are incidental.

 

Really? The fact that he traded one of the only guys on our team capable of taking a walk for Lee makes me think that he valued Lee for something other than his BB taking abilities.

[rawaction]

 

I'm so on the fence with Hendry. He shows he at least knows what OBP is by going out and getting guys like Lee, Walker, and Nomar. He shows that he knows the team needs to get good young production by going out and getting Barrett and Ramirez, and putting as many eggs in the Patterson basket as he did....and staying away from the retreads that this team was known for under Lynch.

 

But then he does stuff like trade value for Macias. Allows Burnitz and Hollandsworth to be his starting corner OFs. And allows Baker to mismanage this team.

 

I just don't know what direction Jim is going in, and actually that's probably enough reason to be critical of him.

 

Does he really value OPB though?

 

To me, Hendry is moreso trying to emulate the Yankees than show legitimate concern for OPB. For example, the Yanks collect superstars. Sheff, Giambi, ARod, etc. are all players brought in by the the Yankees because the are superstars. Sure, their stardom arises partially due to their strong OBP statistics, but those are likely incidental to the fact that the Yanks want them.

 

Due to payroll constraints (as everyone has who aren't the Yankees), Hendry is kind of the poor-man's Brian Cashman. He collects lesser star players on the cheap. He appreciates that Lee, ARam and Nomar have potential to produce, but OBP is incidental.

 

Hendry hasn't shown a willingness to chase, or force the play of, high OBP players with limited power like Boston or Oakland does. OBP just doesn't seem to be a priority in the supporting cast.

 

i agree w/ you, jc.

 

the only guy he's gotten that would indicate that he cares about OBP is lawton...and his OBP sucked while he was here. so i don't know if he'll go that route again any time soon.

 

I think he valued Lee's OBP. Lee didn't have the huge upside of Ramirez or Barrett when acquired. He didn't have the big name of Nomar. The only things that stood out about Lee is that he had the walk rate and the power/size to do well outside of Florida and defense. The move for Lawton gives me hope that Hendry values OBP a little. Going out and getting and then retaining Todd Walker gives me hope (of course the love for Soriano over Walker causes my indifference that I wrote about last post).

 

And acquiring Matt Murton and subsequently trading Lawton and Hollandsworth to get him on the field gives me hope. Calling up Adam Greenberg gives me hope. Getting Jerry Hairston gives me hope.

 

I guess I can't say for a fact that Hendry values OBP, but you can't say that the moves are incidental.

 

Really? The fact that he traded one of the only guys on our team capable of taking a walk for Lee makes me think that he valued Lee for something other than his BB taking abilities.

 

He traded one of the only guys capable of taking a walk, because that guy wasn't capable of hitting very well. Lee could do both. He obviously also valued his defense.

 

Also, add giving Bellhorn the 3B job in 2003 supports the argument that Hendry values OBP a little bit.

[JC]

Can we all agree that throwing in Murton was Epstein's idea so that the deal would get done? According to every account I've heard, the deal was dead when Minaya demanded Brendan Harris. At the last minute, Epstein offered to compensate the Cubs with Murton.

 

Thus, I don't see Murton's acquisition as any appreciation for OBP.

 

As far as Bellhorn, he was a middle infielder that his 27 home runs. My money says that got Hendry's attention moreso than his OBP. In fact, my guess, based on Hendry's conventional approach to the game, is that he was satisfied with Belly's rather low AVG. at 3B, as long as he kept the prototypical 3B power.

 

We know what happened thereafter.

[imb]

 

He traded one of the only guys capable of taking a walk, because that guy wasn't capable of hitting very well. Lee could do both. He obviously also valued his defense.

 

Also, add giving Bellhorn the 3B job in 2003 supports the argument that Hendry values OBP a little bit.

 

Well, that's what I mean. I don't think Hendry said "hey, lee sure does get on base!", I think he got Lee because of his overall game, not because he valued his OBP.

[jtownie]

Can we all agree that throwing in Murton was Epstein's idea so that the deal would get done? According to every account I've heard, the deal was dead when Minaya demanded Brendan Harris. At the last minute, Epstein offered to compensate the Cubs with Murton.

 

Thus, I don't see Murton's acquisition as any appreciation for OBP.

 

As far as Bellhorn, he was a middle infielder that his 27 home runs. My money says that got Hendry's attention moreso than his OBP. In fact, my guess, based on Hendry's conventional approach to the game, is that he was satisfied with Belly's rather low AVG. at 3B, as long as he kept the prototypical 3B power.

 

We know what happened thereafter.

 

Actually I think I read something today or yesterday that said the deal almost died because Minaya didn't want Murton, so Hendry gave him Harris and took Murton instead.

 

Regardless, I'm not exactly sure what Hendry values but it sure seems like the team wants to rely more on the SLG than anything else. I draw that conclusion based on the fact that our team seems to live and die with the long ball, regardless of the number of men on base. Obviously I've done nothing in regards to stats to back this up yet.

 

I guess I would just like to know what the mission statement for Hendry is. I don;t have any exact quotes but we seem to just get generic answers like "we are looking into the best quality player we can get." It's like reading a Joe Morgan chat.

[tgk]

From Stark's Rumblings and Grumblings today. Five trades that were talked about but didn't happen. #5:

 

• Cubs-Indians: Yes, the Indians had interest in Todd Walker. But this was another overhyped deal that "never got too far down the road," according to one baseball man who had spoken with both clubs. Unlike Matt Lawton and Todd Hollandsworth, whom the Cubs unloaded because they'll be free agents, they hold a $2.5 million option on Walker for next year. So they never felt any urge to deal him, unless it was for something that made it worth their while. The White Sox and Cardinals also made runs at Walker, but never got close.

[JC]

Can we all agree that throwing in Murton was Epstein's idea so that the deal would get done? According to every account I've heard, the deal was dead when Minaya demanded Brendan Harris. At the last minute, Epstein offered to compensate the Cubs with Murton.

 

Thus, I don't see Murton's acquisition as any appreciation for OBP.

 

As far as Bellhorn, he was a middle infielder that his 27 home runs. My money says that got Hendry's attention moreso than his OBP. In fact, my guess, based on Hendry's conventional approach to the game, is that he was satisfied with Belly's rather low AVG. at 3B, as long as he kept the prototypical 3B power.

 

We know what happened thereafter.

 

Actually I think I read something today or yesterday that said the deal almost died because Minaya didn't want Murton, so Hendry gave him Harris and took Murton instead.

 

Another thread referenced a BP chat, I think, that worded the transaction a little odd. I am relying on what I remember from remarks made by both Epstein and Hendry. Hendry at one point provided a detailed account of how the day unfolded.

[MeatampPotatoesMan]

Can we all agree that throwing in Murton was Epstein's idea so that the deal would get done? According to every account I've heard, the deal was dead when Minaya demanded Brendan Harris. At the last minute, Epstein offered to compensate the Cubs with Murton.

 

Thus, I don't see Murton's acquisition as any appreciation for OBP.

 

As far as Bellhorn, he was a middle infielder that his 27 home runs. My money says that got Hendry's attention moreso than his OBP. In fact, my guess, based on Hendry's conventional approach to the game, is that he was satisfied with Belly's rather low AVG. at 3B, as long as he kept the prototypical 3B power.

 

We know what happened thereafter.

 

Actually I think I read something today or yesterday that said the deal almost died because Minaya didn't want Murton, so Hendry gave him Harris and took Murton instead.

 

Another thread referenced a BP chat, I think, that worded the transaction a little odd. I am relying on what I remember from remarks made by both Epstein and Hendry. Hendry at one point provided a detailed account of how the day unfolded.

 

Hendry said there would be no deal unless they threw in Murton. No Murton, no deal. That push came from Hendry, not Epstein or any of the other GMs involved in the trade.

[CuseCubFan69]

There's an old GM saying and that is sometimes the best trade you make is the one you didn't make. Hendry has his fingers on all the controls when it comes to transactions and I'm happy he didn't deal Walker.

 

If I were to judge Hendry on OBP and tools I have to lean towards tools. I have to assume he's no idiot when it comes to 2 players that have the same average and tools but one has a 50 or more better OBP, I'm sure he'd like the 50 point better guy. Now weather he targets OBP guys look at a guy he really liked for some time. Barrett. Not great on D. Very good hitting catcher. Decent OBP. Just a good player but not an outstanding one.