Wild Card Round: #7 Bears @ #2 Saints, 3:40 CT on 1/10

[raw]

I agree that Foles isn't good. How often do you find a good QB in the offseason? Especially without investing massive resources into one?

 

You're picking over everyone else's scraps no matter what.

Honestly, I think if Wentz or Carr come available they go that route. They apparently were going to go big money deal on Bridgewater. I don't think Pace or Nagy can wait on a rookie QB nor want to. Maybe a rookie QB can buy them more time on the job if he shows promise, but after the top 4, not much promise in this draft.

 

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[raw]

Can we come to a consensus on RPO and read option?

 

RPO = Run Pass Option. Acronym. QB, RB and OL show a run look. QB reads the LB to see if he steps forward or stays home. If comes up, he PASSES into the hole vacated by the LB. If he stays home, its a handoff.

 

Read option the QB reads the backside edge in read option. If he crashes toward the RB, the QB keeps the ball. If he stays put, the QB gives the ball to the RB.

 

Can we all agree these are NOT the same? Different reads for the QB, and no pass option is a huge difference.

 

So for instance, this play is a read option NOT an RPO, right? Mitch should read the end crashing and keep this ball (lead blocker coming with him as well). There is NO pass option as the OL is 5 yards down the field, which is a penalty on a pass.

 

 

People think those terms are interchangeable, but I disagree. Am I crazy? One of the popular Bears podcasts was making fun of a Packers homer because he thought they were different things, when I feel they were the ones that didn't know the difference.

 

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Pretty sure there was a pass option if you see it from a different angle.

 

 

I'm not a deep Xs and Os guy for football but I am pretty sure I have never seen Trubisky make the correct read on one of these plays. Just by accident you'd think he would get it right once, but he won't.

Everyone is blocking. Except Miller and maybe Wims who are just trying to clear out some space. But like I said if Trubisky passes that ball beyond the line of scrimmage its a penalty for illegal man downfield.

 

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[Hairyducked Idiot]

Wims was very clearly making himself a passing option. I'm perfectly willing to accept that our OL was screwing it up and would have been a penalty.

[WrigleyField 22]

Anyways, yes I'd agree there is such a thing as just a read option, regardless of if that play was one or not.

 

But RPO probably gets used as short hand for both.

[raw]

Anyways, yes I'd agree there is such a thing as just a read option, regardless of if that play was one or not.

 

But RPO probably gets used as short hand for both.

Yes, but it shouldn't be! Two very different things as I defined.

 

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[raw]

Wims was very clearly making himself a passing option. I'm perfectly willing to accept that our OL was screwing it up and would have been a penalty.

Read my definitions again. Do you agree with them? If not, then my definitions may be the issue. If you do agree with my definitions, then you know there's no pass option based on who the QB is reading. Mitch doesn't look anywhere near the LB or Wims. Not to mention an option route wouldn't be a fade in that instance, its almost always a slant or in -breaking route.

 

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[Old Style]

Someone on the previous page said the D was good today. Lol. They tackled like they stuck their hands in Vaseline before every series and were atrocious on 3rd down. It’s hard to believe they only gave up 21 points.

[Hairyducked Idiot]

Wims was very clearly making himself a passing option. I'm perfectly willing to accept that our OL was screwing it up and would have been a penalty.

Read my definitions again. Do you agree with them? If not, then my definitions may be the issue. If you do agree with my definitions, then you know there's no pass option based on who the QB is reading. Mitch doesn't look anywhere near the LB or Wims. Not to mention an option route wouldn't be a fade in that instance, its almost always a slant or in -breaking route.

 

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I’m not a deep playbook guy, so I’ll trust you on this.

 

I just don’t think I’ve ever once seen Trubisky make the right read on one of these

[mias_tisg]

Someone on the previous page said the D was good today. Lol. They tackled like they stuck their hands in Vaseline before every series and were atrocious on 3rd down. It’s hard to believe they only gave up 21 points.

Wasn't me but I thought the defense played well given their injury situation. The tackling was a complete mess and Eddie Jackson hasn't looked good since his 2nd season but I think the defense did enough to win that game. They just had no shot with the offense.

[jersey cubs fan]

Wims was very clearly making himself a passing option. I'm perfectly willing to accept that our OL was screwing it up and would have been a penalty.

No he wasn’t. That’s WR pretending to run route as a de facto block rather than actually blocking.

[Splendid Splinter]

That play was a read option where it was:

 

A: hand off to RB

B: run it yourself

C: shovel pass to TE (not sure if this was a legit option on this particular play call)

 

So no true pass option like an RPO play. But like Kyle said and I've said it before, Trubisky just cannot read defense at all or lack the quick decision making thought process. He just goes with the quickest/easiest option like 99.5% of the time which makes him predictable and easy to figure out how to gameplan against him. It was very clear in the videos that he should've done B or C. I think he would've gotten the first down had he run it himself.

[We Got The Whole 9]

Saw a tweet where apparently last week the offense was shown a compilation video of that Saints DB trolling players into retaliation. Like a 15 minute video with the express purpose of getting our guys to keep their cool.

 

Miller is a special breed of stupid. I hate JAGs who act like divas.

[Old Style]

Anyone know why Graham was glued to the bench all day until that last drive? I didn't see him anywhere.

[minnesotacubsfan]

Wims was very clearly making himself a passing option. I'm perfectly willing to accept that our OL was screwing it up and would have been a penalty.

Read my definitions again. Do you agree with them? If not, then my definitions may be the issue. If you do agree with my definitions, then you know there's no pass option based on who the QB is reading. Mitch doesn't look anywhere near the LB or Wims. Not to mention an option route wouldn't be a fade in that instance, its almost always a slant or in -breaking route.

 

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I have no idea raw, but what you've laid out makes sense. And it wouldn't surprise me at all that a packer fan would understand an NFL offense better then a Bear blogger.

[minnesotacubsfan]

Can we come to a consensus on RPO and read option?

 

RPO = Run Pass Option. Acronym. QB, RB and OL show a run look. QB reads the LB to see if he steps forward or stays home. If comes up, he PASSES into the hole vacated by the LB. If he stays home, its a handoff.

 

Read option the QB reads the backside edge in read option. If he crashes toward the RB, the QB keeps the ball. If he stays put, the QB gives the ball to the RB.

 

Can we all agree these are NOT the same? Different reads for the QB, and no pass option is a huge difference.

 

So for instance, this play is a read option NOT an RPO, right? Mitch should read the end crashing and keep this ball (lead blocker coming with him as well). There is NO pass option as the OL is 5 yards down the field, which is a penalty on a pass.

 

 

People think those terms are interchangeable, but I disagree. Am I crazy? One of the popular Bears podcasts was making fun of a Packers homer because he thought they were different things, when I feel they were the ones that didn't know the difference.

 

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when I watch this, I'm watching 94 (the DE that crashes in). He doesn't commit until after Mitch had handed the ball to Nall- in fact, he has a very clear view of the hand off. In other words, I'm not convinced Trubisky would have gotten the first down on that play. He would have had the TE as a blocker, but there's a good chance 94 blows the play up for a loss anyway. He could have gotten to Trubisky before the TE gets across the formation.

 

 

 

but why Nall? eeesh

 

edit: with 56 right behind 94 following 94's lead. Idk. the Saints had that one pretty well bottled up i think

[raw]

Can we come to a consensus on RPO and read option?

 

RPO = Run Pass Option. Acronym. QB, RB and OL show a run look. QB reads the LB to see if he steps forward or stays home. If comes up, he PASSES into the hole vacated by the LB. If he stays home, its a handoff.

 

Read option the QB reads the backside edge in read option. If he crashes toward the RB, the QB keeps the ball. If he stays put, the QB gives the ball to the RB.

 

Can we all agree these are NOT the same? Different reads for the QB, and no pass option is a huge difference.

 

So for instance, this play is a read option NOT an RPO, right? Mitch should read the end crashing and keep this ball (lead blocker coming with him as well). There is NO pass option as the OL is 5 yards down the field, which is a penalty on a pass.

 

 

People think those terms are interchangeable, but I disagree. Am I crazy? One of the popular Bears podcasts was making fun of a Packers homer because he thought they were different things, when I feel they were the ones that didn't know the difference.

 

Sent from my SM-A115AZ using Tapatalk

 

when I watch this, I'm watching 94 (the DE that crashes in). He doesn't commit until after Mitch had handed the ball to Nall- in fact, he has a very clear view of the hand off. In other words, I'm not convinced Trubisky would have gotten the first down on that play. He would have had the TE as a blocker, but there's a good chance 94 blows the play up for a loss anyway. He could have gotten to Trubisky before the TE gets across the formation.

 

 

 

but why Nall? eeesh

 

edit: with 56 right behind 94 following 94's lead. Idk. the Saints had that one pretty well bottled up i think

 

I see that first step by the DE, which is lateral. Mitch maybe has to give it another 1/2 second to see if he commits further, but knowing he has a lead blocker in Kmet, he probably should pull that based off the lateral step and try to get an angle on 94 so he can turn upfield for 2 yards. Worst case, Kmet chips the DE and Mitch has to outrun the linebacker for 2 yards. Best case, 94 can't get an angle and Kmet can block the LB or if one of those DBs gets in on the play and maybe make it a bigger run than 2 yards. But 2 yards should be gained if Trubisky keeps that ball.

[ConstableRabbit]

Yep, if you slow it down the DE is off balance headed towards where he thinks the RB is going. Mitch needs to pull that back from the mesh.

[minnesotacubsfan]

Can we come to a consensus on RPO and read option?

 

RPO = Run Pass Option. Acronym. QB, RB and OL show a run look. QB reads the LB to see if he steps forward or stays home. If comes up, he PASSES into the hole vacated by the LB. If he stays home, its a handoff.

 

Read option the QB reads the backside edge in read option. If he crashes toward the RB, the QB keeps the ball. If he stays put, the QB gives the ball to the RB.

 

Can we all agree these are NOT the same? Different reads for the QB, and no pass option is a huge difference.

 

So for instance, this play is a read option NOT an RPO, right? Mitch should read the end crashing and keep this ball (lead blocker coming with him as well). There is NO pass option as the OL is 5 yards down the field, which is a penalty on a pass.

 

 

People think those terms are interchangeable, but I disagree. Am I crazy? One of the popular Bears podcasts was making fun of a Packers homer because he thought they were different things, when I feel they were the ones that didn't know the difference.

 

Sent from my SM-A115AZ using Tapatalk

 

when I watch this, I'm watching 94 (the DE that crashes in). He doesn't commit until after Mitch had handed the ball to Nall- in fact, he has a very clear view of the hand off. In other words, I'm not convinced Trubisky would have gotten the first down on that play. He would have had the TE as a blocker, but there's a good chance 94 blows the play up for a loss anyway. He could have gotten to Trubisky before the TE gets across the formation.

 

 

 

but why Nall? eeesh

 

edit: with 56 right behind 94 following 94's lead. Idk. the Saints had that one pretty well bottled up i think

 

I see that first step by the DE, which is lateral. Mitch maybe has to give it another 1/2 second to see if he commits further, but knowing he has a lead blocker in Kmet, he probably should pull that based off the lateral step and try to get an angle on 94 so he can turn upfield for 2 yards. Worst case, Kmet chips the DE and Mitch has to outrun the linebacker for 2 yards. Best case, 94 can't get an angle and Kmet can block the LB or if one of those DBs gets in on the play and maybe make it a bigger run than 2 yards. But 2 yards should be gained if Trubisky keeps that ball.

 

 

that 94 guy is Cameron Jordan...are you sure about that? I get the take its mano-a-mano, but it still looks pretty low percentage

[WrigleyField 22]

Even taking that lateral step in should be enough. Also as reiterated, you have a lead blocker.

[raw]

 

when I watch this, I'm watching 94 (the DE that crashes in). He doesn't commit until after Mitch had handed the ball to Nall- in fact, he has a very clear view of the hand off. In other words, I'm not convinced Trubisky would have gotten the first down on that play. He would have had the TE as a blocker, but there's a good chance 94 blows the play up for a loss anyway. He could have gotten to Trubisky before the TE gets across the formation.

 

 

 

but why Nall? eeesh

 

edit: with 56 right behind 94 following 94's lead. Idk. the Saints had that one pretty well bottled up i think

 

I see that first step by the DE, which is lateral. Mitch maybe has to give it another 1/2 second to see if he commits further, but knowing he has a lead blocker in Kmet, he probably should pull that based off the lateral step and try to get an angle on 94 so he can turn upfield for 2 yards. Worst case, Kmet chips the DE and Mitch has to outrun the linebacker for 2 yards. Best case, 94 can't get an angle and Kmet can block the LB or if one of those DBs gets in on the play and maybe make it a bigger run than 2 yards. But 2 yards should be gained if Trubisky keeps that ball.

 

 

that 94 guy is Cameron Jordan...are you sure about that? I get the take its mano-a-mano, but it still looks pretty low percentage

 

Yeah, I know who it is. Mitch still has the speed advantage, and should have the leverage advantage with the lateral step by Jordan. And the lead blocker makes it so it's not necessarily mano-a-mano.

[gflore34]

Saints defense is good and all that, blah, blah, blah, didn't hurt they were facing a team with a "offensive" HC who's scared of his own shadow. If there's was ever an opportunity to go for broke, yesterday was it, yet, being the dick less coward he is, Nagy attempted his TOP garbage. Before the game announcers suggested Nagy open it up, be aggressive, halftime they suggested he do so again, Romo suggested the same at least, four times. Doesn't fill me with confidence that should a miracle occur and Nagy end up with a competent QB his play calling won't hold them back.

[UK]

Saints defense is good and all that, blah, blah, blah, didn't hurt they were facing a team with a "offensive" HC who's scared of his own shadow. If there's was ever an opportunity to go for broke, yesterday was it, yet, being the dick less coward he is, Nagy attempted his TOP garbage. Before the game announcers suggested Nagy open it up, be aggressive, halftime they suggested he do so again, Romo suggested the same at least, four times. Doesn't fill me with confidence that should a miracle occur and Nagy end up with a competent QB his play calling won't hold them back.

 

 

Nagy will hold them back on offense and Mitch is the perfect QB to do that. Mitch was playing QB for a contract yesterday and couldn't even try for a 1st down on a 4th down scramble. The only thing that they could've kept Nagy was they did play hard for him but now with an issue with the culture of this team, he's done.

 

A poor in-game coach with a poor offensive scheme who can't call games who brings in a DC who can't scheme against a broken QB who elderly and can't throw for more than 5 yards and you play off coverage.

 

They make up for it by having a GM who can't draft. How did that 1st and 2nd Rd combo of Trubisky and Miller do?

 

All trash. horsefeathers em all.

[gflore34]

Saints defense is good and all that, blah, blah, blah, didn't hurt they were facing a team with a "offensive" HC who's scared of his own shadow. If there's was ever an opportunity to go for broke, yesterday was it, yet, being the dick less coward he is, Nagy attempted his TOP garbage. Before the game announcers suggested Nagy open it up, be aggressive, halftime they suggested he do so again, Romo suggested the same at least, four times. Doesn't fill me with confidence that should a miracle occur and Nagy end up with a competent QB his play calling won't hold them back.

 

 

Nagy will hold them back on offense and Mitch is the perfect QB to do that. Mitch was playing QB for a contract yesterday and couldn't even try for a 1st down on a 4th down scramble. The only thing that they could've kept Nagy was they did play hard for him but now with an issue with the culture of this team, he's done.

 

A poor in-game coach with a poor offensive scheme who can't call games who brings in a DC who can't scheme against a broken QB who elderly and can't throw for more than 5 yards and you play off coverage.

 

They make up for it by having a GM who can't draft. How did that 1st and 2nd Rd combo of Trubisky and Miller do?

 

All trash. horsefeathers em all.

 

My same thought, burn it all down, the approach on defense may have been worse than Nagy' offensive approach. You know the excuse for not being aggressive on D is all personal missing due to injuries. Sometime in these playoffs a team is going to realize Brees is limited and they'll use it to kick the horsefeathers of them.

[Old Style]

Not sure if it was discussed during the game and I don't feel like going back to search for it but did anyone else notice the little confrontation between Miller and Nagy on the sidelines? Miller gave Nagy a nice shoulder thrust to the chest and walked past him. He looked mighty pissed.

[jersey cubs fan]

Not sure if it was discussed during the game and I don't feel like going back to search for it but did anyone else notice the little confrontation between Miller and Nagy on the sidelines? Miller gave Nagy a nice shoulder thrust to the chest and walked past him. He looked mighty pissed.

It was him getting chewed out by the coach for falling for the think they specifically talked about not falling for, and Miller dismissed him. That's on Miller.