Cubs cancelled my season tickets - anyone else?

[evanstonian]

What makes you think they will just keep ripping through the list? ...it's terrific marketing to be able to refer to a 100,000 person wait list.

 

You just answered your own question. There are about 25,000 seats sold through season tickets meaning there are, what, maybe 10,000 season ticket holders (though probably fewer because last I recall, season ticket holders could have up to 10 tickets per account)?

 

So you do the math. The Cubs can easily afford to get rid of 500-1,000 accounts who they deem to be "scalping" when their list is 100,000 deep. Remember, you have your season tickets in their "absolute discretion." They can boot you at any time on their own terms.

 

If their true goal is to maintain season tickets holders who they deem to be "loyal" then I don't think they will have a problem finding 1,000 more people who will not sell more than, say 20 games, on Stubhub. Do you?

[CubinNY]

What makes you think they will just keep ripping through the list? ...it's terrific marketing to be able to refer to a 100,000 person wait list.

 

You just answered your own question. There are about 25,000 seats sold through season tickets meaning there are, what, maybe 10,000 season ticket holders (though probably fewer because last I recall, season ticket holders could have up to 10 tickets per account)?

 

So you do the math. The Cubs can easily afford to get rid of 500-1,000 accounts who they deem to be "scalping" when their list is 100,000 deep. Remember, you have your season tickets in their "absolute discretion." They can boot you at any time on their own terms.

 

If their true goal is to maintain season tickets holders who they deem to be "loyal" then I don't think they will have a problem finding 1,000 more people who will not sell more than, say 20 games, on Stubhub. Do you?

I don't think selling tickets every once in awhile on stub-hub is the problem. I don't really like what they are doing, but if I were the Cubs I wouldn't like people buying tickets for the purpose of making money off them, which by your on admission you've done to a great extent. It doesn't matter to them or to me that you've sunk a lot of money in tickets that you can't use or don't want. Don't buy season tickets if your intent is to go to a handful of games per year and sell the rest.

[Sammy Sofa]

If their true goal is to maintain season tickets holders who they deem to be "loyal" then I don't think they will have a problem finding 1,000 more people who will not sell more than, say 20 games, on Stubhub. Do you?

 

"Holy strawman-from-a-guy-who-sold-tickets-to-80-games-plus-a-flex-package, Batman!"

[jersey cubs fan]

What makes you think they will just keep ripping through the list? ...it's terrific marketing to be able to refer to a 100,000 person wait list.

 

You just answered your own question. There are about 25,000 seats sold through season tickets meaning there are, what, maybe 10,000 season ticket holders (though probably fewer because last I recall, season ticket holders could have up to 10 tickets per account)?

 

So you do the math. The Cubs can easily afford to get rid of 500-1,000 accounts who they deem to be "scalping" when their list is 100,000 deep. Remember, you have your season tickets in their "absolute discretion." They can boot you at any time on their own terms.

 

If their true goal is to maintain season tickets holders who they deem to be "loyal" then I don't think they will have a problem finding 1,000 more people who will not sell more than, say 20 games, on Stubhub. Do you?

 

your paranoia and martyrdom amuses me

[Transmogrified Tiger]

If their true goal is to maintain season tickets holders who they deem to be "loyal" then I don't think they will have a problem finding 1,000 more people who will not sell more than, say 20 games, on Stubhub. Do you?

 

You seem to be implying this would be bad.

[evanstonian]

If their true goal is to maintain season tickets holders who they deem to be "loyal" then I don't think they will have a problem finding 1,000 more people who will not sell more than, say 20 games, on Stubhub. Do you?

 

You seem to be implying this would be bad.

 

There were multiple people earlier in this thread who posted that they sell almost all of their season tickets and only go to postseason games or whatever. And in my experience, it's pretty common for season ticket holders to sell many games on Stubhub. No one really thought much of it since there really wasn't a way for the Cubs to track it.

 

Whether it would be good or bad for the Cubs to cancel these people's accounts, it's something the Cubs could do and my point is that for those people, in light of my experience, they should be concerned.

 

You said earlier that you passed up your chance to become a season ticket holder. That's fine. But for those who didn't and lost thousands of dollars each year from 2009-2014 and are still trying to recoup their losses, this would suck.

Edited December 14, 2016 by evanstonian

[BigbadB]

If their true goal is to maintain season tickets holders who they deem to be "loyal" then I don't think they will have a problem finding 1,000 more people who will not sell more than, say 20 games, on Stubhub. Do you?

 

Care to share how much you profited off the sale of your season tickets this year? I would almost bet that the amount you made on your tickets was a much larger factor in you losing your season ticket account over selling all of your tickets.

 

And I ask this because I could totally understand someone losing their season tickets if it gives any appearance that the sole purpose of the use of those season tickets is to make a living/ridiculous profit. I think it's great that sports teams are able to monitor/control that type of behavior, as it wasn't what season tickets was designed for. There are so many people waiting for tickets that would truly use them for what they were designed for, and they are getting hosed by those who only have the tickets because they want to expand their wallet.

 

I would bet quite a few other people did lose their season tickets in this fashion. But I'll also bet that the Chicago Cubs are using due diligence in making sure the people they are taking away season tickets from are deserving so.

[David]

If their true goal is to maintain season tickets holders who they deem to be "loyal" then I don't think they will have a problem finding 1,000 more people who will not sell more than, say 20 games, on Stubhub. Do you?

 

Care to share how much you profited off the sale of your season tickets this year? I would almost bet that the amount you made on your tickets was a much larger factor in you losing your season ticket account over selling all of your tickets.

 

And I ask this because I could totally understand someone losing their season tickets if it gives any appearance that the sole purpose of the use of those season tickets is to make a living/ridiculous profit. I think it's great that sports teams are able to monitor/control that type of behavior, as it wasn't what season tickets was designed for. There are so many people waiting for tickets that would truly use them for what they were designed for, and they are getting hosed by those who only have the tickets because they want to expand their wallet.

 

I would bet quite a few other people did lose their season tickets in this fashion. But I'll also bet that the Chicago Cubs are using due diligence in making sure the people they are taking away season tickets from are deserving so.

 

I highly doubt how much he profited has much of anything to do with it. The market determines that. Everyone selling will price them as high as they can get.

[BigbadB]

I highly doubt how much he profited has much of anything to do with it. The market determines that. Everyone selling will price them as high as they can get.

 

I'm not talking about single game profit. If they have the ability to track all of your season ticket movement through Stub Hub, they can determine what your true intentions are. There is clearly verbiage in the contract for season tickets that says that if you are behaving as a baseball ticket broker with your season tickets, you will lose your tickets.

[evanstonian]

Care to share how much you profited off the sale of your season tickets this year? I would almost bet that the amount you made on your tickets was a much larger factor in you losing your season ticket account over selling all of your tickets.

 

I told you that I sold my World Series tickets. That should tell you enough. And you're probably right - the Cubs were probably pissed that I did that.

 

There are so many people waiting for tickets that would truly use them for what they were designed for, and they are getting hosed by those who only have the tickets because they want to expand their wallet.

 

The dirty little secret here is that in recent years, you could get Cubs season tickets without being on the waiting list. See: http://www.bleedcubbieblue.com/2012/12/15/3770336/cubs-season-ticket-wait-list-line-jumping

 

These people being "hosed" and coerced into spending $3,000 on a World Series ticket had their chance to buy season tickets not too long ago. Don't feel bad for me, but don't feel bad for the folks who didn't buy in earlier, either, when they had the chance.

Edited December 14, 2016 by evanstonian

[David]

I highly doubt how much he profited has much of anything to do with it. The market determines that. Everyone selling will price them as high as they can get.

 

I'm not talking about single game profit. If they have the ability to track all of your season ticket movement through Stub Hub, they can determine what your true intentions are. There is clearly verbiage in the contract for season tickets that says that if you are behaving as a baseball ticket broker with your season tickets, you will lose your tickets.

 

Sure but all they need to look at is how many he sold. How much he profited isn't really all that relevant.

 

If he sold 81 games for face value (plus the pack or whatever), I'm sure he'd be in the same boat.

[jersey cubs fan]

 

If he sold 81 games for face value (plus the pack or whatever), I'm sure he'd be in the same boat.

I very much doubt that.

[javy knows my name]

Omg, Yellon's writing is completely embarrassing. That first paragraph alone should be enough to require him to return to 6th grade.

[Sammy Sofa]

I highly doubt how much he profited has much of anything to do with it. The market determines that. Everyone selling will price them as high as they can get.

 

I'm not talking about single game profit. If they have the ability to track all of your season ticket movement through Stub Hub, they can determine what your true intentions are. There is clearly verbiage in the contract for season tickets that says that if you are behaving as a baseball ticket broker with your season tickets, you will lose your tickets.

 

Agreed; every STH is going to sell tickets at some point they make a decent profit from. I have no doubt that they saw a trend here of someone selling almost all of their tickets for way over face value and made a judgement call. Yeah, it's a subjective grey area, but I seriously doubt the profit margin didn't play a huge factor.

[David]

 

If he sold 81 games for face value (plus the pack or whatever), I'm sure he'd be in the same boat.

I very much doubt that.

 

I very little doubt it.

 

Not that it's a remotely realistic scenario. Nobody is pricing their tickets significantly below what the market allows. Some more aggressively to make sure they sell them, sure, but nobody is selling a high demand game for face on StubHub just out of the goodness of their heart or intentions. I just don't see why they'd even look at how much he got.

[jersey cubs fan]

 

If he sold 81 games for face value (plus the pack or whatever), I'm sure he'd be in the same boat.

I very much doubt that.

 

I very little doubt it.

 

Not that it's a remotely realistic scenario. Nobody is pricing their tickets significantly below what the market allows. Some more aggressively to make sure they sell them, sure, but nobody is selling a high demand game for face on StubHub just out of the goodness of their heart or intentions. I just don't see why they'd even look at how much he got.

 

Because those are the people that compete with the cubs for the highest margin returns. If you have season tickets and sell every one for face, you do not inflict on the Cubs ability to sell on high value games and such. If you sell your World Series tickets for $50 more than you paid, they don't give a horsefeathers, if you are the one selling the $5,000 ticket you are in their way.

 

Absolutely it matters.

 

A well run ticket scalping set-up can make a healthy return. Joe Blow will be lucky to cover his costs.

 

The Cubs don't want people profiting off their product other than themselves and their official partners on the media side. No business wants other people profiting off their product.

[Sammy Sofa]

 

If he sold 81 games for face value (plus the pack or whatever), I'm sure he'd be in the same boat.

I very much doubt that.

 

I very little doubt it.

 

Not that it's a remotely realistic scenario. Nobody is pricing their tickets significantly below what the market allows. Some more aggressively to make sure they sell them, sure, but nobody is selling a high demand game for face on StubHub just out of the goodness of their heart or intentions. I just don't see why they'd even look at how much he got.

 

Because it would be easy for them to do so and spot some pretty obvious selling trends to help them make their decision to give someone the boot.

 

Otherwise it amounts to little more than, "well, this guy is doing something that almost all STH's do, but we're going to kick him out because4 he sold X number more games than the next guy." Money is doing pretty much all of the talking here.

[David]

I very much doubt that.

 

I very little doubt it.

 

Not that it's a remotely realistic scenario. Nobody is pricing their tickets significantly below what the market allows. Some more aggressively to make sure they sell them, sure, but nobody is selling a high demand game for face on StubHub just out of the goodness of their heart or intentions. I just don't see why they'd even look at how much he got.

 

Because it would be easy for them to do so and spot some pretty obvious selling trends to help them make their decision to give someone the boot.

 

Otherwise it amounts to little more than, "well, this guy is doing something that almost all STH's do, but we're going to kick him out because4 he sold X number more games than the next guy." Money is doing pretty much all of the talking here.

 

The market determines what those tickets sell for. It's not like there's some skill to selling them for more money (maybe a little figuring out how to time the market along the way, but that's about it). It's the game and the section determining how much people are getting for them. And a little bit of luck, but that gets washed up when you're selling that much volume.

 

If this guy sold 80 tickets on stubhub (so, basically, almost all of them), his profit margins are almost certainly within spitting distance of anybody else who sold 80 tickets in his section. It's the fact that he sold 80 tickets that put him there (plus that package) and got him in trouble.

 

Aside, I really don't get why you're hung up on how they're deciding what number is too many. It's safe to say that even by subjective standards, most people would say selling 80/88 is a hell of a lot of selling. And the Cubs obviously can make these subjective calls as much as they please.

[jersey cubs fan]

The market determines what those tickets sell for. It's not like there's some skill to selling them for more money (maybe a little figuring out how to time the market along the way, but that's about it). It's the game and the section determining how much people are getting for them. And a little bit of luck, but that gets washed up when you're selling that much volume.

 

If this guy sold 80 tickets on stubhub (so, basically, almost all of them), his profit margins are almost certainly within spitting distance of anybody else who sold 80 tickets in his section. It's the fact that he sold 80 tickets that put him there (plus that package) and got him in trouble.

 

Aside, I really don't get why you're hung up on how they're deciding what number is too many. It's safe to say that even by subjective standards, most people would say selling 80/88 is a hell of a lot of selling. And the Cubs obviously can make these subjective calls as much as they please.

It's not as simple as saying the market determines, if some people are just selling to get rid of them while others are putting more effort into pricing them properly, and dipping into other packages to keep making more. On any given day he may not get any more money than anybody else gets. But if you do it right and sell aggressively and for all the right games, you can make a lot more than a typical season ticket holder that just doesn't want to take a bath.

[Andy]

The very fact that this dude is talking about 2009-14 in terms of 'lost money' is game, set and match.

 

You didn't lose money those years. You purchased Chicago Cubs tickets. You're pissed that you didn't get to then profit off them. Done.

[Sammy Sofa]

The market determines what those tickets sell for. It's not like there's some skill to selling them for more money (maybe a little figuring out how to time the market along the way, but that's about it). It's the game and the section determining how much people are getting for them. And a little bit of luck, but that gets washed up when you're selling that much volume.

 

If this guy sold 80 tickets on stubhub (so, basically, almost all of them), his profit margins are almost certainly within spitting distance of anybody else who sold 80 tickets in his section. It's the fact that he sold 80 tickets that put him there (plus that package) and got him in trouble.

 

Aside, I really don't get why you're hung up on how they're deciding what number is too many. It's safe to say that even by subjective standards, most people would say selling 80/88 is a hell of a lot of selling. And the Cubs obviously can make these subjective calls as much as they please.

It's not as simple as saying the market determines, if some people are just selling to get rid of them while others are putting more effort into pricing them properly, and dipping into other packages to keep making more. On any given day he may not get any more money than anybody else gets. But if you do it right and sell aggressively and for all the right games, you can make a lot more than a typical season ticket holder that just doesn't want to take a bath.

 

Exactly. Dude's talking about "the market" like Kramer talks about writing things off; it's not like the seller HAS to sell their tickets for an insane mark-up just because they can. Basically you're doing that at your own risk if you do it too much.

 

Whether it's the number of games or the money made, both are subjective calls by the Cubs, and, personally, I think the idea of them cracking down on someone they think is making too much/basically acting as professional scalper makes a heck of a lot more sense than doing it because he didn't go to enough games.

[evanstonian]

The very fact that this dude is talking about 2009-14 in terms of 'lost money' is game, set and match.

 

You didn't lose money those years. You purchased Chicago Cubs tickets. You're pissed that you didn't get to then profit off them. Done.

 

It's obvious that you're not a season ticket holder. Most season ticket holders sell or exchange a large portion of their tickets, and when they do so, they hope to at least recoup the money they spent on the tickets or (gasp!) profit on their investment.

 

From 2009-2014, there were a lot of games that you couldn't give away, let alone recoup your money on.

 

So yeah, it's lost money.

[Bruno7481]

This whole discussion has prompted me to review my tickets from last year. I sold in the neighborhood of 60 games by my quick math.

 

I flew in 3 different times in the regular season for a weekend. These were in the summer and the higher priced/tiered games. The others were used by my brother in law and his family who live in the Chicago area.

 

For the playoffs I attended 5 of the 8 games.

 

I sold a lot, absolutely. I haven't asked my rep this directly, but I think considering my location I did as well as can be expected in terms of attendance. Some

may agree others may not. Maybe that plays a role?

 

I've also never bought a flex pack or even pre-sale concert tickets.

 

But, if they decide to bump me at some point logically I can understand it, even if I think I am making a legitimately effort to be there.

Edited December 14, 2016 by Bruno7481

[David]

The market determines what those tickets sell for. It's not like there's some skill to selling them for more money (maybe a little figuring out how to time the market along the way, but that's about it). It's the game and the section determining how much people are getting for them. And a little bit of luck, but that gets washed up when you're selling that much volume.

 

If this guy sold 80 tickets on stubhub (so, basically, almost all of them), his profit margins are almost certainly within spitting distance of anybody else who sold 80 tickets in his section. It's the fact that he sold 80 tickets that put him there (plus that package) and got him in trouble.

 

Aside, I really don't get why you're hung up on how they're deciding what number is too many. It's safe to say that even by subjective standards, most people would say selling 80/88 is a hell of a lot of selling. And the Cubs obviously can make these subjective calls as much as they please.

It's not as simple as saying the market determines, if some people are just selling to get rid of them while others are putting more effort into pricing them properly, and dipping into other packages to keep making more. On any given day he may not get any more money than anybody else gets. But if you do it right and sell aggressively and for all the right games, you can make a lot more than a typical season ticket holder that just doesn't want to take a bath.

 

Exactly. Dude's talking about "the market" like Kramer talks about writing things off; it's not like the seller HAS to sell their tickets for an insane mark-up just because they can. Basically you're doing that at your own risk if you do it too much.

 

Whether it's the number of games or the money made, both are subjective calls by the Cubs, and, personally, I think the idea of them cracking down on someone they think is making too much/basically acting as professional scalper makes a heck of a lot more sense than doing it because he didn't go to enough games.

 

I wish the people that do this actually existed (on StubHub that is). Sure, people will sell to friends (or maybe like other NSB posters in our cases) for face or less, but that just isn't happening on StubHub or any other such marketplace.

[David]

The very fact that this dude is talking about 2009-14 in terms of 'lost money' is game, set and match.

 

You didn't lose money those years. You purchased Chicago Cubs tickets. You're pissed that you didn't get to then profit off them. Done.

 

Don't agree at all.

 

2013-14 sucked. Those of us that had them those years did so for the payoff of having them when they were good. It was money lit on fire.