Week 9 - MNF: Bears (4-3) @ Green Bay (5-2) - 7:40 PM, ESPN

[UMFan83]

Somewhere erik is crying into a bowl of sausage gravy.

 

Packers fans were unusually quite in this thread

[Old Style]

Gruden also said Long only played in 5 games at Oregon while a graphic was on the screen showing Long played in 11 games which I thought was funny.

He also called him Chris.

[rawaction]

oy, looking at the highlights. Conte is terrible. Can't even lay a finger on straight downhill runners like Starks and Lacy.

 

Yeah, he should have benched for Steltz.

 

It's hard to decide which safety was worse. Wright tackled like a child. He had the chance to make a lot of tackles for little or no gain and either missed the tackle, got lost in the blockers, or just went to the wrong gap. Conte's failures were letting 10-yard gains turn into 30-50 yard gains. Conte had more lapses in coverage too.

[rawaction]

Oh and I don't agree that the Bears only won because Rodgers got hurt. If Rodgers doesn't get hurt, they probably don't go after 2 punt blocks, they probably don't onside kick. The 8-man boxes were hurting the Bears more as they (Wright) were getting out of their gaps and getting gashed. Rodgers wasn't anything special on the first drive he was in there. And has historically struggled (comparatively vs. the Bears). He still was missing his receivers. No Finley made a huge difference. No Cobb as an easy slot outlet to the backup QB. Jones wasn't healthy at all. It still would have been tough for him to dominate thru the air. And maybe they would have even gotten away from the run with Rodgers in there.

[UK1679666180]

Slap the meatball out of me...

 

There's part of me that wants almost all of the resources used on the defense this offseason.

 

With that said, would the Bears be better off letting Cutler leave take advantage of the strength of the draft (qbs) early in the draft and develop him, saving money for the defense.

 

Convince me that's a horrible idea.

 

I love Cutler, I dont know if they improve the defense enough to win w/out Cutlers upcoming salary spent on defense.

[Banedon]

Slap the meatball out of me...

 

There's part of me that wants almost all of the resources used on the defense this offseason.

 

With that said, would the Bears be better off letting Cutler leave take advantage of the strength of the draft (qbs) early in the draft and develop him, saving money for the defense.

 

Convince me that's a horrible idea.

 

I love Cutler, I dont know if they improve the defense enough to win w/out Cutlers upcoming salary spent on defense.

 

This is an offensive league. Last night is proof. It was the offense that won the game, not the defense. Trestman is an offensive coach...why spend resources on an area that isn't his strength? Bears fans have to get over the defensive mentality. This is going to be an offense-first team, and they should draft and spend accordingly.

 

I'm not saying not to ever draft defense, but you don't sacrifice offense for the defense.

[Guest]

The offense will take a step back going to a rookie QB while the defense is mediocre, at best.

[pitchcs]

@ Bears

@ Steelers

vs Bucs

vs Packers

@ Eagles

vs Ravens

vs Giants

@ Vikings

 

That's the Lions remaining schedule.

 

Lions lose just one of those I bet

 

No way.

[UMFan83]

BTW, this was the 2nd time in the Bears last 3 trips to GB that the Packers were not called for a penalty.

[Guest]

I thought the defense made decent enough adjustments in the second half to look respectable. The blitz and fake blitz packages seemed to give the offense some fits and I think that will be a direction this team will need to continue going forward. I thought Greene picked things up a bit better in the second half. Some of these guys are just too green yet, but will get better with playing time and playing with the rest of the starters.

 

Peppers age, DT's (in general) and safety are currently black holes going into next year, so I'd rather try to maintain this offense and improve on the defensive side with the draft.

 

Basically, I think guys like Wootton, Bostic, Greene, Frey and possibly Melton all are guys who bridge the gap as we replace old with the new. I liked what I saw in preseason with Cornelius Washington and he has been on the roster all season, though healthy scratches each week. Actually a little surprised he hasn't gotten a green light for some game day action considering how decimated the line has been all year.

[UMFan83]

Barnwell elaborates more on Trestman's 4th down decision:

 

Let's talk about what Chicago did with the game on the line, because it was certainly the most daring decision a coach made this week. Holding onto a 24-20 lead on the road at Lambeau, the Bears were facing a fourth-and-1 on their own 32-yard line with 7:50 left to go. They looked likely to punt, called timeout, and then Marc Trestman basically dared me to name the positive ledger of this column after him by going for it. He got just about the best outcome imaginable. Matt Forte was briefly hung up in the backfield before converting, and the Bears proceeded to take seven more minutes off the clock over the remainder of the drive before kicking a field goal to take a seven-point lead. It's fair to say that Trestman's decision ended up closing out the game for Chicago.

 

As you might suspect, just about every coach in the league would punt in that situation. Even Ron Rivera would hand over the reins of the riverboat to Trestman there. It's a freakishly rare occurrence. I tried to find plays like it, but since 1999, there have only been three plays when a team with a lead of eight points or fewer in the fourth quarter went for it on fourth down inside their own 40-yard line, as the Bears did. (There are others on pro-football-reference.com, but they were either on the final plays of games, elaborate safety routines, or fake punts.) You'll remember one: It was the pass from Tom Brady to Kevin Faulk on fourth-and-2 against the Colts in 2009 that came up just short, eventually leading to a Colts win. The other two were a Marion Barber run from 2008 and a Clinton Portis carry in 2002, each of which moved the chains. So it's rare. But was it right?

 

Advanced NFL Stats likely doesn't think so. Its fourth-down calculator suggests the Bears only should have gone for it if their chances of converting were higher than 71 percent, using their Win Expectancy framework. That would be better than the Panthers in short yardage, and historically, Forte has been one of the worst backs in the league near the goal line and in short yardage. Chicago improved its offensive line this offseason, but it was still 21st in power run success percentage before this game.

 

Furthermore, the averages used by Advanced NFL Stats also don't factor in that the Bears weren't playing an average offense. The post–Aaron Rodgers Packers had enjoyed great success running the ball against the Bears, but Wallace had struggled to create plays in the passing game, something he would have to do during a two-minute drill to win the game.

 

I'm inclined to agree with the numbers here and suggest that going for it wasn't the right choice for the Bears. They're not a great short-yardage team, they were facing a middling offense, and the percentages just weren't in their favor. I admire Trestman's sheer gutsiness in making the move, and I'm happy he was rewarded for that aggressiveness with a favorable outcome, but I don't think that play makes sense given the percentages.

 

http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-triangle/post/_/id/81191/thank-you-for-not-coaching-week-9

[UMFan83]

Also in that article, McCarthy's onside kick call was the best decision of the week, and his clock management was the worst decision of the week....about the clock management:

 

1. The Packers save their timeouts for another day. I really am not sure what Mike McCarthy was thinking about late in the fourth quarter of this game against the Bears. Whether it's too soon to call Matt Flynn without seeming like he's desperate? If he still has Brett Favre's number in some flip phone from 2006?

 

Instead, McCarthy mysteriously waited to use his timeouts until the last possible opportunity. He let the clock wind past the two-minute warning all the way to 1:14, at which point the Bears ran a first-down running play and miraculously held a Packers player, giving McCarthy a free timeout that he turned down by accepting the penalty. The time stoppage there is far more valuable than the 10 yards, especially considering that the Bears are already in the red zone and more interested in burning clock than they really are in scoring a touchdown. Instead, McCarthy accepted the penalty, giving the Bears another play with which to burn clock (and another chance for McCarthy to be stuck having used all three of his timeouts on defense, which is exactly what happened). It was lost in the Rodgers fracas after the game, but it's hard to imagine mismanaging the clock at the end of the game worse than the Packers did.

[Splendid Splinter]

Slap the meatball out of me...

 

There's part of me that wants almost all of the resources used on the defense this offseason.

 

With that said, would the Bears be better off letting Cutler leave take advantage of the strength of the draft (qbs) early in the draft and develop him, saving money for the defense.

 

Convince me that's a horrible idea.

 

I love Cutler, I dont know if they improve the defense enough to win w/out Cutlers upcoming salary spent on defense.

 

 

I think this offseason should be about the defense IMO. It's only because I'm not seeing the offensive pieces in FA that Bears would go after hardcore that's a big need for them. Bears got $$$ to spend (and can get more by cutting Peppers/Bush for example) and could go after a couple good young defensive players (Michael Bennett/Michael Johnson/Greg Hardy at DE, Alterraun Verner at CB, and Jarius Byrd/TJ Ward at S for example). I think Bears can sign 2 of those types and still have room for Cutler pretty easily. I would re-sign Cutler to a 3-4 year deal, Slauson to keep the OL together on the offensive side. Then my ideal draft would be a defensive player (DT or CB most likely) in the 1st (assuming Bears are picking no better than 18th), QB to groom in the 2nd, then C, burner/slot WR, RB, OL, DL in round 3-7 in no particular order. This is assuming Cutler comes back and does as well as he has so far this year.

Edited November 5, 2013 by Splendid Splinter

[Guest]

Also in that article, McCarthy's onside kick call was the best decision of the week, and his clock management was the worst decision of the week....about the clock management:

 

1. The Packers save their timeouts for another day. I really am not sure what Mike McCarthy was thinking about late in the fourth quarter of this game against the Bears. Whether it's too soon to call Matt Flynn without seeming like he's desperate? If he still has Brett Favre's number in some flip phone from 2006?

 

Instead, McCarthy mysteriously waited to use his timeouts until the last possible opportunity. He let the clock wind past the two-minute warning all the way to 1:14, at which point the Bears ran a first-down running play and miraculously held a Packers player, giving McCarthy a free timeout that he turned down by accepting the penalty. The time stoppage there is far more valuable than the 10 yards, especially considering that the Bears are already in the red zone and more interested in burning clock than they really are in scoring a touchdown. Instead, McCarthy accepted the penalty, giving the Bears another play with which to burn clock (and another chance for McCarthy to be stuck having used all three of his timeouts on defense, which is exactly what happened). It was lost in the Rodgers fracas after the game, but it's hard to imagine mismanaging the clock at the end of the game worse than the Packers did.

 

The Bears had been running the ball down the Packers' throat all drive long, and then ran for like 16 yards in 3 carries after the holding call. Say what you will about the timing of the timeouts, but accepting the holding penalty was absolutely the right call. The Bears would've almost assuredly converted the 2nd and 4-5 they would've had without the holding, and then the game would've been over.

[Guest]

Slap the meatball out of me...

 

There's part of me that wants almost all of the resources used on the defense this offseason.

 

With that said, would the Bears be better off letting Cutler leave take advantage of the strength of the draft (qbs) early in the draft and develop him, saving money for the defense.

 

Convince me that's a horrible idea.

 

I love Cutler, I dont know if they improve the defense enough to win w/out Cutlers upcoming salary spent on defense.

 

 

I think this offseason should be about the defense IMO. It's only because I'm not seeing the offensive pieces in FA that Bears would go after hardcore that's a big need for them. Bears got $$$ to spend (and can get more by cutting Peppers/Bush for example) and could go after a couple good young defensive players (Michael Bennett/Michael Johnson/Greg Hardy at DE, Alterraun Verner at CB, and Jarius Byrd/TJ Ward at S for example). I think Bears can sign 2 of those types and still have room for Cutler pretty easily. I would re-sign Cutler to a 3-4 year deal, Slauson to keep the OL together on the offensive side. Then my ideal draft would be a defensive player (DT or CB most likely) in the 1st (assuming Bears are picking no better than 18th), QB to groom in the 2nd, then C, burner/slot WR, RB, OL, DL in round 3-7 in no particular order. This is assuming Cutler comes back and does as well as he has this year.

 

I'd pass on a QB in the second round (paging sneakypower). Go for a developmental guy around the 4th or go for a QB in round one. I wonder how much money they will have to play with if they re-sign Cutler. Man, I'd love to get Byrd in free agency (rather than another round of third round safety) and definitely have a soft spot for Verner. Bringing back Slauson is a must - he's been the best offensive lineman all year.

[jersey cubs fan]

Oh and I don't agree that the Bears only won because Rodgers got hurt. If Rodgers doesn't get hurt, they probably don't go after 2 punt blocks, they probably don't onside kick. The 8-man boxes were hurting the Bears more as they (Wright) were getting out of their gaps and getting gashed. Rodgers wasn't anything special on the first drive he was in there. And has historically struggled (comparatively vs. the Bears). He still was missing his receivers. No Finley made a huge difference. No Cobb as an easy slot outlet to the backup QB. Jones wasn't healthy at all. It still would have been tough for him to dominate thru the air. And maybe they would have even gotten away from the run with Rodgers in there.

 

They would have had just as easy as a time running the ball but would have also been able to pass. They slipped down the field like a hot knife through butter that first time.

 

I have no idea how anybody can think he wouldn't have shredded them. That defense is abysmal.

[jersey cubs fan]

Slap the meatball out of me...

 

There's part of me that wants almost all of the resources used on the defense this offseason.

 

With that said, would the Bears be better off letting Cutler leave take advantage of the strength of the draft (qbs) early in the draft and develop him, saving money for the defense.

 

Convince me that's a horrible idea.

 

I love Cutler, I dont know if they improve the defense enough to win w/out Cutlers upcoming salary spent on defense.

http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mas4n1a7Ag1qhd2lno1_500.gif

 

http://31.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_ltvr43I0FO1qfmvyzo1_400.gif

[mul21]

Gruden also said Long only played in 5 games at Oregon while a graphic was on the screen showing Long played in 11 games which I thought was funny.

He also called him Chris.

 

I believe Gruden actually said started didn't he? Calling him Chris and referring to Alshon as Jefferies all night was annoying though.

[rawaction]

Unless Cutler comes back and wins a championship, I don't see a long-term deal. Emery probably won't offer a deal in the Romo range. Cutler won't accept less than in that ballpark. I think we'll know what they think of Cutler long-term by WHEN they draft a QB.

[Splendid Splinter]

I'd pass on a QB in the second round (paging sneakypower). Go for a developmental guy around the 4th or go for a QB in round one. I wonder how much money they will have to play with if they re-sign Cutler. Man, I'd love to get Byrd in free agency (rather than another round of third round safety) and definitely have a soft spot for Verner. Bringing back Slauson is a must - he's been the best offensive lineman all year.

 

 

I'm ok with a QB in the 4th. I just put a QB there because this is the year they need to draft one and groom him if they re-sign Cutler of draft one in the 1st if they don't.

 

According to this... Bears have $79 mil towards 28 players so a little over $40 mil for 23 players. http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/chicago-bears/cap-hit/2014/

 

They have the 2nd lowest cap hit for next season. http://www.spotrac.com/cap-tracker/nfl/2014/

 

Cutting Peppers would give them about $10 mil in cap space so a possible $50 mil for 24 players to sign.

Edited November 5, 2013 by Splendid Splinter

[biittner77]

Oh and I don't agree that the Bears only won because Rodgers got hurt. If Rodgers doesn't get hurt, they probably don't go after 2 punt blocks, they probably don't onside kick.

 

They wouldn't need to try the on side kick if their starting QB didn't get hurt.

 

The 8-man boxes were hurting the Bears more as they (Wright) were getting out of their gaps and getting gashed.

 

So instead Lacy gets a bunch of 8 yard runs instead of a couple long ones? That still favors the Packers.

 

Rodgers wasn't anything special on the first drive he was in there.

 

It was only one drive. Hard to tell how he might have done later on. At worst, he probably converts some 3rd downs and, if nothing else, keeps the Bears offense off the field.

[jersey cubs fan]

Unless Cutler comes back and wins a championship, I don't see a long-term deal. Emery probably won't offer a deal in the Romo range. Cutler won't accept less than in that ballpark. I think we'll know what they think of Cutler long-term by WHEN they draft a QB.

 

I think we're looking at the franchise tag, with a short-term offer on the table that Cutler won't take until after the draft shakes out. If they get their first choice, they will let him walk. If they settle on their second or third choice, they will keep doing the franchise tag thing and try and pressure him into an accepting what is his last best chance at a big deal that is well below the standard.

[mul21]

Also in that article, McCarthy's onside kick call was the best decision of the week, and his clock management was the worst decision of the week....about the clock management:

 

1. The Packers save their timeouts for another day. I really am not sure what Mike McCarthy was thinking about late in the fourth quarter of this game against the Bears. Whether it's too soon to call Matt Flynn without seeming like he's desperate? If he still has Brett Favre's number in some flip phone from 2006?

 

Instead, McCarthy mysteriously waited to use his timeouts until the last possible opportunity. He let the clock wind past the two-minute warning all the way to 1:14, at which point the Bears ran a first-down running play and miraculously held a Packers player, giving McCarthy a free timeout that he turned down by accepting the penalty. The time stoppage there is far more valuable than the 10 yards, especially considering that the Bears are already in the red zone and more interested in burning clock than they really are in scoring a touchdown. Instead, McCarthy accepted the penalty, giving the Bears another play with which to burn clock (and another chance for McCarthy to be stuck having used all three of his timeouts on defense, which is exactly what happened). It was lost in the Rodgers fracas after the game, but it's hard to imagine mismanaging the clock at the end of the game worse than the Packers did.

 

The Bears had been running the ball down the Packers' throat all drive long, and then ran for like 16 yards in 3 carries after the holding call. Say what you will about the timing of the timeouts, but accepting the holding penalty was absolutely the right call. The Bears would've almost assuredly converted the 2nd and 4-5 they would've had without the holding, and then the game would've been over.

 

Yep, he had to accept the penalty to prevent them from getting an easy first down and making timeouts irrelevant. It was still horrible clock management, but that was the right call.

[Splendid Splinter]

Unless Cutler comes back and wins a championship, I don't see a long-term deal. Emery probably won't offer a deal in the Romo range. Cutler won't accept less than in that ballpark. I think we'll know what they think of Cutler long-term by WHEN they draft a QB.

 

I think we're looking at the franchise tag, with a short-term offer on the table that Cutler won't take until after the draft shakes out. If they get their first choice, they will let him walk. If they settle on their second or third choice, they will keep doing the franchise tag thing and try and pressure him into an accepting what is his last best chance at a big deal that is well below the standard.

 

 

If Bears are smart, they would do a non-exclusive franchise tag on Cutler (1 yr/12.44 mil at most). See what teams would offer and if someone is willing to pay a lot, refuse the offer sheet and gain 2- 1st round picks as compensation. I imagine some teams will take the risk and give an offer sheet to Cutler. Because of possibly losing 2- 1st round picks, teams might not pay market value so Bears can match at a good price.

[captain_kickass]

Somewhere erik is crying into a bowl of sausage gravy.

 

There were no tears, my brother. It sucks that Rodgers got hurt, but there wasn't anything that really could be done about it.

 

Enjoy your gloating. You beat Eddie Lacy and the Packers B-team.

 

It's Erik, btw. Haven't been around in a while but it's nice to know people are still thinking about me. Told you I'd be back.

 

This will be my last post because I know the permaban is forthcoming on this account, but I got back on the boards once. I'll do it again. See you all in a few months.